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Manchester Marathon 2018
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been a quiet week for me, 3 short runs (16 miles) and have a 10k on sunday, may have a 10 mile run sunday afternoon depends how I feel. I hate 10k races and not sure why I bother with them. 41.52 is my pb from 2010, cant get anywhere close to that 2 years ago went 43.45, would be happy sub 45 but think I should achieve somewhere about 45.30-46.30.
I got an email before xmas ON nutrition then saw on the Manchester website they had removed the SIS logo on their sponsors and did wonder.
Also noted last year there was no isotonic drinks available either.. remember reading reports from the earlier years that they had them.
As long as there are bottles of water and not cups (which looks the case as every 2.5/3 miles) I'm okay. I start gels either mile 5 or 8 and then have one every 3 miles (6-7 gels) I start with 2 in a back pocket and 2 in hands then other half will be in Altrincham mile 11/14 where I can pick the others and up.
Hope you enjoy your running this weekend!
or put them in a I phone sized arm holder thing. simples
I can't bear those arm holder things or bouncing bum bags! So not for me, Pete. Really hope they have on course gels - but as others indicated, I checked the ON website and it all looks to be those cr@p chemicals that body builders stuff into their bodies.
Todays run may be one of the most enjoyable run I’ve done everything seems to be working well at the moment. Fingers crossed it stays that way.
Ive got a couple races this month as prep. Half marathon next Sunday and Scottish National 10k XC on the 24th.
had a decent 10k race, had a pre race warm up of 1.5 miles which I’ve never done before. Didn’t do my normal where I’m blowing out my arse after the 1st mile. Kept it composed and comfortable throughout finishing in 44.32 better than the 46 mins I thought I was capable of, watch measured a bit short but still think I would have nipped under 45 mins.
then decided to run 8.5 miles back towards home after getting lost and going back south rather than north.
feeling good and ready for a heavy week after just 32 miles this week (been averaging 40)
Managed a pb on the second half of my progression run yesterday which probably says more about my poor pacing ability than anything else.
Pretty excited to do Manchester as my first ever marathon. Training is going well, did 45 miles last week with a 17 mile long run.
Not entirely sure what time I should aim for. I think 4 hours will be pretty safe, I did my 17 miles at 4 hour pace and found it really easy going with avg. HR of 150. Based on my most recent 10k time an online calculator suggested around 3hr45 but I really don't want to bonk and struggle through the last 6-8 miles.
Also, not sure about race day nutrition. I normally just have some toast & cereal before my long runs and don't drink any water/take any gels during them. I guess I should probably try using them before the day but generally how many should one take during a marathon? Do they make much of a difference?
Thanks!
I'm not sure yet how to go about my nutrition either. I usually run on an empty stomach and take nothing in during the run, even long runs (2.5 hours) or long 10-mile tempos. I certainly don't want to put sickeningly sweet sugary gels in my stomach during the race! I'm leaning towards asking my wife to stand at the 20 mile marker and hand me a banana or something like that.
Enjoy this week's training in what is dubbed as the coldest week of the year!
> Completed a 50 mile week, over 5 runs including a 17 mile long run. Got more to do this week with 55 miles on my handwritten schedule.
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> I'm not sure yet how to go about my nutrition either. I usually run on an empty stomach and take nothing in during the run, even long runs (2.5 hours) or long 10-mile tempos. I certainly don't want to put sickeningly sweet sugary gels in my stomach during the race! I'm leaning towards asking my wife to stand at the 20 mile marker and hand me a banana or something like that.
>
> Enjoy this week's training in what is dubbed as the coldest week of the year!
Yeah, I was considering having a family member stocked with something since I'll have a fair few coming to support. Hoping the cold weather isn't too bad, it can trigger my asthma which makes it too much like hard work and not at all enjoyable!
Annoyingly, I'm just starting to feel the inklings of a cold coming. We've had coughs and colds going around our house for months now but, apart from a fairly minor irritating tickly cough, I've escaped the germs. I'll be getting on the first defense as soon as I'm back from work.
Re nutrition, I'm a novice at road marathons with nearly all of my races at 26.2 and above being on the trail. Because of the slower pace of those races I've always carried stuff like bananas, energy bars and flapjacks - trying to avoid gels if I can. However, I have had them before and have always managed to stomach them OK so I'll carry a few with me I think, rather than rely on what may or may not be provided.
Odd, regarding SiS. I switched to SiS last year so I could take advantage of the gels. I doubt ON is the replacement as they don't do gels. More like they'll have a stall in the race village and we may get something in the goody bag. I can't tolerate solid food when I run (I take forever to digest anything so I didn't even have brekky before Manchester last year, though I did have a banana and two rice cakes before Liverpool as it had a 10:30 start) so I do find I need the gels during a marathon. Sol2 - I'm rather like you in that I do almost all my runs fasted, but my long runs take rather longer since I'm much slower. My 17 miler took three hours and I was flagging by the end, so I think I'm going to have to dig into my gel stash for future long runs (if my calf lets me, of course!)
good training peeps, all about ticking over until race day. Cal hope your calf behaves and able to get back into some training, you able to maintain any x training/ strength work?
Legs still sore from Sundays 10k but went out for a casual 7 miles yesterday and managed to do intervals on treadmill today mile either side 4x1600m @ 10k pace 200m recover, was surprisingly comfortable.
Gels on course
I know in previous years the route map has had SIS all over it and the SIS logo has been removed from the main page. I emailed at race organisers and asked about on course nutrition. They said Optimum Nutrition were the race sponsors and will be supplying 'Nutri – Meno energy gels' Nothing on their website about them and a quick google search bought nothing up.
Anyway, my calf felt a bit better this morning - I was able to do some calf raises without discomfort so I went out and did 3 miles no problem. There is still some stiffness and soreness in the calf but only during certain movements, of which running is not one. So that's good. On the minus side, my dodgy hip doesn't seem to have enjoyed the downtime and has been niggling a bit. I'll have to keep an eye on it.
And I guess I will be bringing my own gels, then.
- You may or may not have read that the human body can store enough glycogen for typically 16-20 miles of running. So running a first marathon takes most people into a completely new physiological condition. Running out of glycogen is the classic hitting the wall, where your body needs to start looking to change to other energy stores (like fat), which simply cannot deliver energy at the same rate... so you are forced to slow down badly. So getting things right - replacing glycogen/sugars is very very important.
- Don't use a strategy you haven't tested in training. If you go for gels, make sure you test the same gel that you will use on race day. Some gels don't agree with some people. People are sometimes forced to drop out of races as a result of this.
- A banana or other solid food is all well and good if you've got experience, or if you are running at a pace which is very comfortable for you. But will your body be able to digest it on the run? Digestion needs blood supply to the stomach. Most of your blood will be being used to power your muscles. It can work, but are you sure it will work for you, at mile 23?
- For me, gels or other easily digested sugars are number one choice for a high intensity road marathon... and unless you really cannot get on with them, they should IMO be the starting point for any new runner. By all means, migrate away from them in later races if you really don't like them... but chances are, taking on fuel in any form is not going to that comfortable when you're at the extremes... so I'd recommend giving them a chance.
- At the expo before the Brighton marathon in 2014, I saw Paula Radcliffe speak. She's probably sponsored by big companies!! But she said she would always have a gel or energy drink on the start line and keep topped up from there. General recommendations are one gel every 30 minutes - but you need to check the manufacturer's recommendation. Lots of people are happy with this. Some find them sickly. I probably don't take quite that many - but only through bloodymindedness that I don't want to listen to a manufacturer flogging sugary stuff. Having said that, I might follow the plan this time, as an experiment.
There are other bits of advice... but that's my starter. Well worth doing some reading around this and make your own mind up. Good luck.I'm wondering if these energy gels are maybe a new product that isn't actually available to buy yet. I've been fine with all gels I've tried so I doubt one would cause me an issue but I'll definitely carry three sis or hi-5 ones with me.
The cold I mentioned did develop and I felt lousy on Tuesday. I was in two minds whether or not to go out with club Tuesday evening but decided to jog up there anyway and I felt absolutely fine doing 13 miles with a decent chunk done at Marathon Pace or below. Doing that was the best I'd felt all day! Out again yesterday afternoon for a 5 mile recovery.
I still feel OK but have been left with the most annoying cough which kept me awake for a lot of last night. My 6 yr old son has it too and my 2 year old son still wakes up a couple of times a night. All of that meant a very poor nights sleep indeed. This has left me in two minds as to whether or not I should run today. I'm thinking I'd probably benefit more from the rest. I think my mind will be made up anyway as I won't be able to go out until after 7 and I'll be struggling to keep my eyes open by then I reckon.
Good points you have brought up, Northender. I will have to experiment. Funny situation, really, as experiments are supposed to mimic the event. However, I really don't require to bring on any additional energy during any training run, so eating something isn't going to tell me much. I'll see during this weeks' 19 miler. Can't see how I could realistically carry a banana around for 15 miles before eating it...
Did a long 9 mile tempo run yesterday evening. Stuck to 82% HRmax, which came out to be a pretty consistent 7.15/20 pace. As I will have to keep on lengthening these outings weekly, up to a maximum of around 13 miles or so and we're still running out of time to further bump up the HR, it is likely that this will end up being my marathon pace. Should have been better, but with injury and time out, its as good as its going to get. I'm just happy and grateful to be back on my feet running. That's what really matters.
Good luck all!
Northender, thank you for posting, I been rewriting a response several times and pondered on posting or not. Just my views and thoughts added.
Gels
There is no exact science to it, it's a matter of trial and error practice on your long runs, even on your shorter runs to see if they sit in your tummy okay. Most of my runs I don't need the energy boost but just get myself used to taking the gels on. I have tried a new brand on race day, thankfully just gave me a wobbly belly and a quick loo stop to empty I was off... could have been worse (cramps, repeat loo stops). Stick to what your gut knows.
People put their noses up when I say I start at mile 5 and then one every 3 miles (about 25 mins if 8.30 mileling). It works for me and all that matters.
Drink (water)
I have always trained and raced with a bottle of water, I take small sips when needed. You lose between 400-800ml water from your body per hour (obv not exact as temperatures, speeds all impact) You should be well hydrated at the start but need to top up but without drinking too much, sip don't gulp water. You shouldn't need to drink all the water on offer think I counted 11 water stops.
One that concerns me as a heavy sweater, losing fluid also loses salt and water doesn't replace these. I have a habit of cramping in the last three miles. Hoping for a cool day but also will have hydration tablets with me that I can pop into water/ collect water from the OH on course.
Breakfast
same as above, test it out on your long runs.
cal well done getting out again, and top marks for being sensible about it.
Cotswold hope the cold/ cough pass. Good miles under the belt when feeling under the weather.
Sol using gels in training isn't just getting the boost for them in training runs but also about getting your body used to them so they don't get nasty shocks on race day. Still a bit of time to improve but main thing is getting to the startline well and fresh.
Feeling good about my training at the moment, after yesterdays intervals legs were tired but managed 9 miles alternating between sub 9 and 8 min miles averaging at 8.08. Welcomed rest day tomorrow before 2 long runs at the weekend (sat 18-20 miles and sun 10-14 miles off road).
Sol.. agree that trials should mimic race day... but that's of course not possible. Nothing wrong with just making the experiment fairly closely to the situation.
Cotswolds... good luck with getting on top of that cold.
Cal... glad you're improving.
Not run for 5 days... but got in 8+ tonight including a 5.3mile night cross country race... through the woods and fields... and rivers (rather cold). Really pushed it, so good training session.
Now have come back this thread and it's been great reading how everyone is getting on with their running, am picking up some great tips from you all. Thank you!
This will be my first marathon and really happy it's going to be Manchester, did my first 30k run last night and it went really well, nice strong steady pace and felt I could of gone further, have been aiming for 50 - 60K per week. Have done lots of half's so decided to take the plunge and go the full hog! 10k's are more my thing but I know much prefer to run long distance.
Has anyone out there ever done the Shakespeare Marathon (Stratford upon Avon)? Am doing that one which I think is about 5 weeks after Manchester, not much break in between I know! Lol
My aim is to finish Manchester 3:30 - 4 hours, did 30K last night in 2:40.
Hi Rob, I know people on twitter have done the Shakespeare marathon, they will have used Racecheck.com to put reviews so worth a look. Sounds like your well on course for min sub 4 with 30k in that time.
There is no reason why you shouldn't perform well at both, in 2015 I ran my PB Abingdon 3.44 then 3 weeks later ran Thames Meander (in tougher conditions) 3.47.
My views/ advice.....
After race Hydration/ Nutrition
most important is to celebrate your success of becoming a marathoner, experts will tell you to take on easy carbs and slow digesting... I've always managed to ensure I stay hydrated the erdinger you get after the race is quite nice for a 0 % beer drink. Take on protein and carbs and keep moving when and if you can.
Massage
Most advise against a massage (esp deep tissue massage) immediately after the race (and for upto 72 hours after) as could cause more harm than good to your muscles. A gentle massage would be okay though as it releases/ works away at waste cells.
4 or 5 days after is a good time it has allowed your muscles to have recovered and means your masseur can go deeper without the agony if done straight after a race.
Recovery and Training
don't be in a hurry to start training and when you do only light stuff for the 1st week or so. don't worry you wont lose your fitness over the short space of time, it still leaves 2-3 weeks for some longer stuff before tapering for the next race. The aim is still to be as fresh getting to the start line again.
Rob... good luck with that. I've never done the Shakespeare. I echo almost all of the good advice that Robert gives above... Personally, I'd be just a bit more cautious because this is your first marathon - I expect you'll be unable to walk the first day (or two)... so would just extend that 'easy' recovery period up to at least 2 weeks. See how you go though. Maybe try a s-l-o-w 10 miles as your long run 3 weeks before Shakespeare. Maybe 16-18 the following week. Hard to say though.
I did another hard run tonight. Probably being a bit stupid with consecutive speedy runs, trying to catch up... but think I've got away with it. 11 miles with 7 at 89% HR max. Having reached Thursday morning with zero miles, I'm on 19. With perhaps a 3m recovery tomorrow and 18 on Sunday, I could reach my first 40 mile week of the campaign. I'll only believe it when it's done though.
I have Liverpool 6 weeks after Manchester so you're not the only one doubling up.
Robert - I've done Thames Meander but only the half, four times. The first one (Autumn 15) was horrendous - driving rain and ankle-deep mud. People's numbers were disintigrating and I saw several runners fall over. The one I did the following spring was nicer, weather-wise, but the mud was still there. Fortunately the other two were much drier underfoot. It can be a very tough race so you did well to get close to your Abingdon time. I've always been around 5 minutes slower than my half PB there.
Calf is continuing to do well. I did a parkrun today and had no problems with it. Due to my recent spate of injuries I am not race fit so it wasn't anywhere near my PB but I think it was my fastest time this year.