P&D Autumn Marathon 2019

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  • Well done toughing it out in the ran Hamo. At the start of last week running in the rain felt like a bit of a novelty to me, but that quickly wore off!

    NIce LT Steve, really strong paces.

    Solid session Jooligan.

    Sorry to hear you’re struggling HA, hope things turn around soon.

    All this rain has gradually rendered most of my usual running routes impassable. On Saturday I just about made it around Pitchcroft, but at several points the river was gushing over the path and yesterday it was mostly underwater. Thankfully levels are dropping now, and I’m hoping I’ll have the racecourse back for my session on Wednesday!

    I had a good run at Stone, with mile splits of 6:01, 6:02, 6:06, 6:11, 6:10 and 6:05, and a final 0.23 at 5:46/mi. Those fourth and fifth miles were tough as they were in to the wind and I was out of my own, but I was pleased to be able to wind things back up for the last mile and a bit. The finish involved a 90º turn in to a muddy grass field, which was a bit of a nightmare in slippy Vaporflys.

    Finished in 37:54, so happy to be back under 38 minutes, and over two minutes faster than Pitchcroft three weeks ago! Plenty more work to do, but slowly getting there. I’ll be concentrating on some longer LT sessions for the next three weeks, before another recovery week and 10K race. Fingers crossed if things continue as they are, I’ll be in a good place to start marathon specific training by then.

  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    Very tidy 10K Spoons.
    SQ Blaisdon is downhill to start then gradually climbs to the turnaround then it's the opposite. The final K back to th e pu can be tough but other than that the second half feels a lot easier. Did you do the Hilly Half?
    Friday I did a progressive 8M (on the TM again) 8min/M down to 6:44 then Saturday I made it to Salisbury parkrun. Nothing spectacular 20:24. Very twisty course & 2 grassy stretches per lap but didn't stop the winner posting 15:44!

  • AWCAWC ✭✭✭
    edited June 2019
    Jools: Nice progressive run backed up with parkrun. You seem to be getting back into the swing of things again.
    Spoons: well done on the 10km, you are definitely speeding up which is nice with marathong training starting soon
    HA: take it easy - definitely worth getting checked out in case there is something going on
    5 mile recovery at lunch today along the shore which was nice. Even got my top off as the sun was out! Left knee was a bit sore - hopefully nothing serious just the aches and pains working their way out.
    Did a 10 min strength session this morning, and planning another one this evening to get back into the swing of things and shift some of this post race weight gain!
    Just finished reading "The Rise of the Ultra Runners" by Adharanand Finn. Really enjoyable book and if you enjoyed Running with the Kenyans and The Way of the Runner then you'll enjoy this latest instalment from Finn.
  • 1SteveMac1SteveMac ✭✭✭
    HA - Yeah, might be worth getting yourself booked into the doctors for a check up.
    Spoons - Nice 10k things are progressing well for you.
    Jools - Good to see you back into things.
    AWC - Just got that book! How are you feeling post SDW?
    15 miles for me on Saturday morning, then 90 minutes on the bike in the afternoon. 3 mile recovery on Sunday. Easy 8 miles this morning.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    Spoons - good to see some improvement, that will get your fires burning.
  • SorequadsSorequads ✭✭✭
    You’ve mentioned low iron in the past, HA. Possibly again?
    Well done on the 10k spoons. I feel your pain on twisty grassy finishes in the VFs!
    You’re progressing nicely, Jools. Thanks for the Blaisdon insight. 
    Sun’s out, guns out, AWC. I’ve really enjoyed Finn’s previous two books. Currently holding off the latest - don’t want to be tempted into an ultra!
    Wouldn’t fancy biking in this weather, Steve. Fair play to you. 
    So, who’s got any races coming up?

    I probably average a race every 6 weeks or so, but have been on a bit of an 8 day spree, finishing with Bourton Hilly Half on Sunday morning. Whilst it is in the Glos AAA series and was the also the county half marathon championship, it had a low turnout due to a date change and the growing popularity of the Speedway 10m that Jooligan has referenced in the past. 
    On Thursday the organisers put up a Facebook post with the weather conditions - they were delighted that the race looked to be in the nicest weather for quite some time. Fast forward to the 8:55 briefing and everyone utterly sodden before the start. Still, not actually cold so who really cares. That said, the rain was truly biblical during the first half, with a good couple of inches gushing down the roads. 
    The course was new - two loops with a solid 2M hill at the start of each. The descent was so steep  it meant quite a significant net loss of speed. I thought I was in about 8-10th throughout, working in a nice group of three. This broke up in the second half as a V50 I frequently race against pulled away on the hill. I busted a bollock trying to catch him on the descent, but without any luck. Still, the sun came out and I was enjoying the silent country lanes. With a few hundred to go, I was shocked to find out I was actually in third - a few in front had been doing the 10k. 
    So, 1:22:46 for a course that I suspect was a touch long and had nearly 1000ft of ascent - and a County Bronze 😃. Despite the low turn out, I never thought I’d be saying that. A cash prize followed by some family fun at the neighbouring Birdland (think exotic avians rather than exotic dancers) completed a great morning. 
    Contemplating a run commute to work tomorrow. 
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited June 2019
    Oooh nice one SQ. More prizes too. You are doing well to race 1/2s on consecutive Sundays.......i have Lordshill 10k june 30th (should beat my chichester time) and New Forest 10m trail race the following week. Abo  (2:55?) training will commence later in july.
  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    Nice work SQ. Bourton was traditionally a Saturday evening race which might have affected the turnout too. Speedway is a 10K btw.
    Double 4M runs today both a smidge below 1200 BpM with the latter one coming in sub 8 pace so definite progress from last week.
  • SorequadsSorequads ✭✭✭
    Good luck with Lordshill, TR. It must be a good one to possibly beat your Chichester 10k (the field there was just ridiculous and incredible to pull us round). Good to see you're back in for Abo again.

    Whoops - yes, Jooligan, I meant to write 10km. Good to see your progress continuing. Where do you get the beat per mile info from? I think I have access to it on fetcheveryone, might start tracking it. Does it vary much for you for a given intensity? Running harder, but the mile taking less time etc. 

    20.4M run commute into work this morning. Headwind the whole way, albeit not a strong one. Legs didn't have anything punchy on offer, so just settled in and enjoyed some podcasts. Spoons had recommended an Australian podcast, Inside Running. I enjoyed the hosts' chat about their training at the start, then an interview with Rod Dixon - legend. 7:36m/m average and quite nice freeing up the weekend. Might have another go next week. 
  • 1SteveMac1SteveMac ✭✭✭
    SQ - Just started listening to Inside Running, after hearing about it from the morning shakeout podcast! Nice bronze! Cycling was inside on the turbo!! Nice run commute.
    Jools - Nice 4m double.
    7m with strides this morning.....as usual more rain!!
  • runspoonrunrunspoonrun ✭✭✭
    edited June 2019

    Decent progress Jools.

    Hope the knee is ok AWC. I find strength sessions hinder weight loss, as I have to bribe myself with food in order to do them half the time :D Finn was part of a talk I went to organised by Tracksmith prior to London Marathon, seemed like a really interesting guy. 

    Another solid weekend Steve. I remember JohnOz recommending the previous podcast by the Inside Running guy, Tell Me Your Tales. I heard about it from The Morning Shakeout too, it's enjoyable but blimey are they long podcasts! 

    Congrats again on another podium SQ, and nice run commute today! Birdland is brilliant, I could spend all day watching the penguins, love how close you can get to them.

    My legs have felt good after the 10K, no doubt partly due to the VFs, but I think my endurance is still stronger than by aerobic ability currently, so I can’t thrash them quite as much as I can when at full fitness. The floods have quickly come down here, leaving behind lots of slightly pongy “mud”. Annoyingly part of the racecourse path is still flooded (or at least was yesterday evening), presumably due to slow drainage.

    Anyway, this morning I couldn’t really be bothered working out what was/wasn’t flooded, and/or covered in slippy mud. I was also feeling a bit tired, and not particularly up for it. So I decided the best way to hopefully get a decent session done was the controlled environment of the treadmill, where I could just concentrate on the run. I want to do some longer LT sessions for the next few weeks, including some of the alternating hard/steady LT workouts from Faster Road Racing. However, I thought that might be a bit much to jump straight in to, so opted for a split tempo of 18/12/10 mins @ LT - although I was ready to cut it down depending on how it went.

    Overall I was really happy with the session. It was a complete sweat fest, but I completed all three LT sections with average paces of 6:06/mi, 6:10/mi and 6:10/mi. The treadmill speed was the same for each, so I’m not sure if the treadmill was slowing or my form was changing meaning the footpod reported a slightly different speed. If the treadmill was accurate, it should have been about 6:12/mi I think. Regardless, 40 mins of hard work which I’m pretty certain I wouldn’t have managed outside today, so job done. It’s all about knowing when to pick your battles! 

  • HA77HA77 ✭✭✭
    SQ - Well done on the podium and swag. Solid time for a hilly course. Great long run this morning too. Have you got a structured plan at the moment or just making it up as you go? It seems to be going well.

    I'm into the Inside Running podcast too. It's just good to hear some proper accents each week. Some interviews I'm not really into and just zone out but others are good. I really like the way Julian (Moose) goes about his running. Should find out soon if he's made the Aussie team for the world champs. You need to go back to the start to hear some better "Moose on the Loose" segments, he ran out of good material a while back.

    Spoon - great session, progressing well now.

    Progress too from Jools and Steve ticking along well.

    Feeling a bit better myself, still a bit bogged down but certainly better than last week. Did a Mona fartlek on Monday, managing 5.7km, which isn't great but not too bad. Just some easy running since. Will try another long run on Friday and see how that goes.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited June 2019
    SQ - well done on the 20, you are on it ! Lordshill is flat and a HRRL race so level will be good, i was hoping to be fresher rhan Chichester with no marathon training around the race. I have last years cramp riddled 3:01 to beat at Abo, if i can keep the consistency going ill be well placed. 

    Spoons - tough sesson that, well done.

    Hope you are back to full beans soon HA.
  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    That's a decent LR SQ so soon after last week's racing. I just multiply average pace by average HR for the beats per Mile. I've a hunch that faster = less beats per mile: a fast 5K produces much my lowest BpM. 
    Glad you're feeling more upbeat HA
    Quality TM session Spoons. I was going to do one today but it's so warm & humid outdoors I couldn't face it so double 7's along the canal. Even threw in a couple of decent efforts on the return leg of the pm shift. 1191 for 7.5M@8:06 vs 1160 for 6.8M@7:41 which agrees with my hunch & my experience of doing better in evening races.
  • 1SteveMac1SteveMac ✭✭✭
    Spoons - Solid TM session there!
    Another good double day Jools!
    LT session this morning, 9 miles in total with 18 minutes (6:16 average) and 14 minutes (6:18 average) at LT pace. Last section was tough!!
  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    Quality LT that Steve. I certainly felt yesterday's efforts on this morning's 7.5M. Legs were stiff & HR was insanely high after a couple of miles. I would've assumed the monitor was just playing up however breathing was laboured & I was sweating profusely. It did drop back down for the return leg. 7.5M@8:33 returned 1291 beats per mile which is ridiculously high but I was up in the 170-18x range during for a while in that 2nd & 3rd mile. I've rung the doc but couldn't get an appointment for another 3 weeks so in the meantime I'll keep plugging away.
  • I'm going to dig deep into the bowels of the thread.....

    SQ, well done on the Market Harborough trophy, sounds like tough conditions.  Well done on the 10k sizzler, more tough conditions.  If you wear the cap backwards it will give you a cpmpletely different look.  Well done on the County bronze, more tough conditions.

    TR - hope you are still glowing from Yeovil.

    AWC - great report, agreed, your dad is a legend.  To finish in 21hrs with the injury is pretty legendary to.  Hope you are recovering well.

    Spoons - great progress with the 10k and the training generally.  A while back you queried the wavas for 10k v 2.44 marathon and you are right.  A 36:2x equates to a 2:44 for my age, hopefully I'm not quite there yet with the speed/age cliff edge drop off :)

    Steve / Hamo - good to see (here and strava) that you registering some good sessions.

    HA / Joe - fingers crossed you have both turned the corner health wise.

    Jools - I would have thought youd get seen sooner than if you mentioned the HR ?

    Only a 2.5 mile test run to report here from the last 11 days.  At about 1mile from my front door my leg felt unhappy so it was a gingerly jog back and more bike action.  I'm lucky I can bike and dont mind it too much so shouldnt complain.......but its not the same.  I might give it a few more days then seek out a professional diagnosis.  The area of pain was upper shin/ under knee cap with a tightness of the outer thigh and general loss of strength in the whole leg, multiple sites  suggests nerve but also some ITBS symptoms.  With some chunky race fees invested in the next few months I can only give it so long to heal itself.

  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    Steve - good session,  what are you training for?

    Macca - id get the advice/ diagnosis asap, last summer i let the hammy issue drag on that prevented vlm and ruined yeovil by giving it time. An aggressive physio session got me going again, but it was late july by then and my Abo build up was shortened........ i have a bit of a sub3 glow (or relief more like), but defo have the could have gone faster (on a better course) feeling. But thats not a bad thing and already has my Abo fires starting to glow. It would have been a long summer with another 3:0X to my name.
  • 1SteveMac1SteveMac ✭✭✭
    TR - Look forward to see what you can do at Abo! Training for Kenilworth half in September, it's a local one but part of Warwickshire Road Race League, so plenty of faster runners, plus it's now a faster 2 lap course from when I did it last!
    Macca - Get yourself seen ASAP in my opinion.
    Rest day today, 15 miles planned for tomorrow.
  • hamo44gfchamo44gfc ✭✭✭
    Bit like Macca, I'm having to scan back a few pages....

    Steve...nice LTs, you seem to be building well.

    Jools...that's a good 1st session back, and nice too see you progressing well. Nice parkrun time as well. Good idea, you're best seeing the Doctor, it'll settle your mind if nothing else.

    Spoons...very good 10k, you have to be pleased with that. A muddy 90 degree turn at the finish is certainly interesting though. Followed up by a brilliant LT run, definite upwards trend you're on.

    AWC...Hope the knee is nothing serious, and as you say, just the 100 miles working their way out.

    SQ...excellent half marathon time and placing in awful conditions. A County medal and prize money, cant be bad to that at all. Class long run commute too. You've had a busy last few weeks.

    HA77...that's not a bad mona run at all. Hope you continue to feel better.

    Macca...Sorry to hear your knee is still giving you jip, fingers crossed it'll recover quickly. As you say though, at least you've the bike to keep the fitness up.

    TR...i completely get that feeling of could've went faster, but as you know, you can use it to push you on to smash Abingdon.


    I was over in Newcastle (well just above it) for a wedding at the weekend, so only managed 1 of my 2 planned runs (demon drink :D ), a 10 mile with strides, in the absolutely beautiful (if not slightly hilly) Northumberland National Park. Then with getting home, school, work etc being as busy as I can ever remembered, I missed Monday and Tuesdays runs as well. Started back into it on Wednesday with a LT 12 mile with 20 mins @ 5.38s and 16 mins @ 5.38s so very pleased with that, and followed it up with a 6 mile recovery that night (Mondays planned run). Thursday had 13M mlr in the morning and a 5 mile recovery that night, and this morning was Tuesdays planned 10 mile GA, which i plan to follow up with Mondays 4 mile planned recovery tonight. That should have me back on an even keel 'plan' wise heading into the weekend. I know you shouldn't cram missed runs in, but they've all been recovery/easy runs to make up the mileage for the most part, and I'm feeling good so shouldn't be a problem. 
  • I hear you Steve & TR.  I remember going a whole footy season with a self diagnosed hernia, putting off going under the knife. Finally bit the bullet, saw a physio, a few abductor stretches later, miracle cure 😀

    Sounds glib TR but never in doubt.  That said you’ve only got a 3hr window on a particular day in a particular place to do it.

    Steve, Given a fair crack at it I think you’ll smash that PB.

    Hamo - that’s something I’ve done in the past, as you say, as long as you’re not doubling up hard sessions shouldn’t be a problem.
  • HA77HA77 ✭✭✭
    Solid going there hamo, expecting good results.

    Steve - I'll probably be running the Kenilworth half as well. It's my wife's home town so will go up and stay with the inlaws. Good LT from you too.

    Macca - sounds like a complex problem. Hopefully you can get it sorted soon. good

    Jools - Hope you're ok.

    Got out for 20 miles this morning. Great morning for it. Still didn't feel great but certainly much better than last week. Managed a touch over 7/mile.

    Saw this on the BBC this morning:
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/48702452
    That is ridiculous. 
  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    Macca: had an ecg recently & full cardiac ultrasound before & after Brighton so not going to make too much fuss. I'll ask him to do some blood tests - iron etc
    Maybe it was just very humid & HRM playing up as back to 1176 on this morning's 7.5M canal trot. Lovely day for it too :)
  • Glad things seem to have turned a corner HA. I’ve heard about that Sri Chinmoy “race” before. Their 24 hour track race is mad enough. No idea what possesses people to do stuff like that, but different strokes…

    Frustrating about the docs Jools, hope things settle for you.

    Great LT session Steve. I’m running Kenilworth Half too, provisionally as an MP run but will see how things pan out. 

    That sounds more like it Macca. Certainly no drop off for you yet! Sorry the knee is still troubling you, I agree with the others the sooner you get it looked at the better.

    Nice LT Hamo. Those catchup runs don’t sound too crazy, the danger is when you start doing too much fast stuff close together without enough recovery.

    Back to the proper Friday medium-longs today - up to now I’ve been running them “easy” along the canal, but today was at my normal “moderate” effort I use for medium-long and long runs. 13 miles at 6:55/mi, pretty happy with that. That’s around the pace I was doing at this point prior to Manchester, which hopefully bodes well. 

  • 1SteveMac1SteveMac ✭✭✭
    Spoons - Hopefully see you at Kenilworth then! Will see closer to the time about race plans, but I would guess your MP might be close to my HMP...so you can drag me around!!
    HA - Nice one, will have to meet up before the race, or have a thread cool down! I'll also be down your way in October, for the Basingstoke 10k , the Mrs home town!
    Hamo - Nice LT from you too!! Super pacing.
  • SorequadsSorequads ✭✭✭
    You’re right about the King penguins, spoons. They were magnificent. Good decision on the LT, and a pleasing pace. And a huge step up with this morning’s MLR. The marathon development continues nicely. 
    I’m just freestyling it, HA. But feel in pretty decent shape. Pleased you’re starting to feel better. Good to see a MF back in there and well done on the long run. I’ve heard interviews on padcasts with a few Sri Chimnoy runners - absolutely bonkers. 
    Really good paces in the LTs, Steve. 
    Urgh, 3 weeks is a long time to wait, Jools. Look after yourself. 
    Oh no, Macca. That sounds potentially nasty. Hope it does turn itself round soon. Well done on the biking. 
    Sounds like the break might have done you good, Hamo. Rapid LT whilst flying solo. 


    With the continuing afternoon recoveries and a mid week long run, the mileage has been huge (for me, high 80s in the last 7 days). This combined with 7 hours sleep a night has left me pretty fatigued and very hungry. Nonetheless, it was good to get a bit of quality in today. In fact I had one of the best school trips ever. 
    I’ve taken a year group to the University of Bath open day. Once there, they are free to look at whatever facilities and departments they fancy. So I thought I’d make the most of the renowned sports facilities. 6 x 800 on the track was fun - even though I was The only one not running 52s laps 😲. 2:50 for the first four, then 2:55, 2:57 before I knocked it on the head. A little turn in the enormous gym after - thoroughly enjoyed making use of a hex bar and some kettlebells. I now feel fully prepared to field questions on life as an elite athlete undergraduate! There was also a lovely woodland path running round the uni, next to to Bath skyline common area. Would be a great place to study or work. 
  • SorequadsSorequads ✭✭✭
    HA I particularly enjoyed one of the opening sentences of the article: a race so long, you might need a haircut during it 😆
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    I read about that race too, absolutely crackers !

    Steve - you are back to it soonish after your last 1/2 then. Do you ever run maras?

    Hamo - good training there,  you are on it.

    Macca - agreed, its difficult to execute a strong mara and takes a lot of work, patience, luck, planets aligning.........

    Spoons - good news, very motivating progress no doubt.

    SQ - see if they'll offer you a job !

    5m easy with a few strides to try to ease my legs into getting ready for next Sundays 10k, but it wasnt helped by some squats, lunges, deadlifts last night making the run feel like an arse kicking. Longish run planned for the morning too.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    Surprisingly strong 20 for me today, a surprise but I'll take it!
  • 1SteveMac1SteveMac ✭✭✭
    SQ - Sounds great, nice set of 800s too! Big mileage, not surprised on the hunger or tiredness!
    TR - Yeah, but last marathon was 2017, injury meant I missed NYC last year, so this year decided to have a year off the long stuff to focus on the shorter speed. Nice 20 miler!
    15 miler MLR on Saturday, 3 mile recovery on Sunday morning then a sweat fest on the turbo on Sunday afternoon for 90 minutes!!
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