P&D Spring Marathon 2020

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  • Bloody hell, TR, that's a lot!

    Jools, hope the XC went well.

    I had my second stab at Gunpowder today (the one that was cancelled due to ice three weeks ago). So tube (with a change), then train, then a 2 mile run to the park, although as I was there early I did an additional mile around the park for three.
    It's hard path there - not the smoothest stuff as it has a gravelly texture, but it's quick enough. Two laps with a slight incline at the start of each lap - it amazed me how many people I overtook on that, it wasn't even a hill. There was a bit of congestion at the start so my first mile was around 8:15, but there was a lot of space after that and miles two and three were both exactly 7:56.6. Consistent eh? I was breathing quite loudly during the last half mile and I did push myself, but still found a little something for the finish, which doesn't often happen. My official time was 25:20, which is somewhat outside my best but still respectable (especially given this has been a 51 mile week since I did my long run on Monday). Good enough for 5th lady and 1st VW50. Rather glad I pushed it towards the end because there were two VW50s three seconds behind me!
    After adopting the bent-over-with-hands-on-knees recovery posture, I got some water and ran the two miles back to the station for a total of 8 miles. Home by 11, which isn't bad considering it's not the most straightforward journey.
    I doubt I will run tomorrow - I don't like 20mph winds let alone 60. Damned storm may keep me indoors for two days. Almost tempted to go out again later today, for that reason, but I've just eaten a baked potato so it probably won't happen. :D
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    Cal - how many weeks until Tokyo?

    Pretty wild here, glad i didnt have to drive to Worthing let alone race.

    P and D said 6+5, i did 12. Legs felt better than during ydays 20. Took a bit of a weather beating. Im sure it wont come in handy on vlm day.
  • That's a massive week TR - not surprised it was a bit of trudge.
    XC was meh so not too sorry today's race got cancelled. Did a hilly trail 13.1 locally with a couple of clubmates through the worst of Ciara!
  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    edited February 2020
    Decent parkrun Cal. I did Gunpowder exactly 4 years ago when staying on a friend's boat in Enfield. Ran the 4M up the towpath to warm up then raced it but I was a bit slower than I'd've liked too.
    XC results are out. Despite feeling like it didn't go that well for me it appears I was slightly ahead of several rivals who've just beaten me in recent fixtures. Still probably 20s/mile slower than I would've been in previous seasons. Good news is we moved up to 2nd in Division 3, 520pts ahead of our nearest promotion rivals so looking promising with just one more fixture to go.
  • 3, TR. So taper time now.
    No running today - props to anyone who went out in that.
    Good luck with the promotion, Jooligan.
  • JohnOzJohnOz ✭✭✭
    Cal - well done on pushing hard and getting the AG win. Another good session in the bag and excited to hear about your Tokyo experience. Would love to run it but no luck in the lottery for the last 4 years.

    TR - impressive mileage as always, esp doing them all in singles.

    Jools - great read and amazing achievement. When you see how accomplished he is, it must make Jasmin Paris's record breaking win last year one of the most incredible ultra performances ever.

    I see Ciara has been wrecking havoc over in the UK and for once conditions have been similar down here. A massive storm has reached the east coast and Sydney has had the most rain it's had for 30 years. Lots of flooding, trees down and some homes evacuated due to combining with high tides. Last time it happened some homes'swimming pools collapsed into the beach, looked like a hurricane had passed through. This all meant I resorted to the TM again for my LR, 25k in 2 hours. At least it topped off a decent week, just under 70 miles. Only 5 weeks to go and I'm behind in fitness but with it being a trail marathon at least I don't have to worry about hitting any sort of target paces.

    Hope everyone else managed to get some running in despite the weather.
  • JohnOzJohnOz ✭✭✭
    On Barkley, also just read that Gary Robbins is going back to run it again this year. He's the guy who took a wrong turn after getting the final book on the last loop and then made it back to camp a few seconds after the 60 hour cutoff: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdbt-yLdWao. Must have had it on his mind every day since then so really hope he pulls it off this time.
  • MillsyMillsy ✭✭✭
    Cal- Sounds like a decent parkrun performance. I`m always a bit off my best times when in the middle of big marathon mileage. I always feel that I`m missing a top gear but could go round again.
    Enjoy the taper for Tokyo.

    I had XC on Saturday which was dry for a change but the legs were definitely feeling the miles accumulated in the legs. As usual i just outside the top 50% (the quality is something else)
    Braved the storm to go and collect the car from the pub yesterday morning. Managed to dodge the worst of the rain for the first 15 miles then it all came down at once . Rather than running an extra lap of the village I called it a day at 17 miles. The official plan starts on Tuesday for VLM / Comrades.
  • AWCAWC ✭✭✭
    edited February 2020
    Jools: sounds about right re JK. He's been interviewed by Ian Corless on TalkUltra this week - well worth a listen. As is the Damian Hall interview on his winter Paddy Buckley Round record
    Cal: how did you find Helen Hall? I've read a bit about her, espeically in relation to Gary Ward's Anatomy in Motion movement model. I did wonder if she was worth a visit - she seemed to help Adharanand Finn quite a bit which is where I came across her.
    John: interesting to see GR heading back to Barkley - he's been injured for a long time so I didn't realise he was back in that sort of shape with the race only a few months away. Would be great to see him finish the 5 loops this time.
    Just a shortish run on Saturday and nothing on Sunday as didn't fancy putting myself in harms way. Unfortunately my fence hasn't survived the weekend so I won't be buying any new trainers anytime soon :smile:
  • Cal - Nice parkrun.
    Jools - Good xc running and 1k reps.
    TR - Massive week, with no doubles.
    John - Good TM long run and big week there.
    15 mile MLR on Saturday, nicely progressive without trying to run as such, first mile in 10:xx and final in 7:5x. 6 mile recovery on Sunday in the wind, for a 55 mile recovery week.
  • Cal...That is a big week, shame about the winter 10k. Well done on the parkrun, good work. Enjoy the taper, didn't realise Tokyo was so close.

    SQ...Nice recovery running.

    Ha...22 mile on a Friday is more than decent.

    AWC...Good recovering. Shame about the fence, the wind was brutal over the weekend.

    TR...Massive week, especially with no doubles, no wonder your LR was hard work, well done toughing it out.

    Jools...Nice windy trail run. Well done on the XC, always nice to beat rivals.

    John...Good work on the treadmill, hope the storm isn't too bad over there.

    Millsy...Good running in the XC, the standard sounds insane. Nicely backed up with a LR too.

    Steve...Another big week, good MLR.


    Saturday mornings 20 mile LR brought me to 107 miles for the 'rolling week', which is my highest ever total i think. The run went well, averaged 6.44 min miles and felt good throughout. I then went away for the night/weekend with the wife and ate and drunk my body weight in all kinds of good stuff :lol: This meant that Sundays 10 miler in the middle of storm Ciara, was run with a hangover as well as brutal winds, was not the most fun I've ever had :flushed::lol: The strides that were called for were decidedly half arsed, but still good mental training if nothing else.

    Usual Monday recovery doubles today. This mornings 6 were in the snow...we are getting all kinds of weather at the minute.
  • John - I really hope Gary does it this time. He's been in the wars a bit.

    AWC - Helen is excellent, although you'll need a few hundred quid spare - she's not cheap. However, my achilles is now quiet after being a whiny little bitch for 18 months so it was worth it in my case...and I daresay becoming a more efficient runner has also helped me get my sub-4. She's a very interesting lady and quite quirky but she really knows her stuff.

    Millsy, the quality in XC is insane. We've got some excellent runners in my club and it always amazes me how far down they finish.

    hamo, that's an insane total! As is going out for a run in Ciara. I did see quite a few people out running yesterday when I popped down to Lidl, but I wasn't actually feeling that good yesterday - when I hit peak mileage I seem to be on the borderline of getting a cold for weeks at a time, though it never really amounts to anything.

    Anyway, I banged out 10 miles this morning, feeling OK, so it was the right call.
  • Evening all. 
    22M day is great going, HA. I’ve done recoveries in the afternoon following a LR,  but not anything punchier. No doubt it’ll pay dividends. 
    Time for the pre beach gun show, AWC. Bugger this running malarkey. 
    Well done at XC, Jools. Will you be at Pittville this Sunday?
    Bloody hell, TR, impressively high mileage off no doubles. 
    Nice parkrunning, Cal. Have you planned one for Japan? Sorry - I now have a feeling you recently answered this but I can’t remember. 
    Blimey, John. Thank goodness for your treadmill. Are you looking forward to 6ft? It has a good reputation. 
    Very impressive post XC and pub running, Millsy. 
    Impressive range of paces in that progression, Steve. Another consistent week. 
    Hell of a week, hamo. And a run in that weather has got to be the ultimate hangover cure. 


    Running highlight of the weekend was my wife finishing her first parkrun in a year. PW but a PBPB. Sure she’ll slowly work her way back into her best shape. I think her PB is 22:xx. I did a short treadmill session of 6 x 3 mins, 90s static recoveries. Started at 5:52 pace and progressed to 5:27. Definitely not as cardiovascularly hard as actual running, but great for leg turnover. And certainly preferable to attempting it in the ridiculous winds. 
    This morning was this week’s long run, having begun to follow a HA-style heavier weekday, light weekend model. The LRs seem to have slowly crept to a Monday (brought forward rather than back) so there’ll be a gap in there somewhere. Doesn’t matter as long as the main sessions get ticked off each week. Still very windy, but lucky enough to get sun rather than the crazy rain of shortly after. Longest run since August: 18M in 2:15 for a neat 7:30 average pace. Nothing fancy but good to finish it whilst feeling fatigued. Somehow last week was 65M, biggest in a long time. Perhaps paying for it now with some definite sniffles. 
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    John - youve taken a weather beating lately.

    Millsy - are you doing anything specific in that plan ?

    AWC - im with you on the fence.

    Hamo - sounds like a great weekend, you can keep the snow.

    SQ - well done Mrs SQ. Nice one on the 18, top dedication for that on a monday morning.

    10m inc strides today, it was grim out there today.
  • SQ, I hope to, yes. Well done on the 18 and well done to your wife. She's a bit quicker than me - I'm very happy to get under 25.
    TR, well done on toughing that out.

    Got 6 in pre-dawn before it got too windy (I think this is the last day with 40mph gusts - I hate running in wind more than anything). Nice moon out. I was happy that I managed to run at my normal easy pace rather than the 11+ pace that has afflicted me recently.
  • 52 minutes at the weekend, Cal. So she's certainly not currently quicker than you. Good to see her out there with a smile on her face though. I noticed this morning's moon too.

    Well done for getting in the strides, TR. The questions is: with our without a tailwind? I'd always opt for with for strides, but varied for intervals. 
  • JohnOzJohnOz ✭✭✭
    SQ - well done to the missus on a PBPB, gives her a decent marker to aim at. Nice paces on the TM as well, I’ve become quite a fan of using them to do speedwork. Not too shabby pace either on the LR in a big mileage week. What’s your longest LR in this plan?

    Hamo - wow just smashing distance and pace at the moment. Careful you don’t overdo it, have you just had a recovery week? Good that you can still fit in the odd splurge, makes for a happy balance. 

    AWC - shame about the fence, is it a long one? A significant number of homes here still without power and forecast for more storms this weekend. The upside is almost all the bushfires are out and the dams are almost refilled to normal levels. 

    Easy 7M yesterday and another today with a couple of tempo sections, the first one flat and the second over hills. Trying to get my legs used to hammering downhills over the next few weeks without getting another injury. 


  • Cal...Definitely the right call this close to Tokyo, nice 10 miler. The moon has been beautiful lately.

    SQ...Yea the wind soon blew the hangover away :lol: Excellent work from your wife, brilliant. Well done on the treadmill session, and the LR. Horses for courses, but i'm not sure i could get a long run done on a Monday, fair play to you. Big week.

    TR...Seems like we are keeping the snow alright, my run this morning was in a blizzard. Good strides in bad conditions.

    John...Yea, the week before last was a recovery, then last, this and next week are all 100 plus miles before another recovery week. I like following a plan that is written by someone who knows what they are talking about, because i can turn off the mind a bit and not overly worry about overdoing it, becasue they have it covered (to a point) if that makes sense. Good luck with the hilly tempo, good idea to start getting used to them now.


    10 miles with strides this morning, in fairly heavy, lying snow...nice to look at, slippy to do strides in :lol:
  • MillsyMillsy ✭✭✭
    AWC, sorry to hear about the fence. My morning run was spent exploring the new estate that has just been built near us. Lots of the fences were down already. Not sure what that says for the workmanship of the houses.

    TR, I`ll be basing my plan on last years but swapping most of the track sessions for hill reps and making the long run more Comrades specific eg, road not trail and including plenty of long downhill sections. Most weekends will have a 12-15 miles on the Saturday (including a hard effort parkrun) followed by the LSR on the Sunday.  It`s a bit of a mish mash of P&D principles combined with some specific tips I`ve picked up from my research.
  • Hamo - Smashing it as usual, brilliant week and long run.
    SQ - Nice TM long run, and congrats to the wife on parkrun PBPB.
    John - Nice tempo.
    I had the dreaded 12 with 7 today...it was feels like -5c temps, windy in parts and I even had some snow, which made it delightful ;-)
    Anyway paces were, 6:33,6:34/6:31/6:23 (yeah this feels tough but doable)/ 6:50 (damn this wind)/6:56 (might as well bin this off now)/7:02 (how can wind come from more than one direction!).
    Anyway after 5 miles, I was going to bin it off, but then decided on the just one more approach to grind it out. Paces were slow, but HR was in the right range. 7 miles at 6:41 average.
  • Well toughed out Steve. I reckon pace is pretty meaningless in the context of this wind.
    I agree SQ: strides with a tailwind rather than headwind as it's about leg turnover rather than effort. Well done on the 18M Monday morning shift. Not at Pittville as I'm in Wrexham for the HM.
    Just a bike commute yesterday to give the legs some recovery. It was glorious on the way in but infernal on the way back. Cycling through floods in to the wind & lashing rain then being buffeted about with some cars making zero allowance as they passed within inches. I was frozen by the time I got back. Much nicer ride today though still very breezy & cold so opted for a progressive TM session at lunch: 9K in 40 mins going from 8:00-6:20s. Definitely felt fresher for a day off so I'll keep the mileage low this week to give myself a chance for Sunday.

  • Ah Jools, of course. VB half much more marathon specific as well. Enjoy. Got to be more fun than the bike ride you describe  :#

    Any kind of tempo effort in this wind is solid, Steve. I wouldn't have dared look at splits - as long as you were working fairly hard it'll pay off.

    Sounds a good plan, Millsy. And certainly did you very well last year. Happiest man in the Red Lion I seem to remember!

    John the plan goes up to 3 hours, twice. So depending on effort, that'll be circa 24M. 

    Cold coming out and feeling generally a bit rubbish. Pleased an easy day was planned, with a very relaxed hour in the sun and wind. Averaged just below 9m/m, keeping HR low. Felt fine whilst running. I know this will be the case from experience, but then you always feel a massive fraud having even the tiniest moan to a colleague later on  :tired_face: 
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    SQ - strides with the wind was the idea, but some were cross wind which didnt help my form. No point struggling into the wind doing them.

    Hamo  - youve copped some weather recently.

    Millsy - sounds good, those weekends will also set you up for vlm.

    Steve - well done, its the effort that counts, well toughed out.

    17m tonight
  • JohnOzJohnOz ✭✭✭
    SQ - sorry missed your question about 6FT. Yes really looking forward to it, needed something different from road marathons whilst not switching completely to technical trails. Most of the route is firetrail and the fast guys even run in racing flats. It was touch and go whether it was going ahead due to the bushfires but it looks like its on. Aiming for around 4:30 which is 30 mins off from 4 years ago. 
  • Storm season continues with Dennis the Menace this weekend. VBHM course is a bit damp post Ciara  :s
    Fortunately they’re prepared & have a back-up certified course ready to go. Provided Dennis doesn’t deteriorate further I’ll be racing this Sunday but should have a decent excuse for a shoddy time :p 
  • MillsyMillsy ✭✭✭
    SQ, yes that London run was the performance of my life. I was on cloud 9 for a while. Especially considering the amount of races I missed in 2018 due to injury. 
    First double day of the campaign yesterday, 4 Am followed by a 10 mile hill session in the evening.
    Already working out alternatives for the weekends training as lots of parkruns are looking dodgy due to the weather and I need a safe LSR route for Sunday
  • hamo44gfchamo44gfc ✭✭✭
    edited February 2020
    Millsy...sounds like you have it covered, best of luck with it, they are big weekends you are planning, fair play. Good double day work.

    Steve...well toughed out LT run in bad conditions, I agree with Jools, pace doesn't matter in that wind, class work.

    Jools...Not sure i'd have like your cycle commute. Nice treadmill effort, and all the best for Sunday. Good that they have a back up route, the swimming that would be required would make it a duathlon if they kept that first course you've put the picture up of :lol:

    SQ...Nice recovery running.

    TR...Nonchalant 17 there, good work.


    15M MLR in the ice and snow this morning. Wasn't really feeling it mentally from i woke up, and the constant slipping and sliding didn't really improve my enthusiasm, but its done, banked and that's what counts.
  • SQ - Nice recovery, also getting/have a cold I think!
    Hamo - Nice MLR, crap weather again for you.
    TR - Nice 17 there midweek long run!!
    Jools - Good job they have another course.
    6 mile recovery with my snotty nose this morning, 5 miles planned for later.
  • Some great runs there - the weather is not making it easy for us, is it? (I am constantly blowing snot rockets, Steve - I try to avoid doing it when anyone can see me, though!)

    I didn't have the best run today. Opted to go out after 9 in order to avoid any potentially frosty bits, and it was nice and sunny but still an icy wind. I had toyed with the idea of making this my long run (which is only meant to be 16 this week) as Sunday looks bad, but when I got to 8 I realised I just did not want to do another 8. My legs didn't want to go any faster, either, so it was just a vanilla easy run, 10 miles (same as Monday, albeit one whole minute quicker, whoop). I think I'm tired.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited February 2020
    Jools - that looks like a good swimmong lane.

    Millsy - looks like another weather beating ar the weekend.

    Hamo - well done, you are due a good ROI so far.

    Best days weather for a while and only had 7 or 8m to do.
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