P&D Spring Marathon 2020

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  • Had a very slow parkrun at Nonsuch today - the mud was that bad I had to walk across one bit. Resulted in my second slowest time of the year. I suppose that's not a bad thing considering I have a 10K tomorrow. And I had a rubbish sleep last night.
  • Toe’s almost as good as new thanks HPR

    Barnstaple Parkrun this morning in 50 mph winds & with several water features en route. Still managed to be 27s faster than over the same course 3 weeks ago. wu & cd made it 8M 😎


  • JohnOzJohnOz ✭✭✭
    Not sure how many more toe photos I can take Jools but glad it is on the mend!

    TR - Impressive start to mara training. 

    SQ - in great shape already. 

    Had a big weekend of running. 12 easy miles on Fri, felt really good and one of those days when I could have kept going. Workout yesterday of 5k LT followed by 6x1 min hills. Was going to do a parkrun for the LT but decided on a loop around an oval, flatter although had to do it solo. Tough start but got quicker each km and finished in 18:55. Hills were slow but it’s a start. Meant today’s 17 miles was always going to be hard and that’s how it turned it for the last 4. Still, gets me to almost 70 miles for the week. Needed a nap this afternoon, a sure sign the training is ramping up. 
  • Ugh, Jooligan, that almost put me off my breakfast!
    Nice work, John.

    Today was a 10K in Victoria Park. I'd done a 10K there in the summer, directly after a fast parkrun and in very windy conditions, so I figured I'd be able to beat that (and was hoping for a PB, since that's the only distance I've not bettered this year). Well, turns out I was wrong. I'm not sure why but my legs would not turn over today. It was like trying to drive a car with a speed governor. Ended up a minute slower than the windy 10K time and two minutes slower than the time I wanted to run.
    I'd dropped mileage a bit this week, ate properly yesterday, slept enough last night and felt generally OK so I can't really explain it, other than I may still have some fatigue after Yorkshire.
    Oh well. I've another one in January so hopefully I will be in better shape then.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited December 2019
    Jools - that has healed up a bit sincethe last photo.

    Good training there John

    Cal - shame you couldn't make it a clean sweep of pb's. But maybe missing the last pb in December will spur you on next year.

    I was playing it by ear today after a Christmas meal and a few snifters last night, but managed 15, so happy with that.
  • SBD.SBD. ✭✭✭

    Good work on the post festivity 15 TR.

    It can be difficult to PB at shorter distances Cal when you're building the volume.  I'm sure you'll you have better opportunities closer to Tokyo.

    That's a solid weekend of training John - I'm not surprised you needed the afternoon nap!

    Healing nicely Jools!  Some solid training from you over the last week.

    16 mile long run early morning.  Laps of Eton Dorney Lake, so pretty flat although the wind was picking up during the morning.  A bit of a slow first kilometre in 5:24 but gradually picked up the pace finishing with a last kilometre 4:32.  Brings me up to 65 miles for the week. 

  • SBD - Good week.
    John - Solid week and good work on the nap! It's what the Kenyans do!!
    Jools - Solid 4 weeks of training!
    TR - Good long run.
    16 miles with last 8 at MP, not sure of what MP is...but ran 7:04/7:04/7:11/7:08/7:30 (stopped to cross road)/6:59/6:50/6:48 for a 7:04 average. Then 9 miles on Sunday with a kettle bell workout.
  • Jools...I did mean physcologically :flushed: Glad to hear your feeling good about your fitness again, and a class parkrun in awful conditions proves its well placed confidence.

    TR...Big week. Fair play to you getting the 15 done after a bit of festive cheer.

    John...Class LT 5k, well done following that up with hill work too. Big week as well.

    Cal...Bad luck with the 10k, as TR says though, sometimes you have/need those days to ignite the fire in your belly, to avenge them next time out.

    SBD...Good long run with nice progressive work, and a big week too.


    Saturdays free hit at a 10k went well. It was a 2 loop trail race up a mountain, not quite sure it was the full 10k, but I certainly wasn't looking to run anymore :D as it was tough, and a lot different to what I'm used to, but a free entry and selection box for the kids meant I'd be mad to miss it :D So i donned a Santa hat and went for it, coming 2nd in 34.50. I was matching, if not slightly faster than the fella that came first, on the (rare) flat parts, and downhills, but just couldn't live with him up the steep trail climb sections. Still, an enjoyable day out, and a bit of prize money for the Christmas drinks fund. One thought i did have though, coming down the side of a mountain flat out, i was running at the same speed Kipchoge runs a marathon in, complete madness, scary actually.

    I followed that up with a 20M LR/ice skate yesterday morning, -4 wind chill meant that my planned nice and slow run turned into more of a steady effort to get home to the warm, not ideal after a race, but needs must.

    This morning is the start of my p&d plan, I'm doubling up on the first week so i can pick and choose next week, what/if any runs i do over Christmas. So, 6 mile frozen recovery this morning, will be followed up by a 5 this afternoon.
  • Steve...cross post, nice MP work, well done, they are tough runs
  • Well done guys, some good work going on there - and good job on the 2nd place, hamo!
    I had time to reflect on my 10K and I realised I had an even worse race about the same period after Liverpool. It was one of those where you could do 2 laps for 5k or 4 for 10k, and I went in intending to do the 10 but realised on the second lap that I just wasn't feeling so I bailed and ended up with a really shit 5k time. It wasn't until the following month that I started getting my speed back, but then I knocked out a 5k race PB and a parkun PB in the same week (despite battling several niggles).
    So on that basis, I should start speeding up from next month on. I hope!

    Did 8 miles recovery today (and fortunately it was my normal easy/recovery pace, not the very slow pace that happened last week). Felt some fatigue in my legs and a bit of a niggle in the left foot (feels like peroneals) but otherwise OK.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited December 2019
    Nice one SBD, i have done 1 x 18 recently, will probably do another this weekend.

    Steve - should the mp be more of an even effort/pace rather than progressive?

    Hamo - nice one on the prize money.

    Cal - good attitude, onwards and upwards.

    10m inc 10 x strides for me today.
  • Cal...Good way to think about it. Glad the recovery run went well for you, hope the niggle is nothing.

    TR...Nice strides.


    1st LT run of the plan for me this morning, so 10 mile with 4 at half marathon pace (5.30, 5.30, 5.38, 5.30 min miles), the 5.38 was uphill and that strava GAP thing reads just under 5.30, so cant complain about that at all, shocked myself with the consistency actually :D 
  • Hamo - Great cold long run and LT run - super splits!
    TR - Nice strides. Yes, should be more consistent on the MP. I'll try to get it a bit more even next time.
    9 miles with 4 at LT today (6:33/6:20/6:33/6:37), bit slower than I'd like, but very cold and foggy today!
  • Welcome Cal

    That photo comparison is crazy John. Intervals on the treadmill aren’t too bad, it’s the long runs that are killers :D

    Very sorry to hear about your mum Macca, all the best.

    Plenty of time yet HPR, you’ll get there.

    Congrats on the second place Hamo.

    Interesting discussion on the long runs. You see both sides with the pros… some don’t go beyond 20, others go over distance. Ultimately I’m not sure there’s one right answer, it’s about finding what suits you.

    Sadly, I lack both Jooligan’s enthusiasm for weekly timed 5Ks, and his ability to run on fumes, so after getting in at 5am on Saturday morning parkrun was a no go. And indeed, after meeting up with friends on Saturday night, the entire weekend was a write-off. It was fun to relive my old London lifestyle for a weekend, but I’m getting too old for it now… I’m not sure I’m fully recovered even today :sleeping:

    Still not 100% certain how to target the spring, but for now I’m just going to aim to build up the mileage over the next few weeks, and get back on board with the S&C and strides I keep promising myself I’m going to do.

  • HA77HA77 ✭✭✭
    Steve - nice MP then backing up with LT today. Going well. I don't think it's important to be consistent with MP runs, other than the 

    Hamo - speedy LT. You're looking good. I can't help but think you're going to give 2:30 a nudge

    Spoon - plenty of time to build up yet. You don't need to be smashing it in December to run a good marathon in April. In fact if you are smashing it in December and try to keep it up, I think it's too long to maintain peak fitness and you're more likely to overcook it. Agree about the long run philosophy. I can tell you what I find works for me but it's likely to be different for everyone.

    LTs a common theme is seems. Yesterday was 8 miles with 5 miles LT. Not especially fast, just about 5:50 but felt ok and it's only marginally slower than I was running my LTs leading into London last time.
  • Morning all. Anyone else getting Ann Summers adverts at the top of the RW page 😯 
    Great to see the fitness and consistency picking up, Jools. 
    TR are you trying to replicate the 3 long days in a row a Tommy Hughes spoke about?
    I like that session, John. A good mix. And probably useful to have the uphills later on forcing good running mechanics. 
    Cal - if that put you off your breakfast, don’t look at Jooligan’s photo on the old thread 🤮 
    Very nice progression in the long run, SBD. I wish I had an Eton Dorney style running route here - flat, nice surface, traffic free. 
    Good MP and LT, Steve. 
    Fantastic Santa hat racing, hamo. You’ve won a fair bit of cash this year 👍. Rapid LT. especially good given the rolling hills. 
    5am, spoons 😮. Midnight ruined me. 
    Good LT, HA. I’d agree (retrospectively) with your thoughts on December running and late April marathons. I reckon I peaked in February last year. 


    Not much running over the weekend, but a 4 and a 5 took me to 66M for the week. I won’t often reach that, so great to have got it in whilst possible. Saturday night was our running club Christmas Do. Great fun to don the posh clothes, although I am tight enough to have snuck in my own wine. Very Alan Partridge. Honoured to have won the Men’s Open a Road Races series, in the closest ever finish. Turns out racing the Stroud Half after an evening of D&V was worth it 😆 I think the hangover has only just left me...
    Had lunch out yesterday - chilli beef salad and a pint of lager. Ran later that day. Yep, disaster pants ensued. 
    10M with 10x 400 at the track this morning. 200 jog recoveries with between 1:22 and 1:27 for the reps. Made to feel very pedestrian by two speedsters, but a good session nonetheless. An hour and ten mins door to door - felt pretty productive! 
    Getting quite excited by the upcoming plan (starting Jan 6th). A good mixture of hills, tempo, reps and progression runs. Will be good to spice things up. 
  • MillsyMillsy ✭✭✭
    It`s exiting to watch all of the marathon plans starting. Lots of decent LT and MP sessions going on too. Those early LT runs are a hard introduction to the plan. I`m enjoying the fact I won`t be starting until Feb.

    I finally managed to nail a decent parkrun on Saturday. Decided to drive an hour to visit Poole (fastest Local) and see if I could give it one last shot for 2019.
    Just as the RD was counting down Martin Yelling (Poole local) lined up at the front which gave me a bit more inspiration to push it. He went off at a 5:40 pace which was a bit fast but I kept him in sight and overtook after about a mile and held on by the skin of my teeth to finish in 17:53 which makes me feel a bit more confident about Stubbington in Jan. 
    Going to tick over now until the new year, looking to creep over 2550 miles for 2019.  


  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    edited December 2019
    Cracking time Millsy. I notice there were 3 unknowns ahead of you though. Bit unusual to have that many speedsters without barcodes.
    Just you & Stevie G apparently SQ. You been doing some xmas browsing for the OH?
    All this talk of LT & MP runs reminds me that I really don't do enough of them. 5 & 13 mile double yesterday to make up for Sunday's zero & bring up the 2,000 miles for 2019. Legs not so happy today & I've a 10K commute each way so reduced the TRunch session to 4x1K rather than the 5x1K I was doing last week.

  • MillsyMillsy ✭✭✭
    Jools, I have been waiting to see if the unknowns get updated as 3 in a block like that often points towards a scanner issue. They were all between 17:25 - 17:30 which is pedestrian for the usual standard at Poole.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    I noted the Ann Summers adverts, better than the udual running gear adverts, i had a browse. Not sure if those young fillies will get much support or comfort from some of that underwear when they run though !

    Well done on the LT runs Hamo and Steve.

    Millsy - nice speed, is sub 37 on now ?

    Spoons - impressive boozing.

    SQ - not quite the full 17, 17, 17 though.......after a meagre 450ish miles in Oct and Nov combined due to Abo and Gosport, i need 344m in December for 3500. With no doubles i need approx 11.5m per run av off my 30 runs. After today i have 154 to go, off 13 runs.

    13m today. 190 done, 154 left.
  • SBD.SBD. ✭✭✭

    Looking good for the 3,500 TR.  I'm not far behind with 3,390 looking likely.

    That's a lot of miles over 2 days Jools.

    Good work on dipping under 18:00 at the park run Millsy and a good scalp to boot.

    Well done on the club prize SQ and a good morning's track session.  Eton Dorney is a 40 minute drive, so it's not a normal run opportunity, but my sons were rowing on Sunday so I was there anyway.  It's tempting to do some of my longer fast finish runs there in the run up to London

    A good LT session HA77 - a good marker to build from.

    Sounds like a tough weekend Spoons - a long run on Sunday would have been challenging!

    That's a good LT session Steve - the early ones in the campaign always feel hard.

    Nice consistency and a pretty quick pace on the LT miles Hamo.

    LT session for me today as well.  Late afternoon on the treadmill, 10 miles with the middle 10k at tempo pace.  ran it progressively from 3:58 down to 3:50 pace, so 39:00 for the 10K. I feel slightly guilty at using the treadmill for these sessions but the main alternative (the local track) is a bit harder on the logistics.  On a positive, I quite like the fact that you can make sure the pace and HR are in the right zones.

  • JohnOzJohnOz ✭✭✭
    Cal - sounds like you’ve had a good year so one bad race shouldn’t worry you. I always find 10ks hard to get right, I have to push too hard for too long. At least 5ks are over quickly and HM is not so intense. 

    SBD - good mileage already, I don’t mind doing laps for my LRs, they make it easy to see how far to go. Great LT on the TM as well, they all count!

    Steve - good MP and LT sessions. I forgot how they come round pretty quickly in P&D. 

    TR - ticking over nicely.

    Hamo - sub 35 in a Santa hat is impressive! Also can’t get much more consistent in your LT, I agree with HA77 that 2:30 will be well within reach. 

    Spoons - take the time to enjoy festivities and am sure seeing the others here doing P&D will get you back out and up to your usual mileage. 

    HA77 - good start with that LT, you seem to have a knack of peaking at the right time

    SQ - congrats on the win, decent prize? Nice 400m reps as well, did a similar session today and it was painful but know what you mean about time just flying by.

    Millsy - great time, that must put you in great shape to break some PBs. You could probably smash a huge PB if you were targeting London and with your endurance I predict a big performance at Comrades!

    Jools - maybe you should try out some LT/MP sessions on the TM?

    This week so far has been Mon recovery, Tues MLR with harder downhills and 400m reps today. Focusing on toughening up my quads as the first 15k at my trail marathon is all downhill, and then again for the last 3k. Last time I ran it I was in agony at the end with cramp and fatigue. Pretty happy with my 400m reps, all 82-85 seconds, haven’t done them for over a year. 
  • John - Nice 400m reps.
    SBD - They all count, nice LT.
    HA - Nice LT too, you seem to know what works for you, so I've no doubt you'll peak at the right time.
    TR - 3500 is on then!!
    SQ - Nice win and reps.
    Kettlebell workout and 5 mile run commute today, another 5 miles to get home later.
  • SQ - yeah I did see it and scrolled past rather quickly. Well done on your win - well deservee! I ended up getting my club's Veteran of the Year prize a couple of weeks ago, which was totally unexpected, as there are vets in the club who actually win races, but I took over doing the club's weekly results round-up last year and I think people appreciated that.
    Excellent parkrun, Millsy. It's a shame my parents are dead as they retired to Poole, which would have been a good chance for me to hit that parkrun (and Upton House), but I only started doing parkrun after they'd been gone a few years. Never mind. Not really short of options in London.
    The Yellings were behind the Bournemouth running festival, weren't they? Bit of a pity they ditched the marathon - one less option for Autumn.
    TR, glad I don't have to put up with the ad crap (not sure if it's because I'm a subscriber of if it's my ad blocker, but no Ann Summers for me!) Well done on the 13.
    SBD, rather you than me. I can't seem to run fast on a tready without feeling like I'm going to lose my balance and fly off.
    Thanks John, and yeah, that sounds like a good plan.
    Steve, I keep looking at my kettlebells but I never really get around to using them. I really ought to.

    Day off yesterday as I was visiting a friend in Windsor, but got 10 done today with three at pace. I'd intended to wind up to MP (9 min/mi, which still feels unfeasbily fast as it's a good 30 seconds per mile quicker than my previous fastest marathon) and after last week's problematic run, I was glad to hit it on the first try. I did the next one a little quicker and then the last one ended up at 8:31 which is basically LT pace. Oops! Wasn't going to do anything faster than MP this week as I did the 10K on Sunday, but there you go. I actually felt as though I could keep going, but once I slowed down for my cool-down mile, my legs suddenly felt very tired.
    Foot is still a bit tempremental but was alright during the run. Wore my Zoom Flys as they are a bit firmer than my Epics, which I use for most of my training, and my foot seemed to like that. Probably helped with the pace, too.
  • Steve...Nice LT run, and run commutes.

    Spoons...Excellent weekend partying, time of the year for it.

    HA...not sure about the 2.30 prediction, ill see how the training block progresses, but couldn't see it. Nice LT stuff.

    SQ...Class work sneaking the wine in, just right. Congrats on winning the race series. Fair play to you attempting a run at all after that lunch.

    Millsy...Congrats on the sub 18 parkrun, nice scalp too.

    Jools...Good doubles, and that's a cracking yearly mileage.

    TR...Good MLR, and good luck on getting the 154 miles in.

    SBD...Class 10k at tempo, nothing to feel guilty about at all getting it done on the treadmill, you still had to run it.

    John...Good idea working on the downhills for your trail marathon, nice MLR.

    Cal...Excellent pace work in the 10miler. How do you find the epics? They are quite cheap in my local outlet shop, and I have pondered getting them before, but was never sure.


    12m MLR this morning in the ice. Not sure why I've taken such an aversion to my ankles lately, but i must have, because i went over on my other ankle (not the one i twisted last month) in a pot hole in the dark after a few miles :flushed: It's a bit tender, but not awful, so fingers crossed no real damage has been done, and tomorrows planned recoveries will sort it.
  • Hamo - I used to do all my runs in Nike Frees but once I started running marathons, I found the balls of my feet got hammered (I am cursed with thin fat pads there - unlike my arse, alas). So I gave the Epics a try as they were also very light (and flyknit, which I love) but have a lot more cushion. I'm just wearing out my third pair and have two more in boxes waiting. They are very comfortable (I've done many long runs in them, and also one marathon). Nike estimates 600 miles for them but I've found I can get 700 out of them (your mileage may vary...literally).
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited December 2019
    SBD - good miles for you too. Good to see your usual 10k tempo too.

    Cal - good that you felt nippy.

    Hamo - hope you are ok after the fall.

    10m absolute drenching for me today, either splashing through puddles or wearing them (thanks to cars). 144 to go.
  • Good to see everyone else is bashing out the miles too.
    Fingers crossed for the ankle Hamo.
    Was going to go for my canal 10K route pre-work but the temperature plummeted turning the pavements into icy hell so went for the TM option. Inevitably this resulted in a planned easy run (with strides) morphing into a workout. Did a pace pyramid with 6K up & then 4K down 7:59/7:43/7:29/7:16/7:03/6:51/7:00/7:09/7:19/7:29. The weather had improved by lunchtime so got out for a comfortable [email protected]:40s
  • Jools - nice pyramid!
    Hamo - hope the ankle is OK.
    TR - ticking off those miles nicely.
    Cal - Nice fast finish there.
    13 mile MLR this morning, strangely warm for this time of year...was shocked to see 8c at 4:30am!
  • I was out at 6 and had a T-shirt on under my (light) jacket. Needed the jacket for the drizzle, but it felt very mild.
    I got 12 done today and, like last week, it was ridiculously slow. First 8 miles were all over 11, with the slowest at 11:37. If you'd ask me to run that slowly deliberately, I'd find it awkward, but the weird thing is that it feels like normal easy pace. Garmin data shows that my stride length during these slow miles is very short (I have a short stride anyway, but we're talking 8-10cm down on what it usually is for easy pace).
    Once it got a bit lighter, after 8 miles, I was running sub-11s but still at what I'd class as easy/recovery pace. I really don't know what's going on exactly. Generally speaking, if I got out at 6 or before, I'll be 20-30 seconds a mile slower than if I go out at 9am, but currently it's more like a minute or more. I'm stumped.
    Anyway, I got it done, and after a fairly decent run yesterday I'm not going to worry too much.
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