Sub 2:45 FLM 2006

[Deleted User]

Ah, a double run per day plan, very impressive, I tried this when I was training for NY last year. I think I will have to try this again but not sure I can fit it in as I work around 50 hours + a week. But thanks for the example and I like the use of beer as a training tool!

[Deleted User]

Be warned Toby, your 10k time is impressive on 50 miles a week. Most of the runners on this forum would need at least 80 miles a week to achieve that, so dont be dragged into high mileage debate too much. Many runners who started on this forum are now injured thinking that big mileage was the answer to all.

[Deleted User]

Toby,
Don't get too hung up on mileage. Alan Storey always had a simple view. He said do your key sessions then whatever steady running you can fit around this while still doing those sessions at the necessary intensity.

Marathon means long run is key, long/glycogen depletion training is important, then some VO2 max (eg 5k/10k pace) work. Then steady running.

Fits with Frank Horwill's views you can run a good marathon off 'low' mileage (low being relative of course) as long as it is the right type of training that makes up that mileage.

[Deleted User]

Hi
Some of you guys are doing some impressive times and training.

Im up to 50 miles a week. Want to get higher but struggle for time to do it all.Will have to run twice a day. Not run a marathon since FLM 2004 an ran 2-47-14.

Would just like to break that this year and get as near as possible to 2-45.

Ran Stamford 30k in 1-59 so pleased with that.

Tomorrow i'm running Stafford 20 and next week Stafford Half. Useually do Ashby 20 but it's a bit hilly and to close to FLM for recovery.

Will pop in again to see in how you are all doing.

Good Luck.

Boniface Earl Jones

Good luck for tomorrow tigerrunner.

I've also noticed lots of people getting injured when exceeding about 60mpw - guess I'm lucky in that respect - I just dived straight in and made massive improvements within 2 months which seem to keep coming! Just hope it continues.

4 miles for me today - the mileage monster that I am

Imaginary Friend

Toby - Sorry to butt in, but the times you posted on the previous page intrigue me and I wanted to give you some encouragement!

My times are 35'00" for 10K and 1hr17'31" for HM. I did both of those times of a diet of 60-70 miles per week with almost no speedwork. I'm sure that this is the reason that my 10K is slow in comparison to my HM time. You obviously have a natural ability to run fast, so I think that a few weeks of high (and slow) mileage followed by a few weeks of speedwork will see you take minutes of your HM time.

Good luck!
Dave
8o)

Matt the Brum

There is a 25mile hill/mountain run I'd like to do two weeks before FLM. I'd do it at a steady pace. Is this too close to FLM?

[Deleted User]

come on Matt, of course its too close! you should be on a good taper by then.

[Deleted User]

I'd say it's too near MtB. I'm planning 20 miles that weekend. And that's because I'm behind the 8-ball this year.

Matt the Brum

I thought I might get that answer

8Ball?

Boniface Earl Jones

Quite a fast 8-ball I'd wager.

I'll be doing a 5M race on the Sat, and about 2hrs steady on the Sunday that weekend.

Official HM time in Milton Keynes was 76:41. Not what I was looking for, but nobody to race so it felt more like a solo time trail. Respect to Paula R for being able to do that. Managed 5M and 10km pbs though, and was only seconds away from last month's 10M race time on my way through )

[Deleted User]

Ah glad to see this thread is up and running again (excuse the pun). Some good training been going on over the last month, and i see JEJ is still churning out the miles...you must have to get a hell of alot of sleep and i dread to think what your food bills are like!!? what are your plans after LM, rest maybe?

I am off to spain on Sat for 2 weeks training and Palma Half on sunday, fingers crossed, looking for P.B as usual. Had to take enforced easy week last week, as I think i over did it since Bramley 20, legs were dead, no bounce and generally felt flat. Have learnt from those weeks that the 4 hard 1 week easy doesnt work for me and will go back to 3 1/2 hard 1/2 easy, as i overcooked it a little, (78, 80, 88, 80 - 2 rest days).

Glad i am doing to Palma and not Bath as weather looks terrible for the weekend, blowing a gale here now!

Also made a monumental decision to leave my job, as it had been taking over my life and all my time for far to long. A case of I dont want to look back and think what if! So left my salary and 45-50 hrs a week job last week - nutter i know that what you are all thinking! but i feel a huge sense of relief. Taking a month out to prepare for LM then start my new 30 hrs a week job (less hastle, less money, lots more time to concentrate on training and being happy!!).

Will be taking laptop to spain, so will report on Palma! Dibs x

Boniface Earl Jones

Well done on quitting, Dibs - I know exactly how hard it is to make that decision but you've got to put things in perspective and in most cases jobs are really just things we do to pay the bills and let us do the things we really want to.

I'll be over in Portugal, so not too jealous of your trip to Palma. Good luck in the HM!

As for life after LM, I'm running a 25km race in Berlin 2 weeks after (target sub 1:30 with sub 75 HM split). That will be my last long race for a while as I'll be switching to my track targets (ideally sub 2, sub 4, and sub 15 for the 8, 15, 5000).

What is this 'rest' that people talk of?

[Deleted User]

JEJ - 2 weeks isn't long after FLM to be knocking out times like that. 2 weeks after FLM 2004 I ran a 5000m race for my club. Rather than the 16:50 I would have expected I ran 17:20. So about 6 secs per mile down. Same in 2003 now I come to think of it.

Also doing the same this year:-)

Good luck with it.

Boniface Earl Jones

BR, it seems that marathons affect people in different ways. A clubmate who beat me by 18 minutes in Berlin was behind me in races until November. On the other hand, I took 20 seconds off my month old 5km pb 8 days later.

In fact the clubmate was injured over Christmas and is well behind me again now - he's been running 2:40:xx every year for ages and it's looking likely to be the same again this year ;o)

[Deleted User]

Im a lurker, I admit it, all the training schedules schedules sound a bit scary! i just dont do enought speedwork.
Howarth Hobble, and Edale Skyline are my stamina defining runs for the FLM - Do any other people do big hilly off roaders for stamina? I find them much easier on the legs.
HM time this year was 1.17.40 after a day on the toilet post curry, I dont know what marathon time this translates to!

[Deleted User]

Andrew

I'm a semi-lurker, and am doing the Cleevewold on 26 March - a hilly 14 mile off road race - so yes I'm using the same approach as you. Not sure how good it will be as a warm up for FLM but did it last year and loved it, so decided to do it again...

Matt the Brum

Andrew- Long hilly offroad stuff is my favourite type of running. I totally hate trackwork. I've got quite a few long off roaders planned before FLM this year, but thats more in prep for a longer race in May than for FLM. I find this type of running is excellent marathon training, but you still need some speed sessions.

[Deleted User]

Thanks Huw, Matt
Im trying to mix up training for FLM and the Bob Graham Round - which is a bit of a conundrum!
I do the odd hill rep session, which may be good for speed, or lactic tolerance.
What sort of speed sessions should i do?
Ive only ever done 6x800m - so above a half hour session - is this enough? should i be looking more at an hour?
cheers

Matt the Brum

Easy one for mara training is 800m reps at your target mara time, but in minute instead of hours. I think you have 50% of that time as recovery between reps. Build up to as many reps as possible, say about 10 or 12.

[Deleted User]

My favourite is 5x2k at just faster than 10k race pace with 90 seconds recovery. Absolute killer session. I used to use it only in 10k training but I recently read Paul Tergat's biography and he used the same session in his marathon build-up. The key for me is to do sessions where I know I am going to end up really pushing myself, and this is the best one I have for that.

[Deleted User]

Some great advice from people so thanks!

Dave thanks also for advice and encouraging words. I am doing london half this weekend so looking for a PB. Anyone else trying that one?

I do these 800m reps also, called Yasso's 800 and they are good! nice track session been doing sub2:35min 800's

[Deleted User]

Thanks lads.
5x2k sounds brutal, i might give it a go. Ive got no access to a track though.
And 12x800? jeez! i thought 5x800 was bad enough! Maybe im just too soft? I often find excuses for getting out of 'quality' sessions.

What do you think of using treadmills for speed sessions? The problem is i train in the evening, and there is hardly any descent flat around - also treadmills can nail on a constant pace - any views?

[Deleted User]

Hi all,

Training's going well - ran a 10k race this morning in 32:54; and did a 19 mile run last week at marathon pace, but turned in at 6:04 pace.

My training has been planned for a time of 2:45, but now i'm wondering whether i should go for something faster, say 2:40 or so. The calculators suggest i should be able to beat that off my 10k time. The fear is that i might end up blowing up in the latter stages. any advice, or previous experience?

[Deleted User]

anybody got done a half marathon over the weekend? if so, how did you get on?

[Deleted User]

Mark - looks to me like you ought to be looking at sub 2:40, especially if that 19 miler was in training and felt comfortable.

Matt the Brum

Mark-32:54! You'll be smashing 2:40 if you've been doing your long runs.

Did a very hilly (and quite windy) 20 on Saturday in 2:02:59. Tried out a pair of DS Racers. Verdict is I'll defo be wearing them at FLM.

Rocky3

AC: I do my reps on the tready as I don't have access to a track and as you say you can accuratly judge the pace/distance.

MtB: No ill effects from the DS's? I tried breaking in a pair last week and they gave me a massive blister under my big toe nail! DO you use the same size as your other shoes?

Matt the Brum

AF-Can't remember what size compared to my usual shoe. I normall take 9.5 in a Nike, I think the DS's were a 9. They are on the snug side but uppers are very giving so they fit nicely. No problems from the uppers whatsoever. I did get lots of blisters on the balls of feet and bottoms of toes but I'd have got those in any lightweight trainers. The downhills (there were lots of them) probably increased the blister factor. Blisters don't really hurt until you stop anyway:)

[Deleted User]

Did the horrible edale in 3 hr 27, now that works out at 9m50s miling he he.
Not sure if staggering through snowdrifted frozen bogs on kinder scout really constitutes a quality session!