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Shades Marathon Training
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Have had a lot on but have been having a couple of mega skims through the thread when I can. Well done on all racers and good luck to Shadies racing tomorrow. Big G, I reckon those Munich race organisers have been stalking you and decided that you're capable of a faster time tomorrow
Well done on getting under 20min again SK. Re HR, I have a chest strap and a couple of times early on in a run it has given me some mad high readings which I've ignored. My max HR I take is the same one which I've taken at the end of two marathons, on both of which occasions I was convinced I was going to die.
I got the Maffetone book on the advice of Mowzer a couple of years ago and found it an uncomplicated way of building up a good base. As Shades says, you need a period with no racing to really stick to it and you need to be patient but it really worked for me. I am a lazy dreamer and like running slow mind you
Sorry to hear about your foot injury at Loch Ness Shades. Can't believe you were able to run with that stone to the extent that it wore through your shoe and your foot bled everywhere! Did it not hurt too much to run?
Have been a bit wiped out due to one thing and another so have missed a couple of key P&D sessions in my plan which is annoying. Mileage has been roughly on plan so am trying to hang on in there. Long run tomorrow and at time of writing have no valid excuse why I can't do it so we'll see what happens.
Lily/Big G-Good luck with your races tomorrow.
As for my race not too sure how it will go.All inclusive the week before a race probably wasn't my best idea but it was the only time we could fit a holiday in,other than that I seem to be ok so will see how it goes.
Lily - good luck and enjoy your day, you've worked hard for this, I'll be thinking of you. Don't worry about the post marathon blues, we can always find you another marathon or two to do
Big G - you're on the start list now for Munich, I wonder if it only refreshed after runners had registered and collected their numbers. I've had the Expo 'walk' in a few events I've been to, it's a poor marketing trick as it just makes me cross and I completely ignore all sellers wares and walk out as quickly as I can.
Maybe they moved you up to Pen A as that's where they had plenty of numbers and space, it may be to your advantage.
Thanks for the info on the 230, I'm not looking now but for the future.
mamafox - hope all went as well as it could in Wales.
Interesting you've taken your MHR at the end of a marathon, there's no way you'd be able to get near your MHR at the end of a marathon as you'd be too tired, needs to be done on a shorter race (no longer than 10k) or with a test. So your MHR is probably a fair bit higher than you think. But with Maffetone his calculation doesn't need your actual MHR anyway.
Don't worry about missing a few speed sessions, they shouldn't be done when you're tired anyway and you've kept your mileage up so all's well.
Yes, foot was sore at Loch Ness, but these things happen.
Ian - if you get a PB today, you'll be having a week's all inclusive holiday before every marathon, that will make it a very expensive hobby
Big G has speeded up, going strong.
well done
Looking forward to the race reports guys.
Yet again I cramped a bit,so I'm going to start strength exercises to try and help as it's bugging me now.
Other than that it was a really good race,I went out a bit too fast and hit 5k in 23:30,settled into a decent rythym but at 11 mile my legs seemed to really struggle and feel heavy,maybe I wasn't quite fully recovered or the hills on holiday had an effect,had to really kick myself along until 16 when they seemed ok again.At 21 the 3:30 pacers overtook me yet I was still about 2 mins under target.I knew I still had sandy lane to face so steadied a bit,had a steep downhill and uphill(downhill I cramped) and thought that wasn't too bad,but then realised it wasn't sandy lane and I still had to face the drag up. Got through that and realised 3.30 was gone,the only bit of the course I didn't like was the last 500m was around the grass on the racecourse and with the rain it was pretty sloppy and muddy.
Great organisation,plenty of drinks and Lucozade and high5 gels at alternating stations for whoever wanted them.Decent crowds in the villages and start and finish.And early bird offer later means I'll be signing for next year's today.
It is a good race, I'm not surprised you're signing up again.
Just seen Big G's result on Strava, amazing! (Jelly - it's forum protocol to let the runner post their result!
Shades - I'm not sure how accurate the wrist based monitor is, but it's fairly consistent in that similar types of runs get very similar readings. I can't remember how high it went in the VO2 test, will have to check, but certainly not as high as some of the readings I've seen from the Garmin. But I guess if I was using the Garmin for monitoring HR, it might make sense to calculate the zones with that too. Interesting to hear that MAF worked well for MF too.
An early (for me) 13 miles this morning as had to be back for football duty.
I haven't posted much lately as I've been rather despondent but today was Royal Parks. I definitely wasn't looking forward to it since I knew I couldn't run, and I was also pretty tired this morning thanks to my neighbour singing in his bathroom last night which roused me from my slumber and I had trouble going back to sleep. Bah.
Seeing all the runners on the tube usually makes me happy but instead I felt rather envious and grumpy. But then I got talking to a girl and we had a nice chat on our walk from Victoria and it was good to have someone to chat to in the loo and bag queues (both long!)
I started one start back from the one I was meant to be in, but I wasn't fussed seeing as I was walking. It was certainly odd to be starting at a walk but I adopted a fast pace and tried to stay out of everyone's way. I should add that, after queueing for quite a while, my back was hurting rather a lot so I was dealing with some pain for most of it. It was fortunate that the weather was lovely so the sights we passed looked nice which helped to distract me somewhat.
The one nice thing about walking is that you get to see more of the silly stuff - the people trying to run in daft costumes (there were at least two dinosaur costumes, two stormtroopers and a wookie blasting out the Imperial march as they passed, and a whole troupe of morris dancers with accordions). I was able to chat to a couple of people - I spent most of mile 2 talking to an injured runner who stopped to walk for a while and had a few other brief exchanges along the way.
Originally I thought I'd take around 3 hours 15-20 to complete it, but when I finally got to mile 11 I realised I could get in under 3 hours if I really gunned it. I turned on my walking turbo thrusters and powered though (I passed a lot of the run-walkers and a surprising amount of slower runners while I was walking flat out).
I don't know my official time yet, but I came in at a smidge under 2 hrs 59 according to my Garmin, so whilst this is a personal worst for a HM by a long way, I'm actually rather pleased with my walking prowess.
So, no regrets about doing it. Pretty tired now but I feel less ruined than I normally would after a half, although my back and groin are aching a fair bit.
Looking forward to hearing all the gory details from Big G. Bet he's got his head in a beer by now.
Cal - Well done on still doing that race.. and coming out with a fine walking time too. Don't be down about your injury. It will pass. My tendonitis has finally gone and it feels great to run properly again, after being injured you really appreciate being not injured. That's not very good english but you know what I mean I hope.
Shades - I've used that figure for my max HR as both marathons were well paced (for once lol) and I finished them with a sprint. The first was from my marathon PB two years ago and my second was from La Rochelle last November where I ran just to HR and again managed a fast last km. On both occasions I knew I couldn't last very long at that pace, was giving everything and had pins and needles in my fingers.; both occasions showed the same figure too. I've also had this figure, or close to it on the rare occasions I manage to get any long speedwork training in. I didn't get near this for my last HM race, or the end of Blaye marathon in May as then I just felt too tired to run fast. Anyway, I use it to give me a rough idea of what effort I should be running my training runs at the moment. Maybe I should do a proper HADD test to find out. But then maybe I won't
Thank you, my trip to Wales went ok. I brought my dad back with me to stay with us for a bit here afterwards. I'd sorted off some time off work so told dad we could take it easy driving down here, break the journey up, stop and see things on the way, spend a bit of time together and enjoy the journey etc. Unfortunately my dad just wanted to "get there" and we zooomed down non stop - my 70 year old dad wild eyed at the wheel knocking back cans of Red Bull with the window wide open. An experience not to be repeated (for me anyway.. I was petrified!)
Managed my 30k long run this morning in spite of feeling groggy with a bit of a head cold so glad to cross that one off. Was a bit faster than last time too but still just hanging in there at the top end of my pace range. The words "teeth" and "skin of" come to mind
Home and scrubbed up and I'm actually really happy now.Ive took off 50 mins in a year and 28 mins in my last 2 races.1 more HM in a few weeks then that's racing done for this year (probably) Will be after some tips on how I can lose another 16mins though over the next 8 months.
Just seen my splits,some error at 20k,it shows 10-20 took 1hr 8 then a sub 31 20-30
Big G - amazing result - neg split get in! I actually managed a neg split today (only my second ever), but, uh, I don't think it counts in a walking race.
Cal - well done that's impressive walking. I thought you were maybe staying off the thread as you were so fed up being injured, lots of folk do that. I hope tomorrow that maybe you'll start to see an improvement in your injuries. As you walked so well maybe you could try a run/walk method of keeping your fitness up and it will get you out and about.
mamafox - you misunderstand! The highest HR at the end of a marathon, no matter how hard you sprint is not your MHR. It might be the highest in that race but it's not your MHR. It's not possible to run that near to your MHR at the end of a marathon as your body is tired. To find out your MHR you need to run on fresh legs, rested and recovered and it's actually easier to reach close to your max if you're unfit. You don't need to do a Hadd test either as in a Hadd test you don't run close to MHR so that would be pointless. A short race or an MHR test, hill reps is usually the preferred way, is the way to find out your MHR, not on anything longer.
That was one scary drive with your Dad!
Ian - 50 minutes off your marathon time this year is phenomenal. I saw that blip in your splits and thought something had gone wrong, injury, fallen over, and was so relieved at the 30km split to see you were back on track. Re further improvement, look at your mile splits and see the if there are any obvious parts of the race that need work.
Big G - congratulations again, that's a massive negative split. I'm so pleased everything went well for you, kit, fuelling, the start etc and your head was definitely in the right place today, a man on a mission in the 2nd half. Enjoy that steak, you've earned it.
Sorry, no new training paces as they are based on your half marathon time not your marathon time.
Lily - Well done!
Big G - Well done to you too!!
I've been out of action for the week. I managed a test run on Friday and it was a complete disaster so I made the decision to not run yesterday and i'm really glad i didnt as i've still been quite rough. Today has been the first day that i've felt relatively 'normal'.
Lily - Well done you.. a new PB!! You look fab in your photo too
Emmy - Healing vibes coming your way.
Big G - What a great race you ran, overtaking all those people must have been brilliant. Respect going out for the negative split too - now enjoy the rest of your time in Munich
Well done to you all on fantastic PB,s.
Cal- Well done today after all you've been through lately.
First run today since last Sunday only done 4 miles however it felt great to get the legs moving.
Ian - it's usually the last 6 miles for most runners too, but had you dropped by only 15 seconds a mile that would get you a sub 3:30 next time. It's hard to quantify the damage done by going off too fast, so I think it's that's the part of the race you need to work on next..
Emmy - you made the right decision, I'd guessed you'd had to DNS, but good to know you are now better
mamafox - No, you've probably been training at the right heartrate for base training, it's almost impossible to base train at too low a HR. You don't do Hadd anyway, you do Maffetone which doesn't use your MHR for your base training HR. Unless you mean your P & D speedwork as I remember Big G saying that can be done to HR or to pace.
Steven - tut tut, a whole week before you've run after a race, if you want to run your 3 marathons next year you will need to start doing recovery runs the day after your race and back into easy training by the Wednesday
Very mild this morning, back to short sleeves again. Wore my new race shoes and new race socks as a little test run, OK with my heel. Need another run in them this week as the laces are a little too tight, elastic laces need a couple of runs to just get quite right.