Shades Marathon Training

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  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    10 miles today,decided to make it a little harder by doing my hilly loop but took it nice and easy.
    Has anyone done a night marathon before? Logistically the times work but I'm unsure on how it will work with pacing etc,as I'm generally a bit slower in the dark,but dont know if it will be the same in a race.
  • I done 8 miles this morning.

    Adding unknown bits on to my routes is dodgy when it's pitch black, big pot hole this morning, fortunately no more than a soaking, guess it could've been worse!

  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2020
    Cozy - the trouble is carrying sports drinks, which is why a lot of runners use gels for fuel and alternatives for electrolytes.    You can get gels with electrolytes, but most don't have electrolytes.

    We'll await your Dragon's Den debut. :) 

    Be careful running in the dark. :o   That's a decent distance before work too!


    Ian - I take it you mean something like Bilbao marathon?   Not an off road self navigate toughie through the night such as Iain did fairly recently.

    The negative of night races is that you're running at a time unfamiliar to your body clock.  City night races are lit by street lights and if you were thinking of Tromso then it doesn't get dark at night at that time of year so it's like early dusk.

    I haven't done a marathon at night, I've done a couple of 12 hour races starting at 6pm and they were tough.


    Great circuits class today, followed by good lower body session in the gym which was lovely and quiet.

  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    Shades,-It is antwerp,trying to find one before our September holiday and it falls on that weekend.I do most of my running after work so think I'd be ok on that side.
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Ian - I can't get onto the race website but it says starts in daylight and finishes in the dark, but it will all be street lit, don't know what time it starts.   But you run a marathon in 3 hours so it won't be that late for you.  The negative of a city evening race can be a build up of pollution from a day of traffic, but having never been to Antwerp I don't know how relevant that might be.

    Luxembourg is at about the same time of the day, some of my club went there a couple of years ago and had a tortuous time as the weather was so hot, but that's at a different time of year.
  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    Shades-I'll try and find out about the traffic as I hadn't considered that,other than that its tallin or vilnius and no easy flights from up here.Jut had a quick look and it starts at 6.30,sundown is 8 so half in dusk,half in night.
  • I didn't want to do anything too speedy this week as I'm doing a 10K on Sunday (the stupidly expensive Winter Run, which I entered on the whim and then regretted when I got into Japan due to a) cost and b) timing - though I am hoping it'll be fun at least) so I decided I'd throw some MP miles into my 12 miler.

    I decided to go out after rush hour (partly because I didn't want to have to deal with any frost, and and partly because I wanted to enjoy the sunshine, even it it's quite nippy out) so I did the first six miles at an easy pace, then the next two a bit quicker (9:40s, which was my MP in 2018 - early 2019) with the aim of hitting 9 minute miles for the next few. The first mile felt pretty fast, effort-wise, and I glanced at my watch and it was saying 9:05, which I thought was good enough, but when I hit the mile it came up as 9:18. Fail. So tried a bit harder and...fail again, 9:13. So I picked it up again and my breathing was becoming pretty audible and this time it was 8:44, which is closer to HMP (although it felt like 10K pace), so I didn't do a great job there either. After that I did the last mile as a cool-down and finished a smidge under 2 hours.

    I'm still not sure how the same pace can feel so much easier during an actual race - it's not just mental, I can actually talk to people rather than breathing like someone sawing through a log. It's like some kind of voodoo, I swear.
  • Shades - Strava tells me I was on the road for 5:22am! The most annoying thing about the watery pot hole was that I missed a turn (as it was a wee added on bit of a run) so when I turned back I then proceeded to stick my foot in a shin deep puddle! As I said, could've been worse than a wet foot!

    Cal - I agree, voodoo race pace is the strangest thing ever. Also, it seems no matter how slow I run my HR remains within about 10 bpm, I'm still getting to grips with easy runs so I'll report back on this in due course!

  • Well quite, you could roll your ankle like I did! :D
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Ian, I've not done a night race.  I have looked at Bilbao in the past but never entered it.

    Had an awful 6.5 miler this morning.  Not sure why but felt very ploddy and then to top it off the last 2.5 miles I had stomach issues, so not good at all.  Definitely one to forget.

    Also, I went into the GP and the prices for a certificate were very different to what I was told over the phone the other day, starting at £98, with a check up required.  I queried why what I was told over the phone was so different, and was told by the manager that I must have been informed incorrectly.  I'm not paying that, so I walked back out again.  Shame, because unless I can get it sorted elsewhere, I won't be doing Annecy as that price is very prohibitive - i.e, way more than the flights!
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    edited February 2020
    I, reluctantly, have just messaged a friend who is a GP.  He does Torbay Half most years and I knew him from when I had my Caterham.  He lives nearby so if he's not able to do it, then I think I'll give the race a miss as I don't really want to go down the forgery route.  Shame though.
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Big G - you can get a certificate online.  I believe one is a Skype type docs appointment the other type is a  detailed questionnaire.

    But I'm sure your friend will oblige.

    £98 is taking the p...
  • Shades, may have a look at price of chicken breasts in Aldi, last time I went they only done 1kg packs, pref bigger packs as less plastic waste.

    Cal just shout when you fancy a parkrun.  Never fancied that winter run, I usually pop a 10k in my marathon plan early feb but usually find something a bit cheaper as I actually detest 10k, it just gives me an indictor where I am.

    Big G, certificate just seems to be a tick box exercise for races, but be an insurance thing, just annoying that docs charge a premium.  Hope you manage to get your GP friend to sign it, I agree wouldn't want to go down the forgery route.

    Iain, I really enjoyed Ranscombe when I did it, August Bank Holiday and dry.  Lovely Cakeathon event and ate by body weight in cake.

    Topolino I agree with Shades banking back to back long runs with get your legs used to running tired and also slow, when I was training for Manchester marathon when NDW50 was 6 weeks later I kept my normal marathon plan for 35-40 miles a week but added another long run instead of a short run.  

    Ian if you don't want to travel too much Dartford have a midnight marathon, I know its popular (sells out) don't know it's its any good.

    Cozy, I tend to only run in the light, which I need to overcome for a 50 miler in November.  Glad you only got a wet foot!

    Yesterday was a hard slog 5km on a treadmill, didn't fancy a outside run.  This morning managed 7 miles, felt okay, just need to keep on steady and gradually increasing the distances.

  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Robert - I don't know about the size of the packs in Aldi.   I don't buy chicken breasts, prefer the thigh fillets, tastier and thigh meat more nutritious so I'm told.  :)
  • Shades, unfortunately slimming world only allows Chicken breasts... unsure why the other half bothers.... it just seems to be a social outlet no one loses any weight
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Shades, unfortunately slimming world only allows Chicken breasts... unsure why the other half bothers.... it just seems to be a social outlet no one loses any weight
    Well don't tell SW.   ;)
  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    edited February 2020
    Rob-It's not so much a night race I am after,just one that particular weekend and that came up,as for Aldi 1.8kg is the biggest they sell in our region.
    Cozy-That has nearly caught me out a few times in the past,hence my after run works now are nearly always the same route so I am aware of most hazards.
    Cal-Think we all know that feeling and wonder how it happens,my wife is currently on the disbelieving stage that she can run faster over 26.2 than she has over 20 in training.
  • Rob, try Lidl if you have one near - they do big packs.
    One of my clubmates did the Dartford Midnight Marathon - it actually starts much earlier in the evening so most folks should be done by midnight (and that's the slow ones).
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    I see Mo Farah has pulled out of the Big Half.   Mild achilles niggle apparently.  However, I suspect he's not able to take on Bekele, we all know Farah only likes to take part in a race he thinks he can win.
  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    Shades-That was my thoughts when I seen Bekele was in,or that Bekele was treating it as a training run only.
    Went for 6 after work,it's been a long time since I've done this so smashed lots of my Strava records.Tried for MP and it came out a bit faster,felt a tough effort but happy to hit consistent paces.
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Shades, I've had a quick look around for Skype or a questionnaire facility, but it seems problematic.  I think if my GP acquaintance can't do it, it's game over for me for that race.  I did message a Trotter who now lives in France (Dave D) to see if he had any advice or workaround, and sadly he didn't.

    I've been sorting out logistics for a couple of races.  It seems OTT, but I've decided to fly to Manchester.  The train would have been my preferred way of travelling, but it was much too costly, even if I split the tickets.  Crazy that flights can be so much cheaper.  I would have driven but it's a long way from here and in the end flying seemed easier all round.  It's Flybe so hoping everything will be fine.  

    Also, I've booked Frankfurt.  OH has that weekend off, I mentioned it to her and she said "book it", so I did :) 
  • Ha ha, there's been a lot of similar thought on Facebook, Shades. Well, he will have to take on Bekele and Kipchoge in London, and he won't win that.
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2020
    Ian - Bekele won't be using the Big Half as a training run, that's not what they do.  Isn't the Big Half organised by London Marathon?  I suspect it's part of his London deal and also good PR to highlight  Kipchoge/Bekele at the marathon.

    Well done on your training, I can tell you are marathon hungry :) and ready for a race.

    Big G - I can well believe that the plane is cheaper than the train for Manchester.

    That's great news about Frankfurt, I think you'll enjoy that marathon especially the finish in the Festhalle, it's really special.

    Cal - is Mo running London?    I thought he'd decided not to run so he could focus on his track comeback.  I thought he said he will do London in 2021?   Or did I imagine that ;)  


    Due to do an ILTHR run today but I had a really bad night's sleep plus I'd done a glute session in the gym yesterday so when I got up I felt a bit weary.   So I decided just to run easy instead, but once I'd done the first mile I felt good and conditions were good, no wind, so did my ILTHR after all and it was the best one I've done so far re pace.  I felt good too, normally I'm wishing for the end but not today.   Love my Under Armour shoes for this sort of run, I bought them last year for £24 and they are brilliant.

    Pilates and gym this morning. 
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Keith - good luck today for day one of the Quadzilla.   Hope you got some decent training in.
  • Lol er reask the question on sunday and i'll say yes cos of the prior 3 days. Hippo is there so i'll not be last and as its one of Foxy's there will probably be others who are slow too. I shall take it relatively easy to start with as its kinda icy/frosty right now. Sunday's weather could be fun too wet and very windy.
    I shall aim for around 5.5 hours each day but see how i feel and trying to remember if i feel good not to go to fast first few days. In theory based on past experience third day is when the DOMS kicks in as its usually 2 days for me.
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Shades, well done on your training.  Yes, yours and Ian's reports on Frankfurt made me look at it.

    Good luck Keith.  I'm a bit worried about your comment on DOMS coming in at day 3.  I've got my first triple planned next month....

    My GP friend can't do that medical certificate.  He says it's a bit dodgy doing it as really he needs access to my medical records to be able to do it properly.  But it does mean I can't see me doing that Annecy race.
  • Big G - rubbish news about the docs certificate, hopefully there is some solution for it.

    Keith - Good luck in Quadzilla, what is it? sounds tough!

    Shades - I'm currently looking at cheap options for trainers, £24 would be great. I tend to wear new balance fresh foam range but I may branch out!

  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    Big G-Well done on booking Frankfurt,it's a great race,just dont get too despondent when you see the finish then run away from it.
    Keith-Good luck.
    Cal/Shades-Mo isn't on the list for this year and I reckon I'll scare him off If I get gfa for 2021.
    Shades-When I said training run,I meant that he may only be 95% fit as he will be just finishing London training,I'm really interested to see how he goes as fully fit and motivated he is the only one who can give Kipchige a race.
    Yes I am ready for the races now,After a day or 2 rest I always think I'm race ready but know I need to rest more to give it my best,then just the old question of how to pace it.
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Keith - so I take it, no training done...tut tut.   But that's your choice and you obviously like the pain/challenge.   Hope the weather isn't too bad for you especially on Sunday when the storm arrives.

    Big G - you won't get DOMS as such in a triple, tired legs yes, DOMS no.

    That's bad news re your certificate, I had a doctor friend do mine and she's never seen my medical records.   Buy a stamp is your only option.   You can understand why marathon runners don't bother with French races except some do Paris perhaps, such a farce.   

    Cozy - which NB Fresh Foam do you have?  I have them on my wish list, can't remember which model.

    The Under Armour shoes I have are Charged Bandit 3.   But don't buy shoes without some research first.   Try this website, 
    https://runrepeat.com/
    put in your favourite shoes and at the foot of the page it will come up with similar shoes of alternative brand/models.   Shoes that fit right and suit you are really important, more important than price.

    Ian - ha, ha at scaring Mo off.   :) 

    Wait until you get to Seville, assess the course and the weather etc and how you feel.   And if all is well I think you need to be a little less cautious in the first half, just a little though. :) 

    Lovely Pilates class, we did some good hip stretches but my poor legs were aching by the end of the session.   Followed by a good gym session.
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