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Sub 3:15 - FLM 2009
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DD/K9 I'm with you on long run pace, very comfy at 8 m/m, feels odd to go slower.
DD, 'Just' has only 4 letters ;-) go for it! Boston is tough later on I believe though. What did you think of Lochaber? I've thought about going up there if FLM ballot follows its usual pattern.
Odeon, followed your exploits whilst lurking on the sub 3 thread. Great start in Edinburgh, I fancy just from knowing how to race the full 26.2 now you'll already know where to find those extra 5 minutes.
Odeon - wow, very impressive 3.19 on 3 months training. The sky is the limit for you, m'boy!
Forgot to say:
FLM 2001 4 weks training 11m longest run
4.29.
Lesson- Marathon is not like half where you can decide in pub night b4 and get round. Most painful yet satisfying experience until this year.
Humph- With you on long run. My problem now I've trained a bit is I can 7.30 for 10m at less than 70%MHR. (15.5m on sun 7.46mm at 69%) However, if I try and go quicker, Hr appears to shoot right up.
I know this would imply more speedwork, tempo etc. Is this the only way say to get up to say 7mm at 75%.
I'm definitely in the I want to cruise round bracket. Working hard 4 3 hours is not fun!!
DD- I had same sort of HM time as you b4 ed. managed 1.38 and 1.41 splits so definitely the speed is there. It would be a case of reaching 40-50m 4 weeks out for a couple of weeks.
Lochaber looked great but an awful long way to go 4 me unfortunately.
Did HM 3 weeks ago. Got down to 1.31 with 6.38 last mile. Good base for current schedule.
Rome is my main one nxt yr.
Would love to do Boston- Need 3.10 in next 9 years tho. Mmmmmm....
By the way. Have just bought Garmin 305. Anyone else use theirs. I think its fantastic piece of kit. A real "What did I do before I had this!"
Looks like a good base is there but it needs some icing.
**I'd say that tempo runs at 80 - 85% would improve your 75% efficiency whilst continuing to build the aerobic base. Have a look at the P & D section on lactate threshold training. This is key to race success since the body needs to be used to working at harder efforts or the HR drift will get you big time. 'Real' speedwork, mile reps etc. will help later on in the schedule also.
Do you have a mid distance run at target pace on your regular schedule? What time do you think you could race 10 miles in?
** Caveat emptor: I am only a minute quicker than you over the marathon so what do I know!!! but based on shorter distance times have at least some potential to improve, hopefully, next time, please....
I do have say 10m with 5 at target pace. Last time I did this it felt quite comfortable and Hr was below 170. The 305 has helped me run at even pace. My splits for hm have been anything from 6.20 to 7.20. Really poor.
I have a 10m PSUK race in September. I've never broken 70mins for 10m going through in 70.15 on my PB half (Had food poisioning and diarrheoa night b4) so was really shocked with time.
65-66mins- 6.35mm is it?
A long blast would be good but calf niggle at mo as hopefully shoes r on way out (400-500m to the good). Don't really want to change the P and schedule too much. I'll see how that gets me. Have just joined running club. First night this evening. Hopefully this'll be a boost with some local races.
Without trawling back, when's ur next marafun?
10 mile pace of 6:35 sounds good to me. I managed 65:32 back in Feb mid way through a marathon training cycle. Sounds like your HM PB could be lowered quite a bit without all the pre race excitement!
I followed P & D for FLM this year and found them really good so stick with them if you have the base there already which it sounds like you have, they'll introduce the other elements you'll need. Closer to race day sort out a pace plan based on both m/m and HR, this gives you a fall back if the pace does not happen on the day for some reason.
No marathons for me this autumn, so something around FLM time I guess is next. Interim goals are a 10 miler in October and maybe HM in November both aiming for PBs, with some shorter club championship and x-country events spread around.
Hope the club night went well, best thing I ever did for my running was to join a club.
Didn't bother running and first rest day for 16 days.
Was hoping for several groups and just slot in.
Gonna train on my own and maybe go for lr with them on Saturdays.
I've been running 2 years now, and done 3 marathons and an ultra in the past year, best time of 3:41 at Belfast having aimed at 3:30 (spent the 2nd half puking!). Only raced 2 of the marathons though. 10k time is 40 minutes and was done 2 weeks ago, and did a 1:32 HM / 1:08 10 miler back in April. Looking at running 65 minutes or so at the Cabbage Patch 10 in mid October.
I'll be doing the triple, in late October, and possibly Clarendon Way and Luton too, but none of these will be raced, and they will all be good for building a base I hope. I'm hoping this and a more disciplined approach to long runs (I'm hoping to join a club soon) will make 3:15 a realistic goal.
Is it a realistic goal? Hope the club has more people than yours Odeon1085!
You have about the same times as me over those distances. I ran 3:28 last year on the back of three weeks off with flu a month before FLM. I'm sure I would've broken 3:15 otherwise and I'm sure you will too. (Unless you get the flu of course!)
can i chip in here as well please?
i'll(hopefully) have an automatic spot for FLM 2007 after 5 rejections in a row.
i've run it twice before for charity with a best time of 3-15-something in 2003. half-mara pb is 1-25, so i'm hoping i should be able to sneak under the 3-15 barrier this time.
looking forward to some like-minded banter on this thread!
g-d.
I'll be running 40-50 miles a week for my autumn marathons, and then easy recovery miles in December, before building hopefully to 55-60 for the spring marathon. I don't do much speedwork though, unless a monthly 5k time trial counts. I will introduce more MP work this time though, which counts as speedwork in my book.
g-dog, you should be well under 3:15 if you can run 1:25 for a half!
i think my half/mara time discrepancy is due to a lack of big mileage weeks. i can do the good quality threshold work for a half, but if i try to get big quantity in, i end up picking up over-use injuries.
this summer i've been trying to sort this by doing triathlons, and spending a lot of time of the bike to put in base endurance which (i hope???) will be transferrable to running base. i'm hoping to do FLM2007 on four (quality) runs a week plus a weekly long bike ride (for endurance base).
any thoughts? is 3-15 on four runs a week do-able?
i'm sure there was a thread about three runs a week marathon training somewhere...
it'll be interesting to see how we all go on big versus low mileage schedules.
Vienna was a good event, nice flat course with Mozart's music (played live by the Vienna PO) and broadcast from speakers along the route .... crazy! I had hoped for about 3:20 at best, so was really pleased - one of those occasions when all went well.
Have gone down hill since then though (shin splints not helping!). Need to get back in to some serious traing now (and shed a few pounds gained) in time for the Clarendon Way XC marathon on 1 October. Another good event.
I'd like to see if I can break 3:15 in FLM next year - much depends on how well my speeed work training goes (hate it!). So, count me in too.
OtR
I'm with the 3 times a week lot, highly injury prone above 30mpw so rarely exceeding 25mpw at peak. PB 3.10 and dfefinitely room to improve. I'd be interested in how any other low mileage types structure their training.
Since I got back I've achieved best times for each one of my regular training routes.
I have 7 weeks to Loch Ness Marathon and I'm hoping to join you On the Run with a GFA time before the closing date for FLM07! I think 3.15 really is in my sights if I stay healthy and injury free till 1 October.
Treadmill sessions with lots of speed work is also surprisingly easy just now and I'm feeling good. I have a 400Metres club champs this evening, but still made myself do me session this morning at the gym.
OTR I also am 54, but on the doorstep of 55. First marathon was just after 50th birthday and each year I get a bit quicker!! How does that work? LOL Wonder how long that will go on for. Did you see the 51 year old Israeli in the European Championships with a 2Hrs 20 Time?!!!!!!
Good to see the thread kicking into life again and quite a few new names cropping up to, welcome one and all, together we can spur each other on!
I ran Vienna06 too 3:02 (age49) just outside my PB. Didn't think it was a flat course, and I found it slightly too hot for me, but not as hot as the year before when I ran it in 3:17 (28 degrees!).
Even you have to admit that the last 2k slight uphill to the finish was pretty hard work, and the section between 10k and 20k was a steady uphill grind.
I reckon if you were in similar shape with cooler weather, you could go sub 3:05 in London, and perhaps faster than that if you tried Cardiff, which is an even flatter marathon course.
Take no notice of your age, don't undersell yourself, go for the sub 3.
Aberdonian The general held consensus is that regardless what age you start, if you work at it you should improve for 5-6 years before you start to come off the boil.
Bruce Tulloh the old British international did some research into it, and found many veterans new to running were producing PB's more than 5 years after taking up the sport.
I started at 46 and I'm still convinced I'll eventually get my sub3, possibly this year at Abingdon, or maybe at FLM07.
Even if I don't, I've had a bloody good fun trying.
Previous FLM 2005 sub 3.15 effort blighted by injury, recovering now and set to attempt 2007, (subject to getting in).
I'm in my fifties too. But I've been running for more than 5-6 years, so I guess my best days are behind me . . .
Paolini-Was part of Hilly's sub 3.15 thread for 2005. Really enjoyed the thread and was amazed how much it helped. Got in with a club place that time but six weeks before the big day tore a calf muscle. The next run I did after being OK'd to run was the FLM, unfortunately couldn't race hard because of the missed training but had a great run round chatting with the other runners and enjoying the crowds and sunshine. Seem to remember mentioning on the thread at the time it was the first time I'd enjoyed a run in months because of the focus on hard training and working round training runs like the East Hull 20 (Sorry Wardi).
Poacher: my 3-runs-a-week training plan is going to be something like this:
runs:
1x interval work at track
1x tempo run
1x long run
other stuff:
1x long slow bike ride (3 hours+)
1x tempo session on turbo trainer (bike)
1x long slow swim
i have no idea if the bike and swim work will be of any use for marathon running, but they should keep my hand in for next tri season.