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  • MennaniaMennania ✭✭✭
    Instant pace is pants. HR off the wrist is pants. Ave lap pace based on manual lap on race days is great, except they dont do that on the 235.  Like everything it is a tool to be used as a guide only. 

    Anything below half distance I have no meaningful PRs in as I dont race them - 5k is 17.28. 10k is 35.48, 10 miles is 67mins. I didnt hate  the 5k TT I did the other day as much as I though RJR, it can be brutal but even if you hare off like a loon for the first mile (as i did) you can at least console yourself with 'only 2 miles to go'. 
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited June 1
    Joe - if you are running solo pbs, you'll smash it when racing comes back.

    CD - im sure you'll get the eye of the tiger back when the lunchtime sessions can come back.

    Menn - you'd smash all those pbs given a good run at them. Im similar to you in that i dont train for shorter distances.

    13m tonight
  • runjoerun91runjoerun91 ✭✭✭
    edited June 1
    Good ride that CD. Ditchling Beacon out and back? Shame on the parkrun front but not overly surprising. There ought to be scope for some time trials (which I remember Banstead Woods parkrun used to be called) but people would have to be realistic about their expected time!

    Menn - That's a very familiar story. I tend to kick myself a little that I don't do a bit more racing in the marathon build up when i'm in quite good shape. I wasn't a million miles off my 10k pb for the first 10k of the solo half I did in March and that was over 2 months out from my target marathon. I think marathon training gets you in reasonable shape across pretty much all distances.

    TR - A few people said that to me about my solo half but I'm not 100% convinced. I'm not too bad at motivating myself, the watch helps with the pacing and then I get to choose my time, my course and I don't have to travel to do it. I guess time will tell. That said, I wouldn't expect to do a pb solo marathon, there comes a time on feet where you need a little support.

    The other half fancied a run today (out of character) so I set her a 1.6 mile loop and I ran it twice. I thought it'd be a bit of a top gear challenge-style finish but she cut her loop short and beat me by quite a way. Still, I appreciated extra motivation, knocking out a couple of back-to-back sub 6 min miles in the process.
  • OuchOuchOuchOuch ✭✭✭
    edited June 2
    SJ - That sounds like a grand run, running uphill is soo much better.
    CD
    - Am a bit like you at this time (apart from not being so fast and as good on a bike).  I am sure we will be 'up and at them' when the marathons return.  
    RJR - I reckon racing can be worth >10 secs per mile so that solo half was a cracker. A scalps a scalp - though shocked when my wife beat me running forwards to my backwards over 300m last night. 
    Menn - Same here, I only train for marathons asnd shorter races I see as just fast marathon pace practice.  Dont think I've ever run a 10m race.       
    TR - That must have been a warm 13m!

    220 May miles, surprised the same as May 2019, though I was coming off 2 marathons in April 2019.  Aims for June, get some longer runs under my belt as start to train for the Dartmoor mara at end of August and a few > 6.30 mm runs - less than 15 of those May miles were under 6.51. 
  • WardiWardi ✭✭✭
    CD.. that's a grand day in the saddle, good distance.  Certainly excellent biking weather up to now.  Agree re Parkruns, if they tried a gradual return of, say, 50% venues the Parkrun tourists would simply travel to the nearest one, no way to control the numbers.
    OO.. is the hernia still behaving?
    TR.. nice midweek miles, looks like you might get a cooler run tomorrow.
    Joe.. I once offered to pace Mrs Wardi in a 10m race (sub 85) as I was coming back from a niggle.  By the last mile I felt like the pied piper as the word had got round what time I was pacing for and I had about a dozen in tow!  
    Menn.. on my Garmin 230 av. pace per current mile is my most useful reading.  Sufficient to let me know if I'm slacking off.  
    After 5m steady yesterday I decided on a longish bike outing today as it is forecast to be the last warm day for a week or more.  43.3 sunny miles in the saddle this morning. They are resurfacing/gritting a lot of my favourite country lanes ATM so it is pot luck on a distance like this when you might get a spell of loose grit.  :/
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    Joe - youll smash those times in a proper race, id manage about 5m of hnp tops.

    OO - sounds a good plan, ive decided to stop wondering what shall i do this week, and get back on the P and D(ish) i normally do.

    Wardi - nice bike ride, is the leg behaving? I dont mind running in the heat, and im still working anyway so last nights run was 4.30, todays was 7am.

    8m easy
  • MennaniaMennania ✭✭✭
    RJR - nice - also we all know you let her beat you  ;)
    Wardi - looking forward to some proper weather for a change. Not this for lizards stuff.
    TR - almost a double that. Getting back to P&D about now might prove optimal timing.

    I had a pretty carp run today - was supposed to be 9 x 3.5mins (4 at 10k, 5 at 5k) and I could barely hit half mara pace for the first 3 so stopped and gave myself a talking to - which didnt do the job as I binned the next rep half way through. Anyway salvaged 3 x 3 mins at 5k (ish) to complete a 5 mile session of Junk miles.  Chalk it all down to fatigue from  hard training and being a tool for running intervals at midday in the heat -  these things happen - 8  miles banked :)

    Had a Bombadier and wainwrights tonight to relax everything down. Jolly nice.
  • WardiWardi ✭✭✭
    TR.. may be my optimism or imagination but it does seem to have improved in the last couple of days so I'll see how the run goes tomorrow.  Dropping from 23 to 13 degrees here and wet apparently. 

    Menn.. you have put in some hard sessions lately so I would put this one down to experience and move on.  Bet those beers went down well.
  • MennaniaMennania ✭✭✭
    Wardi - good news on the leg - hopefully a good run in the cool for you today. Not sweating that session at all, got a bit of a beast tomorrow so see how that goes. I was rolling after those two beers - had to go sit down for a bit :D
  • saintjasonsaintjason ✭✭✭
    Wardi - good news indeed. Hopefully the testing run today goes well. We started a diy project last weekend, sanding all internal doors, so typical the weather has turned. 

    TR - you're not the first person I've heard is getting back into p&d recently. Must be that time from rescheduled London. 

    Menn - as Wardi says you've been ticking along very nicely hitting your training paces. Forget about the one thay didnt go well. Onwards. 

    OO - when we do finally get some races to run in, the faster MP stuff is where I want to improve. I've gotten away with 10km per week of those miles but I reckon I should be building it up to more like 10+miles, possibly broken up into 2 or 3 efforts at the end of long runs. If I'm going to improve any further I reckon this is an easy box to tick. That and maybe a few more mpw. I've never run those horrible looking 15miles at MP sessions from p&d. Too scary without a number on. I guess that's where the half marathons come in handy but I always run those as HM and not training runs. 

    Club coach is still emailing sessions for people so I decided to do a pyramid tempo session last night along a busy canal tow path. 3, 6, 9, 6, 3 mins efforts. Felt pretty good even though I was dreading the session and almost canned it during the 15min warm up. It had the desired effect anyway as I was working hard and HR nicely up into tempo zone. 

    Up into the hills after work today with a couple of buddies. It will be soggy now though. 


  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    Menn - still a good session bagged, good attitude. Sounds like you need a bit of volume in your beer training though.

    Wardi - hopefully its real improvement......a damp run today here, but its still warmish so no probs.

    SJ - 18 weeks til vlm (or IoW) started this week. Nice one on the session, a little bit of quality is a good idea.

    In my wu today, i had a very non distanced face to face with a guy on an mtb as he came round a blind corner on a cyclepath striaght at me, we were both gripped on to opposite sides of the handlebars for a second or 2.........then into the 4m LT  - its been a while, 6.11 av couple of undulations and 180 turns so should be able to get nearer to 6mm in a few goes (im keeping this as a weekly for a while, as a bit of quality is what i regularly lack).

    10m inc 4.
  • WardiWardi ✭✭✭
    edited June 3
    SJ.. you did well to dodge all the tow path pedestrians at speed!  Nice session.
    TR.. good work on the LT pace, definitely better weather for those who struggle in the heat.

    6.3m done on York-Selby cycle/pedestrian track.  Amazed at the difference the rain made.. I reckon there were only about 10% of the folk out compared to last week.  The rain was light but persistent so a t-shirt, gilet and shorts were ok for the conditions.  Can still feel the affected leg but definitely less painful, plus I can push off from it much better now whereas it was too numb last week.  Small progress but I'll take it for now.  

  • saintjasonsaintjason ✭✭✭
    edited June 4
    TR - I have had a few close encounters with both runners and cyclists on the tow path. Mainly people second guessing what I am doing and ending up doing the opposite of what I expected. No harm done in your close shave by sounds of it as the LT segment of your run is promising especially on an undulating course. I do my tempo runs on the aforementioned tow path so far easier way to run them, other users notwithstanding. 

    Wardi - As above I do have to shout an advanced "excuse me" in order to keep the pace up. Most of the time it works fine. Quiet up on the moors last night too because of the gloomy conditions. It's been hammered up there recently and a few moorland fires caused by disposable bbq's. Good news on the leg and at least you can get some running done as you say. 

    Up in the hills again last night with some club mates. It was supposed to be around 16km / 10 miles but ended  up being almost 21km. Climbing wasn't so bad but descending wasn't pretty. I am slower coming down than going up especially on very technical paths. I say path but it was a poor excuse for a path :) Massive rocks to bimble over and lose footing everywhere. Quite pleased I got down without falling tbh. Another good workout anyway with 537m of climbing. 

    I am tempted to open P&D and have a look.
  • OuchOuchOuchOuch ✭✭✭
    edited June 4
    Wardi, glad your on the mend. My hernia pain has gone, maybe due to the cutback in mileage. 
    SJ, another good looking trail run, it is so easy to take a tumble. Agree with a longish mp run is tough work unless it's a HM race.
    Backing up an amazingly scenic and warm coastal path 11m run on Tuesday with a 10 mile progressive run last night, first time I've run this. Loved it, 7.10 for mile one, speeding up by 8 secs a mile to mile 6 and then 10 secs a mile to the finish, so miles 7-10 were 6.30, 6.20, 6.10, 5.59. Felt like a proper training workout without feeling wiped out and quite easy to manage the consistent acceleration. Was helped as my mate started his watch 300 metres before me so had someone to chase on the way back. 
  • runjoerun91runjoerun91 ✭✭✭
    OO - That's a great session, and cracking pacing by the looks of it. I could certainly learn a thing or two.
    SJ - That sort of climbing and distance would qualify as a fell run I think. Very nice! Your running sounds like my cycling, I'd rather go uphill than down. I mean cycling uphill is definitely slower but equally lower risk of injury / death!
    TR - Some sharp sessions you're throwing in. No surprise given the volume. Can only hope there's a marathon in the autumn/winter for you to tear up.

    11 miles today at a 7:15 average but with some progressing through the gears. Feeling a bit creaky early in my runs but fluid once I've warmed up. Hilly ride in the Cotswolds planned for Sunday so a couple of easy days before on the agenda.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited June 4
    Progress indeed wardi

    SJ - sounds a dangerous run to me

    OO - ome good work there, that progressive run was pretty sharp too. I only did 4m at that pace !

    Joe - thats pretty sharp, dont hurt yourself.

    Newport mara and cardiff 1/2 which were due in Oct have been cancelled, they say that they have been following (welsh ?) Govt guidance and its clear they cant have any mass participation events.......southampton have given up on their August socially distanced mara and cancelled too. I expect some vlm and brighton news soon.
  • WardiWardi ✭✭✭
    Nice progressive run OO, are you still planning on Malaga if travel etc is ok?
    Joe.. nice consistent pace for the MLR.  Are your niggles holding together?
    Good work in the hills SJ, descending is a skill by itself according to a couple of fell runner videos I've seen.
    TR.. one of the reasons I deferred Barca was the potential lack of tune up races, they already seem to be dropping like flies.

    Decided on a 7m test run today, mostly off road.  Pleasantly surprised to have my most pain free and enjoyable run since March.  The problem area is still there but it does seem to be waning by the day.  I won't count any chickens yet but if this disappears on it's own I will be tempted to put some champagne in the fridge after 3 months of frustration.  Fingers crossed!
  • runjoerun91runjoerun91 ✭✭✭
    Wardi - some reasons to be cheerful there it seems. I feel like I've had a number of false starts this year but no issues running in the past month now. Still a little annoyed with myself that I haven't been doing my exercises though.

    TR - It's funny, I don't see anything 7 min/mile plus as being particularly quick but maybe that's because of the P&D earlier in the year. When the long runs are TMP+10-20% that's 7:09 - 7:48 based on a 6:30 pace for the marathon. I think when you're only clocking 30 miles a week the paces can be pretty much whatever you want (avoiding injury of course) but when it gets up to 40/50/60+ miles a week you obviously need to be particularly mindful of pace so that you can get through the next days.

    That said, I had to have a quick look at P&D just now and realised i had GA down as 10%-20% slower than marathon pace when I could have stretched it to 25%. I can't complain too much though. Injury aside, it looked like I was in pretty good aerobic shape. A half thumbs up for P&D!
  • MennaniaMennania ✭✭✭
    SJ- Nice trail work - I find a gentle cough alerts people that theres a runner on the tow path these days.
    OO - Lovely progression run.
    TR - decent LT - will you drop the miles a bit to give room for the quality stuff?
    Wardi -  Everything crossed. All moving nicely forward hopefully.

    Was supposed to be a loon of a HMP session yesterday but put that back to Sat and did an 8 mile Hard steady effort which felt pretty strong.

  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    Wardi - all progress gratefully received.

    Joe - your average pace shows you must have run some quick miles within that run (for a person that reports issues at times), was my thought process....... The p and d 10% long runs are tough runs indeed.

    Menn - hope the hmp goes well, as before im only going to run singles so the easy days will between the min 6m up to the 11m of the 6 and 5 of the double, usually 7 or 8m is the intended idea.

    7m easy today
  • OuchOuchOuchOuch ✭✭✭
    Wardi - I've already entered the Malaga marathon, so yes 100%. You too? Also toying with the Madrid marathon a month earlier. As you say though all travel dependent. 
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    OO - when is malaga ? December.

    Did the P and D 16 inc 8mp today (although i did 17), same undulating, flat then hilly section for the effort as last wks 3x20. 8m came in av 6.35 which is solid on a blustery day on a lumpy route.

    Decent week with 10 inc 4LT, 2 x mlr and 17 inc 8mp.
  • OuchOuchOuchOuch ✭✭✭
    edited June 6
    TR - Cracking session again. Yes, Sunday 13. Flat, fast, scenic, great city, cheap as chips. A lot to like. Are you tempted? 
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    OO - sounds good, but im already entered into too many events, that i wont be able to run as they will either all be on top of each other in sep/Oct or in April/may. Also who knows what restrictions will still be in place over foreign travel and the associated quarantine etc.......indeed who knows if city marathons will even be allowed in December, i can see mass participation events next Spring still being as risk.......id love to go a flat mara (or 2) this year though.
  • runjoerun91runjoerun91 ✭✭✭
    Point taken TR. Quickest miles were a couple of 6:55s which are just opening up the legs a little really. Looks like you've had a good new week with a bit of extra focus. wont be a surprise to anyone though with your mileage!

    Reluctantly agreeing with others that marathons just aren't likely this year. they're not exactly essential and the lack of progress in the UK is a bit worrying. starting to get a bit worried for friends who's wedding is in October 
  • OuchOuchOuchOuch ✭✭✭
    18 hilly trail miles in 2.21, ran out of oomph 10 miles in, as didn't eat enough, so the rest of the run was a bit of a slog. Glad it's now d&d and 58 miles for the week. 
  • runjoerun91runjoerun91 ✭✭✭
    Blimey OO that's good going. especially if you didn't feel 100%.

    just shy of 50 miles on the bike this morning with 1200m of climb in the cotswolds. A few wobbly moments but on the whole a really enjoyable ride. See how the legs feel tomorrow and crack on with the 5k training.

    23 miles run / 50 bike this week
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    OO - 18 is a decet distance. I started to get a bit light headed by the end of my run yday, but thats probably due to the mp section. I'll take a gel with me next time.

    8m easy today, wasnt really up for it after 2hr walk with spo first, but was ok once i got going.
  • WardiWardi ✭✭✭
    Nice bike distance Joe, is it a road bike you've got?
    OO.. that's a tough run with the distance and undulations.  I know some folk do long runs on a black coffee but I do like to get something down me if I'm going to be out a while.
    TR.. nice work yesterday, bet that was hard work in the wind.

    Rain here until about 2pm so just been out for a chilly 6.4m.  Where have all the exercise brigade and cyclists gone?
    Re Malaga/travel generally.. after being semi stranded in Barca in March me & the OH have decided not to fly anywhere until all the signs of masks, lockdowns, 2 metres, quarantine etc are gone.  Travel can be onerous enough without that lot added in.  It might be ok in a few weeks or might still be here at Xmas so I'll keep an open mind as the weeks go by.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    Wardi - no wind today, as it was easy day !  I could still run into plenty of folks if i picked the right or wrong place to run.
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