FLM 09 - 3.45ers!

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  • My lack of long slow runs compared to take-it-as-it-comes tempo runs showed yesterday. My legs were absolutely fine and could easily have gone faster and for longer, but my cardiovascular fitness held me back. I was exhaling at a volume normally associated with tennis players.
  • Dont know if this helps, but I do LSR's as follows.

    Target Time for marathon per mile = x

    Half of LSR would be 20% slower than x

    The return would be 10% slower than x

    I also try to do the last couple of miles as fast as I can sustain to try and replicate race day fatigue!?!

    Also v.rap is correct, you need to do structured speedwork to improve VO2 max and crucially your running form.

    Anyone use a HRM?
  • Hi All,

    I too am undecided re; applying for a charity place now or when I get rejected from the ballot..... thinkI'll ponder on that one a little bit more.

    Unfortunatley Mr QQ has had to stay on at work for late meeting so my sociable monday evening run with the local club is off . Now I have no excuse not to do a tempo run tonight! Would actually prefer an 11 minute mile recovery run but don't think I can justify it My training plan is crying out for "structured speedwork"!

    Not yet got a HRM, Ripped dap but awaiting delivery of Garmin so will soon be well and truly in 21st century!

  • I don't have a HRM and don't plan to get one at the moment, though it's bound to happen eventually if I get to a plateau and need to make my training more logical.

    I like your LSR arrangement, RD :o)

    None of my speedwork so far has been structured, but I'll start that when I start following marathon schedules in late December (a bit early to allow for a skiing holiday in spring and build in a week of slack in case I get a significant niggle) and meantime try to build up a base of long runs. Abingdon will just be a see-what-needs-to-be-done kind of marathon.

  • Where is this article about LSR being race pace +2mins? Did someone say it was in RW? And was that paper version or online?

    I'm most intrigued.
  • HRR - the article is on P24 of October's RW "Arrested Development" and the text is in the answer to the first question. Not sure if it's online..

    QQ
  • Thanks QQ
  • Hello All!

    Bristol Half this weekend!!

    Not in very good shape at all, hoping for 2 hrs.

    Cardiff and Snowdonia marathons are looming large. Going to run / walk them. Will start training for (fingers crossed) London in December.

    Also, if I dont get into London going to do either Halstead or Lochaber.

    Any races this weekend peeps?
  • Good Luck with the Half RD !

    My next race is Macc half on 1st Oct. Then nothing planned until (hopefully) FLM . I think I will have to find some races over the winter months to keep me motivated.

    Feeling a little disheartned this week after poor tempo run on monday followed by equally bad speedwork session on wednesday. Hoping to enjoy my LSR this weekend particularly as I plan to go extra slow !!
  • Have a good race, RD :o) I'm looking forward to hearing how you get on.

    No racing for me this weekend. I'll do my pre-Windsor 12-miler tomorrow afternoon, then hopefully a gentle recovery run with a friend on Saturday. Next week I'll do just enough to stop me from losing confidence in my ability to run.

    There's a good half-marathon PB in my legs and I have to be careful not to sabotage it by doing too much at this late stage.

    Then 4 weeks to get ready for Abingdon. I don't expect to be able to run the full 26.2, but I would quite like under 4.30.




  • I have bought Runners World and found the offending article about long slow runs. Is the article suggesting that this +2 min mile pace is only in the run up to a race or is that generally?
  • It applies to training in general, HRR :o) I'm quite fortunate in being a slow runner who has speeded up, so I can easily run 9.45mm with good form.

    I'm definitely going to struggle at Abingdon. I did a 13.5-miler today, and the wheels came off about 9 miles. It was realtively easy to keep going knowing that there wasn't far to go, but if there had been 17 miles still to go ... :oS

    Windsor should be OK. I'd have to have a real 'mare on the day not to get comfortably under 2 hours.
  • Hello all! I feel a bit of a fraud posting here as I've entered the Paris Marathon '07, which is the week before the FLM. But as it's my first marathon, my fears and anxieties seem to match a lot of other peoples on here.

    Compared to the ballot, Paris entry was a doddle! Apply online with credit card and confirmation that you had a place came back within 30 secs.

    Am now, just trying to build up to a consistent 40km per week by December, and then try and inject some more speed and to lengthen the long runs.
  • Welcome & good luck Andy.

    I had an absolute mare today at Bristol. 2 hrs. 17 mins 10 secs.

    My worst ever performance by a around 30 mins!

    Considering my pb. is 1.40 I think you will agree the Dap had a bad day. Cant really complain, my training has been ****

    Ah well, worse things happen at sea ;)

    Everyone's runs go ok today?
  • Ah.... Sorry about your mare RD. Still you sound quite philosophical about it and with a P.B. of 1:40 ( Wow) I'm sure you'll get back there !

    Hi Andy, Bet it's nice to know you've got a definate place for Paris... bet that helps to motivate. Good luck with the training. I was speaking to a friend last night who got his marathon P.B. in Paris, if that helps at all !

    I had quite a good long run yesterday but finished with a sore knee so thinking my tapering might come a week earlier than planned so as to be fit for the 1st October.



  • Hi,

    Found this thread and thought it fits with what I'm trying to achieve. I have got accepted on the St John Ambulance Team for 2007 FLM so am really starting to step up my training. I have a 10K this weekend and am hoping to improve on my PB of 50:05. I am also doing the Henley Half on the 8th Oct and hope to beat my PB of 1:59:28! Training has been going ok, but I too am confused about doing these long runs at such a slow pace...it feels like I am taking a big risk that I would be able to up the pace on the day itelf when I am not used to it.

    Anyway I'm sure time will tell.

    Good luck for anyone doing races next weekend and hope everyones training goes well this week.

  • Andy and happy hermit, welcome aboard :o)

    Sorry to hear you had a bad'un, RD, although you have the reassurance of knowing at least part of the reason. I understand that the race organisation was a bit chaotic at Bristol too! When's your next race?

    I've been taking things easy this weekend after my long run on Friday. I did a pleasant 3-miler at 11-minute-miling with a friend yesterday evening, and was out again first thing this morning for about 5.5 miles at 9.15-9.30mm. My legs felt quite ploddy this morning and I couldn't have run much faster even if I'd wanted to.

    It's important that I start with fresh legs at Windsor, so I'll just do a couple of gentle runs this week.
  • Hello All,

    V.Rapt - my next race is the Cardiff marathon!!!!!!! There is a 5 hour cut off; at present that feels like my biggest challenge yet :) The start at Bristol was a shambles.

    HH, well done on getting your place. You can now start to make definite plans for FLM. Is it your first mara. / FLM?

    QQ - thanks for the encouragment. PB's seem like a distant memory at the moment!
  • Cardiff marathon. So you've got a 4-week gap between a half and a marathon too, RD. It'll be interesting to see how you get on. What training do you plan to do between now and then?

    I am going to be unbearable later this week, with taper madness and performance anxiety. If you see me wittering on here, please send me off to make flapjacks or give me your ironing to do.
  • Thanks for the welcome.

    Ripped Dan, this is my first marathon!!! I am excited but also aprehensive about the training ahead. I always wanted to do the London Marathon before I'm 40 and now seems as good a time as any. I started running again last December eight weeks after a C-section having my second baby. I did the Reading half in April in just under 2 hours but have really got into my training now. Not sure if I'm bing a bit enthausiatic about completing in under 4 but I always need a goal time rather than just completing to keep me motivated.

    Velopricator - Many congrats on your sub 50 10K, I bet you are really chuffed. I notice that your previous was 52, any tips on how I can do the same on Sunday and crack the 50?

    HH
  • Many apologies Veloricaptor, just realised I spelt your name wrong...should have copied and pasted :0).
  • Ha Ha ! Vrap, I know Exactly what you mean and next week I will be cleaning the Utility room to work off my excess energy. ( I make really bad flapjack).

    Hi HH , I feel exactly the same about the LSR though I suspect it's the correct way to train.

    I've just returned form a 6 miler with my running club and surprisingly no sore knee today. Hopefully if I avoid hills all will be fine for next weekend......
  • ROFLMAO, happy hermit :oD

    I was delighted with my sub-50 10k. The best tip I can pass on is one that eL Bee casually threw in my direction a few months ago when I was running 10 to 11 -minute-miles - "think like a fast runner even when you're running slowly".

    And mine would be, "Run like hell, because once you've warmed up you're never more than 6 miles from the finish."

    I won't be taking a pop at my own 10k PB this year. The only other 10k I'm doing is the Suicide Six(ish), which is an off-road obstacle race for fun (my PB for THAT one is 72 minutes). The priority will be building up long runs.

  • Hello all. It's been a LONG time since I have posted on here, but my FLM entry has just gone in the post so fingers crossed.

    I did run FLM in 2000 in 4 hrs 32 mins having started from scratch in the New Year. This year, I have completed a season of triathlons (mainly sprint distance with one olympic distance) so am in a far better place running wise (I even do speed work now!).

    Having put my last 5k and 10k runs (done as the end of triathlons) in to the race time predictor, it says somewhere between 3:45 and 4:08 so sub 4 sounds good to me! So looks like I should hang out with you guys. Sounds like you are all cracking on well with training - 7 months and 3 days to go ... I might start tomorrow!

    Looking forward to some good old winter training and forum bashing.

    Yours, a saggy old cloth cat.
  • Hello Bagpus :o) Good to see you back!
  • My extra emergencey marathon programme is

    20 miler this Sunday (which could take most of the day), 18 the week after (assuming I have finished the 20 miler by then ), 6 mile taper, then the marathon.

    Wish I could pull out from a sporting point of view; the charity means too much to me though. Doing it for my dad; who is home now by the way :) Going to give it my best shot....bearing in mind that I am doing Snowdonia mara. two weeks later!

    When is Abers? Not run it myself, but I have heard wonderful things about how friendly/scenic the course is etc. You will have a blast.
  • That's a scary 6 weeks ahead of you, RD! I assume you're going to take things very easy between your two marathons?

    Abingdon's on 22nd October. It's a very flat course but I'm not sure whether or not that will be an advantage since I train on undulating routes, cross-train by hill-walking and have a mean downhill kick! I was only planning to toddle along to support, but a race number fell in my direction and I couldn't resist grabbing it.

    I'm not going to set the Oxfordshire tarmac alight this time, and won't be too surprised if I outrun my training and have to walk a big chunk at the end.

    Using my 10k time, the RW calculator predicts that I'm capable of a sub-3.40 marathon. I'm laughing - but a little bit of me is thinking that with sustained and sensible training I could be looking at a GFA place in 2009 ...
  • Ah go for it.

    I am definately goinmg to aquaint myself with the run/walk approach to both my marathons.

    You will be fine V.rapt. Just don't go off too quickly...make yourself run slow for the first two miles or even three. Then if your feeling good at about 18-20 miles, go for it.

    Feeling good at 18-20 miles in a marathon is something thats never happened to me....but I wish you well ;)
  • Is that run/walk from the start or run till you can't run any more and then walk, RD? I've used the latter approach in all my marathons so far.

    This time I'm planning to try to hold back to LSR pace (no faster than 9.30mm) from the start and treat the race as a training run. I suspect that by 18-20 miles I'll be wanting to walk rather than to push the pace!

    Wondering how long I should leave it between racing a half-marathon (and I'm going to be eyeballs-out on this one because it's my main racing goal for this autumn) and doing my next long run, which will be 15-16 miles. I'll have an opportunity on the Thursday, but that might be too soon, and doing it at the weekend would interfere badly with family stuff. It might end up being the following Monday, which would mean leaving it no more than a week before my next long run ... might just see how my legs are and then decide.


  • Hi All

    Sounds like there are a lot of people with fairly punishing schedules to run through over the next few weeks - Good Luck with those. You're all making me feel very lazy and so I'm thinking of entering a 10k in Pickering where we are going for half term. Apart from that and next weeks half there's nothing on my agenda and I was actually looking forward to taking it a bit easier! ( Note to self: must be more committed !)

    Good Luck to everyone this weekend.. enjoy your 20miler RD and hope you're managing those pre Windsor nerves V'rap.

    I'll look forward to hearing how you get on.
    I'm going to support Mr QQ as he runs his first 10k !

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