P&D Autumn Marathon 2017

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  • Bingo John. I was down to do a super-sprint team relay at Cotswold Water Park today so thought it'd be a relatively easy day. 4 people in a team each does a full tri 400m OW swim, 8K bike, 1500m muddy trail run. Ankle chip is used as the baton. I was down to do Leg 1 for my team then late last night I got the call from the other Monmouth Tri Club team  "How would you feel about doing a leg for us too?" - they were down a member through illness & nobody else was stepping up to the plate. Couldn't say no could I? 
    It was great fun especially first time around.
    Mass start in the water came out 30th of 55 including my stumble on the exit ramp & most importantly ahead of my clubmate. I was then able to pick people off on the bike all the way round. I overtook loads & was only overtaken by 1 - my clubmate! I got back past him on the final turn as he was in the wrong gear but he stormed back past me just arriving at the dismount line ahead of me but in his eagerness he put his foot on some loose mud & went down on the ground. Unfortunately he was now blocking the way so I couldn't capitalise on his incompetence & so he got in & out of T2 ahead of me just but this just made me all the keener for the run. I'd overtaken him within 200m & proceeded to reel in several more runners without being overtaken once. Total time 31:12 & 19th position at the changeover in spite of my usual rubbish transitions. Unfortunately they weren't timing those separately so Bike leg times include T1 & T2.
    We eventually finished 12th of 55 overall & 6th of 34 Mixed teams.
    My 2nd team were only 1min20s behind & my performances definitely accounted for most of that!
    Good luck Joe & Tom.
    Great LRs AWC & John - need to get out for one tomorrow only done 2 10M runs in the last 6 weeks!
  • HA77HA77 ✭✭✭
    edited September 2017
    I really should've included another bucket analogy. Sorry Reg. I'm looking forward to XC season this year.

    SQ - I think I'll give the double 20km with 10 miles MP a go but I think I need to just can the second session it if feels like it's too much.

    Great double race Jooligan. Crazy as usual. Love it.

    Nice MP runs John and AWC. Thery're tough ones.

    After saying my longest run would be 20km I snuck out this morning and did 25km. Didn't feel tip top but pace was ok.
  • HA77HA77 ✭✭✭
    Good luck tomorrow Joe. Really looking forward to seeing you do well.

    Good luck also to Tom and anyone else racing.
  • Jooligan - love it, one race not enough so you do it twice!

    Great MP runs John and AWC.

    A couple of blogs to catch up on Joe and HA.

    Mainly a quick check in to wish all the racers well this we, Alan, Tom, don't like to single anyone out but especially Joe, good luck.

    Nothing exciting from me this week although I wore my watch in a footy tournament for giggles.  Multiple 11-a-side games although only 20mins each but I thought 1.3miles per game was decent enough effort.
  • Joe is out of the water in a solid time, fingers crossed as he mounts the bike!
  • HA77HA77 ✭✭✭
    Good time in the ocean. Esp if it's a bit choppy.
  • Good luck racers.

    AWC - looks like you're up and running well.  The LT run you did in the week followed by that long MP run sound tough. My recovery from my ultra is a bit hard to judge.  I've never felt a huge hangover from it but have had a number of inexplicably 'odd' performances in training since... probably related.  I'm just trying to manage the recovery and blend it into prep for Chester in 4 weeks time.  Did 20 miles yesterday (first 20 since the ultra - 29July)... I found it tough and slow-mediocre pace.

    Next weekend is the last pre-taper.  Would people take the opportunity for another steady 20 miler - or try to inject some pace... perhaps 18m with 12m at MP?

    Yesterday's 20 took me to 1000 for the year.
  • HA77HA77 ✭✭✭
    Weather is not looking great in Tenby.
  • Looks like there will be some sunshine but that wind is going to be hard work!
  • AWCAWC ✭✭✭
    John: great MP run as well. Like you I'm feeling Aerobically fine but my legs felt pretty fatigued at the end. The midweek LT Run might have had something to do with that. Glad we've got the final 7mi LT this week
  • Tom13Tom13 ✭✭✭
    C'mon Joe!! 76:xx and 8th place for me today. Pretty dissapointed as I was 4th for most of the race but faded. Obviously not in great shape as conditions were decent.
  • Not too shabby Tom. Was it not seriously windy?
    Well done NE - not done anything long since my Snowdon jaunt 6 weeks ago. Hope to see you at the Mile on Tuesday.
    Did a 1500m race today after 7.8 hilly miles with the club at a very steady pace with lots of pauses to regroup. The conditions were blustery to put it mildly. On the plus side it was blowing us home but unfortunately we were battling into it along the much more exposed back straight. Given my recent form, the weather, fact I'm on a 7 day streak & yesterday's racing I'm amazed to say I believe I got a 2s PB B) This is only provisional off my watch as I've not yet seen the official results but it can't be far off.

  • Seems like it might just be a bad day, Tom. By your standards anyway, I'd take that quite happily as a new PB and 8th is pretty good.

    Nice mileage NE.

    Nice going Jooligan, must be all that Chinese food.

    Joe is currently 7th in his age group, I suspect he needs to make up a few places to get an automatic Kona spot. He's going strong though.

    Last longish run for me, just an easy half marathon in Z2 but it came out pretty quick for the effort put in a sneaky quicker last mile to dip under 1:30. I'm very happy to be cruising sub 3 pace I can tell you.
  • Cheers NE. Nice session, good luck at the mile if you do it. I think I’ve decided to skip it and concentrate on recovery ready for the Worcester 10K.

    Very impressive BAC session SQ, certainly saw you coming in the vest. 

    Interesting blog post HA, a very different approach to traditional marathon training, but what you’re doing is certainly working for you. I think your existing endurance base helps counter the lack of longer runs. I know for me, still being pretty new to running, the longer runs and high mileage has been crucial in building my leg strength and therefore endurance.

    Alan yes clearly my fitness has improved since Brighton, so that MP is almost certainly “soft”. I won’t find out until London though ;) Hope the 10 miler went well.

    Always nice to get the final MP run done AWC. That LT session is a killer, good luck!

    Great work on the double tri relay Jooligan. And then a 1500 after hills! Never a quiet weekend for you ;)

    That’s still pretty good going Tom, everyone has off days. 

    Nice sub-90 HM Reg, sub-3 pace being easy is indeed impressive.

    I’m impressed by the tracking for Ironman, good to see the entry fees at least go towards things. Looks like Joe is having a great run, making up places. Exciting stuff, fingers crossed for him.

    I had a good progression long run this morning to round of a very pleasing week of training. 18.5 miles averaging 6:51/mi, with the last 3 miles at 6:25/mi. Not too bad on a breezy morning at the end of a 106 mile week! Very happy with how this week has gone, I’ve been faster than ever for given efforts, and feeling good. Just need to get recovery right next week so I can hopefully put in a good performance at the Worcester 10K on Sunday.

    I had a quick look at the start of the final stage of the Tour of Britain at the end of my run, as it was starting just down the road from my flat. Impressive how open access was to see everyone warming up etc. I also caught the peloton as they rolled past the end of my road. Even at their neutral start pace I’d have struggled to keep up I think!

  • AlanBAlanB ✭✭✭
    edited September 2017
    Solid racing Tom. You said Cardiff was the target race so don't stress about it, great performance anyway.

    Well done on the pb Jooligan, your recovery abilities are astounding.

    Nice training half Reg, must be a nice confidence boost for that pace to feel comfy.

    HA i read your blog post a few days ago and i've already forgotten it  ;) it's just because i've had so much on to be honest. It was interesting though from what i recall and i will read it again.

    Any update on Joe, can't find the tracker?

    10 mile 'round Cumbrae' race today. Weather was as predicted, very wet and very windy. It was a southerly too so got the full extent of it on the second half. Started at a decent pace, legs were very tired so was holding something back for the second half headwind. It didn't help. Got a bit battered and finished in 59:20. Not the kind of time i was looking for but given the conditions and the fact it was at the end of a tough 90 mile week i am reasonably happy. Couldn't get my hr above marathon effort the whole race so the legs were obviously the controlling factor. It's all good training.

    As i said, 90 miles for the week including 3 hard sessions and a steady and very hilly parkrun yesterday. 6:45 min/mile average pace and 943 bts/mile for the week. Treated myself to a very tasty (and expensive) fish supper at the best chippy in Scotland afterwards. Happy days!
  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    edited September 2017
    Reg: Glad to hear you're happy with cruising 90min HMs - I'd be over the moon.
    Another cracking run to end yet another monumental week Spoons. Shame you won't be at the Mile but understand you have other fish to fry & it's a fair distance to travel for just over 5 minutes of racing.
    Sounds like a satisfactory end to a solid week Alan. Have you noticed lower bts/mile as you go faster? What effect does distance have on it? I was thinking about this on my ride to work. My HR variability is pretty low: 5K@6:15min/mile was 168 bpm while 12K@7:43 was 152, thus a 10% increase in HR was 24% faster! Beats/mile would therefore be significantly lower
    Btw Joe finished 53rd (7th in Age Cat) in 10:31
    Went out for my 3rd run of the day to chat marathons with a novice from the club who's doing Brum in 5wks. He's only been running just over 18 months but managed 1:29 for a HM in March & then 1:22 in August. 11M brought me to 63.5 for the week which is my highest in 5 months. I also managed to top the P&D leader board on elevation gain B) 
  • Great effort and performance from Joe.
    Spoons/Alan... phenomenal mileage.
    Jooligan ... amazing racing and great pb.  Definitely planning to be there Tuesday... the main reason I did my long run yesterday rather than today.


  • Tom - great racing yesterday, 8th is fantastic. Likewise, Alan.

    Whaf an absolutely brutal day yesterday. By far, the hardest thing I've ever done. The conditions were pretty atrocious, people are saying the worst ever at Ironman Wales on what is already a tough, tough course.

    Swam 1,08, pretty happy as the chop picked up on the 2nd lap and I've only ever swam once in the sea. Same time as the Outlaw.

    Biked 5.54 to move up from 416th to 87th. It was an absolutely war of attrition. Driving rain with 45mph gusts of wind with relentless climbing up and down hills. Was really happy with my ride al things considered. Was passing plenty of people in the last 40 miles, finishing strongly. Most importantly, zero bike issues!

    The run was also pretty horrific, constantly up or down, it just never relented. Went for it, going through half way in 1.33. Faded to a 3.19, before being carted away in a wheelchair at the end. 

    There will be 5 spots for Hawaii in my age group and I finished 7th. 5th was 2.5 minutes ahead. C'est la vie. I couldn't have given any more. 

    Will write a proper report on the blog obviously! Thanks so much for all the support guys, means a lot. 

  • Tom13Tom13 ✭✭✭
    edited September 2017
    Wow that is some achievement particularly in those conditions-what an incredible effort and a fantastic result Joe! Congratulations. Were you able to celebrate at all last night? How you feeling today? Recover well mate :)
  • HA77HA77 ✭✭✭
    edited September 2017
    Great effort Joe. Sounds like you had a good race. Was looking out the window yesterday thinking how windy and horrible it was out. Bad luck on missing the Kona spot, 2.5 minutes is not far over that distance. At least it gives you something to aim for next time.

    Tom - like others have said, just a bad day. I'm sure you'll be back for Cardiff

    Nice PBs Jooligan. 

    Solid 10 milers Alan. Tough conditions also, obviously. 

    Great pace on the long run Spoons.

    NE - I'd be doing the MP long run but wouldn't bury myself to finish it on pace.

    A bit over 100km for me last week for the first time in a while, which I'm happy with.
  • Reg WandReg Wand ✭✭✭
    edited September 2017
    Congratulations Joe, awesome performance. Are you going to take a roll down spot if it comes up?

    Great week Alan, sounds like a solid race on tired legs.

    Just the three runs Jooligan and not all races either, slacker.

    HA, no idea what 100kms is but sounds impressive  ;)
  • Looked brutal at Wales Joe, which makes your time really impressive. I bet it was a massive relief to finish! Unlucky on the Kona spot although I imagine if you went to the roll down you would probably get in.
  • AWCAWC ✭✭✭
    Joe: great job in horrific conditions! And glad you had zero bike issues this time around.
  • Just popping my head in to say well done to Joe. Amazing performance in less than ideal conditions.

    will have a proper catch up later. Spent most of the weekend driving round the country and now on the Isle Of Wight for work. Not run a step since Friday. 
  • Top effort Joe! Fingers crossed that you might still get to Kona but it's just a matter of when not if. Look forward to the monster report. 

    AlanB - Still a a great run at the end of a massive week. From you avg pace and HR it sounds like you're in top shape. 

    Jooligan - great racing as always. Do you ever have any weeks where you can't find a race and get withdrawal symptoms?  ;) And well done on topping the elevation table, just pipped me. 

    Spoons - more speedy running, seems like you are locked into the fast paces now! Must make HMP seem really comfortable. 

    Reg - always satisfying to get a sub 90 HM at an easy pace. Looking in great shape for this weekend. 

    HA77 - I'm with you on the kms, it would make my life easier if I didn't have to convert all my runs every time I post here!

    AWC - you might want to consider 7m alternating 5k pace/MP instead of at LT. I find it easier and average pace comes out similar. I alternate every 1km but you can do any distance you feel you can sustain. It certainly makes MP feel much more comfortable.
  • It's heartwarming that you convert them though John, I certainly appreciate it.

    Talking of Kona, I looked at the entry criteria for my race, there is also likely to be 5 slots in my age-group. I am anticipating a very high standard in Italy so I don't expect to be anywhere near the reckoning, however even if I was, the entry fee is $950 + 8% booking fee! That's nearly £800 and then you've got to get to Hawaii.
  • AlanBAlanB ✭✭✭
    edited September 2017
    Congrats Joe, fantastic performance and amazing resilience to see things through on such a horrible day.  

    Nice weekly mileage HA.

    Jooligan, I've found the variance comes right down as my fitness comes back. 8 weeks ago there was as much as 100 bts/mile difference day to day between runs, the faster runs generally being lower (although they were on fresher legs and the easier runs were recovering from hard sessions the day before so take from that what you will). This last week all the runs have been in the 930 - 950 range except Friday morning (I seem to be useless in the morning these days). the only other exceptions to that being the track sessions and grass tempos which are always lower and I think that is because the gps watch is usually a little generous in it's recordings.
  • AlanBAlanB ✭✭✭
    edited September 2017
    Just realised I din't really answer your question Jooligan :) Yes I do find that faster runs are lower, more so when I'm unfit but when fit it's probably only 20-30 bts/mile difference tops.

    Glad I don't do triathlons Reg! Some of the marathon majors are quite expensive but nothing compared to that!
  • AWCAWC ✭✭✭
    edited September 2017
    John: that's interesting re the LT runs. I'm doing my 7mi in a 10km race on Wednesday which makes it a bit easier to maintain LT pace than on your own (the race is 4x2.5km laps so I'll just add an extra lap in and not worry about my actual race time). But next time round I might try your tactic and see how it goes.

    Reg: Blimey those tri's are flipping expensive compared to a £50 marathon. Presumeably you have to transport your bike as which which can't be cheap! Luckily I can't swim so there is no possibility of me even contemplating one.
  • You also have to pay the fee by card the very next day at the presentation, no time to save up or ponder the decision.

    What's your max HR Alan? I can't see that I'd ever get much under 1000.
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