Moraghan Training - Stevie G



  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    edited February 2019
    Nice run Bus. Like the change in pace.
    SG: sounds like you should have plenty of strength for Wokey at least. If you've got the speed too then happy days.
    The Dursley Dozen 12M MT race with 2K' of elevation today. Heavy going & legs were struggling after the first couple of climbs but some jelly babies about 6.7M got me round in 44th (of 450). About 3:30 slower than last year & 15 places down but I did XC after the race last year rather than the day before! Last year's time would have placed me 22nd (& 4th MV45 same as last year) so I guess it was heavier going underfoot this year too.
  • Just got the XC results from yesterday & we were 1st in our division  B)
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭

    (I'm sure links used to come up with a big box showing what the clip was..but oh well)

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭

    Nice turnout Jools. Sounds like just the sort of race I strive to avoid.

    No idea how Wokey will go. Mileage good, lots of beyond distance long runs, some faster sessions working 1500-5k pace. Probs can't do anything more.
    Vague feels I was doing 15s at 6.50s last year to low to 7.12 sort of pace this year, but in fairness those were all Slough to Windsor totally flat routes pre work, whereas this year's are a bit hillier.

    Will be a good day out with a few from the thread and a lot of clubmates whatever happens. Will aim to go sub 6 each mile and see what is bankable.

  • So no specific time in mind then SG? :wink:

    Thanks Jools, and cracking job in the XC :smile:
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2019

     Same as last year Bus, aim for sub 6, and see how it goes.

    I think a half always goes better when you get to bank time every mile (hopefully!), rather than have a hard set aim, that you lose heart/panic a little when you slip off it early doors.

    Probably what separates some of us from the likes of Dachs….

    who has to be due a re-appearance at some stage...

    ps presume Wokey will still be a "send out in post" job, rather than the tightwadded "pick up" version a lot of races do now?

    Always starts to feel real when you get the pack in your hands :*

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    Trust to the process SG.

    The rest is irrelevant.

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Tru dat Ric. Will try and enjoy the whole thing, but not too much :)

    Tweaked one of my 6 mile routes round a bit today to keep things fresh. Again managed to bodge the Jubilee River bit up.

    I think the prob is from Slough end, it's straight, but then has this turn to the right and back.
    Go left, and it takes you right back the other way, disorientating you as to where you are, as it all looks the same.
    Turn right, and it takes you into some business/housing estate, and all of a sudden you're right off route :)

    So had a little tour round a housing estate, saw a footpath and thought, yes, that'll take me back on route.

    Took me to a blooming dual carriageway! What sort of point is there to having a footpath emerge down a dual carriageway!

    Still..done now :)
  • Was that dual carriageway the M4 SG???

    If you cross over to the far bank at the weir, you can run much further along the river.
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2019
    A Dual carriageway OFF the M4 innit. A355

    Crossing a motorway would add a whole new level of peril  :*:*

    I think i'll sack off the Jubilee River apart from if im going the other direction that is impossible to end up miles away.
    Not entirely sure what people's thrill is with it. Maybe the better bits are further on, as this bit is bobbly, horrible surface, windy, underpasses, and not especially lovely.
  • SG, you have a Garmin 235 so follow these steps:

    1) Plot a route you want to follow. I use a combination of Strava and Strava is fine but the maps it uses have a lot of paths that are not public rights of way.

    2) Upload the route to

    3) Follow the route.

    Have a practice with routes you know to get confidence and the feel of the displays etc but once you are settled in you can head out wherever you want to and be pretty confident that your Sunday 15 will be 15 and not arrive back home after 13 and have to add some or get to 11 and know you are still 7 away from home down a busy road.
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Can you imagine me going to that tech effort Phil? But ta!

    PO10 have finally clamped down on the mass additions :(

    Seems to be a case of
    Pre 2010 - free for all, load any old iron
    After 2010 - needs a license.
  • Standard SG getting lost in his own backyard story. Luckily you've done Wokingham before so shouldn't be any danger of you veering off course. 

    Remembered haring off last year at the start, so thought I'd have a look at the strava. Chuckled when I saw I'd gone through the first mile in 5:35. Probably a bit overenthusiastic! Will tell myself that I'm going to be more sensible this year before doing exactly the same thing.

    Definitely not tapering, will maybe do a bike session friday morning and then just easy running friday/saturday. 

    If anyone's got spare time at work (SG) and wants to raise their excitement levels, here's last years coverage of the race;
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2019
     :D   You got me - I don't think I'll ever be one of these types who claim they're too busy to even send an email / read a quick race report ;)

    I was the other side of the low 1.17 coin...went off sensibly, fairly consistent splits , natural slight drop on the "hills" near the end...

    If you're fit, you can get away with a roaring start, as it's a very slight down anyway, and those first 3miles bank a little. 
    I suppose on the flip, if you're off pace after 3miles, you're in for a world of pain!

    That 75.41 feels a long time ago, as that's averaging 5.47 for goodness sake. I remember just ticking 5.4xs off banking loads on what i think was about a high 1hr 17 pb at the time, and the mental wellbeing from the banking was unreal. That and hitting a group just slightly quicker than i'd like took care of it in conditions these days that would be top of the "excuse locker" after ;)
    Best bit was discovering "Jock Itch's" review on Fetch everyone, where he referred to me as "sandhurst slag" :dizzy:

    I wonder if any of the randoms we mention in races end up reading these!
  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    Banking time can only be a mental boost since trying to do that by surpassing the optimum pace will have negative results.

    If you don't believe me, try doing a Samir Haddad. And see where that gets you.
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    Yeah not trying to bank two mins in the first mile 😄😄😄
  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭

    Actually the real damage is done in the first 400m where those near the front desperately try to keep up with whoever is around them at the time. We've all done it.

    If you're 40m further down the road at 400m than optimum level pace would have got you, then on paper, you've just whacked off 400m at 10% faster than prudent. That's a lot.

    Takes nerves and concentration to settle into level pace while all around you are racing past. *

    Combine that with not bothering to increase one's breathing rates until the pains in your lungs makes you, is another minus point. Get the breathing going from the off. Feels a bit odd but the tight chested feeling never quite gets there.

    * Done this often. After ten minutes, the masses start coming back and there's bugger all they can do when I drift past them.

  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭

    I can already feel the nerves brewing for this one. And it's still almost 2 weeks away!!

    Got the pack today, which heightens it.

    Interesting to see that there's a 1hr 15 pacer. Not been in a race with that level of pacer before. Usually you'd equate that pace with a fairly quality runner who doesn't need one.

    Still, i'll use a "don't get too close" job ;)

  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    edited February 2019
    Ric Suicidal first 400m? Sounds like every XC race ever :D
    Much needed return to runless Monday for me today. Just a bike commute & steady swim for my active recovery.
    Got home to 2 HM race packs. Wokingham (893) & Wrexham which is this Sunday :)
    Hope my XC spikes heel blister has healed by then. The road shoes weren't aggravating it last week but it still had skin on til Saturday pm! Much worse pushing off uphill so no real concerns with either of those races :smiley:
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭

    Joe, was checking back on what the recovery is for tomorrow's 3x2m HMP (it's 90secs!), and found splits for a 1.17.5x half there from 2012

    5.28 first mile! Now that was keen!

    Jools! Didn't know you were part of the Wokey party too ! <3

    Rollcall looks to be...

    Myself, Joe, Reg, Jools, Bus, Pete, Dachs

    Phil, you in?

    Anyone else want to get aboard? Looks to be possibly the biggest thread expedition..ever, without even thinking it until now.

  • RicFRicF ✭✭✭
    SG, you'll be claiming the only reason these guys are going there is because of you next ;)
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭
    I'll ease my chat about it down i think now, as the law of sod would be that i don't even make it 😄
  • I am not so sure I will be part of this thread line up. I'd give it 50/50 at the moment. Injury clearly wan't ready to be run on. Something in there needs more than a few days to heal. If it isn't pain free by the end of this week I will probably sack Wokingham off and refocus on Reading. I am pretty sure something small, either a ligament or a tendon has been torn to some degree and that probably means 2-3 weeks to heal, maybe more if you run after 5 days on it :-)

  • PeteMPeteM ✭✭✭
    Hope it improves soon Reg; must be maddening after you got a proper training block in and were in decent form as a result of it based on that Tadley xc. 

    I'm another who is highly doubtful for Wokey. I never managed to get anywhere near enough distance training in, primarily due to sickness this time rather than injury. As a result of a recent chest x ray finding I also have got to go for Echocardiogram 2 days before so that could also be an issue (anyone know much about them and likely outcomes?). Main target for me anyway is Fleet HM in late March so don't mind missing Wokey if I can still do that.

    Did a parkrun Saturday at proper pace as my daughter said she'd rather I didn't run with her. Nice to feel wanted! Course at Woking was much muddier in its short woodland section (done 3 times) so I'll use that as my excuse for a below par 19'09. Weirdly good enough for 2nd of about 400 still. Guess many of the usual  fast guys were off on races or xc's this last weekend as most parkruns seemed to have rubbish times. I think only a couple out of over 1300 broke 18 at Bushy when normally about 20 do. 

    Windle awards night Sat; retained my best age grade runner trophy and somehow came 4th overall in club champs (though primarily because a few guys hadn't done the requisite qualifying races😏).  
  • Cheers Pete/WAVA king, it is maddening but not surprising. Running always feels like a tightrope walk to me.
  • Evening All, some decent running going on, long runs etc. 

    So xc on Saturday, Lloyd pk which is just a couple of tram stops from East Croydon, so quite handy really. Had a look at the course which I’ve done a couple of times before, spotted Joe in his cap in the Div2 race and gave him a shout. 

    Its a pretty decent 2 lap course, with quite a long stretch for 3/4 of a mile during its 2nd half. Set off at my usual reasonable pace, felt a bit better than the last two xc races and was holding my own ok during the undulating first half of the lap, then the supposed long stretch along the back was tough as it was muddy all the way. But at least we turned out of the wind to start the 2nd lap. Mainly then held position, although got done on the line by my mate Tim from Kent. Ended up 56th, 8th scorer, so a bit better than last outing. 

    14 miles yesterday, big standard LSR. 
  • Stevie G said:

    Rollcall looks to be...

    Myself, Joe, Reg, Jools, Bus, Pete, Dachs

    Phil, you in?

    Anyone else want to get aboard? Looks to be possibly the biggest thread expedition..ever, without even thinking it until now.

    Nope, no races booked until Vitality 10k which is late May. The training is starting to make sense and I have had 13 weeks of unbroken training since I turned my ankle mid-November and clocked a zero. I'm giving blood on Thursday and am up off work all of next week (heading up north to see friends and family but also have a few days in the to the Lake District) so will probably card a couple of lower totals for those 2 weeks.

    After that, I need to think about some speed again for March and April so will probably get in a track session each week. SG, what are the arrangements for the Little Marlow track at the moment?
  • Stevie  GStevie G ✭✭✭✭

    Makes sense Phil. Halfs aren't a distance to just cruise into if you aren't putting in what you know you'd need to.

    PM'd about the track.

    Had a brief chat with a local quality coach, and the pre Wokey build up. He'd have switched today's session to Fri, with more volume. Wasn't a fan of that as it's getting too close to the race day, and it suits me today as a single run, with no second one doable due to driving.

    I will take his tip to do a shorter LSR Sunday, and some faster than race pace Friday, having asked if he thought doing a quality weekend run incorporating tempo was an idea.

    I'll stick to the classics of 3x2m HMP 12 days out, and 3x1m HMP 5 days out.

    Therefore, went and did my 3x2m HMP off 90secs. Day off today to go up to United, so although I "could" have had a bit more sleep, I thought I'd keep to the routine, albeit without the pressure of having to get racing off to work straight after.

    I always forget this is quite a tough session. Probably because you're thinking 2miles at a pace you're aiming to do for 13.1 should be easy. It aint.

    1.28 lap aiming, and averaged them all out on par with exception of rep 1 that started a bit fast (1.24) lap.

    Probbo average of 5.53/4 all in (added the 9metres on rep 1, forgot on rep 2 (straight 8 laps|), and added 18metres rep 3 to make up for it!)

    Must admit during, I wondered about reducing the laps a bit and having a shorter but faster burn later, but saw it out, and glad I did so.

    Nice couple of hours sleep after. Eat then off I go.

    Local legend Dom posted on my strava link about wouldn't it be easier mentally doing it as a straight 6!

    No! And makes it a far, far tougher session.

    He's still going to try a 10miles HMP session tomorrow though, despite my "Noooo, please nooo, you'll ruin Wokey" please. Will not be told this lad either about suicidal starts, or his sort of race reducing training.

  • Last two Wokingham's I've had last mile burn ups with thread members. 2015 it was Phil, 2018 SG. Who will it be this year..

    Reg - really sucks mate, not what I wanted to hear. Fingers crossed there's still time for it to heal up, and you'll be nice and rested for the race. 

    Decent turnout on Saturday Simon, sounds like you had a good run. The weather was rolling in as we were packing up and I was glad we'd already got our race out of the way..

    Nice session SG, looks like you're in a great spot and ready to go. Christ - 10 miles @ HMP. Is that even possible? If it is, surely that's not his actual HMP. 

    Easy running and swimming yesterday and today - have pushed my bike session back to this evening to keep the peace with the neighbour. 
  • Stevie G said:

    Had a brief chat with a local quality coach, and the pre Wokey build up. He'd have switched today's session to Fri, with more volume. Wasn't a fan of that as it's getting too close to the race day, and it suits me today as a single run, with no second one doable due to driving.

    I will take his tip to do a shorter LSR Sunday, and some faster than race pace Friday, having asked if he thought doing a quality weekend run incorporating tempo was an idea.

    I'll stick to the classics of 3x2m HMP 12 days out, and 3x1m HMP 5 days out.

    Basic physiology shows that the body needs about two weeks to react to training, so any session in the two weeks before a race is going to be more about psychology. Marathon runners will typically do up to a three-week taper before a big race. Shorter distance runners tend to be a bit more blasé about such things but if you have a big race pencilled into your running calendar then having a week with the emphasis on getting sufficient rest and recovery but also mental preparation (short and faster than race pace) is useful.

    It always tends to be a trade-off, so if you did the proper thing and rested the week before a half and then took two weeks easy afterwards then that is 3 weeks out and it maybe takes 6 weeks to get back after that.
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