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P&D Spring Marathon 2019
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Spoons - Sounds like quite the session, well paced. Question on the S&C session, did you log it on Strava?
Joe - I did some Strava stalking and it was a group named city hash house harriers. Luckily it seems it won’t be a regular thing as they were a bit of a hinderance. Some good mileage and running for you again already this week.
Chicksta - well done on the first VO2 max, mine last week was quite a shock to the system. To get the MLR in after I think is great training on tired legs, as you mentioned.
FBT - Nice MLR. I like to add 0.2 miles to the end of runs so it’s a full number of miles left to complete a marathon. A weird thing I’ve done for a while.
Jooligan, Ramjet - Nice MLRs
TR - Nice MLR and progression
George - glad work has eased up and that the phone survived its tumble.
15 miles yesterday for me and 7 this eve. Tomorrow is the dreaded 7 @ LT. Legs are feeling tired at the moment, but I’ve been able to grind out some decent runs on tired legs in the last few weeks. Hoping it will be the same tomorrow.
Great session Spoon. I've done similar as fartlek sessions but it seems much more daunting as 400s. Great long run too. You're smashing it.
HPR - I do all my runs my feel. Don't use HRM and try not to look at my pace. For my tempo on Monday I didn't look at the pace at all. Great mileage and good luck with the 7 LT.
Some other great running - Macca's LT, Joes 10k tempo, LR from SQ, MLRs from Ramjet, FBT, TR. Most people ticking along very nicely
Legs have been sore all week from the Monday tempo. Decent but relatively short Wednesday double with a steady 10ish miles with strides in the morning, then a solid lunch fatlek 8x about 2min on / 1 min float. Long run this morning was the best in a while. Just short of 22 miles with a bit of a fast finish. Averaged about 6:32/mile and the last few miles were a similar pace to Monday's tempo. Felt like I was running on fumes by the end but legs and body felt strong and had more to give.
Nice 10 miler Steve. That’s exactly why I’m doing Wokingham this year, I felt left out last year
Bad luck with the phone George!
Millsy yeah I’ve read “Today We Die a Little” by Richard Askwith which is a great book about Zátopek. An amazing guy. I particularly love his quote:
Great MLR Chicksta, always tough after a session.
I didn’t even know the Apple Watch estimated VO2 Max Ramjet! The one on my Garmin always estimates wildly optimistic race times. I think it had me down for a low 2:3x marathon once.
I do log my S&C (and my yoga) on Strava HPR, I use it as my main reference when looking back over training as I love the layout of the training log page, so I like to have everything there. Probably annoys everyone following me though (as evidence by the very low kudos for those activities
). Nice MLR, good luck for the LT that one is a beast.
Great long run HA very speedy. Great to end that feeling like you had more in you.
I felt quite tired yesterday afternoon so was surprised to feel very smooth and flowing on my recovery run. That continued through to this morning for my medium-long, where I was slightly surprised to average 6:52/mi over 16 miles. A good chunk faster than I’ve ran any MLR since before my injury break, and back up to the pace I was running this time last year which is very pleasing.
I’m cautious to read too much in to a couple of good runs, but between the MLR and Wednesday’s session it does feel like things might have finally clicked like I’ve been hoping they would.
Ramjet/Spoons: Agree with the Garmin VO2 max prediction being pants. It gives me 56 and a marathon prediction of 2:56
Maybe it doesn't factor in age properly and thinks I'm a 20 year old
Spoons: Looks like your running is coming together nicely. Love it when those MLRs suddenly begin to flow.
HA: Your long run pace is my interval pace. Amazing.
HPR: Oh dear. Rather you than me. Think about how smug you will feel afterwards. That usually keeps me going when my body is trying to tell me to stop.
Lovely lunchtime run with uphill sprints + strides. Spring has sprung. Sunny, no wind and 12 degrees. Loved it. Forecast is similar for my next winter series race on Sunday. So, fingers crossed
Volunteering at parkrun tomorrow
HA - very strong long run this morning. You're not there next weekend right? Are you doing a half?
Great to hear it's all coming together Spoons. If you're running that kind of pace for your easy MLR's, I can't see anything other than an absolute stormer at Wokingham next week. Closer to 1:15 than 1:20!
Agree re; Spring Chick - good luck on Sunday!
Easy swim and run this morning ahead of a pretty hard bike session tonight. Leading a novice ride tomorrow morning - I'm head of the 'Novice Tri Programme' our club runs, about 100 or so beginners looking to get into the sport, so we set up a group each year and give them a training plan building towards a sprint triathlon.
More importantly, my go faster shoes have arrived. Will do a little test run in them at some point next week ahead of Wokingham.
Spoons - it is in the Health app. It seems you have to do a run to get a figure (shouldn't be a problem for you!) Amazing MLR - this high mileage business seems to really work for you.
Sounds nice Chicksta. This weather is amazing at the moment.
13 easy miles for me in the sunshine. Kept the effort to easyish as I have a HM on Sunday. It is on the trail I nearly always run on so it will be fun to race on it for once.
Joe-Enjoy the magic shoes
Spoons-Another good MLR. How far off last year's fitness do you feel?
Chicksta-Enjoy PR volunteering tomorrow
Ramjet-Nice 13 miler and good luck on Sunday
Had my best session in a long time yesterday. 13 miles with 10k tempo in the middle. Tempo was 42:4X and felt really in control. Good confidence boost with 7 weeks until Manchester. Backed up with 5 mile recovery on the treadmill at lunch, thankfully this time without the phone issues
Good weekend all
7 miles GA run for me - very tired so day off tomorrow before 20 miler hopefully on sunday.
Fine line for me between putting more miles in and keeping any quality there...
HA - thats a good weeks work.
Spoons - cracking mlr, you've had a good week too.
Ramjet - nice 13, hope the trail race goes well.
George - good session that, good confidence booster.
6m easy for me today. Long run tomorrow.
george... sounds a nice session.
ramjet... enjoy that race tomorrow.
Joe... sorry if I missed it... but which shoes?
Chiksta... some good speed work. Volunteering at PR was probably just what you needed to recover. Junior PR for me in the morning, I think.
I desperately wanted to get into the forties this week... with a view to staying there for the next 8 or 9 weeks. So after a busy week, I got in 10 on Friday night and Saturday lunch I attempted 17 w. 10 @MP. 5m warm up was followed by 5m where I was slightly ahead of schedule and feeling pretty good... mile 6 was a bit slower.. then at the end of mile 7, HR was up at 93% (unusual for me) and 12s outside MP and I knew that quitting was sensible - even though that really is a rare and unpleasant thing to do.
I still ran back to clock 17 w. 7@MP. Apart from a couple of LTs a month ago, this was my first speed session since October's Cardiff Half. I clearly bit off more than I could chew but still it must have done me some good. Just need to find 2 recovery miles tomorrow to get to 40... and junior PR won't be enough!
NE: well done as that is a toughie especially with no recent speed work
20 miles with 10 at MP this morning up in Bristol visiting family. Was supposed to be 16mi with 8 at MP but felt so good I just cracked on without feeling like I was totally hammering it. Averaged about 7:10/mi I think so not bad for the first MP run of the plan. Been a big week with an LT Run as well so gonna back off a bit next week and let the body recover.
George - great LT session, cracking work.
TR - Certainly doing the hard yards at the moment, keep it up.
NE - well done for seeing it through, can't be perfect all the time but they all count.
AWC - sounds like it went really well. Enjoy the easier week - always nice! I'm looking forward to the same.
Decent weekend of training. Couple of runs yesterday sandwiching a 50 mile ride with our novice triathlon group.
Then 23 today @ 7:05mm. Took the first half relatively easy, then picked it up a bit for the last few. Ended up in Kingston supporting the Hampton Court half. 102 miles for the week - not quite Spoons but nearly
I ended up running MP pacing two of them to a sub 1:45 half. Conveniently they'd upgraded the course from 20 odd k to HM distance due to construction work en route. The diversion included a nasty narrow footpath with tree roots and loose stones as well as 5 or 6 180 degrees turns so pretty chuffed to bring them home in 1:44:25.
Sometimes it's nice to drop the ego and give something back. The weather was definitely conducive to a PB but my legs were quite heavy so I doubt I would have rocked the world today. I've covered 60 miles this week (and I'm not marathon training, mind) including a hardcore VO2 max. session. Saving myself for the final race in March. I may train a bit smarter in the week leading up to that one.
AWC - goid run that, good confidence booster.
Joe - you are also putting the yards in. Thats a atrong 23m, you will be able to put in a decent show at vlm dhould you choose to.
Chick - well done, like you say good to give something to help others.
6m easy peasy pace for me.
Fab super-long runs TR and Joe. And fantastic mileage Joe, what with triathlon training as well.
7 @ MP is still a decent workout NE. No doubt you will get stronger if you keep up the 40 mile weeks.
Fantastic when it all clicks AWC.
Sounds like a nice way to race Chicksta. Always more fun in a group.
My HM pretty much went to plan. I was untapered but the plan was to do 10 @ MP and then try to push on. The effort was a bit high in the first half into the wind and slightly uphill but I got the payback in the 2nd half and the last 5K was enjoyable as I overtook a few runners who I'd let go in the first half.
Time was 1:28:23 or about 6:42 pace. I won't be setting off at that pace in VLM but it felt nice in a HM.
Spoons - you seem to be running really well at the moment and I saw a very solid long run today on Strava
Chicksta - Great work with the volunteering and then pacing in the race today. Amazing how running brings people together and I'm sure the 2 you paced were very thankful afterwards.
Joe - I agree, the thread is very quiet, I'm assuming everyone has been making the most of the weather. Another big week for you, even discounting the non-running activities. You seem to be running really well, where do you think you are fitness wise compared to PB shape?
Ramjet - Nicely done on the well paced HM
George - well done on the tempo, must be a confidence boost after work interfered with your training last week
TR - Solid LR
NE - If you're just upping your mileage into the 40s and did 10 on Friday, you were probably a bit fatigued still for your MP. As I mentioned before, my runs with 8 and 10 @ MP went really poorly, but then the 12 went really well. Hopefully things will click for you later in the plan.
AWC - Great confidence booster when you can extend the MP section of your run. Enjoy the recovery week.
My 7 @ LT went really well on Friday. After a pretty stressful day at work I didn't go into the run feeling the best and the warm up miles didn't feel fantastic. But when I get onto my loop to run the LT section things just clicked. The loop is another my garmin hates, but even manually measuring conservatively I averaged 6:20mm.
24 miles today were more of a struggle. The first about 18 miles I felt good, going along at about 7:30mm and not having to work too hard. Then the last 6 turned into a complete death march, to average 7:45mm for the full 24. Really pleased I toughed out the last few miles and I still averaged a pace I'd have been very happy with probably only 6 weeks ago. I think the reason for the struggle was the warmer weather and the fact I didn't take any water out with me. I weighed myself after getting back in and I was about 6 lbs lighter than before running, so that suggests I'm right. What strategies do people use for taking on water during long runs in training?
Forgot to add, 97 miles for the week, the most I've ever done. I decided against going out and doing 3 miles this evening to round it up to 100, after the issues I had at the end of the LR. I'm now just waiting for Macca to chuck in a 20 miler at 11pm to knock me down to 4th again in the Strava group. Although I lay the blame squarely with Joe, can't you run a bit less and do some more cycling like most triathletes?
HydeP - good going on the LT and the 24, as you say its a good feeling having done the full distance even if you have to tough it out. Race day is tough, so a bit of practice is fine. I used to do all my long runs on fresh air, and just carry a gel if i was going over 22ish. I have to walk the dog before i csn run now, so i always have a bowl of cereal on long run day now, i also took a bottle of luco and a gel with me yday, as i was going to be running for 3 hours. Fuelling isnt a bad thing at times IMO and makes it easier to recover.
Cracking 23M that TR & I expect the luco/gel helped you stay strong right through.
Huge week Joe & certainly given yourself some genuine sandbags to carry round for next week with that 23 today!
Nice pacing work Chicksta.
Wish my HM had been that way round Ramjet.
Uphill & into a headwind for the final 3M at VB HM but no excuse I was weak - mentally & physically. Couldn't make my mind up whether to go hard or run MP until I'd done 5K in 20:00 which is bang on HM PB pace. I was feeling OK but conscious of the wind & thought I'd be happy at 6:30 average. At 10M I was about 30s down on that but couldn't even hold MP over the final 5K
Speedy LR HA, especially with the end around tempo pace.
Sorry HPR - I only needed 8 to knock you off the podium, still time to get that 100 though. Speedy LT, maybe still in the legs for the LR but I make that the toughest week in the bag, well done.
Well done on the 10k tempo George, hopefully works settles down and you can crack on with the plan.
A good place TR if 23 @ 7:50 was easy. Apologies if I’ve missed them but are you doing much in the way of Mp, LT etc ?
NE - that looks like a good effort in the absence of much recent speedwork. Hope you got to 40.
AWC a sensible approach which I’m sure will reap dividends. It’s great when you can add on those extra miles because it’s feeling good.
A solid week of training there Joe - if the novice bike ride was 50m I dread to think what the intermediate or advanced was, well done for putting some back though.
Likewise Chicksta on the pacing, a 60m week outside of marathon training is commendable too.
That sounds like a good way to run a trail half Ram, especially being able to push on and make places at the end.
Jools - maybe difficult to dig deep if you weren’t sure on the strategy from the off - a decent 21m though. With half an eye on next week I wonder if 4.5m was maybe a bit long for a warm up ? I dont know but would be interested in others thoughts.
As said to HPR above,for those of us heading to Manchester, last week was the toughest imho. Not ideal but scheduling gave me 7@LT on Thurs, a 24m LR on Fri which turned into 26m then a Parkrun on Sat. Parkrun yielded a 18.19 PB which I was quite pleased with given the previous 48hrs or so of activities. Get me, I also managed some last minute birthday shopping, a birthday meal and a party, all for a 7 yr old.
Macca - blimey, that was a good 3 days. Ending in a parkrun pb too. You must have dome steely legs. Im roughly following the 2x mlr and 1 x lr of P and D. But i have run a couple of recent 10ks as LT sessions. I have done a couple of 3min rep sessions and progressive 10m. I dont usually do more than easy running, but have done the odf BAC session. I hope to put a bit of quality in over the next 5 weeks.
Good Half Rammers.. very respectable time..
Hyde park - I don't ever take water on any training runs and never found it a problem. (nice mileage for the week by the way! I have also done one of my highest mileage weeks ever - but it was only 55 miles)
I have found that with high miles week, my pace drops off . Presume as its as my legs get more tired.
TR - its even harder to predict my racing as I only do a couple a year now!
I think Macca has had a bionic leg transplant ..... only explanation!
Slower 20 miles for me at the weekend (never really sure how much to push on the long runs, this week was slow apart from last few miles.
Sounds like a well run HM Ramjet.
Well done too chicksta, perfect pacing job.
Jools - Think of it as a good session. When you race every week, you've got to expect to not be on your game every time. I imagine you're more targeting Wokingham this coming weeking anyway.
Joe - Smashing it at the moment. Keep going like this and you'll be in PB shape. I won't be there on the weekend but am running Reading so will hopefully see you a few weeks later.
Spoon - That LR yesterday was a cracker. You're looking good for that sub 2:45.
Macca - 7mile LT, Casual 26 miler, then a parkrun PB. Sheez. Don't really know what to say. You've taken it to a new level. Awesome.
HPR - well done on getting through 24 miles. Great toughness. Make sure you recover OK.
AWC - Must be going well if you tack a couple of extra MP miles on. Well done.
FBT - Well done on the 20 miler.
Another Monday tempo this morning. 7.5 miles (3x 2.5 mile loops, no breaks) a bit of an improvement on last time, which was nice to see, with paces of 5:40/mile for the first 2 loops and 5:49/mile for the last. Looking back on last week's session I decided I shouldn't have been too harsh as there is about 150 ft of climb per 2.5 mile loop, nothing big but certainly enough to slow you a bit.
Talking of climbing, I don't know how Spoon manages a 110+ mile week but only does 1600ft of climb.
Chick - great work volunteering and pacing, always so nice to give something back.
Jools - like TR said, don't get too disheartened, if you're not going in fresh you can never quite be sure what result you're going to get. Onwards and upwards!
Macca - I should've been clearer to be fair. The novice ride was only 20 miles - me being me, I added some on before and after. Another phenomenal week from you. Would be really intrested to see just how fast you could go for a fresh 5km! I reckon 17:30. You properly tapering for Sunday?
Nice one with the long one FBT.
HA - was thinking about you the other day. How do you know your paces if you don't wear a watch. Use the strava app?
Still undecided re; taper strategy if any. Definitely want to have some quality somewhere at the front end of this week. Easy day today though - legs pretty weary.
Right lets start that quote again "I don't know how Spoon does 110+ mile week" FULL STOP.....
Joe - I always wear a watch I just rarely look at it whilst running. I check out the paces afterwards.
Nice weekend of giving back chicksta between the parkrun and HM pacing.
Great tempo George.
Great long runs TR and FBT.
Wise to cut that short NE, and still a decent longer run with 7 miles at faster pace.
Positive that you felt good enough to extend the MP run AWC.
Big week Joe. You weren’t far off my total, and you probably swam further this week than I have in my life!
Solid HM Ramjet.
Impressive week HPR. Great the 7@LT went well despite the stress beforehand, I find that can really affect my performance. I wouldn’t worry about the long run, big end to a big week, and toughing out those final miles is great mental training for the end of the marathon! I don’t usually take water with me, if desperate I’ll buy some from a shop but can’t remember last time I had to do that.
Sorry you didn’t have the race you wanted Jooligan. Sometimes it just isn’t your day, but regardless 75.9% WAVA is better than any race I’ve ever done!
Incredible few days from you Macca, don’t know how you managed such a fast parkrun after those big days beforehand. Look forward to seeing you smash it on Sunday!
Another top tempo HA, great work. Believe it or not, I could easily cut that elevation down even further if I wanted, but I deliberately go up a few small hills on my MLRs and long runs as I know avoiding them entirely is probably not wise.
I’m really pleased with my long run yesterday, 24 miles with 10 x 1 mi @ ~MP, 1 mi @ MP-60s. Unfortunately I managed to time it so several of the “on” sections were uphill, but despite this (and a bit of a headwind for the last few) I averaged 6:22/mi (or 6:15/mi according to Strava GAP). This compares reasonably well to last year, when I averaged 6:17/mi (but 6:13/mi GAP as the efforts were better timed to flatter sections).
That brought me to my fourth 110 mile week in a row, and fifth in the last six weeks, so definitely ready for a recovery week now! The hard work definitely feels like it’s kicking in now, and I feel like I’ve made a big leap in fitness over the last week or so. I’m now almost wondering if a PB might be possible at Wokingham given that my PB at Worthing was set on a very windy day, and currently the forecast is looking good for Wokingham. Will have to see how things go on the day, but I now have much more confidence to go for it if I am feeling good.
I’m not sure quite how much to taper, but I’m keen to give my body chance to absorb the training so might cut back quite a bit. Last year before Worthing I cut back to less than 50 miles after a similar block of training, albeit due to an injury scare. That worked out quite well last time, so tempted to repeat something similar. If anyone has any thoughts though, I’d welcome them.
The only negative is that I’ve woken up with a sore left glute, but hopefully that will loosen off with some rolling and stretching.
Hell of a week, Joe. Especially with the cross training as well. I’d love to chalk up a ton one day, but no that jumping to it suddenly would ruin me.
A great week from spoons as well. Hell of a long run. Were they some older VFs you wore? How do the feel after a few miles? Sub 6 m/m on the cards this Sunday. But not too far sub please, I’m intending to draft you the whole way!
Enjoyed the treadmill story, George. I’ve seen someone fall off the back once and for some reason desperately try to cling on to the moving belt. Nice tempo btw.
Ramjet I also just noticed the vO2 score on the Apple Watch. Mine seems to vary by +/-3 every couple of days. Another metric to build into the bigger picture, I suppose. Great and controlled half from you.
Fantastic long run, HA. Hope the Cotswolds are nice this weekend. Huge week from you. Back on it.
Great long run, TR. you’ll definitely have the legs in the latter stages of the marathon.
Great session, AWC. Overachieving and feeling good!
Well done on the volunteering, chichksta. And great pacing. It can be really fun to do a race below max effort.
Wow HPR sone great running there in the context of a huge week. I tend to run very early in the morning. The cooler weather helps with not taking a drink. Although I do neck a couple of bottles of electrolyte before a really long one. Could you stash a bottle somewhere? Or wear a camelback? To be honest, I have found that I have trained myself to never drink whilst running. In a marathon I will have a few sips at most.
A solid session, Jooligan. Hopefully half term will reset you. Plan for Wokingham?
Cheeky marathon, Macca. Not many can follow this up with a parkrun pb. Impressive. 1:18 at Wokingham. Look forward to drafting you as well!
My home cross country yesterday afternoon. A great atmosphere in the park and loads of support. I was coughing a lot during the first half so wasn’t really feeling it. A 5:48 opening mile preceded a gradual decline to 6:20s. Nonetheless, a solid LT effort and 15 for the the afternoon. Another 80+ mile week. It’s half term which gives a bit more opportunity for sleep. I’m also definitely going off plan to recovery and taper for Wokingham. 6M standard recovery this morning.