Shades Marathon Training

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Comments

  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    Rob-Fair play if you do that after DD,I've got my local 10k 2 weeks after DD and hoping I'm going to be ok for that.
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Shades, I just checked my Strava to remind me of Yeovil.  I remember going off at what I thought was a pace I could easily maintain, but the splits tell a story.  I distinctly remember sitting on a wall at around 16-miles, seriously considering a 3-mile walk of shame back to the finish for a DNF.  But I got around it.

    First half splits - not too bad.
    8:21, 8:14, 8:36, 8:19, 8:17, 8:11, 8:12, 8:26, 8:38, 8:43, 8:47, 8:41, 8:23

    Second half splits...
    8:30, 8:50, 10:58, 9:59, 10:50, 11:37, 12:34, 12:38, 11:54, 11:47, 12:12, 13:22, 10:17 :)  4:18 finish time.   Ooooph.   Legs actually felt okay generally but I just ran out of energy and then shuffled back with my tail between my legs.
  • Cal JonesCal Jones ✭✭✭
    I think the lesson there is take more time off after DD, no? :D
    Just did hot pilates. The instructor made us do the kneeling lean back exercise - last time we did that my quads were fried for days, so I hope that doesn't happen this time!
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Cal, quite possibly!  Or at least go off really steady. Funny though as I did another event on the Thursday after Yeovil and did something like 3:50 running within myself and pretty consistently. 
  • 1SteveMac1SteveMac ✭✭✭
    Shades - My first was 2015!
    Rob - Racing after those DD hills will be interesting!
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Big G - my last run at Yeovil was just as sorry a tale.   2017 and I'd run a PB at DD the week before and had to run really hard to get that.   I'd only just joined the Mavericks and there were 2 other Mavericks and they were planning to run a sub 3 at Yeovil.   I ran the first half in 2:25 and oh so tempted to DNF at halfway but I didn't and lumbered round the 2nd half in 2:47, like you I just ran out of energy on the 2nd lap.   As I came onto the track for the finish they were doing the presentations and I wondered if the 2 Mavericks had won anything but they had both DNF'd at halfway and they hadn't done DD the week before, so I didn't feel quite so bad, at least I'd finished.

    Cal - I can't do that exercise my quads really hurt as soon as I start it.  I wonder if that's because we run.

    Yeovil is a local marathon to us and we like to support the smaller races so they don't die out, I've entered again this year. :'( 

    Steve - wow, 4 years already.   And you've done a lot since then, ultras etc.
  • Ian feeling confident of the DD start line, with a very raw base fitness of 4 weeks training it won't be pretty.

    Shades/Big G when I say race on the Wednesday after DD, that translates to recovery run, no racing involved.  I Have the week booked off work so may need the whole week to recover!!!

    Big G, good on Belfast to issue revised times if it does qualify for a gfa for anyone, it will never suit everyone but at least they have acted on it.

    Saw AH pacing report too, I'd love to find 3hr pace easy! Steve Edwards came into some criticism last year by sprinting the final so help his personal average time, had a look and banked it in the 1st half this time round 3.28.33.

    Friend entered a sportshoes.com comp to guess Charlotte Purdue's marathon time, he guessed right and the prize was a pair of Vaporfly's signed by her.  He's only been sent one signed shoe.... to say he's hopping mad is an understatement

  • Shades If I get really badly lost at DD then I could make the Yeovil Marathon :D


  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Robert - I'd be livid too if I'd won the competition and only got one shoe!  I guess the prize was shared then.

    Shades If I get really badly lost at DD then I could make the Yeovil Marathon :D


    Ha,ha.  But you can be sure you won't get lost, it's beautifully marshaled. 

    You could always stay down here for the week and run Yeovil before heading home.  ;)
  • Elle has considered using DD as a stop on the way to Cornwall, could return on the Sunday, seen they have a half marathon.  What a great way to spend our anniversary :D bit of a contrast from last years holiday.
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Robert - so drive down Friday with Elle, stay Friday night, run DD and then drive onto Cornwall after the race or the following morning? Princetown is about 30 miles from the border into Cornwall.

    Then run Yeovil half on your way home on the 9th.  :D 
  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    Rob-Sounds like a crazy plan is forming there,when is your anniversary? I messed up a bit and ours is May 30th so the day before I go down so have to do something the weekend before now.
    Dodged the club 5k tonight as calves are still a bit tight,went for an easy 6 miles instead,hopefully good to go again from tomorrow,needs to be as a busy few days ahead in work.
  • Robert OHaraRobert OHara ✭✭✭
    edited May 2019

    If I was fit I'd love to do both, I'm hoping to get down to cornwall either July or August and will keep an eye out for races (all distances on the way down, on the way back and during).  Ideally if I was going to Cornwall I'd want to get out along the coastal path for a few runs.... I don't see that happening much after DD.

    Ian wise choice on missing the 5k, hope calves are better tomorrow!

  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Ian - I'm sure the calf soreness is just a bit of DOMS, but good idea to skip anything as speedy as a 5k.

    Robert - I'm sure post DD you'd be able to do a little running on the coastal path, you'd be fine on the uphills but the downhills might have you swearing ;) 

    My 6 mile hilly run today through Abbotskerswell, which is a pretty village near me, lovely houses and gardens, blossoms smelling divine after the rain. birds singing and no traffic.   Love early morning running at this time of year.   My calves are tight today, think that's due to my circuits yesterday but thankfully the DOMS in my quads has gone as I had some long downhills today.
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Had a reasonable day yesterday with the shoulder. Little things I’m noticing, for example walking into town at a more normal (quite fast) pace for me, are improving over time. But this morning on one of the exercises that I am doing, there was a worse range of motion and a different pain than usual, for some reason. Not sure why that would be.  I wonder if some of that calcification has dislodged or something. Don’t know. 

    OH’s parents left early this morning for the long drive back home. Her mum is very good at making stuff so she bought her sewing machine over and we had her taking up curtains etc :) She also made a few things for us - house number, a swallows nest with chicks, and a duvet cover with lots of African animals on. Very nice they are. The garden set they’ve bought is arriving today so we’ve been very fortunate. 

  • 1SteveMac1SteveMac ✭✭✭
    Shades - Yeah, it's gone fast. 5 road marathons, 1 trail marathon and 5 ultras since then!! Although thats a few months worth of races for you and Big G :D:D
    Big G - Those a nice gifts....like that house number!
    Rob - Sounds like a nice plan, DD, Cornwall, Yeovil!
    Ian - Good idea to miss the 5k if the calves are sore.
    Easy 7 miles today, sports massage tonight.
  • 1SteveMac1SteveMac ✭✭✭
    Oh and all this talk about DD is making me jealous....it is on the list for another year....but not sure when!
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Steve, yeah, very clever to make all those things.  I don't have a clue about stuff like that!  I had them doing loads of stuff that I’ve not been able to do because of my shoulder. Changing the fridge/freezer doors around, putting shelves up, putting together a large storage box for the garden, etc. They’ve had to earn their stay ;)
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Big G - what great out laws, they've probably gone home for a rest.   Lovely stuff they've made you and OH. I particularly like the swallows nest with chicks.

    Hopefully the random pain when doing your exercises was just a one off.  Good that you can walk faster and more freely. 

    Steve - 5 ultras, blimey didn't realise you'd done that many (so far).   I'll pencil you in provisionally for 2020 DD then, always the first Saturday in June ;) 

    Pilates was tough this morning, but good.  I definitely won't be doing her Pilates class 2 days before DD. 
  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    Big G-Great gifts off the in laws,looking good.
    Heavy week in work ahead and 2 x football matches means I don't think I can run until Tuesday now.
    I see Mo has agreed to do Chicago again.I thought he may have went for Berlin with Kipchoge probably missing for his breaking 2 attempt.
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Ian - you are busy.

    I expect Mo doesn't want to do Berlin as he'd probably be way down the rankings and get a race number down into the teens.  I don't expect he was happy at London getting number 8.  At Chicago at least he'll get number 1 as he won last year.
  • Cal JonesCal Jones ✭✭✭
    Shades, I usually cut classes just before a race. Did Vinyasa this morning though - it's a tough class but I like the teacher so I try to do this one each week.
    Another rest day - as predicted, my quads are sore from that damned pilates exercise.
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Cal - I too have taken an extra rest day today, I'm aching a bit too from this week's classes.   Pic below of us yesterday in Pilates, basic exercise but by the time we do multiple reps, then pulses, then same laterally my muscles were on fire.

    Big G - spot the Trotter in the red. 


  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    edited May 2019
    Shades, I probably should have mentioned it but I suggested PB speak to you. He was asking me about why I tend to run slowly in training, and he was talking about HR training so I suggested he speak to you. I was around his place the other day as the painting I had done of the dog had slipped in the frame so he was fixing that.

    Basically, there’s a sub group of Trotters who call themselves The Plodders. It’s a Facebook message group that both me and PB are a part of, they run most weekends together and a few went to do Manchester marathon together. There’s a guy on there trying to run to HR and we had a good conversation on Strava about it, which PB noticed and so was asking me about it. The Plodders are a great bunch but there’s a couple in there who haven’t gone under 4hrs for a marathon but do their long runs at 9min/miles or quicker (not continuous running)...so it’s not really ‘plodding’ for them. There are two 3:15 runners in the group so the pace is more suited to them. Anyway, PB was asking me how his legs would remember to run fast and I gave an unsatisfactory answer along the lines of ‘errrm, trust me - they just do’.

    After yesterday morning’s pain on that one exercise the rest of the day - and exercises - went very well. Best day I’ve had. It’s still nowhere near 100% but let’s hope it continues and there are not too many more set backs. I’ve got a physio appointment next Thursday and if it continues to improve I’m wondering if she may give me exercises to do with those bands - up until now it’s all been exercises just using my own body as very, very light resistance. 
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    Big G - yes, PB stopped me for a chat leaving Pilates yesterday and mentioned you and your training, long run pace etc. and how you've knocked huge chunks off your marathon PB, he's so impressed with your progress.   He's doing London next year so is thinking about his training for that and maybe HR training.   But he doesn't have an HRM, so I suggested he either gets a chest strap from another runner that doesn't use theirs and sync it with his GPS or buy a cheap HRM without GPS and just see how he gets on.   I did say that the downside of HRM training is that it can be difficult to run in a group but the upside is that it's the least stressful and the least tiring.   I did suggest that if he does train in a group with an HRM then maybe to drop down a group.
    So I think he's having a ponder about it.

    I never run race pace in training and find answering that question very difficult too, but you're right 'they just do'.

    Great that your shoulder was good for the rest of the day, you're making good progress now
  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    Big G-That's great news about the shoulder,hope it continues.Thats about as technical as my answers go when people ask me why I run a lot slower in training than races.
  • Cal JonesCal Jones ✭✭✭
    My slow training pace is one of the reasons I can't train with my club. They do a social run on Monday evenings, which, to me, should be a relaxed, recovery run. However, while they have different groups for it, the slowest "novice" group is 9mm+. Sorry, but 9mm is faster than MP for me - 10:45 or slower is what I use for an easy recovery run. I am not the slowest in the club, not by a long shot, and I'm definitely not a novice, so this pisses me off. Grrr.
    Anyway, talking of plodding, I did another 6 mile recovery plod today. Marginally quicker than Wednesday's run, but not much. Achilles niggle came back, too. Legs better sort themselves out for the weekend. I had an Epsom Salts bath when I got back, which I don't normally do on a weekday.
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Cal, it's a problem in our club too.  It got under my skin for a long time and I tried to get the groups changed in my club, but to no avail.  Basically, there's a thing in my club where people are very much encouraged to move up the groups.  I would run in the slower group and get told that I wasn't trying hard enough and to move up.  That has changed more recently though in that we can run in which ever group, but you *have* to run to the prescribed pace.  Generally though people are encouraged to move up and run too quickly for them, and if a faster person runs in a slower group it's assumed that they are taking it easy, as opposed to running at their correct training pace.  I love the club, apart from this aspect.  I let it wash over me now though and just tend to do my own thing these days, apart from the speed sessions.  It's the same with Strava too though - all the "trending faster" stuff and where it implies that you're taking it easy just encourages people to run hard too often.

    Shades, PB has an Apple Watch but I don't think he's overly happy with it.  He said the HR sensor is a bit crap, and also it's difficult to set the watch up to see HR when out running.  Hopefully he'll get to London next year - he had a place this year via the club but couldn't do it so someone else registered for his club place, and he's hoping to use his club place next year instead.

    Ian, I just tried to say that if he races fairly regularly at shorter distances he'll see improvements, although stressed that it takes time.
  • SHADESSHADES ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2019
    Cal - so what do the slower runners in your club do, not go to training sessions?   Maybe they need leaders to take out the slower groups?

    Big G - oh yes, we've been here before haven't we re Trotters training paces.  Yes, the posting of training on line does encourage the runner to go faster and be competitive in training which is wrong and it's the runner that loses out.

    PB had his Apple watch on, but he knows that wrist HRM's are useless in training.  You can sync an Apple with a chest HRM, although not sure how easy it is to do.   But I also suggested that he could buy a Garmin or similar with an HRM, model I use as it's discontinued is £99 now, so good value.
  • 1SteveMac1SteveMac ✭✭✭
    I found the same with my club when I went, I ended up running around 7:30s ish, never run that pace in training now, either high 8:xx or low 9:xx, unless it's a faster session then 6:xx.
    Not racing in training allows you to race in the race....but WE all know this!!
    Big G - I love it when my strava tells me it was "easier than my usual effort"!!
    Anyway, parkrun this weekend, haven't run one in a long time at pace, so no idea what to expect, but will give me an idea of where I am pace wise compared to previous years.
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