Moraghan Training - Stevie G



  • Dachs, bad luck on the relay entries! However, a good return to form with your 10000m.

    Tidy reps as always SC.

    Nice long'un Bus, haven't you found any crazier local routes that add more elevation yet?

    A couple of sessions this week aimed at dialling in on tempo effort. 2 x 2km off 1km easy on Wednesday, coming out with 7:56 and 7:47 feeling very smooth and comfortable in the flatlands of Cambs. Friday was 4 x 1km cruise & 1km tempo, with the cruises in the 4:20s, and a slight progression on the tempos from 3:58-3:53.

    With 30+ winds and 40+ gusts this weekend, the flat 5mi wasn't going to be as fast as I'd hoped for. The race is roughly two laps, but you lose more time on the undulating headwind section than you gain on the downhill tailwind section. Miles of 5:54, 6:02, 6:28, 6:00, 6:18 saw me in 35th for 30:45. I spent a lot of time in no-mans-land again, with the group ahead going sub-30 and the one behind ending up mid-31. Plus side is I claimed a few scalps on the second lap and didn't lose any places.
    I would have liked to have been closer to 30, but glad I improved my SB. Saying that, I didn't want to bury myself today, given the conditions, so that I can give the 10km next week a good shot with hopefully some better weather!
  • A bloody good effort in this weather Matt - blowing a hoolie and wet, so windy and undulating has got to be worth sub 30 on another day, on another course.  And yes, yesterday was an exercise in trying to string together every hill I could find :smile: (there was one I missed out, whihc would have added 3/4 mile but I was risking ending in the dark then!)

    Amazing stuff in Berlin today! Looking forward to SW's report....

  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited September 2019
    Matt - well played, it was a horrible day for racing.  But youll get a training benefit from it for your 10k next week.
  • TR - SG did say he was feeling better last week, had a messenger messages, so hopefully he'll be back on soon MH - Presume your race was back in Cornwall? what one was it? Good effort anyway in that weather. Saw a couple of photos of SW on twitter, looked like he had good time and a PB, which was always going to happen as he was running well.

    So, although slightly disappointed to miss out on finally meeting the famous and elusive Mr Bus, we still went over to Wendover to do the parkrun as the kid wanted to do it again. So I ran with him on a pretty hilly but decent 1 lap course and he was happy with a 25.57 and a PB. He's 9, so he's just started taking chunks out of his time after going over to Bedford in the summer and getting a bit of low level coaching.

    Then over to as very windy Wrest Park for a session of 8 x 800, managed to average about 2.32's. Yesterday I got back on my 'Cublington loop' a 17.5 mile hilly loop out in the countryside. Did it in about 1.50 odd and it generally felt better than expected..until about 15 miles when you have about 3/4 of a mile downhill. By the time I've done that the quads and hip flexors are shot and I'm 8mm maximum. Decent weekend though.

  • Blimey - that's a full on weekend of running Simon!  I'm not elusive :wink: Good work by your son on a tough course!

    Looking forward to a nice dark, soggy run home tonight :neutral:
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    Cheers Simon, i had seen the original update but wondered if there was a more recent one. Should be back soon ghen, once his isnt too dizzy to type.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited September 2019
    Bus - i copped it on my 13m run home tonight. Last mlr for a while though, so its not all bad.
  • That's a good feeling TR. Bit soggy and slippy tonight, but not going to complain as my legs are feeling OK after Saturday's LSR - amazing how a nice 3 hour long run can sort you out :smiley:
  • Not elusive Bus? - well I suppose you were away for the Aylesbury 5k - so I wouldn't say 100% you are avoiding me :) Didn't do too badly rain wise yesterday on my long commute day.

    Was going to Luton tonight, but my regular lift has hurt her ankle and not coming over...and with the weather forecast as it is I decided to run before work instead. Did 15 x 60 secs (on,off,on,off) in a similar vein to the 30 x 35 secs. As expected, bit of sun and the fair weather cyclists were out in force, but weren't too bad.

  • Berlin Marathon 2019

    Berlin had been the target all year and training had gone well indicated I had a shot at my ambitious sub 2.45 goal. Arrived in Berlin on Friday morning so after leaving the luggage at the hotel we headed straight for the expo. Its located in the old Tempelhof airport building which was really good to see, have to say the organisation left a lot to be desired though. Had to stand in a long queue to have my wristband put on and then walk through the entire expo to get to number pick up at the end. Again there was another long queue to get into the pick up area with people skirting down the sides and jumping in at the front. The positive note was on the way through I put my email address into a computer on the Hoka stand and found out I'd won a pair of Cliftons! Had a little look round the rest of the expo then headed back to the hotel.

    Saturday morning I met up with a mate who had come over from the states and did a short shakeout run including some strides in front of the Brandenburg gate which were cool. Spent the rest of the day taking in the sights on a bus tour and relaxing before the traditional Italian dinner.

    Race morning I set off at 8 to meet my mate who's hotel was round the corner. Narrowly avoided a disaster as last minute I realised I hadn't even thought about attaching my chip to my shoe! Luckily spotted a lady in the lift with hers which reminded me! Met Nath then took the short walk to the start area, after the obligatory toilet stops we walked towards the starting pens. The wheelchair race was just about to begin so Pens A & B weren't open, we wrongly assumed this would be the same for C. After the race started we walked over to C to find it was open and absolutely rammed. Some bright spark had decided the entrance should be at the front of then pen which meant there was no way to get in. So we had to jump over the fence which I was very reluctant to do 20 mins before a marathon! Also we noticed that strangely for a 2.50-3.00 pen the 3hour pacer was next to us and another one at the front! We knew this would be a problem but hoped we could clear through the traffic quickly and get on pace.

    Gun went off and we tried to get through the crowds as quickly as possible, this proved to be a problem. The first 5k split came up in 20.13 so we were already 40s down on target pace. We skipped the first water station to try and take advantage of the gaps opening up. At around 9k it finally opened up and we could try and get on pace. Even so we hit the 10k marker 90s on pace, started thinking here that 2.45 but could be off but I couldn't let myself write it off that early. 5k split was 20.04.

    Over the next km or so I decided I was going to need to go for it from here if I was going to make the time up. So coming out of a water station I kicked on, unfortunately this coincided with Nath getting stitch so this is the last I saw of him on the course. My garmin measured mile 7 as 5.54 which I was sure couldn't be right as it didn't feel that fast. Tried to keep 6.10 pace up which felt fairly comfortable. Saw my coach on course at 13k who told me to try and make the time up gradually, he later told me he wondered what had happened in the first 10k as the splits were so slow. My garmin had me averaging 6.03 pace for 10-15k (18.47 pace) however my official split was 19.53. I was struggling a bit to work out where I needed to be timewise so just concentrated on keeping the hammer down and trying to stick to the blue line.

    Saw my parents and girlfriend at halfway which was a nice boost and came through in 1.24.09 so still 90s down. my watch was reading 13.57m at this point. Tried a mental calculation and thought it if could get my average Garmin pace down to 6.10 I might still do it. 20k split was 19.43 and 25k at 19.42. Spotted the chairman of our club at 28k who was struggling with stitch. Shouted some encouragement at him as I went passed. There had a been a few minor rain showers by this point and I was starting to struggle for grip from my On's. Also noticed my hamstrings were aching slightly which I tend to find in slippy conditions. Kept the hammer down and concentrated on overtaking people. 30-35k was my fastest split of the day in 19.39. 

    Started to stuggle at around 4km out and it also started raining heavier. While still just about overtaking people I could see my pace was dropping and I couldn't go any faster. Saw my coach at 39k who gave me some encouragement when I told him I had nothing left! Was just trying to drag myself past people at this point. Passed 40k at 2.39.21 (20.39) so knew sub 2.45 was off. Took all my willpower not to just jog it in as I was really struggling. Got a huge shout out from my family at the Brandenburg Gate and picked my pace up for the final 500m. Felt a twinge of cramp in my hamstring as I went for the full sprint so kept a lid on it.

    2.48.05 final time which is a PB of 5.12. I wont lie and admit I was a tiny bit disappointed at the finish, in hindsight though its a huge PB in only my 4th marathon and I left everything out there which is always the target. Took me 30mins to get back to my family as there was no signage and unhelpful marshalls. Was drenched and cold by this point. Had a few celebratory beers in the hotel and met back up with Nath who while disappointed still managed a small PB in 2.55. Then headed to the BRLO brewhouse for some more beers and met up with my coach and some more of his athletes.
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    Good work SW (and an admirably succinct report for such a big occasion :smile:). 2:48 and a huge PB should definitely take away any lingering twinge about not going 2:45. If Bekele hadn't been 2s off the world record, I'd have let you have slippery conditions as an excuse, but difficult in the circs :smile:
  • Yes Nice work SW. Take this as a backhanded compliment, I thought you were going to be sub 2.45 the way you were training, but like we have all said it's a good PB and a Launchpad for sub 2.45 and beyond.
  • Haha Bus he finished 45mins before me! Did get to hear him announced on the podium as I came down the finish though.

    Cheers SC - Compliment taken! I think I needed a near perfect day which I didn't get. London next year I'll be in Fast GFA so should get a clear run.

    Taking 2-3 weeks off now recovery and to reset, may go for a couple of runs but nothing serious. Then back to it to try and get myself in shape for Telford 10k and my XC debut!
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    Good plan SW, and don't get sucked into any false sense of security that can happen the week after a marathon when your legs may actually feel not too bad. I always find its the second, or even the third week after that problems can creep in.

    My lunchtime run yesterday was biblical - biblically wet that is! 7 miles of running on flooded pavements, aiming at something resembling marathon pace (mine, not yours SW :smile: ). The legs felt OK for the first 5 miles, but was hard work for the last two and it came out at 6:56 all in. Not too bad given the weather, and it also involved a couple of miles with lots of gates to open! Either way though, it's pretty sobering to think that my last marathon was actually done over 10 secs per mile quicker! 
  • WoolWool ✭✭✭

    huge congrats SW, a 2:48 and a 5 min PB at your level should certainly be celebrated even if we all know that you'll have some residual disappointment on not hitting the sub 2:45 it really sounds like you dug out an excellent run with all that other stuff going on. Brilliant!

    I had a lovely day out with the Dashers at the (lumpy) Windsor HM on Sunday. Managed to run a course best round there, take 2nd V45, help the winning team and finish just outside of an actual PB so I'm happy again after my crap run at Mhd. One more decent sized week and then the taper ahead of the opportunity to meet TR at Abo in a 2 1/2 weeks time. Great mileage man, really great!!

  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited October 2019
    Wool - i look fwd to it. My 82 last weekend gives me signs of improvement. You are obviously in good shape. If things go well I'll hopefully be in contention for sub 2.55. I'll probably set a "no faster than" 6.35 early doors and then just go on feel. Marathons are tough to nail, so it needs a bit of a compromise at times as to what youd be happy to achieve vs overreaching (eyes bigger than engine).
  • Bloody hell SW - Just the Telford 10K before xmas? You need to race more pal - I've seen your PO10 needs beefing up ;)

    Well done on the half Wool - we all know V45 is the hardest Vet category...Good running Bus and TR.

    No national relays for us, so attempting sub 16 at Great Denham PR tomorrow morning, then the 17.5 hilly LSR.

  • Simon you'll be pleased to know I've been roped into doing the 6 stage tomorrow! No idea what sort of form I'll be in, haven't even put my trainers on this week! Hope parkrun went well
  • Matthew HeadMatthew Head ✭✭✭
    edited October 2019
    SC, hope you went well at the parkrun. The race last week was Cubert 5, in case you wanted to look it up on Po10.

    SW, all the best for the relays today! Massive congratulations for your marathon PB - shame you didn't achieve your desired time, but I'm sure a race without the congestion will see you through.

    Well done on the half Wool!

    Been a bit of an odd week, some days feeling a bit coldy, but then the next fine. A couple of small sessions, one with 3 x 3 x 75s going 6:06s, 5:43s and 5:08s - it was hard work stringing the last ones out, but felt good to push the envelope. Then 4 x 2mins yesterday to turn the legs over, averaging 6:05s.

    Plymouth 10km today, with an earlier than normal start time of 08:30, never much a fan. Race was delayed a little, which made it less of a shock though. The race starts in the city centre, heads down Royal Parade and back up, past Charles Church, along Exeter St to pick up the embankment, to do pretty much that in reverse. It's really not the most scenic of runs! But with less than 100m gain on the course, it's one of the flattest around here.
    It was hard to judge pace at the start, with the town buildings and tight course I didn't know if I could trust the watch, but naturally ended up going out too fast - heading through 1km in about 3:40. I tried to rein it in a bit, but not enough with the first mile sub-5:50 and the second around 6:00. Feeling okay though, so thought I'd see how I can hold it. Reached 5km at about 18:40ish - a season's best, so was either on for something spectacular or would be treading water later. Got to about 6km before the pace started creeping over 6:00min/mi. The race was a bit strung out, and people around me were struggling too, seemed like it was a fast start for many. I think the next couple of miles must have been around 6:20s, as I reached 5mi in about 30:20, but did include coming back up the small hills on the course. Last 800m and I had a bit of a second wind, and took a couple of places.

    Given the recent races, all I was after was to be back on the PB trail - very pleased to cross the mats in 38:21, a PB by 38s! A bit disappointed with how I ran through, I knew that I should have been more conservative at the start, and that probably cost me a 37:5x in reality. Either that, or I've lost the ability to grit my teeth and grind out that last 3rd of races!

    I've also been selected to represent Cornwall on the B team at the SW Champs 10km next month - so that gives me an opportunity to cut another chunk off my 10km time!
  • great running MH, well done on the PB! SW hope you liked the relays. 

    Parkrun went ok, went out hard, liking the new racers. Its 2 laps and went through halfway in 7.40, but really didn’t feel as bouncy as I’d expected and battled to just get under 16 with a 15.58. Decent enough but I definitely think I had Thursday’s Primrose Hill session in my legs. 17.5 mile long run today was a bit tortuous as usual! 
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    End of a hard week Simon :smile: Solid enough parkrun though!

    Nice one Matt - both on the pb and the Cornwall selection. Somewhere down there they must be able to string together a flat route!!!

    parkrun for me yesterday, as part of a longer run (12.3M). Pretty slow in 19:44, but fairly soft underfoot and I think I've got some sort of virus. Been feeling a little nauseous in early morning runs, felt totally shattered yesterday afternoon and have just felt really light headed and not quite right today after a bike ride this morning.

    I hope it clears ASAP as I've entered Langdale Horseshoe and paid for two nights B&B for Friday and Saturday!
  • PeteMPeteM ✭✭✭
    edited October 2019
    Big belated congrats to Stevie Wh on a brilliant marathon time. don't be down at all about being over 2'45; you did a massive pb and a time to be really proud of :)

    Excellent 10k Matt H (sub 38 on an easier course should be almost a gimme) and fantastic parkrun Simon (sub 16 as a v45 is unreal :o). 

    Great HM's from TR and Wool; you guys casually knocking out 82's must mean you can expect great days at Abo. 

    Fine effort at pr Bus as part of a much longer run; hope the Lake District trip goes well

    Good to see you back on Dachs and on top form again; the cock up on entries will soon be forgotten, everyone accepts that administrators are unsung heroes and it is even more impressive when a top runner steps up to the plate in that regard. 

    Hope SG is recovering well and back on here soon; we need his enthusiasm and am also getting a bit fed up of only conversing with him via messenger about the woeful performances of Utd :# .

    No good news from my side sadly. Been fighting these calf issues for ages now and had lots of physio and sports massage but still not right. Took a couple of weeks off running including walking a parkrun (37'37 for anyone with morbid curiosity ;)). Did a semi fast threshold pr last weekend and just squeezed sub 20 but felt crap all weekend with the calf after. This week wasn't too bad and managed a few steady runs. Yesterday morning planned another tempo parkrun but calf playing up even in the warm up so elected to just run with my daughter who is now a low 25 runner so even that not too easy. 

    Woke up today feeling much better so thought I would try the first xc. Big mistake :'( . Never going very fast and obviously well behind those I would expect to be around but happy enough till 7k (so 2k to go) when the calf pinged big time again. Huge jolt of pain and stopped immediately for a lonely walk back to the start and yet another DNF. Feel very dejected now; not had a pain free race since Yateley at the start of June and despite all the time off, calf not getting better. Joined a gym to try more strength work but no gain from this yet. Done loads of calf stretches and foam rolling but again to no avail. Any other suggestions from you running aficionados out there on how I can get back in the game, or should I just accept I am past it and give up (as my physio suggests) :s
  • Top Running SC, MH, SW. All performances really good! 

    Everyone seems to be well. SG Hope you are better soon and get back 

    I raced a 10KM today for a bit of fun, had no hope given how little I've ran this year not to mention the last couple of years now. Ran fairly evenly apart from a fast start (typical) and came out around 40:45. A far cry from what I have done but can't complain. It was tough, unsure if I have aspirations to do more but perhaps be in a position to handle the distance.. 

    I just counted back how many times I've ran this year.. Only (I think) 5 times have I gone over 5 miles in the last 18 months and my average running works out to be once every 4-5 days and 5KM at most :S ..Around 350m for the year

    Pete - I am firmly in belief you can overcome your injury. I'm almost certain the 4%s haven't helped. Also guessing you went into spikes or low drop XC shoe today? 

    A lad at work had a very serious grade 3 calf tear earlier in the year, took his time on the bike and today paced his mum to a 3.30 marathon (also won NF HM the other week) OK he is 21 and recovery is on his side but there has to be a resolution for you. 

    Is it possible you see someone else? MRi or Ultrasound? I was super lucky we had a physio renting a room at work and he did some ultrasound treatment on my achilles a while back when I said I've been struggling (I think most days I am limping or extremely stiff and think it's this nerve related issue from my op just making me really locked up) Unbelievable the difference and no concerns really being tight from that. 

    Pain is weakness leaving the body
  • The BusThe Bus ✭✭✭
    I saw your 10k on Strava Scott. Damn good time off pretty much bugger all training and just reinforces what we all know about your natural ability versus your ongoing bad luck in getting a half decent block of training in!

    Pete - that's a bugger! Tend to agree with Scott, but I've no clear idea on what you can do for the best. If it went suddenly at 7k in, that in itself suggests an issue that can eventually be worked on, or else why wouldn't it have come on in the first k or so?  Difficult to say from here, but maybe you are trying so hard to fix it (with all the calf stretches, foam rolling etc) the cure is actually impeding the healing - I've certainly been there and done that! Perhaps the next step is to just rest it, or at least nothing over the distance that set it off today, do nothing to try and heal it and see what happens?
  • PeteMPeteM ✭✭✭
    Thanks Scott and Bus; good point 're the 4%'s and yes in low support xc shoes today, but why would the 4%'s have made matters worse?  

    Bus, agree your counter intuitive logic may be right. Must have foam rollered that calf to death in the last month. Will try just staying off running completely now for a while and see if that helps. 
  • I think they increase the load on the calf and Achilles springing with the plate plus the foam is really soft so bit marshmallow like. I think there's a counter to performance gains

    Basic gait analysis doesn't account for much IMHO but seeing hundreds of people run in tons of different shoes you'd be suprised how much people gait / pronation etc change and how it might impact you..

    I'd be interesting to see what you ran in before and also racers before and how niggly you was 
    Pain is weakness leaving the body
  • Also low drop xc shoes. Less cushioning and again stretching straining the calf. Like running barefoot almost. Only takes a tweak to blow up if you're not used to it and also weak from the time off 

    You haven't mentioned specific strength work on those areas, calf raises, tip toes etc. Assuming you've done that 

    Pain is weakness leaving the body
  • PeteMPeteM ✭✭✭
    Thanks Scott; very useful info and makes sense all of it.

    Not used the 4%'s that much but did in Maidenhead Half and calf felt crap after that, so prob took its toll. XC shoes today were Innov8 Talon so yes, not much cushioning there but what else can you wear for xc that would cushion?. Usually my road stuff is in Asics DS trainers; have DS racers as well but virtually no cushioning in those so rarely used. Before those used to use Asics Nimbus but they're a bit heavy; maybe I should go back to them for a while at least though; what do you reckon?. Yes had calf strains loads of times over the years but each seems to be worse than the last nowadays. Also done lots of calf raises too, not tip toe stuff though. 
  • Been in the US on business so I've read the last page back (and huge congrats to StevieWh on Berlin: I know it hurts when you miss a target but still a massive PB and it is good to stay hungry).
  • Scott - Nice one mate, good to see you back in the swing of things!

    Pete - Like the others have said, surely it can get fixed - never understand how things can ping when you are warm after running for 7k? bizarre and bloody annoying.

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