Overdone it?

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  • Sounded like one of Muddy’s race reports.
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    edited February 2020


    Look at that lunatic in the yellow vest just ahead of you smiling like it's fun! Everyone knows that xc races are only fun with hindsight!

    Looking down the results there were a fair few from your club there on Sunday, Tommy.

  • DT pb again, your training is reaping its rewards.

    McFlooze great time in your10k, looks like you can get close to a pb this year after your marathon.

    Tommy XC hell, well done.

    Skinny, nice miles, getting the running juices ready for the park run.

    Managed a couple of runs over the past few days in Valencia, a city for runners going by the amount out on both days.

  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    Nice trip, Kevin. How long you there for?

    Training gone well this week. 8m easy yesterday then 13 today with 10 at tempo. Tempo was on the streets as race course flooded but as i was working from home i got out at 4 so in day light. Came out 6.31mm average for 159bpm. Pleased with that 3 days after a half and on the streets at a busy time of day. 
  • That's keen three days after a half, DT?  You must have felt ok though? 

    That's proper mud, Lit.  Lovely!  

    I've heard a few people raving about the Valencia marathon, Kevin.  I quite fancy it.  

    I feel tired this week. Did a recovery run with club on Monday night of only 7 miles.  Tuesday was my planned day off.  I then fannied about all day yesterday before deciding I cba to go for a run at all.  Got up today and did my MLR of 12 miles in which I felt tired.  I've slipped back into a glass of wine of an evening and going to bed more like 11/11:30 than 10.  It's catching up with me I think.  Plus having to observe focus groups two nights this week so 11pm before home. 

    So having used up all my days off the rest of the week will be 5x800, then 8m general type run followed by Warwick half run at MP with some miles before.  Bah.  Need to sort myself out a bit. 

    Muddy - there is some talk of the golf centre at the racecourse opening after Warwick half (by special request or my club!) for bacon sarnies and cups of tea.  So bring a tenner.  
  • DT, you are putting in the sessions and it has reaped its rewards, i was only over for a few days to settle my daughter in who is over there for 4months.

    McFlooze, you have put plenty of miles in over the past while and XC so you are allowed to chillax.

    10 miles last night and looking to get out and do some sort of session with the marathon getting closer, plenty of easy miles so really need to get some sessions in over the coming weeks. 

  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    Kevin......what have we said before about the need to 'get sessions in'.  It isn't the holy grail of performance gains. Consistency is that!

    Mcf, yes, I felt no different to coming off a normal training week. Another weekend, another storm blowing in, though looks like it'll be gone come sunday this time.

    Recovery 5 and bodypump yesterday. Easy 9m this lunchtime pending.

  • DT, going by what you are saying I have plenty of miles in me over the past 6 months, went out last night 1m w/u 5miles 8.23avg and 1m c/d. Pace felt comfortable, out tomorrow for 18mls but weather to be poor. Hope everyone has a good weekend, anyone racing... Cheers Kevin
  • McFlooze said:
    I think we had a local club special early bird rate, Muddy.  I'm going to run the 5 miles from home and then do it as a MP run as well so hopefully see you there.  Last year the weather was vile - freezing cold, torrential rain so I imagine there would have been a fair few no shows.  
    It's shaping up for similar this year (Skinny :tongue:). Thanks for the heads up on the golf centre - I will bring some cash along for a hot drink at least. I'm not certain to be hanging around much as I'll be tight on time as stopping over at a friends and heading out for lunch afterwards.



    DT19 said:

    Tommy I notice from the results that a female from your club was 1st female sunday in 1.25. Looking at RB she finished 2s behind me at Telford and beat me by 30s at Derby. Quite please therefore to put over 3 minutes on her on sunday. 

    She was running marathon pace DT 😉

    DT19 said:

    Kevin......what have we said before about the need to 'get sessions in'.  It isn't the holy grail of performance gains. Consistency is that!

    Exactly. I've ran pretty much 5 days a week for the last 6 months with  not many fast sessions at all, and *raced* plenty as the goal races approached. If you find solo sessions tough, do a few low key races.

  • Tommy - Nice work, tough wasn't it! And Lit - sounds challenging too. Good to see there were a few hardy souls (mugs) prepared to get mucky among this sea of road runners ;)

    This my favourite that I posted on SG..muddy zombies - especially the 'leaners' on the right hand side :)


  • Cheers SC, that's an excellent photo! I remember being bogged down in there at one point. Sounds like you had an, ermm, interesting experience at Wollaton...glad you enjoyed your night out in Nottingham after. I do enjoy XC but I'm glad that the season is over now, the conditions this winter have been atrocious. I'm sure by august I'll be ready for the new XC season to begin.  

    Kevin - what DT and Muddy said. Sounds like you've been very consistent recently and that will pay dividends.

    I was thinking about an effort parkrun tomorrow but the weather looks to be absolute horsepiss so don't think I'll bother.

  • SCoombes2SCoombes2 ✭✭✭
    edited February 2020

    Yes Tommy. Was comedic in the end tbh really. Met my mates from when I lived in Sherwood after for a few pints, so that was great. The took some lucky HHH comrades on a nice running tour of Sherwood and Forest fields Sunday morning :)

    Doing inter area indoor and British masters indoors the next 2 weekends - right to the other end of the scale! Really considering missing the really muddy xc races next season...i'll see.

  • McFloozeMcFlooze ✭✭✭
    Hilarious photo!  Sums up XC this year really.  

    Warwick half at marathon pace in an 18 mile run (nice to run to a race from home) ended another 50 mile week for me.  Came out as 1:37:25 so bang on what I was aiming for.  Not sure marathon pace quite equated to marathon effort though at times!  Course is fairly undulating and there was a nasty, cold headwind in some places.  Also had tired legs from a 12 miler on thursday and intervals on Friday.  Ran with some clubmates though who werent feeling it today either so we had a nice run and chat.  Nice to see Muddy before and after as well.  My clubmate broke the course record today in a rather tidy 1.09!  

    Focus on recovery this week and a mini-taper ahead of target half next weekend.  

    How were everyone elses weekends?
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    what half is pending, mcf?

    9m easy Friday, some gym classes Saturday then a mixed pace long run yesterday with 6m easy then 2 x 5m at mp with 1 mile easy recovery between blocks and 1.5 cd. Felt pretty strong yesterday despite it being a pretty big 8 days coming straight off the half, a big tempo midweek and 58m for the week.

    Much the same this week with the Knighton 20 thrown in next Sunday.


  • Sounds like a good effort McFlooze and at the end of a 50 mile week makes it that little bit harder too.

    The 'leaners' on the edge of that photo does look like something from Zombies Dawn of the Dead rather than a running race - rather you XC lovers than me.

    The faster flat parkrun of Penrith was recommending trail shoes on Saturday morning so I decided just to go to the local one and see how much faster I was than my 20:35 on New Year's Day.

    The answer was -38 seconds as I ran a rather disappointing 21:13. It was busy, and a bit windy but have got to put it down to just one of those 9am Saturday mornings where it doesn't quite happen. I was totally wrecked at the end so it wasn't for lack of effort.

    Planning a couple of 5 or 6 milers through the week and then the Glenkiln 12 (the only race I ever won) on Sunday. This year they have moved the start to a different place on the loop which means the last 4 and a half miles will be the mile and a half hill and the three mile downhill to the finish which makes for an interesting end to any race.

  • PS Looking a bit dodgy for the London Marathon now - hope it doesn't come to that but hard to imagine that Corona will have gone away by then.

    PPS I got my bonus so went to try and buy some 'illegal' shoes on the Nike website - only size 4.5 or 7 available so it's harder to cheat than I imagined. If I do find any somewhere what would you say about sizing DT or Muddy - same as your day to day shoe size or something else?

  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    I suspect they are about to launch both the Alphafly and new colourways in the next%. They tend to pull back all stock when they do this. My usual running shoes are an 8 and I prefer a 7.5 in the next%. If you register on nike plus you get free next day delivery and returns so you could just order two pairs of differing sizes and return one.

    Unlucky on the parkrun, but as you say, sometimes at 9am the body doesn't want to work at that effort.

    I am tempted to enter the Newport mara, which is the week before London. Smaller affair so less risk of cancellation.


  • McFloozeMcFlooze ✭✭✭
    It's Retford half, DT, which is pretty flat.  Will give it a good bash.  Stratford marathon is the same day as London if coronavirus stops play.  
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    yes, that's also a good option, assuming the rest of the house don't still want to go to London.

    Newport entries close on 30th March so by then we will have a clearer picture of where this is all going.

  • Skinny - sizing is the same as for all my other shoes - size 11 and the fit was great. A New Balance size 11 is a bit snug by contrast.

    Echo DTs comments - the returns policy is really good, you can try them out and return them with no quibbles. I tried a pair of the Zoom Fly (the none lightweight foam ones) and they were like bricks and I blistered immediately and sent them back with 10k on them.

    Shame about the parkrun but could be a sign of the increasing mileage giving you a bit of fatigue and maybe indicating a cut back week required.

    So I've not done the Warwick half before but I'd heard bad things about it :smile: It was all part of a similar training run to McFlooze's: a 4 mile warm up, 13.1 at marathon effort, and a 3 mile cooldown to bring up a 50 mile week. That week included a couple of cross training days as I couldn't run due to a sore (left) foot.

    Getting ready for the race after 4 miles around 7 min/mile was a bit of a palaver as they didn't have my race number, so I had to queue while they issued me a new one. That meant I was really late getting to the start but the plus point was that allowed a chat with McFlooze about the route.

    Given it has been pissing it down on my last three long runs, I was grateful for blue skies and a straightforwardly blustery day. The route was all very lovely - quite up and down - and with a couple of memory jolts as I passed the Saxon Mill pub and then encountered part of the Kenilworth half marathon route. The highest point of the route was quite exposed and I was pushed back there by a hefty headwind.  

    Overall I was running a little bit under what I would consider marathon effort due to a late and moderately boozy night . Still it was moderately fun running from the middle of the field as I was moving past people up to around the 5 mile point. I did think 'blimey there is no way I can do another 16 miles of this' at the 10 mile point and started reconsidering Manchester. Miles 10-12 seemed very exposed to the wind exacerbating such doubts as we passed through Hampton-on-the -Hill. However I put a bit of a spurt on in the final mile and realised I had a reasonable amount still in the tank and finished in 1.24.09 on my watch.

    I was not listed in the results - I suspect the race number palaver. McFlooze helpfully pointed out the free beer stall after the race, which was not conducive to a further 3 miles of cooldown, but helped with an afternoon nap.
      

  • 'Shame about the parkrun but could be a sign of the increasing mileage giving you a bit of fatigue and maybe indicating a cut back week required.'


    Except that last week was my cut back week - I only ran 10 miles including the parkrun. :-)


    Sounds like you had a good run out too although shame about the number mix up - I never drink night before I'm racing so racing probably about the only thing that keeps my liver functioning!

  • kevin70kevin70 ✭✭✭

    McFlooze/Muddy, great times within a training run and miles for the week.

    DT, you are in great form, all you need is a marathon to happen.

    Skinny hopefully the magic shoes once purchased will give you that extra zap and with more miles over the coming weeks.

    16mls on Saturday 9.46avg took me to 47mls for the week, enjoying my running over the past while and would like to get something to show over the months ahead.

  • Ah well, you probably didn't need to cut back then Skinny ;)

    I wasn't strictly racing so I felt it was ok to drink but yeah it wasn't the best preparation for a benchmark training run. The course and conditions were not great for benchmarking either. For what it's worth I ran 1.23.10 for the Village Bakery half at the same effort last year earlier in the training cycle. That was a much flatter course though.

    I'm a bit worried about my left foot at the moment. It's not standing up to the miles and has a bruised feel to it, around the middle two toes in the ball of the foot. Google reckons metatarsalgia. Complete rest day today.

    More good mileage Kevin. You may as well test things out right now rather than thinking months ahead though - jump in a parkrun, and see what you've got  :)
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    Muddy, I had exactly the same about this time before London 2017 which I self diagnosed as that. I started applying ibuprofen gel directly to it and kept going. It never got any worse and stood up to the marathon then just disappeared in the recovery phase.

    I'm not sure i'd have fancied a few drinks the night before 13 at mp!!

    Kevin, some good miles there.

  • macemace ✭✭✭
    edited March 2020
    SCoombes2 said:

    Tommy - Nice work, tough wasn't it! And Lit - sounds challenging too. Good to see there were a few hardy souls (mugs) prepared to get mucky among this sea of road runners ;)

    This my favourite that I posted on SG..muddy zombies - especially the 'leaners' on the right hand side :)



    See them leaners + 4stone, that's me on an easy 3M road run that is

    Some of the paces you lot are hitting make my lungs hurt

    muddy - i had a touch of metatarsalgia a few years back, a gel pad did wonders for it. For a couple of weeks, all the time, not just when running. It's a strange one, usually hurts like buggery to walk/run on for a few minutes then eases off.

    DT - i very much doubt i can trouble my pb's. Nearly 54 now  :/ and i'd need to be running a lot more than the current 10-15M a week
  • 'DT - i very much doubt i can trouble my pb's. Nearly 54 now  and i'd need to be running a lot more than the current 10-15M a week'

    I'm in same boat at nearly 52 and 15 - 25 miles a week (although that 10 mile PB still looks just in reach.....)

    I do think (and I realise you are not in this shape* at the moment) that you can still get to a level of fitness where you can be proud of your times - for me if I could run a 5k sub 20, 10k sub 40 and HM sub 90 then I won't be breaking any PBs but I will have a feeling of self satisfaction. Still a bit to go for me and sounds like further for you but achievable.

    *possible current shape?

    See the source image

  • macemace ✭✭✭
    I don't think you ever really got a decent crack to reach your potential did you ? You always seemed to get injured at the wrong time. That's how i remember it anyway.

    Actually, looking at my 'racing career' now it looks a bit pathetic really. 15 proper races and apart from 10M they're soft compared to mara. Obviously i had plans to put them right but once the PF nabbed me it was a slippery slope and a long way back at that age once the fitness drops.
  • mace said:
    I don't think you ever really got a decent crack to reach your potential did you ? You always seemed to get injured at the wrong time. That's how i remember it anyway.

    Actually, looking at my 'racing career' now it looks a bit pathetic really. 15 proper races and apart from 10M they're soft compared to mara. Obviously i had plans to put them right but once the PF nabbed me it was a slippery slope and a long way back at that age once the fitness drops.


    Re my own 'potential' I'm not sure how you measure that - sure whenever I got faster I tended to get injured but I guess running potential is governed by how much training your body can stand - always a bit frustrating that it was one small part of one foot that scuppered me though.

    Re your 'racing career' I suppose you sacrificed a lot of race days for your marathon quest and were magnificently successful in that goal.

    Between us we have a nice list of PBs :-) - I would love a marathon time within 5 mins of yours, you would probably like to have a HM sub/much closer to 1:20 but we did okay for a couple of old men (even if Muddy makes us look shit).

  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    Skinny, I suppose there are various ways of looking at 'potential' one being taking account of what your particular body can  cope with. I would look at it more that you achieved what you did off a controlled level of training. I'd see your potential as where you could have got if your body allowed the raining to be done.

    Ticking along  this week. Session of sorts last night with alternating miles for 8m from hmp to steady effort. The hmp miles came in 6.10-6.20 and the steady 7.10 to 7.20 but basically felt like I was walking. 6.45mm average for the 8m.

    11m MLR tonight then just some shorter easier runs for the rest of the week leading into Sunday.

  • macemace ✭✭✭
    mace said:
    I don't think you ever really got a decent crack to reach your potential did you ? You always seemed to get injured at the wrong time. That's how i remember it anyway.

    Actually, looking at my 'racing career' now it looks a bit pathetic really. 15 proper races and apart from 10M they're soft compared to mara. Obviously i had plans to put them right but once the PF nabbed me it was a slippery slope and a long way back at that age once the fitness drops.


    Re my own 'potential' I'm not sure how you measure that - sure whenever I got faster I tended to get injured but I guess running potential is governed by how much training your body can stand - always a bit frustrating that it was one small part of one foot that scuppered me though.

    Re your 'racing career' I suppose you sacrificed a lot of race days for your marathon quest and were magnificently successful in that goal.

    Between us we have a nice list of PBs :-) - I would love a marathon time within 5 mins of yours, you would probably like to have a HM sub/much closer to 1:20 but we did okay for a couple of old men (even if Muddy makes us look shit).

    I think the fact you can get close to 20 minutes off seemingly little training tells you what your potential is and i agree with DT. I remember thinking that 2.45 was probably a bit out of reach after my pb but i reckon i'd have got a 2.4x if i'd had another consistent year. And yes, not getting sub 1.20 HM, sub 36 10k and sub 30 5M all piss me off a bit, sub 60 10M even more !!

    DT19 said:

    The hmp miles came in 6.10-6.20 and the steady 7.10 to 7.20 but basically felt like I was walking. 


    ahhh, those were the days ....

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