Overdone it?

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  • macemace ✭✭✭
    edited June 2020
    I once read that you get an aerobic benefit from around 30 mins but I’m not sure if that was aimed at any type of runner in particular .... as DT says I guess it’s depends how much you run.

    If it works for you and you enjoy it why not. 



  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭
    Afternoon all. 

    DT - good to hear that you're back running. I'm sure the bike/turbo sessions will have kept you in pretty good shape. 

    Mace- good consistency. 

    Skinny - run streak still going? How did the first day of the training plan go?

    Muddy/Rich/Kevin - hope the injuries/niggles are improving. 

    I'm still not running very much mainly to being really busy with work but also due to cycling quite a lot including a 40 miler on Sunday with about 4500ft of elevation gain which just about tore my legs off, although aerobically I felt fine. Really should start running a bit more though  


  • Hi Tommy - sometimes a change is good for you and you’re doing some good miles and climbing there.

    Likewise DT turboing his way back to fitness - sounds positive on the running front too.

    How many miles last week Mace?

    I did bring the 8 week sequence to an end by not running Saturday - it had never been a hardship so was no big thing to stop it.

    The first week of schedule ran into an immediate problem that I’m playing golf all day on Sunday so I’ve turned the week on it’s head and did the long run tonight - 13.6 miles on a Monday night - not sure I’ve ever done that before.

    Ive moved the 6 at a notional MP of 7:20 to Thursday from Wednesday to give me a bit of recovery time and will report back Friday.
  • 8 weeks Skinny, that's a great run. I imagine that the 2 miles runs have some benefit as to recovery.

    Tommy, I used to do a lot of mountain biking and it certainly helped my running fitness. I've a few triathlete friends who seem to do very little running but still have decent enough times so there must be a good bit of carry over between the disciplines.

    DT, hopefully your up to a decent mileage soon and you can ditch the indoor cycle work... I've always found it soul destroying, I don't know how you are managing 5 days a week!#

    I fell a little short on miles last week (27) as I ran out of time on Sunday for a proper long run and ended up doing a  very windy 7 mile fartlek of sorts instead. I'm trying to persuade myself to do a 5k time trial later this week to try and see where I am pace wise - easier said than done.
  • macemace ✭✭✭
    27 last week so I seem to be going backwards but it’ll do for now. 
  • There is a post on here (my 2016 end of year review) where I state that I'd averaged 35 miles for last 9 months and that was the mileage I did my 1:21:45 HM off and my 37:37 10k.

    So 27 is enough for now and if you can do it consistently then surely 30 - 35 will follow.

    Same to you Rich too.

    Keep at it. 
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    Tommy, how come you've started cycling so much? Are you doing leisurely cycles or going hard? 

    i think you can make fair progress on 30m a week if consistent. 

    A 5k timetrial is the last thing I'd want yo suffer through right now. Until i can do 10m tempo at 6.30mm at 160ish bpm then I'll stay away from races and time trials. No idea how long it'll take to get back there. I probably won't have built up my training enough to even try that until September. 

    Rich, 6 days a week on bike. i put my headphones on and quite enjoy it. Im replicating a running schedule with a couple of easy rides of 45m, a longer ride with some moderate tempo efforts,  a real high intensity ride, a thresold type ride  and some heavy gear stuff. That variation keeps it interesting. 

    15 min run this morning. Felt fine so 17 min tomorrow. 
  • Tommy2DTommy2D ✭✭✭
    DT - it started off as wanting to do a bit of cross training, then with lockdown  and the cancellation of races for the foreseeable future I decided that a change in focus would probably be refreshing. Also, my fell runner and triathlete mates tell me that cycling is good for leg strength and help with running in particular on hills. I'm hoping to have a good go at the XC season this winter (if we're in a position to race by then) so hopefully this will help with that, although I do need to do some running before then!

    Also, I can go out for the day with the family / friends on the bike which has been good during these strange times. Initially they were leisurely cycles, however, now I have the road bike and I've been putting more effort in; the 40 odd miles with 4500ft of climbing on Sunday certainly falls into the hard category for me. 

    Rich - yes I think there must be some carry over between the two, be interesting to see in the autumn! 
  • macemace ✭✭✭
    edited July 2020
    There is a post on here (my 2016 end of year review) where I state that I'd averaged 35 miles for last 9 months and that was the mileage I did my 1:21:45 HM off and my 37:37 10k.

    So 27 is enough for now and if you can do it consistently then surely 30 - 35 will follow.

    I’d say those times off that sort of mileage are the exception rather than the rule. I reckon at my fittest I could have squeezed inside 1:20 but that was off the back of marathon training averaging 70M per week and averaging 50’s in the 9 months before that. 

    I think you have more than a fair share of natural running ability. 
  • mace said:
    There is a post on here (my 2016 end of year review) where I state that I'd averaged 35 miles for last 9 months and that was the mileage I did my 1:21:45 HM off and my 37:37 10k.

    So 27 is enough for now and if you can do it consistently then surely 30 - 35 will follow.

    I’d say those times off that sort of mileage are the exception rather than the rule. I reckon at my fittest I could have squeezed inside 1:20 but that was off the back of marathon training averaging 70M per week and averaging 50’s in the 9 months before that. 

    I think you have more than a fair share of natural running ability. 
    I'm naturally thin which helps. I wasn't really suggesting that either of us will get back to those kinds of times with that kind of mileage, merely that 35 miles a week is enough to arrive at a decent standard of running which is all we can really achieve now - age category competitive in smaller races hopefully but PBs are behind us (although I think you have one or two distances that you neglected at your fittest - that 32:12 5 miler looks like a PB opportunity even now).
  • I've rarely averaged more than 40 mpw annually. I would like to do more but it just seems to be where it lands with ups and downs around races,  injuries and illness. I do a fair bit in the gym though, which I've really missed the last few months.

    Last week I took off running to protect the foot and knee. They feel worse for doing no running, weirdly.  Also looking like no runs this week due to illness. High temperature, fatigue and headache. I'm off for a covid swab later, just in case.


  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    For 2019 which is my highest ever mileage year i did just over 2200 which is about 42m per week. i guess once you take out holidays, taper, recovery periods sustaining a yearly average of 50mpw is pretty hard going. i tend to always think in running 50-60mpw as when im in full swing most weeks are in that range. So thst got me a 2.57 mara. If i could genuinely run 50-60 mpw and not break i wonder if i could get much more just off the extra miles. im just not sure i could squeeze more in. Some of lies i had to tell just to get that mileage in i couldn't exploit any further!

    17 mins this morning and no issue. Have appt with back consultant Saturday for face to face examination. 
  • A face to face examination of your back is going to be tricky DT ;)
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    perhaps more cheek to cheek in this scenario. 
  • muddyfunstermuddyfunster ✭✭✭
    edited July 2020
    You've made me think of Chris De Burgh there DT. Never a good thing. He ran off with the nanny and then composed 'Lady In Red' to win his wife back  :(

    Sorry for bringing a bit of romance to the thread ;)
  • So 6 miles at 7:20.

    7:21, 7:04, 7:17, 7:11, 6:59, 7:07

    Happy enough with that - tonight it certainly felt that 3*2 at 7mm off 2 mins which is next week’s session should be doable without too much stress.
  • Nice one Skinny.

    I had changed my mind on an all out time trial yesterday it was just starting to rain, and the road was fairly greasy. However after a mile I felt like picking up the pace for 4 miles. 7:39, 6:39 (oops),  7:31, 7:23. My Garmin  reckoned there was a 22 minute 5k in amongst there somewhere and that was nowhere near flat out. Pretty encouraged.
  • kevin70kevin70 ✭✭✭

    Looks like progress is being made DT

    Muddy hope everything is ok

    Skinny... happy enough.... first session in a while and pace doable  B)

    Rich, looking good for a time trial now ;)

    Have had an ankle issue for a couple of weeks and flared up during Saturdays run, taking this week off and possibly next :(

  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    edited July 2020

    Nice session, Skinny.

    Take it easy, Kevin

    Muddy, wasn't it his daughter that was Miss Ireland some years back? I'll assume his wife was quite attractive from that and that he was punching above his weight a bit!

    Nice going, Rich. Worth having a crack at something all out then. What's your 5k pb?

    20 mins continuous today. Starting to feel much less clumsy and more fluid now as I move and effort level is coming down.

  • Hopefully that ankle repairs quickly Kevin, a bit of time off did me the world of good, sometimes an enforced rest is a positive.

    Good progress DT, I hate that uncoordinated feeling you get when you've had a bit of time off, glad you're getting past it.

    My 5km parkrace pb is 20:10 - don't think I'm quite there yet, but a few weeks of speed work hopefully should get me there. Hopefully parkrun Ireland will restart soon and I'll have a bit of company on an attempt... That said, my local one is very small and would probably end up being more like a TT!
  • Rich I think the 6:39 (oops) suggests you're pretty close to parkrun pb form (unless that mile was downhill).

    Kev - hope ankle settles and coming along DT.


  • That’s running done for week - with a bit of rounding
    14, 4, 0, 10, 5, 2, 0 for 35 total.
  • Mr VMr V ✭✭✭
    edited July 2020
    Skinny - seems like you are nicely moving in the right direction. Apologies if you've already said but do you have a mileage you are working up to?

    DT - good to see you building back up. No niggles or twinges so far?

    Rich - sounds promising, you must be itching to race now.

    I've been under the weather the last few weeks which has rather derailed the come back. I've felt somewhat better the last week or so though and managed to get a couple of faster sessions in. So hopefully I can move on and get a consistent block of training under my belt now..... something I don't really think I've managed since 2017.
  • SkinnyPart2SkinnyPart2 ✭✭✭
    edited July 2020
    Mr V said:
    Skinny - seems like you are nicely moving in the right direction. Apologies if you've already said but do you have a mileage you are working up to?

    I've been under the weather the last few weeks which has rather derailed the come back. I've felt somewhat better the last week or so though and managed to get a couple of faster sessions in. So hopefully I can move on and get a consistent block of training under my belt now..... something I don't really think I've managed since 2017.
    I'm there really Mr V - 35 to 40 I've coped with in the past - marathon training where I creep up to 50 to 55 seems to break me.

    10 miles including a session, plus 13 to 15 LSR at a weekend and then 10 to 15 made up of little runs. See how it goes. 


    'consistent...training' Alehouse will be along in a minute ;-)
  • alehousealehouse ✭✭✭
    Good to see you MrV. Consistent consistency preferably of the progressive kind looks as if it is needed. As per Skinny. Wouldn't worry too much about the faster sessions for now. Keep building that base. It is not as if we have races to aim for.
    Progress is rarely a straight line. There are always bumps in the road, but you can make the choice to keep looking ahead.
  • So 3*2m at HM off 2 mins recovery last night within a 10 mile run.

    Zone I originally intended this session for was 7mm but after last week I thought 6:50 - 7mm window and see how it goes.

    6:37, 6:43, 6:41, 6:46, 6:40, 6:34.

    Average of about 6:40. It was the right effort level I'm just fitter/faster than I realised.

    Even in the first two 2 miles the slower second mile was me slowing down because the watch said I was going too fast rather than any physical need to slow down.

    In the last 2 I just kept going.

    Pretty promising.

  • kevin70kevin70 ✭✭✭

    Skinny, another quality session, easy miles now for the rest of the week  B)

    4 miles tonight to test the ankle

  • macemace ✭✭✭
    Excellent Skinny !!

    Nothing for me so far this week as I’ve been too ill to run. I suspect it may have something to do with a Thai seafood Penang on Sunday as I haven’t been able to keep anything down since.  May go for a walk later on this evening As feeling a bit brighter now.
  • Thanks Kevin - yes I'll do LSR on Sunday of 13 to 14 but other than that just a few runs of 2 to 4.


    Sounds nasty Mace - you seem to be finding a new reason not to run every fortnight. It should at least have helped you shed a few pounds ;) 

    How many miles last week?
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    That doesn't sound fun Mace! 

    Mr v, I'd just concentrate on being consistent for, no need to be sharp and that sort of training comes with a risk. 

    How was the ankle tester, Kevin? 

    Skinny, that's pretty impressive progress. You must have a generous genetic dose to get there off seemingly base level, limited training so far. 

    So saw back consultant Saturday.  Booked in for further MRI on 25th July. He advises against more than 40 min running until then, which is fine as it'll take me until about 20th to progress to that much running. 

    He says my problems all come from a locked up  thoracic spine and my running economy must be terrible as a result. Need some physio work to sort it but if i get it right my economy should improve a lot. 

    Couple of runs this week, up to 25 min today. Some minor aching in sacrum but I'm told that isnt unexpected. Out for 27 min tomorrow. Still doing a lot of bike work to push my cv on. 
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