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P&D Spring Marathon 2022
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OO - that’s a strong finish, your pair of 6:15s would have out sprinted me. Looks like your 30s beat Jools 90s by some margin too.
Jools - well done on the sub 3:15. Going for it again at Brighton or a bimble around ?
Finish line video for a giggle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fb4fnPu8TP8
I'd suggest a smaller affair too TT.
Boston, Lincs is in a fortnight which would allow you to capitalise on your training https://www.bostonmarathon.co.uk/ Physically yesterday won't have done you any damage but obviously depends on how you feel mentally.
Jools - nicely done, gfa achieved? Much stronger and even run than the last few maras. Shame you needed a pit stop, or youd have had more of a buffer.
Shame TT, sounds a bit like vlm, you should ho somewhere thats rmore unner friendly like Abingdon and have a decent day out. Its worth using the training to complete a marathon.
5m commute home, still lurgified which is getting tedious. Well see how 6m inc 2m mp tomorrow goes. I have a North Dorset rolled over number for 3 weeks time so might have a day out sunday and save it for 3 wks if the lurgy doesnt bugger off soon.
Haha well done Westy. Thought that ball park finish might be the result. Impressive considering! Recover well mate.
Really sorry to hear that TT. Have enjoyed following you on here. Stick around. P&L half marathon plan 😉
Macca - that is truly immense. You are a genuine inspiration. Look forward to hearing the full report.
Fantastic, OO. Very impressive! Well must have the strongest concentration of V50 runners around on this thread (huge apologies if I have dropped an age related clanger here 😆).
Well done, Cal. You are right to feel proud of your efforts.
Excellent result for you, Jools. Not really a fade at all. Really pleased for you.
Manchester Marathon race report:
A good build leading from a 10M race at the end of January. Managed several 70M weeks. No killer sessions, but lots of consistency, which is the recipe for long term enjoyment of the sport (in my book), even if not rapid results. A solid 10k at the end of February, before some untimely covid and various family illnesses in the three weeks before Manchester curtailed mileage, a final long run and any serious sharpening sessions.
Nonetheless, did my usual 10 day ‘sports motivation’ course on Headspace and got myself calmly excited for the big day.
Had a night in an Airbnb with my oldest mate, laughing at how aged we have become. Sofa, slippers and bed by nine. 25 year old me would have been appalled 😆.
Tram into Old Trafford before an easy bag drop off. With the weather at 3C at this point, remained in loads of clothes to discard/donate to charity. Conditions ahead seemed perfect and certainly panned out that way: little to no wind until right at the end. 5-8C. Mixture of sun, clouds and a brief bit of rain.
The cunning plan had been to go with the second sub 3 pacer from the Red B wave. This involved me dropping down a wave, but meant I could start with Ben, follow the pacer and then perhaps try to bridge up to the first pacer (Red A) after a few miles. Infuriatingly, however, both pacers started right by each other in Red A. Having done lots of marathons I had the confidence to just tell Ben that we would barge our way over a roadside little hill and join Red A. Madness really, why would you want two pacers adjacent with a massive group around them.
Started about 45s after the pacers and stayed with my mate for the first two miles, going through in 6:55 and then 6:35 or so. We split off then and I gradually reeled in the pacers by the time we were in the city centre. This was a new bit of the course to me and it had a good atmosphere.
Saw a lady who presents the Single Malt Marathoners podcast go past in a group and I knew she was targeting 2:55, so jumped in with the ladies. Followed this train until about 16M with some pretty metronomic 6:39-6:43 pacing.
Through half way in 1:28:02. If I am honest, I was finding it a little too challenging for this stage, and probably had been since about mile 6 😆, but I seemed locked into the pace so went with it anyway.
Did my usual: systems check every fifth mile from 5M and a gel at 6, 11, 16, 2. The two caffeine gels seemed to add a boost. Absolutely nailed the in-race blood sugars which was good - although my Freestyle Libre (inserted blood sugar meter) got ripped off at a drinks station, not ideal.
Short but sharp hill around 16M in Altrincham. Managed this mile in 6:50, and carried on around the 6:45-50 mark. Had plans of pushing on with a parkrun to go, but it was starting to bite. Never in a cardiovascular sense, but hamstrings in particular seemed to be tiring. I haven’t been in the gym with any regularity in the last two years, so will aim to get back to deadlifts next term.
From 22M it was clear that sub 3 wasn’t actually in the bag. Mile splits were coming in over the seven minute mark. Tried to focus on form when it got hard and jump onto the back of those who were flooding past - at least for a few seconds. Pretty keen for the finish line at this point.
Mustered just enough for 7m/m for the last half mile or so, but my goodness is it a long finishing straight back towards Old Trafford.
Crossed the finish line in 2:58:30 and knackered! Hung around for a couple of minutes in case Ben had broken three hours (he came in 3:05 for a 12 min PB), then began the painful trudge back to the baggage.
Got fully naked behind some bins for a shivering wet wipe shower. Shall we say that I probably wasn’t looking my most impressive at this point 😆.
An enjoyable meal next to the finishing straight with some friends before beginning the journey home. I was looking out for Jools, Macca et al, but unfortunately didn’t bump into you guys.
Manchester doesn’t quite have the visual landmarks (other than the stadiums) of other big city marathons, but good support nonetheless. Well worth it if you want a London replacement on a fast course.
Feeling surprisingly ok and pleasantly motivated today. Buggy walk and 30 mins on an indoor cycle should help loosen the legs.
Macca - I might have finished the last 5k faster but you would have finished by then, definitely what's the story, morning glory! So chapeau once again.
Congratulations to you to Cal.
TT - I think you were unlucky yesterday with all of those incidents. The 15m would have done you good so do go looking for another marathon with an aim just to complete, I do think you will thank yourself.
Some of the benefits of yesterday's lower key event, hot showers at the finish venue (a first) a huge Sunday roast in the post-race pub and as a mate was driving, a snooze on the way back home. Still would have preferred the Manchester experience though.
Feel fine today a few aches, next up the Exeter marathon in mid May and maybe a HM between then.
Couple of things echo experiences I’ve had: the end when the aerobics were fine but the legs were suffering muscular fatigue/faint crampy twinges & getting locked into an uncomfortably hard pace which was definitely the case at both Shepperdine & Newport for me. Particularly obvious in retrospect. By contrast yesterday felt pretty easy til that hill at Altrincham.
Technically a GFA qualifier TR but this time the cut-off was 3:12:20 so even without the pit stop I’d’ve been a minute adrift.
On reflection it’s not surprising things panned out better as my campaign was slightly less haphazard.
5x20-23.5 nicely spread out + a couple of raced halves, a XC season & a reasonable smattering of MLRs. More consistent speed work, less hills & a drastic taper with both Monday & Friday off. I also took on more fuel, starting just 2M in. I ran with a bottle of Lucozade Sport which was still almost half full by the end. No water but I did grab a shot of Costa Espresso at 10 miles(?) Could be what made the guts go or could be the SiS gels - never liked them but necked 4 starting at 15K. Up til then I was eating salted caramel fudge & had some between gels.
Shepperdine: 3x20-24 in 8 days finishing 3 weeks before race day. Plenty of slow hilly MLRs but not much really pacy stuff longer than 5K
Newport: 1x20 at a decent pace 3 weeks out & a hilly off-road 19 10 weeks out with just a handful of 17-20K runs between.
SQ - enjoyed the report, interesting/ intelligent reflection on build up. Chucked at “keen for the finish”.
Jools - as TR says, quite a narrow window for 2023 GFA, fingers crossed. Sounds like you were taking quite a bit on board, gels, fudge, espresso, carrying a bottle of lucozade , build up sounded consistent though.
(My crow's feet aren't usually this bad!)
That little hill in Alty is a lot more noticeable at 16 miles than it was at halfway on the old course. Having said that, I do prefer this course - the crowds around Deansgate are great and the Carrington dead zone is gone. My favourite bit was the techno DJ under the motorway bridge - gave me a much needed boost on the way back into town when I was hurting.
I always got on well with SiS so not sure why I started feeling sick towards the end...perhaps it's just the fact I've not done a marathon for 2.5 years. Jools, I don't think I'd be able to stomach fudge but whatever works I guess.
I'm still aiming to do my first ultra (50K) the day after my birthday in June so will need to find something I can stomach for 5+ hours...which will be tricky as I am prone to reflux.
My report.
My training and races had shown that a sub 3 was maybe possible if all my stars aligned, but unfortunately that star alignment was wrecked by covid. Two weeks before race day I went down with what I initially thought was norovirus or food poisoning. Spent next few days either in bed or on the toilet, no running possible except out of my bum. On the Tuesday I noticed a sore throat, but was still testing negative for covid. By Thursday the gut situation was improving and I went for a short jog, but the cough was getting worse and I tested positive later that morning. I didn’t run again till the following Tuesday when I started doing some short jogs, but the covid/cold symptoms were still there and starting the marathon was looking more unlikely. Advice I was getting from people on here, and from friends and family, was either don’t run as too risky, or start but take it easy and if I was advising someone else I probably would have said don’t do it. But as got closer to race day the symptoms were definitely improving, and I thought I’d give it a go and see how it went, if started coughing or struggling with breathing, stop.
Race day morning I was still unsure what I was doing. I hadn’t really carb loaded, or done any usual race preparation. I was kind of treating it like a long run. I thought I would just set off at a comfortable pace, but that morning I did have another look at GFA times for London, and looked like 10 minute cushion made GFA qualification easier, so 3:05 was in my head. Cycled the short distance to the start, freezing! Conditions for marathon running were perfect though. I was in red B start, and at 9:25 we were off.
First few miles I just took it easy, and after a few miles I had settled into what felt like a reasonable pace which turned out to be about 7min/mile. The route through city was fun, and went through 10k in 43:54. My plan had been to check how I felt at mile 8, and if I was struggling drop out there as that was close to the start where I had left my bike so I could easily get home. But, I didn’t feel too bad. There had been a bit of coughing early on, but I was controlling the breathing and at the pace I was running at my lungs were able to cope, so I continued thinking I could drop out after half way and get tram from Timperley if problems started. Got half way in 1:31:56, was starting to tire, thought about dropping out, but didn’t. So, then I felt kind of committed, although there were plenty of other places I could drop out and get back easily on the tram.
The run though Altrincham went ok, despite a few little hills, again I wasn’t prepared to beat myself up too much and would slow if felt I needed to, like those uphill sections. The kids choir in Altrincham made me smile and a little bit emotional, which is unusual for me, getting sentimental in my old age. I got to 30k in 2:10:35 so I was holding to 7min/mi pace pretty well, and that’s when I thought 3:05 was definitely on if I could just keep it together. The latter miles were hard as always, but I was able to hold the pace up until the last couple of miles when I did start to slow a bit. Despite the lingering covid I was in better shape than last October when I really struggled and slowed in the last 5 miles. Saw the family at mile 25 which was nice. I was working out in my head how slow I could go and still get in under 3:05, but such calculations are dangerous as brain isn’t working properly and you make mistakes as I have many times in the past, so I just tried to go as hard as I could muster which was somewhere between 7:15 and 7:30 min/mi pace. Crossed the line in 3:04:41 and after a few minutes started to cough and had a bit of a moment, but after a few minutes I was ok and made my way out of there, got my bike and made my way home.
Satisfied with that time. Sub 3 would be nice, but considering I was still recovering from covid I can give myself 5 minutes. It was probably a stupid thing to do, a doctor would definitely have advised me not to, hopefully I’ll be ok. I don’t feel too bad now, usual DOMs, cough still there a bit but improving. Enjoyed this one much more than last October mostly because finished stronger. Manchester is a great city marathon in my unbiased opinion, well organised, well supported, fast.
Great no nonsense race & report. So much easier when you're not over-reaching. Sub 3 next year - if you can be arsed
Looks like we started together - I crossed the line at 9:26 apparently. Got a bit confused with the waves & jogged round the cordon moving the wave up as I thought it was Pink B. Pleased I did as it allowed me to set off with the 3:15 pacer.
Tidying up yesterday & noticed the faintest of pink lines on Tuesday's LFT so guess that headache last weekend might've been covid after all. Didn't notice the line after 30 minutes though so maybe not. Had a bit of crap on the lungs at the start of the week too but all fine now. Friday's was still clear as a bell. I know which was which as they were different packs.
Taunton was to be a more relaxed experience than Manchester. Woke at 6.30, had breakfast in bed, took the dog for a short walk and had a lift to Taunton with some running mates Steve & Phil, who I am going to Seville with in 2023 so most of the chat was on this. We got to Taunton an hour before the 10.30 off, greeted by warm sunshine and enough runners to create a buzz.
Training had gone well, hoping the speed from my 10K TTs would complement the endurance from my long runs. Taunton is a fastish course, I run my HM PB there in 2007!, but there are a few climbs. Target was 2.49-2.52 (sub 250 ideally) aiming for HW around 1.24 to allow for 2 minute slowing in the 2nd half. I've run enough marathons to hit on a formula, so brief warm-up, can of Monster 30 minutes before the off, chill, 4 gels en route and take the first mile easy.
Best laid plans! We were off, first mile 6.06! Doh. The race calmed down, and the next miles were c6.25 and from mile 5 ran with 2 other marathoners which worked well as most of the course was in the country it was pretty, calm but quiet. Ran with these guys until mile 18.
Halfway came in 1.24.07 so sub250 was on, if kept to c6.25-6.30 pacing. This was massively helped by a really tight course, so all the Garmins were beeping as we ran past each mile marker and this was also helped as for part of the second lap rather than share the road route with the cars, I switched onto the pavement which shaved a few metres off here and there.
The group was working well until mile 18, a hilly and 6.43 mm one, so now the imaginary 2.50 line was gaining on me, breathing down my neck. 1 of our group of 3, decided to kick-on, I followed though not at his pace though the few miles were quicker. Running solo and mile 20 came at c2.10 so sub250 still very much on with a 40 minute 10K which was motivating. But, I had, 100% had, to have a scooby doo (first time ever in a race) which became apparent at mile 12 and now we were at Defcon 1! Quickly, found a quiet spot (the beauty of country races) did the deed lost 30 seconds but back in the race and lighter. Sped-up a bit and got past mile 23 needing a c20 min or so 5K so 6.30s.
This was where my solo 10K really helped as though I was running solo, I was a tired and it felt tough I was able to pick-up the pace with the next mile 6.15, onto hilly mile 24 with its 400m climb (6.30). Got to mile 25 - a flat one - ran in 6.13 and into the College where the finish was with over a minute to do the last 200 metres, crossing the line to the applause of half a dozen people in 2.49.34. Really pleased as a sub250 was the aim for this year (what do I do now!).
A hot shower, got changed, had my prize and post-race chat with my mates over a beer and a massive Sunday roast as the carvery was about to close-up, so they gave us what was left. Snooze on the way back with a good day rounded off with my son scoring his first ever tries in a local rugby tournament.
Only fly in the ointment, 3rd time run in VF Next% and 3rd time a right heel blister, this one from mile 10 despite thin socks and vaseline!
Westy...agreed. Signed up for next year, in fact. Couldn't resist the early bird price.
Westy - sign up for an atumn mara, keep ticking and get the sub3.
Jools - even more impressive steady pacing if you had just had CV.
Spent 4 hrs in a hall today with 100s of others, if i come out of that unscathed by CV then i must have super immunity.
6m inc 2m mp, which was reassuringly tough and niggle ridden.
Manchester Marathon
The watch word for this training block was “slog”. Just about every session felt harder than it should and the stats showed that 12 weeks of training were around 20-30s per mile slower than the same block last year. One bright spot was a 10m PB in January but as I'd never raced 10m before there was nothing to benchmark against. I put the MP sessions off as long as I could but was pleasantly surprised with paces suggesting 2.50 or thereabouts. It was only 2 or 3 weeks out that things started to feel a bit better but then it was time to taper.
Anyway, full of beet shots and mildly carb'd up, the journey up the night before and morning of race were smooth and hassle free. It didnt feel as cold as expected so arm sleeves and gloves were left in the drop bag and a variety of toilets were sampled from the many on offer. I was in the white wave and the aim was to try and do it justice, numerically, 6.30s for a 2:50 ish.
Knowing I take a while to warm up I wasnt too concerned about early pace, 6.11s ave as it transpired. Miles 5 and 6 were a bit keen, maybe the crowds around Deansgate but then it was a case of trying to spot any clubmates coming the opposite way. A group of 4 or 5 seemed to form and I settled into a few miles, some just over 6.15, some just under.
Halfway was reached in 1:21:30ish and still 6.15s appearing on the watch, albeit theres now a 20 odd second gap between watch and mile markers. It was about here that I got totally disoriented. I know the course has changed from 2019 but as we went over the bridge before Altrincham, mile 16, I couldnt work out if the people on the other side of the road were in front or behind. I didnt remember the little loop being such a steep climb either but pleasingly, in my head, this had been halfway in 2019 and in 2022 we were now into mile 17.
Effort and breathing were now marginally increasing and I was noticing a few people pulling up although equally, a few were passing, I reasoned that they had paced it well as I was still 6.15ish up to mile 21.
Before the race I had read an article about embracing the pain, thinking of all the people who in that moment would love to be in my shoes (I dont think the author had quite imagined the shit some people would be in). Well that went out the window and my mind turned to how much could I slow and still get a time I'm happy with. Just get through another mile and recalculate. Whilst effort was now sky high, pace was still under 6.30 and a thumbs up was all I could muster for any of the encouraging spectators. As said above, the finish was a long time coming down that straight. A 2.43 looked possible on the watch but being 30s early, it was more like a solid 2.44 and as a 17s PB was realised as I came over all Mr Agressive Fist Pump, getting excited over some arbitrary target. Got a shout from the PA announcer though.
So in summary, a surprise PB from a training block that felt like running through treacle. I cant help but wonder if the exertions of last year took longer to get over than I realised or allowed for. Thats in the past, I've the SDW 50 to look forward to this Saturday.
Pos Pace
10k 378 6.11
½ 391 6.18
30k 356 6.12
Finish 331 6.23
Macca, that's a great result for you. And yes, I'm not surprised your legs felt a bit tired after those epic ultras.
The finishing straight has always felt endless although I'm sure it was worse on the old course. That could just be faulty memory though.
Good luck with SDW. You don't do things by halves, do you?
Cal - Good running.
Jools - Nice run.
TT - Sorry it didn't work out for you.
OO - Great result.
Macca - Epic! Glad the fall wasn't too bad!
SQ - Great run. After the marathon I want to do a few Moose Fartlek sessions, as always a good session with the mix of paces.
I've made it to taper (just!), having fallen over on my knee a while ago, I did the same but hurt my elbow recently! Training was taking it's toll and I was overly tired. I've got a really tight calf which I've been foam rolling and getting a sports massage this week. I think 3 weeks of 68 miles (110kms) took it's toll on me, so just hoping to get to the start line injury free now. No more speed work, despite the plan having some 1200m and 1600m reps, I'll drop those as more important to get to the start and it's not going to get me any fitter at this point. Did 23 miles on Saturday as my last long run and backed that up with 12 miles on Sunday, which is when my calf got tight. Easy 7 miles (Tuesday) and 5 miles this morning. 5 miles this evening planned.
I did spot a post of the taper from P&D 3rd edition, which doesn't have the 3*1600 in, so they must have taken that out.
Steve - Sounds like your good to go and receive the benefit of those 68m weeks. I am with you, in not doing speedwork, though a speedy 5 or 10k has benefit at this stage. Massage that calf.
Just easing back in, a few swims short bike rides and a 2m easy treadmill run this morning.
Macca - you're a steely legged machine. Set out for sub 250 went 244, top job. Not surprised it took you a while to get over last yrs antics. I also have all sorts of mind games to employ but it reality its all just in order to get it done as soon as possible.
Westy... I recite all my parkruns (currently 99 of 'em). I usually do that while doing my achilles exercise (which is basically a static calf raise) but it's a lot harder when your brain has run out of glucose.
In other news, the ultra I was going to enter in June has now been bumped to October, which is not going to work for me as I'm doing Chester. Shame, as it was almost perfect. Now I have to consider whether I want to find a different ultra or whether I should forget that for the time being and work on getting faster again. I'm rather inclined to do the latter (opinions?).
I've entered Manchester again...not sure if I will do Tokyo (much as I'd like to, my finances are not great) but as Manchester's two weeks later next year, they'd be far enough apart I could do both, I think.
4m home into a brisk headwind, had to go back for my cap at one point.
It appears that london have extended the gfa period from August 7th until midnight on vlm day. I bet a lot of folks invested time and money specifically chasing a spring gfa time due to the August cut off.
Seeing both Jools’ and Maccas’ strava entries when I opened the app this morning brought a smile to me face 😊.
With the 1 at the start of Westy and Steve’s names, I briefly thought the two posts were by Westy. 11M would be a punchy return! Enjoyed the report, Westy. And what a great result in the circumstances. Impressively even paced effort I reckon.
Cal - I’d being doing Tokyo if at all possible, although I understand it must be a very costly affair. Would love to head out to Japan on a running related adventure. Hope it works out for you. Very well done on Manchester - you first marathon in such a (relatively) big gap and you should be really proud.
Steve - yes the Moose is a great session. Looks deceptively easy on paper, but definitely gets harder throughout. Stay injury free pre marathon! I reckon you’d get plenty from just strides if needed.
Macca - that is a great report. You have done so well there and it is really shown with the rise in places in the back end of the marathon. It is a long finish straight, isn’t it?!
Great result and super report, OO! Jealous of the hot shower at the end - Abingdon was always a great one for that. Did mile 24 really have 400m ascent? Or am I reading that wrong at it was a climb spread over 400m of running.
Taking things easy so far this week. 1.8M buggy, scoot, cycle, playground thing on Tuesday. Then in Chichester yesterday. Fannied about trying to charge the car, eventually getting an obscure charger in the bag of a industrial estate to work. Surprisingly, I was quickly able to head to some lanes circumnavigating lakes and then through fields. 5M at 8:50s. Then a buggy drop off into fields recovery this morning, 6.8M at 8:40s.