I'm after a decent pair of running shoes (to train and run up to half marathon distance) but am concerned about sweatshop working conditions.
Allegedly, the working cnditions for Nike, Addidas, Reebok etc... are awful.
Does anyone know a good manufacturere who have an ethical code of conduct that they actually adhere to?
Many thanks
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their website says which are made in EU though (mostly Keswick for shoes, Portugal for clothes).
And anyway, surely proper runners wouldn't be seen dead in JJB
the components are still all made in china
I'm sure audits must have been done. I doubt 5 years olds are making the shoes.
At a guess I'd say that the factory brings work to the region & pays above average wage.
I'm for shopping ethically but on what evidence do you base the assumption that the likes of Nike, Asics et al are unethical?
However, don't get me wrong on this. I hate the thought too - it's exploitation, and everyone deserves a fair wage for their work. When larger companies act in this way, then it's obvious that saving money is the obvious motive (when considering how much such companies make, it does not need to be).
To be blunt though, it wont stop me buying Nike, Adidas or other running manufacturer's shoes and clothing simply for the fact that they make good products that I can find good use in. But do I care to think about where it comes from, and think the issue is a touchy one? Yes, and we know it's not right.
http://www.saigon.com/~nike/reports/report1.html
http://www.icmr.icfai.org/casestudies/catalogue/International Marketing/CLIM041.htm
http://business.nmsu.edu/~dboje/inthenewsNIKE.html
Stuart G - even if you didn't give a monkesy about unethical practices ), does it not grind your gears that prices have not fallen in line with productin costs.
I think that despit my principles I might end up buying unethically manufactured shoes. So which manufacturer would be the least unethical I wonder?
Nike have improved since 'No Logo' - they started by improving their PR & not doing anything on the ground, but after they got found out for that too they do seem to have improved a bit.
Anyone ideas about bike kit, or even useful places to do the research? I'm actually in charge of finding a new supplier of women's kit for the bike shop i work in, and would really like to find someone with at least some human rights / environmental standards (apart from my own feelings then i think it would be a good buisness decision for the shop).
I've heard rumours that Pearl Izumi are not so bad, but does anyone have any basis for that? I can't even find a Europe website for them.
Right I'll stop talking rubbish - basically yes it would be fairer if prices were cheaper since production costs aren't exactly high, but as a marketing strategy for a big company, it's clear that that would be a foolish move.
If only it weren't all about money eh? We can only dream that sports manufacturers truly care about the individuals and not profit..
The first one is talking about issue 10 years ago. I'm pretty sure lots of multinationals that outsourced to poorer countries at that time. I don't think they gave a lot of thought to how these places were managed but I really think with public awareness as it is teh bigger companies that so many vilify have been forces to do well in these areas if not to be ethical then to protect their brand image.
I think in terms of ethical shopping the cheap stuff we buy from highstreet chains like topman / topshop, H&M, Tesco, M&S etc need to be looked at too.
I couldn't get the 2nd link to work - I couldn't seem to access a free version of the PDF
Their PR has improved but not much else.
I have checked on www.ronhill.co.uk and as far as I can see they don’t say anything about their ethical policy but I think they manufacture in Eastern Europe (is that more or less ethical that some other countries?!) and they are not a multi-national a ‘local’ company to me (Manchester) so I like to support them.
At least some manufacturers are acknowledging some ethical issues
http://www.newbalance.co.uk/2005/AboutUs/NB-AboutUs.shtml
http://www.brooksrunning.com/corporate/conduct.phtml
I do own Nike stuff, it feels and fits really nice, but am making efforts to spend less with them. Have just checked their website and couldn’t find any ethical/code of conduct info.
The current issue of ethical consumer does have a trainers buyers guide! My partner gets this mag so will report back!
Whilst Nike (looking at them in particular, as they seem to be the main source of irritation for most people) still have a long way to go, they really have made great strides in the last couple of years. In fact, in 2005 they took the very bold step of publishing a complete list of all the factories that they source from, so that anyone who wants to go and check them out is able to. This really is quite a big step, and one that no other company had done.
Large companies have also suffered because a lot of the manufacturing they do is actually outsourced to other companies, often local ones, who do not have codes of conduct regarding labour practices etc. Which raises the question of how far down a supply chain an individual company's responsibility goes. Whilst in the past this has been used as a convenient shield (think Coca-Cola) for bad practices, the complexities of modern supply chains make being 100% sure of good practice in all operations almost impossible. If you don't believe me, there were suggestions that some of the Make Poverty History wristbands had been made in factories with very questionable labour practices....oh the irony!
Anyway, companies are now working much more cleverly with local people to improve standards in factories etc. For example, a group of international companies, together with one of the Prince of Wales Charities and the Vietnamese government have been working together for the last 6 years in Vietnam to improve health and safety conditions in factories there - check out http://www.vcci.com.vn/sub/vbli/default.htm
So yes, there is probably still a long way to go, but the picture is often not as black and white as some campaigners try to present it.
You can check out information on this sort of thing in the Good Shopping Guide, which includes lots of information on a wide variety of products. A good company is Howies, www.howies.co.uk - a small ethical but technical company based in Wales. Otherwise, why not drop a line to the big company that you like to buy kit from, telling them that you want them to be more ethical? Most websites have a feedback forum. And most big companies now produce annual corporate responsibility reports that will give you information about their policies and practices (although obviously these are mostly good-news stories, but some will tackle difficult issues).
Phew - sorry for the lecture. Its a really interesting, complex topic, and one that I've looked at through my work - hence the rant. But its great that people want to take these things into consideration when buying - that's what forces companies to change.
No one stands out really
Thanks for the link KittyD.
I've been running with Karhu M1's for the last year and as a normal / slightly pronating runner I've been really satisfied with them.
Ah the familar reply ...
I remember when a lot of the brands of outdoor clothing I sell where made in UK, then the EU.
It was very common to be asked where a product was made as the purchaser claimed it was important.
Then they discovered that the "ethical" manufactured product was £10+ more (fleece) and could be as much as £50+ (waterproof). It saddens me to say that in 99% of cases they suddenly became less concerned when it was going to cost.
Most manufaturers work on the same profit margins. If it sell for less it is either poor quality and / or made in less than perfect conditions.
I am more concerned about the Lidl / Aldi / Supermarkets etc. of this world. With prices that cheap someone is getting a raw deal.
I hold my hands up that in an idea world all my products would be made in "nice" factories. However I can't afford this with a young growing family.
If I have to choose between local, organic food or EU produced shoes. The food wins every time ....
Sometimes we have to prioritse, it isn't always easy.
1. Labour is a fact of life for MOST children, most families are poor, earning per head, even in the fast developing countries of South East Asia adult incomes can be as little as $1000 per year. In the UK during the 1800s, when we industrialised, factory work was generally accepted as the solution to problem of the rural poor.
2. Education over the age of 11 is not free. Some businesses provide or contribute to the education for younger workers after they have finished ther daily work, but most parents have to contribute to the cost of education of their children. So if work is taken away, these people lose there livelihoods.
3. People in developing countries move to the cities, partly because the USA and the EU have farm subsidies that mean they over-produce and DUMP the surplus on the world market, lowering prices and as a consequence, the incomes of peopel in countries who cannot affort to subsidise there own farming communities!!
4. These countries improve their standards over time: consider Taiwan; Singapore and South Korea where industrialisation happened more recently.
OK so some companies are beter than others but is it about principles? If a business trades on the principle that it bahaves badly less often, no has to be the answer. I will continue to buy Asics shoes as they fit and perform best for me. They support my sport and that this part of the UK is important.
On the one hand I think that at least with NB there's some UK involvement, on the other hand I think that's pretty deceitful marketing, so... basically I'm none the wiser.
Looks like the over-riding factor is still just getting the shoes that are best for your feet.
Good to see you have gone for a recognised global manufacturer as the reality is that it is more likely to have been manufactured ethically than a less recognised manufacturer. A lot has changed over the last 20 years and the large global manufacturers have listened to the issues that have gone on in these countries and have more often than not resolved these issues. You tend to find it is the smaller brands that are tending to slip under the radar and try to get away with things in order to compete with the larger global brands. Recognised global manufacturers are being watched so closely these days they have to make sure they are doing everything as ethically as possible, it is the brands that are delivering products at 'unbelieveable' prices that are probably cutting margins wafer thin somewhere in the production process in order to offer the prices they do.
I have in the last 15 years spent time working in product development for major running shoe manufacturers and have visited many of the factories that have been the source of many of the complaints on this forum. Admittedly I personally would not want to do the job a lot of the guys are doing in these factories but the reality of the situation is that it is a different world to the one we live in. A job in one of the footwear factories in Southern China is quite often a sought after position as it brings with it job security as well as food and lodging. Yes the wages are very low in comparison to what you and I would accept, but once at the factory the money they earn is quite often purely their own as they do not have to worry about food and lodging. In fact a lot of the time a good percentage of the money is sent back to their fammilies who are struggling to make a living off the land.
Price is also always an issue whenever the discussion turns to sportswear manufacturing, you know for sure as soon as any brand launches a new product (especially a football shirt) the Daliy Mail runs a story on how nasty the sports brands are, and how much these products actually cost to make. In some cases they are right, the actual material cost is low but they seem to always forget to mention the wages, overheads, packaging costs, cost of manufacturing (machinery etc), development costs, shipping costs, import duties, Insurance payments etc, all which are part of getting sports products to market. Then of course the retail margin is added on by the retailer which is totally dictated by the retailer as it is illegal for a manufacturer to set a retail price.
It would be wonderful if we could all buy sports product that is sourced locally, however if you can find a manufacturing source that can deliver you the products to retail at the prices you are prepared to pay I would be very suprised, and certainly they would not be in business very long as it just is not economically possible. There is also the fact that if those footwear manufacturers were not spreading their manufacturing sources to the poorer areas of the world you are taking away an industry that is vital to the survival of many workers in these countries.
Apologies for the mild rant but having worked in the industry it tends to annoy me a little that more often than not the people complaining about working conditions in footwear factories have never been to any of these factories and are the same people complaining about how much a pair of shoes cost (not on this particular thread I note). I can say for a fact than running shoe manufacturers margins are not great and are a lot less than a lot of other industries, the reality is if you want your shoes totally made in this country by people working a 38 hour week then be prepared to pay a lot more than you are at the moment!!
I think the 'best' actual running shoe on that list was Brooks, & they are only 10/20
this is depressing.
oh well, i suppose running everywhere still works out better than buying a car, even if it does mean more shoes.