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20 Milers – how do you do them?
Happy & healthy 2011 to all.
I guess it more mental thing than the physical but i still like to know how you guys achieve that.
I did my first last week for my upcoming mara and did it by breaking the run into manageable chunks (5K loop). After each loop i stopped & took liquid/gels onboard. I am not sure if that’s the best strategy i could deploy???
Anyone like to share their experience?
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OMG M&M - there is no way i could ever do a 20 mile run by doing it in 5K loops!!!! What you did isn't wrong - I guess you just have to do whats right for you but the thought of running round and round the same loop.............
I tend to see any run over 15 miles as a "journey". I still break it down into chunks of 6 miles or so in my head as mentally this helps. I make sure I'm well hydrated in the days before the run and eat enough to make sure I've enough fuel on board. I don't use gels - I take jelly babies and carry water. I sip the water little and often throughout the run.
I'd go mad doing it your way, I'm not sure I'd have the commitment to finish! - I'd much rather run a beautiful 20 mile route and take in the scenary as I pass by. But then, thats why I run. Everyone is different and run for different reasons. As I said, your way isn't wrong - but are you afraid of suffering complete exhaustion or something and being far away from home?
My preferred way to do a 20 miler is to get a lift somewhere and run home - like Tigerlily I prefer a really long run to be a journey, running home is great. Also good to do it with lots of others in a 20 mile race - but only if I know that I can hold myself back and not really race it. It's always good if there is someone else to run with, even if only for part of it. So for my lsr this morning I am running about 3 miles to meet someone, we will run a few miles together and then I'll run the rest back to where I started...only 14 planned today though, but I do like to break up a long run like that.
I take water and stuff with me, but find I need far less this time of year than in the summer
I had a good laugh at the above, i guess above fear is enough motivation to do the 5K loops!!
Back to the subject, yep i agree what works for me is not necessarily going to work for everyone, I accept that, i just needed the reassurance and i guess its good to know that what i am doing is right. I will observe other posters and their strategy and see if I could use their experience to my advantage.
I just can't see myself running with liquid/gels/etc tucked around my waist for 20M!!
I agree running with a group is fun & perhaps easy but it does not work for me as i have odd hours when i do my LSR/20 Milers.The other way you could do it M&M and I have done this as well is stash water bottles/gels on the route. I also run with my OH who cycles - he's kind enough to carry my fluid etc!
When you say you can't see yourself tucking gels water round your waist for 20 miles - what is your strategy for race day? Races don't always have gels and almost certainly not your preferred brand.
As you say - it is "horses for courses". There is no right or wrong!
B - running home is always a good motivator........ M&M - you don't run past your house on your loop do you? If you do that shows real commitment and I'm well impressed! There's no way I could do that at mile 18!!
The thought of doing loops makes me shudder................takes a lot of mental strength to keep going when you are tired...........
I love going to see different places and scenery on my long runs......My favourite way is like B's when you get dropped off and have to run home.....no cutting short that way
One of my best `races` was at the Bramley 20 last year. I ran it as a training run where the plan was;
5M @ MP + 45sec
5M @ MP + 30sec
4M @ MP + 15 sec
4M @ MP
2M @ What ever pace I had left.
It was a great race & worked out - the hardest thing I had to do was work out the pace band.
(Thanks Gobi for the plan)
Last year I was training for a local marathon. (New Forest)
Therefore my training partner and I would run parts of the course. This meant that we would know what was coming in the course and it allowed us to run 20 miles which became second nature to us after a while.
Luckily the course, although being one loop allowed us to cut off parts or go a certain distance and then turn around and come back.
We always carried water and gels with us as we did not know what would be available on the day.
I also ran a marathon last year that was 13 laps of the same course (Boddington). I found this quite difficult especially as I was constatntly being overtaken by faster runners.
I guess you just have to experiment. A lot of running is psychological.
I do "out and back", so 20m for me is 10m out, then 10m back, or sometimes, the same route, but run in reverse. I live in a fairly rural area and prefer to stick to roads (for many reasons), so I sometimes repeat part of a route, but I couldn't do that many loops.
I have to run early and don't have time to eat, but take Shot Bloks and water with me. TBH, I don't think that stopping after every 5k loop for gels / water is a good idea. While it's a good idea to keep a steady intake of fuel on a longer run (in advance rather than when you're keeling over and it's too late), starting at 5k (if I've read your post correctly) is a bit early. It sounds as if you're a bit unsure about distance at the moment, sticking close by and fuelling up every 5k. Try to have the confidence to go further and longer without fuelling up like this, you'll be surprised at what you can achieve.
Each to his / her own, certainly re the route, but you will need to adapt your fuelling strategy for longer races. You may also find you're picking up injuries if you're constantly going the "same way" around a loop. Pavements my way have massive cambers, so I often have to make sure that I do the return bit so both legs have an equal turn at running lopsidedly.
20 miles is 20 miles - I'm quite happy with any variation from a single 20 mile loop to 80 laps of a running track.
However, it does seem that LSRs feel a good deal further when on an unknown course as opposed to familiar territory!
I'm happy with small loops (2.1 miles to be precise) but they dont pass my house so its a lot easier...I cant do passing the front door.
I can do up to 23 miles (furthest to date) without even water so I dont need loops I just find it handy to run around something I know and can zone out on. I've lap counted at a track marathon and it didnt seem too bad...not sure I'd be up for it, but thats more because of the ovetaking!
I think 20 milers are easier when the bulk of your weekly mileage supports the distance - they are certainly more tough for me at 50 miles a week than 60+
MandM, you just get used to it
As others have said though it's horses for courses... as you go on you'll find out what works best for you. I like to do my 20 milers in loops too (I have a 6.8 mile route I just do laps of for long runs) - it helps with pacing, and like PRF I find it goes quicker than a random or unfamiliar route.
I don't carry water or gels or anything, although I used to when I started out. The thing to remember with 20s is that they should be slow, so your pace should feel comfortable enough to remain pretty constant over the distance. Curly is spot on too, they're definitely easier when your weekly mileage is higher - helps reduce your risk of injury too. (Am yet to reach 60+ though, only started doing 50 a few months ago!).
Well done by the way, and good luck!
I don't start taking any 'gels' until 13miles on the marathon, even then it was a jelly baby every half mile at most. A medium size bowl of porridge half an hour before running seems to do the trick for me. During training I didn't use anything. I carry my water in a camelbak.
The furthest I run is 19miles. One large loop where I know where the 6mile points are and use them as targets. ie break into 3 short runs, with a bit tagged on the end. I know if I stop I find it very hard to get going again.
What pace are you doing your LSRs at, this might affect how many gels etc?
On the marathon I ran, most people seemed to have only 5 or 6 gels in their packs, not loads. I only got through 15 jelly babies
WoW, it seems i have enough variety listed here to do twenty 20Milers
The response is simply fantastic; it seems i would fly with my next 20Miler…
Anyway as many of you said there are many ways to skin the cat and & i agree you just have to do what suites you best.
Some clarifications:
I do pass my house to pick up fluid so yes I do this to get some metal strength.
I dont take gel at every 5K but fluid, I read so much about dehydration that i decided to take sips at 5K interval and stay hydrated throughout the run, i know its possible to extend the liquid break but i would not want to take any risk. Curly 45, how the heck you could run 23 Miles without even fluid intake, you defy all LSR logic.
Oh I like Mr K/Gobi 20Miler with some variations, am sure it will make the run little challenging.
I try my best to keep pace LSR 5:45 – 6 minK, again it’s to ensure that its inline with my MGP of 5:15 min K. For the mara i intend to take 3 gels which will fit nicely in my short/back pocket, water/energy drinks will be available on the course so no need to practice to carry liquid.
They may well be provided, but don't assume that there will be enough for everyone, that you will be able to get access to them or that they will be at the points where you need them. I've been in busy races where they've run out of drinks for a number of reasons. It's really not a good idea to rely solely on the water stations for providing you with what you need, it's better to have your own supply available so that you're not caught out. By all means use theirs if it suits you (for eg, their energy drink may not be one you've tried, or may be one that doesn't agree with you - not the time to rely on it
IMHO, it really would be worth incorporating that into your training runs. When I first started my longer runs, I used to take water and jelly babies, but I'm like Curly, I recently did some 20m and all that I needed was a small amount of water towards the end and a few Shot Bloks and that was going out on empty. Horses for courses, but it would be worth considering fuelling / hydration when looking at your training strategy.
I just built up to it - on a hot day I will drink water but over the winter I dont need it anymore...liquid gives me a stitch and slows me down so if I can avoid it then I will.
I drink small amounts in races though, because I get dry lips/mouth from the salt.
I guess it would take a few more 20 Milers then i'll be able to say that
You are absolutely right i 'm in this camp too but at this stage i have to suffer and take the liquid.
I know i can run for an hour without any liquid but just for the mara i thought its best to take liquid at a regular interval and stay hydrated.
You'll know your own body, but I'm like Curly, too much water and I get a stitch, feel sick etc, but I drink gallons during the day, so I'm probably pretty hydrated before I even start, hence being able to go for longer distances without needing to take on too much. I do need a tad more in the hot weather, but even then, I'm careful as if I take on too much, it makes me feel
.
Fair enough re the small race, but just make sure that the water stations will be where you want to take on water, as if they're not, you then have to hang on until you reach the next one.
Good luck with the race, hope it goes well.
I'm another to not take anything on LSRs and that means up to 27 miles..there just isnt any need.
Having liquid sloshing about in the stomach is the last thing I want to have to put up with.
Remember that nobody ever died of dehydration in a marathon but many have died of the opposite!
There's been some interesting research on sports drinks and other drinks recently (and not so recently in the case of the 1991 Noakes research!):
http://bjsm.bmj.com/content/early/2010/12/22/bjsm.2010.075697.short?q=w_bjsm_ahead_tab
http://bjsm.bmj.com/content/45/1/2.short?q=w_bjsm_current_tab
http://bjsm.bmj.com/content/45/1/14.short?q=w_bjsm_current_tab
It seems that BJSM has a bit of flavour about this at the moment...I wonder why?
I found that I used to drink a lot more liquid than I needed. On my first 10mile race I carried a bottle and thought I needed it. I was sipping water every few hundred metres towards the end.
It's worth experimenting to see what you actually think you need and what you actually do need.
As Curly says lots of misinformation and hype from the drinks and gels manufacturers.
TBH if your well hydrated you shouldn't need to drink for the first hour of running, i do half marathons and dont take on anything, However when i ran edinburgh i took on Lucozade at every station(due to the heat), i had gels which i started to take from mile 10 and took them inbetween each drinks station.
A word about doing loops, I wish i had been doing them and not an out and back when i was 6 miles form home and my curry from last night decided to make a sharp exit. LESSON LEARNED..
It worked for me.