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Lactate Threshold Training
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A mixed week! Good set of intervals on Tuesday, as Sunday had been easy. Thursday's 11K Tempo and Saturdays Easy 7K were screwed up because I had set the wrong HR Zones, fortunately I went slower rather than faster than planned!
Todays 24K was same pace and HR as last but surprisingly my VO2 notched up to 53 and forecast HM time is now 1.29.54! So my watch thinks I'm doing something right.
One more week of training, two weeks taper and then Hackney HM so we will see what happens then.
Average intervals Tuesday. Exhausting 15KM Tempo on Thursday so I skipped the Saturday easy run. The week redeemed itself with a decent 29K easy pace today. So two weeks of tapering to see what speed comes back.
VO2 max back to 52 which seems more likely.
7k 5.10 141
10k 4.30 159
7k 5.16 144
24k 5.05 143
6 x 400m 4k 156
11k 4.49 151
7k 5.51 144
24k 5.06 145
4x1600m 9k 156
15k 4.41 160
29k 5.06 143
Hope the data makes sense - that's three weeks running.
Sorry it's metric.
160 is where I would do my threshold runs but I wouldn't consider doing much more than 40 mins at that effort. You have more than an hour here. Even if I downgrade that to half marathon effort assuming you have a higher threshold hr than me, it's still a tough tough session that is most likely to leave you needing a huge amount of recovery.
We're all different and what works for me may not work for you but I remain convinced you're digging yourself into a hole with this training, and barely getting out of it by the time the next effort comes along.
Here's my last 4 weeks prep for a half last September when I was coming back from a fall and illness that heavily disrupted running for 3 weeks in August. First week is a transition week after a 10k off nothing but residual fitness on the Sunday before. Apologies for the mixed distance units.
Wk-4
Tues:
3.33km wu 119bpm
7.6km@150
4.6km cd 126bpm
Weds:
9.8km@132bpm
Thu:
30 mins xt
Fri:
Rest
Sat:
7.9km@135bpm
Sun:
18km@127bpm
Wk-3
Mon: 6.4km@130bpm
Tues:10km@154bpm 4.05min/km (5km wu and cd-125bpm)
Weds:7km recovery 123bpm
Thu: 6km@130bpm
Fri: Rest
Sat: 2 x 1.5m + 1m @ 160 bpm (2mins recovery) 3.42 min/km
Sun: 23km@130bpm
Wk-2
Mon: 8km fartlek 133bpm
Tues: 8km wu and cd @ 125bpm, 8.1km@150bpm 3.58 min/km
Weds: 30 mins xt
Thu (am) wu + 4m@150bpm (pm) 8.5km@133bpm
Fri: 30 mins xt
Sat:
3.5km wu 118bpm, 3m@160bpm + 1.5m@160bpm 3.49min/km 2.6km cd
Sun:
24km @130bpm
Wk-1
Mon: 5km recovery 119bpm
Tues: 11km@150bpm 2.3km wu+cd
Weds: 5km recovery 120 bpm
Thu: 30 mins xt am, 13km@130bpm
Fri: 7km@127bpm
Sat: Rest
Sun: Race 21.1km @157bpm 3.51min/km
Race was tackled as a b race as I'd lost a few weeks in the 8 weeks prior.
Thanks for taking the time to share that. Apart from a VO2 max of at least 60 and training almost every day - its just like me!
I take your point though, and looking back at my data I'm still pushing above the the target HR too often and for too long so I still need to cut back and make the easy runs easier. Prob 5.15/5.30 pace on the longer runs. It is interesting to see the wider range of HR that you train at and the higher quality of your speed sessions.
I have a 10K Sunday so rather than setting a target pace of say 4.25/4.30 - I'm going to run the first two laps at Threshold Pace (I reckon 4.45) and then see what's left to push the final lap. If nothing else it help break my habit of over estimating my target pace and then fading in the last few k.
thanks for your interest and feedback.
If you are fading in races it may also be connected with underlying fatigue rather than over ambition... how do you adjust training in the fortnight before a race ?
Good luck with the 10k. I have one next Sunday that I am umming and aahing about as I'm not so fit - I have had a stop start year so far. It could be a threshold outing there for me too.
Ignore Garmin race predictions, they are wildly optimistic.
As planned I stayed within LTHR (153-163) for first two laps and stepped it up for the last lap (163-178). Satisfyingly I was only 9 seconds slower than going flat out two months ago and HR was 161 compared with 166 and I have finally realised that I can control my heart rate rather than letting it control me. Still need more practice at HR led running though. Today's 10k was 4.24 pace.
So next Sunday is Hackney Half and I will run 15K at LTHR and see what's left (if anything) at that point.
Sub 1.37 would be great and sub 1.35 unlikely but you never know!
I taper for the two weeks prior to a half and that means shorter runs but keeping the speed up. I might try easing back the intensity as part of my more easy running campaign.
When do you use the zone above 'easy' and below 'tempo'? It seems to be called 'steady' and is probably the pace I'm running when I'm trying to bring it back to 'easy' without success.
I don't do many steady runs by design. Sometimes I strive for an 80% effort and fall short due to tired legs and it may come out as an intermediate effort. I do progressive efforts that take me through steady on the way to threshold and 10k effort too.
Is the half a goal race ?
Yes - having done 1.41 then 1.38 in February and April respectively I'm looking for 1.36 or better on Sunday. Reassuringly this easy running lark doesn't seem to have had a negative impact!
Did 7k this morning and HR average down to 138 and below target for 86% of the run.
Will probably do 5K LTHR on Thursday then see how we go Sunday. Once i've recovered next week - I might see how close to 20 minutes I can get on my 5K route. Then it's the Southend Half on 12 June. Maybe sub 1.35.
I read an interesting article yesterday about an experiment using heart rate variability to govern when to run sessions and when to run easy. Over the course of the experiment the group using hrv ran fewer moderate and intense sessions than the control group but improved times by 2 and a bit percent over the controls nevertheless..
So 1.46 at Hackney was a 'Personal Worst' and I can only use the heat as an excuse.
On the positive my average HR was 161 - my lowest ever in an HM, AND I enjoyed the final 5K whilst all about me were collapsing. The St John's Ambulance were loving it.
Also I recovered really quickly, jogging a couple of km home and then out for an easy bike ride in the afternoon.
Tuesday should be Tempo but as part of my less is more it will be just 7K easy.
Whilst I don't yet have the times to show my revised approach working (and I still need to slow down more on easy runs) I 'feel' it will pay off.
Hope your running is going well.
Mik!
Keep with it. You will really enjoy it once the gains start to appear.
Yeah the heat and humidity were hard to bear on Sunday Mikhail, particularly as the previous Sunday was about 15 degrees cooler. I would ignore that half. I ducked out of my race and was glad I did as my replacement long run was very hard work.
If you feel fresher that's a good sign and the easy runs should set you up better for the endurance and speed sessions in weeks to come. I suppose now you'll put in a good couple of months of training before the next race ?
I did a harder run for the first time in a month last night with 5m at 150bpm (in the pouring rain). I can feel that the fitness is returning as it returned 6.57 min/mile av. pace. The same run March last year came out at 6.16 min/mile so there's a way to go yet.
Not posted for a while but have adjusted my training regime to more HR led with increased easy mileage and a couple of focussed speed sessions each week as advised. Similar conditions at Southend Half between 2015 and 2016 and I went quicker this year - 1.36 rather than 1.38! But even better look at the splits.
Distance 2015 2016
5k 22.24 22.48
10k 22.18 22.43
15k 23.46 23.14
20k 24.03 23.34
In 2015 I went off at max HR and faded after 10K. In 2016 I kept HR in Zone 4 to 16K and stepped it up to Zone 5 for the last 5K. Still some fading in speed but far less and I passed quite a few runners in that final 5K rather than being passed.
I still need to bring my easy runs down to 5.15km rather than 5.05 but much better than when I first made the change.
Next up Maidenhead in September - a sub 1.35 would be great but unfortunately my holiday will throw training and my wife won't cancel! No commitment. ;o)
Hope your running is all that you would want.
Seems a lot better that Mikhail, and maybe the splits would hold up a bit more with a few more medium long runs in your training mix.
I would expect to hit Zone 5 in the last couple of kilometres of a race rather than the last 5 - it's still rather a long way to go at that point. I find if I've paced it right, it starts to feel like a bit of an effort around 10k, and quite a lot of an effort past 10 miles and the last half mile to a mile is last ditch territory.
Things slowly recovering for me - consistent mileage now and longest run ever of 18.1 miles on Sunday in 2 hrs 19.
So after 1.36 at Southend a combination of illness and holiday screwed July and August training! However the long slow runs at 'Easy' pace 5.15 per km paid off and I kept good base fitness. As a result and after just half a dozen runs through August (one 5K tempo the rest easy/moderate) I still hit 1.39 at Maidenhead today.
Better still I was a human metronome lol! Target 4.44 per km. All kms between 4.36 and 4.52 and that 4.36 was km 21. HR rose steadily through the LTHR of circa 158/160 by km 12 and only hit 175/180 in the last couple of km.
So best run so far if not best time!
Thinking I will focus on 10K through winter on four runs per week, get the LTHR and speed to improve and bring the longer runs back in next spring?
Any thoughts on this strategy and suggestions on what the three/four runs should be each week much appreciated.
Big thanks in anticipation.
Thanks also to the 1.40 pacer at Maidenhead who thanked all Marshalls and Supporters as we ran around plus giving half a dozen of us great support and motivation.
Also to the two runners who stopped to check I was ok when I fell arse over tit Friday and gave myself a black eye, scraped knee, shoulder etc!
If you've got nothing planned just treat the next few months as aerobic base training. That means mostly easy runs with strides and a marathon effort run once or twice a week, a mid week medium long and a long run. I have got away with long runs on a 10 day cycle before now so maybe consider that as an option if you really don't fancy them. Apart from that sprinkle in a bit of work on your efficiency with the occasional fartlek or some short Hill sprints and see how you get on. In this phase have mileage be the progressive element in your running, not intensity.
Thanks muddyfunster. I will keep the weekly long slow run 15K to 30K - I really enjoy them now they feel like a jog with HR of 125 - 135 with breath to chat.
I guess my query is around the intervals and tempos where for HM the intervals range from 4 to 6 400, 800 and 1600 intervals. Tempos are between 5K and 15K.
As I want to push up my 10K performance through Autumn and Winter should I reduce the distances and increase the pace of the intervals and tempo (effectively reduce the distance by half as a 10K is half a HM?).
So my tempos would be say 3k to 7k?
For marathon effort runs my volumes have been between 6 and 8m typically. I'm afraid I don't really know what tempo means in effort terms or pace terms but those marathon efforts are the significant harder efforts I tend to do in base training.
Not posted for a while but kept the running solid through the winter despite the Christmas cold so we'll see how the HM Marathon times compare this year.
Ran 15KM Tempo today at 4.30 per km pace and HR average 162 - LTHR running.
I was wondering though should I run to a 4.30 pace and allow my HR to rise over the run OR run 162 HR and allow my pace to decline over the run?
Allow it to decline or run at a lower heart rate that holds stable. Or just call it a progressive effort run. There's room for all three types of run in a schedule really. If it is happening all the time it's an indicator that you are perhaps working at too high an efforr level and not staying aerobic.
Tempo Thursday and Long Run Sunday I guess this new run will go in on Friday or Saturday.
Thanks - very helpful as always.
Distance 2015 2016 2017
5k 22.24 22.48 22.42
10k 22.18 22.43 22.54
15k 23.46 23.14 23.09
20k 24.03 23.34 22.56
Looks like this slow running works!!! Thanks.
My HR was at a steady 165/167 which is my LTHR until the last few km when I stepped it up.
So now I'm running 4 times per week 30Km to 50Km per week with 15 to 20% at Tempo/LTHR and 5% Intervals or Fartlek.
Any thoughts on how I can improve - more frequency? more distance? - I am focussing on halfs and a sub 1.35 would be nice - last achieved September 2015. Sunday was just sub 1.37 but still better than anything in 2016!
Glad it's going well. I think for half marathon you need consistent distance work - so a weekend run of 20km plus and a mid week run of 15km (all mostly easy). You can incorporate sections of marathon effort (150bpm, 3-5miles) into either run (but not both) if you're feeling comfortable to further stimulate the aerobic side. Just make sure if you do that it doesn't impact on any planned 'hard' session. A rule of thumb is to rotate these tougher longer runs in every fortnight or so. But really go with how you feel and the recovery guidance from the watch.
Also vary the hard stimuli - use hill sprints, 2 minute hills, alternating threshold and sub-threshold paces on a tempo run. Add strides 10 x100 m to the end of your easy runs. Do range of motion drills to the beginning and end of hard sessions, use strides in the warm up.
I think Vo2Max is a good thing to track as a guide to fitness. I recall when I came back from injury mine was at 56 and it took about 9 months before it was back to where it was when I was hitting pb form. Happily I did manage to hit pb form at the start of 2017 and ran a 1.16.31 half. After a couple of hiccups I am now training consistently for London and building mileage - at around 60 mpw now.
Good luck with Reading, I find I can get away with a one week taper for a half, but need at least a week of recovery afterwards ...