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Moraghan Training - Stevie G
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Alehouse - sounds OK for a couple of pints then! Cool. Shame it looks like it will be a bit breezier tomorrow, probably a bit more troublesome on the first half of the race, we'll see.
Welcome Matt. I'm sure the serious ones on here will be able to give you some decent advise
The man has obviously been reading this thread, as they've now reset the long leg distance to "6.38km" on PO10 now.
Which equates to a very fussy 3.96miles.
Last year they labelled it 4miles exactly, so it's strange they're now deciding it's worth 0.04miles of a distinction!
Strange.
Matt, welcome aboard mate. I'm a bit of a casual, but the rest of this lot are obsessional nutters of some standard, so will cruise in with stacks of advice soon I reckon
Not to get too caught up in this RB stuff (as I get caught up in it), it now has the long leg as a 1.8 difficulty. That's more like it.
Anyone have a higher "difficulty" for a race they've done than 6.0! My highest by miles, that crazy parkrun at Gadesbridge. (next highest in the 3s)
I expect I didn't help that, with that being an already awkward course with 2 laps, featuring awkward offroad climbs, that I managed to ruck the route up and get a pro rated time, plus a big extra time lumped on (18.46 given, actual about 17.10ish for 3miles!)
The main interesting part of my "handicap" is that it now sits at 0.8, which is the same as my finest period ever from 2013, where I was hitting a 34:30 10k and 57:09 10miler.
Is that trying to make the suggestion i'm in that sort of shape, or is it simply a lack of recent races, a measurement versus others, or given allowance for being older etc?
Wasn't forcing the pace, just leaning into it and concentrating on style.
When I finished that bit, I went and tried out my super light racers (4oz) to see how I would go at a level effort when having already clocked a few miles.
The average pace of a succession of 200m strides came out in the 5:40's. That'll do.
🙂
Welcome Matt (so to speak!).Looking at your PBs, I don't think speed work is going to be the issue with a sub 60 10M so much, or getting your half and 10k times down. Your 5k and 5M in particular are well below my PBs for those, but my 10M PB is sub 59. What were your longer runs like at the time you did those? Presumably the marathon group training has upped those a lt? Are you ding longer tempos?
Why aren't the relays just set distances and measured properly or am I missing the point?
Double for me today. That calf twinge from yesterday was OK until he last mile or so tonight, when it turned to pain. I'm hoping a day off tomorrow will sort it, as I'm off to the Lakes tomorrow and don't want a second week there marred by injury!!!! icing it as we speak.....
Ale - speedy recovery!
Haha Bus, you weasel, I thought i'd get away with that.
I'm the least casual person ever, I live breathe and sleep it, and my whole existence is geared round it. Which is why I fear a life and commitments kicking in, as it can only go downhill
Matt - stick around and learn from these fellas. But you sound like you're well on a good run and don't necessarily need any advice right now anyway! sub 37 as a training run sounds pretty tasty!
Bus - another different niggle that's irritating. Another holiday will ease it though
Ric, do you get any reaction from those super lightweights? I've been 50-50 on my 6 ouncers. Calfs, where I never feel anything.
Hoping this rib ache thing is just me being over thinking on things. I dare say I can see out a 17-18min 5k job tomorrow though. Hopefully in less rain and wind than last time, but either way, it's over soon so all good!
Yeah, the long runs for the others have ramped up, and there's also a focus on MP tempos with HMP sections - but as I don't train with them, owing to being away, my plan was to alter it into some kind of HMP/LT tempo.
I think what I have lacked is sessions dedicated to speed endurance - which that one in November knocked on the head.
Regarding long runs, I've done 15mi since last summer, but planning on pushing it up to 2hrs as the pace comes down.
Bus, I hope some rest during the holiday will help!
FWIW, I used to spend a lot of time focussing on RunBritain, but given it allocates a handicap based on the other participants recent race history I'm not so keen! Although I still can't resist checking it after fast parkruns, as that causes the handicap to drop well
Your overall handicap isn't based on others though is it? Just the race handicaps, based on conditions v performances v what people "should" be doing?
Or is it? I really know jack about RB.
If it was based off world record, like say WAVA, surely you couldn't have people miles under 0?
RunBritain do have a FAQ here... http://www.runbritain.com/blogs/runbritain-rankings-frequently-asked-questions
As clever as it tries to be, unfortunately it is flawed like others have said
Checked Dachs RB to see if his handicap took a similar shape, but as would make sense, with a best half recently, his handicap is highest ever now.
I did marvel at the man's skillz though. That 14.25 at a race billed as 5k XC sounds very tidy indeed
No wonder it sits above even your 69min half
MH - thanks, but holidays are not for rest :-). Possibility of 3 races while I'm away, but most likely just the mid-week one close to where we are staying, or it'll compromise my ability to just get out and enjoy the fells (calf permitting!!)
Still, it's always nice to have a 14:25 cross country 5k on your record.
Welcome Matthew. Good to have another west country boy on here, as I'm originally from Somerset. I believe Dean is from Devon, but he obviously couldn't cope with the natural beauty so moved to Stoke on Trent.
Welcome Matthew and you will get decent advice from the folks here. Your current pb's are all very close to mine except your 5 miler which is much better. As such I think you have loads of scope and should firstly get your 5k and 10k in line by focusing on 1k/1 mile reps respectively at the paces you want to target for the 5k/10k. Run that regularly then half the distance at race pace as your last threshold pre race and you should be ok. I wouldn't worry about 10m or HM till after the 10k.
Changing tack I think Run Britain is wrongly maligned here. It is based on facts and they cannot allow for who was and wasn't trying on the day! Yes maybe parkruns should be excluded, but that would take out a high percentage of all runs so not ideal in that respect. If you want a better ranking you know the format; even I got to 2.4 at one point last year so most on here could be sub zero if they want to be.
After a month out of action I am starting to run again. Kept my record of at least one parkrun a month since 2011 by running with my 11 year old to a cool 29'xx last week! May try a proper one this weekend if the ribs will allow it
Breakfast down, looking forward to the LFOTM and a couple of pints after. Hi Pete, yes has been a while..
Not sure that Dean actually lives in Stoke though!
Just about to set off to meet other thread members at LFoM!
See you chaps soon. Just eating still, as it's still 3 hours away!
As you say, that 5-mile race stands out by a mile. It equates to a low 17 5k, mid 35s 10k, 59 for 10 miles and a half in 78/79 minutes.
My advice would be based around periodisation, so e.g. for a marathon people are used to a 12 or 16 week plan with a definite target at the end and you need to do the same for the other distances. If you are targeting a 10 mile race in October you have space for two periods, so April, May and June followed by a rest in July and then August, September and October for the Great South Run.
In each period you do three types of runs:
- Reps over short distances at faster than race pace
- Race paced reps
- Over distance
So say you were shooting at a low 17s 5k which is 5:30 pace, you may do 800m reps round the 2:30 mark to get the speed element up and longer reps (say 3 x 1600m at 5:30 pace) and then you longer tempo runs would be at 6 minute pace (so 1 to 2 miles warm up, 5 miles in 30 minutes, cool down).For that sort of work, try and avoid the temptation to mile count. If you can do 3 good sessions like that a week then your other runs need to be recovery runs at about 7:30 a mile and not going out for a couple of hours LSR with a marathon group as it is social.
The two periods of training works well, as the first will allow me to train specifically for the Devon Country 10000m towards the end of June. I'll have to think what is a realistic target for the track over the next 3 months, that will still put me on track for the GSR.
It looks like I may need to work on raw speed - I've never run a rep of any length much faster than 5:30 pace
As for the recoveries, my easy run pace (~75% MHR) is around 7:30, which is also the pace I try to do the long runs at (although occasionally with a pick-up section at the end)
Also, Matt is perfectly fine
Hope those taking part in LFotM have a good'un!
What I do have though is two pain free runs to my name this week. There was some soreness after run 1 but it disappeared and is now less sore than before the two runs.
Just 5 miles a piece but it's a start. Today's lunchtime 5 felt like hard work though. I had a sore throat last night so I am hoping it's down to that rather than lost running fitness. I guess 3 1/2 months of barely any running will do that.
I am hoping it will come back quickly due to the high levels of XT though.
Good to hear your recovery is going well Pete.
Shame there appears to be another twinge Bus. Could be something reacting to faster running that's all. Don't be surprised if there's nothing there in a day or two.
SG, on the 4oz racers. There's no adverse reaction to my calf muscles. Multiple reasons.
One clue is that it's a good idea to train in race shoes.
I used to do that a lot once.
It's a style issue mainly.
🙂
Long day today, London trip featuring the 5k race and post race mini social, and a bit of dutiful son hospital run tonight.
However, we can now get the report done!
Despite a rest day yesterday, I still felt strangely tight in my back, which will pass, and a little bit of a worry about an ache in the rib type area again, which I really hope does pass. We don't want the 2015 story to pan out again, which started from that area! The good thing so far is it's just a bit of an ache, whereas last time I was positioned in a way that felt like it affected breathing. Depends what rib it's on I suppose!
One of my oldest pals from school came along for the trip, he has his spells in and out of running and racing, regrettably completely out of it at the moment, and luckily we allowed a decent margin for getting to Hyde Park, with a few delays on the tube.
Quickly saw Simon near the bandstand, the classic start area of this event with the main route. (last year it was the "other" route.
Then Crispy came into sight! Small world. Has been a bit off his game due to a few potential health things himself, but he looked the part straight off, despite his "I don't even have a watch" and i'll run round with you lines
Saw the man himself, Aley, and I thought, 3 friendly faces isn't bad at a Friday lunchtime race, when I've been largely off the proper scene for a while. Simon's popped up at 3 of my last 4 races!
Didn't have any time goals in mind, although I did notice a Dasher who had run 16.17 here last month was 30secs quicker than me in the 4mile relay leg last week, so did wonder if that'd mean 16:47
The start line seemed to be marked with a yellow or orange (I forget now) line, yet most of the front line seemed to start the wrong side of things. Me and Crispy like good boys made sure we were behind it, and due to being wide, I found myself starting monsterly to cut into the centre. At this stage Simon was behind me, so I knew it was a little silly.
A slightly undulating curve and round, and there seemed to be a really big front pack this month. The order was settling down, and didn't feel too tasty a pace again, and through the 1st km in 3.17.
I remember a fairly windy spell on one of the slight downs, as well as a woman with a pushchair stubbornly staying a little bit too central on a narrow path as a hoarde of runners steamed towards her! Yes we don't have right of way, like the organiser said, but if you're an individual, and there's tonnes coming towards you, you probably might be best moving a little
Through 2km 3.22. It's going ok.
A few overly optimistic and loud breathers were coming back hard over the next km, and it must have had a little bit of rise and wind, as it was suddenly 3.32
I was enjoying the route, it seemed a much better bet than the alternative one we did last May.
It didn't feel like working too hard, and I was pleased the next km hadn't dropped off, and came out the same as 3.32
So this was the run in. There were a few pairs or gangs of guys just out for their own runs pootling along blocking bits of the road, but the main action was battling with a guy in grey who had a dam infuriating style. Like he was swimming, or trying to simulate the effort of running very fast, but not actually doing so. He also had that habit of unintentionally cutting across the line at the wrong time.
I'd had enough of this goonery by the time we got to the last run in, and he ignored the marshal's instruction to cut a corner off and just put full beans on, and left him.
I could see the finish, and was low 1640s, but with a big sprint, knew i'd just missed it with a final 3.17 km. As it panned out, it had inched away from the real hard luck story of the Ealing mile, and one guy had that scenario, running 17dead.
Final time confirmed as 17:03 -11th place
That's 45 5ks now, and that ranks 3rd, behind the Dulwich 16:53 and Battersea Park 16:59
I dare say BP is faster, so that's promising. I also remember running BP with a more pronounced version of this rib thing, and it was only about 6 weeks before the the race collapse saga (hopefully the 2 conditions aren't as linked as I remember them being!)
Anyway, Simon led us on what felt like another 5k to the pub, that in the end seemed to be about 100metres away from the venue, and despite the guilt of allowing Simon to be fleeced for £11.50 for 3 drinks (including a half pint Coke and orange juice), a good bit of run chat was had with Aley as well, plus pals!
I cut it a little short as I was aware dragging my "off running currently" mate in amongst people he didn't know to revel in running chat for too long wouldn't be fair.
So to conclude, good thread meet up, and without spoiling it great work from Simon and Crispy. Aley did well after an ill week, and if I can shift the current aches, it feels like a good place to be in.
Good news on the foot injury AG and likewise PeteM.
Bus, any races planned? Pendle fell race today which you could do on the way through. 35-40 min job. ;-)
Not far off the A target Aley so more to come in favourable conditions.
Well done too SG. Back on the hunt for Pbs now!
One to consider when you head north for a united game is the podium 5k. Theyre on a Saturday about 6.30-7pm on a 1k loop which is a cycle track. Flat as a pancake. Fields haven't been massive but usually always won in 14/15 mins so attracts some decent names.
Race wise...bit congested at the start so I had to go round the side to the front , where I stayed for a few more metres until James McMurray from St Albans stormed past me, never to be seen again basically! Breathing wasn't brilliant, but went down and up the first couple of rises and through the first K in 3.09, really windy in a couple of places.
Went through 2k in 6.20, so still under 16 pace, still not feeling amazing and a St Albans guy on my tail. Round the end of the lake and 3k in about 9.50 and down into 3rd. So hanging on ok, but now slipping pace wise, up past the club house and starting the run down Rotten row through 4K in 13 mins, managed to just about keep the pace ok to the finish in 16.15. So first 5k foe a while, so happy enough. First M40 by over a minute too.
Nice couple of pints with SG and his mate after in that stupidly expensive pub and then with Alehouse and a few of the older guys. Humbled by their times and medical past too, for the tube back to Euston with Alehouse too.
Off for a 10 miler in a minute and then train to Southampton later for the footie!!
SC - Quality run there. I couldn't get tickets, or at least then 3/4 I wanted together, left it late
Coach has set a nasty session today ahead of some of us gearing up for some racing. Sessions have been going well although my foot is hindering a bit.
8km tempo (few minutes rest) + 5km parkrun (tempo) whatever I can muster there
Probably all just inside 6m/m which for near 10miles will be happy
Excited to see Matts run at Manchester tomorrow
Reg - Hoping the foot sorts itself soon, been ages now
Ale - Very close to target on an off week. Nice
Reg, sounds like the foot is on the mend - fingers crossed....
Pendle would have been nice Matt, but had to collect the kids from school, so didn't hit the motorway until 2. Horrible journey, thanks to eejuts crashing and bringing the M6 to a crawl in several places. Didn't arrive until 8, despite only stopping once and doing the last 100M faster than I normally would. Several race options this week. Today could have been Dungeon Ghyll, but its an hour each way in the car nd pouring with rain, so not sure I fancy it after yesterday! Tomorrow is the Muncaster Luck race. It's a BM, and again, an hour drive, so I may just do a long run up the higher fells from here as the forecast is good. Wednesday evening is the short but very sharp Grisedale Grind, starting just up the road and a definite. Next Saturday is the Coledale Horseshoe and I can see the start field from here - trouble is we leave on Friday....grrrrr!
Good luck tomorrow Matt - you've done the miles, so the race is the easy part :-)
Pete - missed saying good to hear you've been able to get out! As per Phil though, easy does it.
Horrible journey Bus. Think my worst was about 5 1/2hours from Wycombe to Altrincham once. Up that way Tuesday, so hopefully it's easier then.
Tidy work from Scott. Good luck on the marathon Matt, will have a look at those races, and how frequent etc