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Moraghan Training - Stevie G
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Question is whether to build a base and build to a target now, or just have another month of rampaging short stuff.
I have 2 races that I have "committed" to. The 1 mile hill race 3 weeks today, but that's pure for experience/cult race appeal, and the Marlow 7 in November (having entered the half about 3 years ago, and managed to salvage/tightwad my entry on due to pals running it!)
I'm hoping racing longer stuff in Sep/Oct is altogether different from summer. Should be
I can't get anything in the calendar at the moment :-(
Quite frustrated and disappointed this morning. I brought my "allowed" tester run forward a day, so I can organise the weekend better - don't think one day would make a difference. Possibly slightly longer than it should have been, but the rail station can't be easily moved, so an easy paced 5.5M was the only option.
Whilst there was no pain as such, I could feel there is still the same discomfort as before. This became more noticeable after about 3 miles. It’s also slightly sore sitting here now.
It actually felt pretty much the same as before I started the treatment a month ago, though the discomfort then came after a bit further. So, after 4 weeks of rehab with reduced running for the first two weeks, then no running at all for the last it doesn’t feel like any progress has been made - if anything it's a little worse.
Should it at this point, or am I expecting too much? Could the discomfort this morning be just because it was the first run for a while and things would have been a bit stiff? Should I persevere and run anyway? Should I amend the rehab exercises?
I've emailed the physio and asked all these questions, but I'm beginning to doubt the diagnosis or at least the efficacy of the rehab. Some of the exercises actually feel like they could be aggravating it to be honest.
On the plus side, the shoulder isn't hurting this morning, so not cycling and running may have at least helped that!
Persevere, and if you don't feel like it's getting anywhere there's also a different physio/Oesteo opinion.
Day off tomorrow and then I am standing in high viz in some wood on Sunday helping out at the Wycombe Half. Plan is to run to the start, run to where I am needed and then run back afterwards to get the miles in.
Interesting reps Simon, quite fancy having a go at those.
That's disappointing news Bus, but it might be a case of sticking with it. After all, if complete rest was what was actually needed, then the two weeks of reduced running won't have helped at all, so maybe you've actually only had two weeks of recuperation. Hopefully the physio can shed some light on it.
Not posting until you spell it right!
Oh, so you want a report do you? I thought I’d bought myself a little time by not mentioning the race before or after, either on here or on any social media platforms, but I didn’t reckon on the thread’s collective research skills. Yesterday was a nightmare day, hence the lack of report.
Fine. Yateley 10K, race 2 (of 3 race series). Quick recap – comfortably won race 1 in June. Probably my favourite race, bit undulating, but fastish times still possible. Previous best on the course is 32:50 from last August.
Everyone lines up, and I don’t see anyone near the front who wasn’t there last time, so looks like I may be favourite again. Have a vague aspiration to set off at sub 32 pace and see how long I can hold it. As usual, my clubmate has a glorious first kilometre and is 20 metres ahead as I go through in 3:10. I quickly pass him, but the start of the main hill at 2km throws off this pace, and by the time I’ve got to 3km in about 9:45, any thoughts of sub 32 pace are put to bed. I’m sweating like Trump meeting the Pussycat Dolls – it’s not scorching, so either it’s humid, or I’m not well. Hopefully the former.
Very clear at this point that it’s a solo effort, so just concentrate on trying to get to 5K in a reasonable time. A reasonable time turns out to be 16:08. Nice! Still, the first half is often faster here for some reason even though it contains the main uphill, so let’s not read too much into that. Onto the long 2km straight on the main road, and actually enjoying myself, having belatedly decided not to worry about times too much. Come through 8K in 26-dead, so sub 33 is going to happen at least. I do end up slowing quite considerably those last 2 km, whether I mentally turned off the gas, or I just ran out of legs, I’m not sure, but finish in 32:42 to win by over 2 minutes.
Pleased with that really, my fastest time of 11 goes at this course. Since I run this at least once every summer, it’s a pretty good marker to compare to previous years. In fact, RunBritain’s madcap algorithm rates this as my second best ‘adjusted’ time ever, after some random cross country race, so that’s not too shabby.
Some friends looked after the kids whilst I ran, and they did the kids’ race too whilst mine was underway. My younger one is starting to get closer and closer to my elder one. That’ll become another thing to argue about then.
I remember a 100mile a week geezer i knew years ago saying when you're doing that mileage and are that fit, terrain and the like doesn't matter at all.
So erm, the rest of us are just not fit then, as most of us crumble at the hint of humidity, hills or offroad
Thanks chaps - appreciate the comments. No response from the physio as yet
Well done Dachs - cracking time as a solo effort too! Loved the trump and Pussycat Dolls reference :
Bus, with my injuries I felt like I wasn't making progress but I obviously was. Even when I started running again I felt some pain but it slowly went as I stuck to it. I would trust the physio or get another opinion if you don't.
Great stuff Dachs - superb run. 10k wise I'm still scarred a little but from the BUPA 10000 and that cock up, sub 33.30 would be a stretch at the moment. Bus - I think the 'no running at all' bit for these rehab plans is the problem for a lot of folk and reduced running - hard to judge what is right isn't it..
Tomorrow im running a 3000m at the BAL in Bedford, they are bizarrely having all 5 leagues at one venue. The other 5 & 3k's at Kingston and Yate have been at 4.45 - tomorrow it's 10am! Although the forecast says 18 degrees and light winds, so with a 9.06 in the afternoon heat last week, I need shooting if I'm not sub 9 tomorrow. No pressure then...
Wonder what time the bar up there opens?
It's generally a good field by the standards of local races. Unusually thin this year, it must be said.
starting faster than a mid 32 10k guy for a km is pretty insane though. Especially when it's not like he doesn't know you exceptionally well! Unless it's some ill thought out strategy that you wouldn't fancy trying to make up the 20metres gap and you'd both stay as you were for the rest!
There is probably something in that tactic, but a lot less mad a start, and not against someone way faster!
Well done on the 10k Dachs. Sub 33 must feel like an extended sprint.
Bus. 5 miles plus as a first run out is possibly a tad ambitious. Difficult to resolve with a 'getting' to work aspect.
🙂
Cripes, Simon racing again!
Choice of 6 races on Sunday and a few tomorrow.
May do one, may not bother. It'll take a decent offering to get me up early tomorrow. I don't know what age "a lie in" became some sort of holy grail.
This is the sort of beauty/uncertainty of the flexible approach. Not 100% sure it's me. I need rules, restrictions and structure
Bus, that is a conundrum Ric points out. If a run serves a getting to work purpose, you're sort of committed, and knowing you, it's going to take something major for you to admit it needs stopping on route!
A young guy at work had a spell of doing something mad like running 6 miles, getting a train, then running 2miles into work. Then the same again back. Five times a week!
At 80miles a week without counting any weekend activity, that was only going to go one way. And it did, the running was replaced by cycling. And I don't think the running came back.
Actually, that's the one part of employment I miss. The day was straight forward for training. A short run, then a ride in, ride back, longer run. Once that was gone, there was no incentive to get cracking.
I note that Ron Hills training took a similar knock once he started working for himself. The stress of that and the booze gradually took it's toll on results. Book Two of 'The Long Hard Road' is grim reading. Book One; which I own, is much better.
On the re-hab issue. 5 miles is on reflection, a reckless way to start up again. Loads do it mind.
And putting yourself in a position of no choice if something goes wrong, doesn't help at all.
My own way involves jogging in the house. Only then do I venture out. And then it's an unmeasured untimed walk jog.
Running is a luxury, remember that. It's not a given aspect of life and ability for as long as you like. It's a physiological party trick which some take so much for granted, they grizzle about race times. Enjoy it while you can. One day it ends.
I wonder how Bus has got on with the physio?
I have visions of the guy saying what a golf pro once said to a client who he'd had enough of trying to teach.
"Sorry sir, but I feel I've done all I can for you". And walked briskly away.
The client wanted him to return, asked him to return, pleaded even. Running after the pro, all he got back was, "No Sir, you are wasting my f...ing time, and your f...ing money".
🙂
Good run there as a solo effort. As nobody else has mentioned it I will have to drag out that old chestnut about the quality of races. Looking at the results, over 800 runners and top 11 sub 37. Compare that with Silverstone 10k, also mid-week and part of a series, 1,200 runners and top 35 sub 37 (and you would have won that easily as the winner did 33:30).
My PB over 10k, a sedate 33:59, was set at Silverstone in 1994 and I was 36th. Your time would have been 16th overall and 134 sub-37 out of about 750 runners.
My trip to work yesterday, wasn't fully committed - I had the option to turn back at any point up to 2.5M for it to be shorter and was fully prepared to abandon it and go home if needed. I didn't, because it didn't hurt - discomfort, yes, but not pain, and as others have said, the first run back will often be uncomfortable - it's more about how it progresses and feels after, and this is where my disappointment now lies. Yes 5 was ambitious, but given I was running 7 with virtually no pain before I went to the physio, not overly so.
As for the physio Ric - I have followed his advice and instructions virtually to the letter, even against my own judgement. I can't imagine there are many patients who do so, so not sure what you are getting at with the golf analogy.
My frustration yesterday was that, having done so, I'm no further forward than when just ignoring it and hoping it would disappear!
Either way, there are far bigger things to worry about in life and plenty of others on here with bigger problems to deal with so I'll stop banging on about it
Am currently wondering if the last sentence will hold true for me! Three weeks ago, out of the blue, I developed a problem around my heel during parkrun. Stubbornly and foolishly continued, losing over 90 seconds in the last 2k and then taking over half an hour to limp another 2k back to my car. Totally unexpected and had been training sensibly and cautiously, and having had one Achilles op was sensibly stretching and strengthening to avoid another.
Fortunately I am friends with the former RW medic (and GB team doctor) who was sure it is a serious Achilles issue, and referred me on to a former club mate who is also on the GB medical team. Scan confirmed the problem. Various treatments will happen but we may well be looking at three months out, and could be longer at 63 going on 64. All very frustrating as it happened about a fortnight before my first A race of the season at the Sale Sizzlers. Hopefully there will be next year...but one day it ends. As will my bank balance but happy to throw money at the problem if needs be.
On the standards debate there is a definite reduction! Take a look at some stats that Mick has provided on the over 60s thread!
Off to stretch.
Sorry to hear Aley, typical sod's law timing that running is famous for! At least you better than anyone will know what's a sensible rehab plan and that you'll be back.
Bus - just an awkward scenario for you right now, after the couple of years of the nag in the first place!
I'm in a place where I sort of need the constant re-assurance of hard sessions and the odd race, or otherwise I let the doubts build up again.
I left it open to do a race this weekend as you have two distances at Wycombe and Burford and also the double header mile/5k at Eastbourne, but weighing it all up, I can't quite muster the desire.
Eastbourne would be a 2hour solo trip which just stretches it I think, and the Wycombe 10k is a mix of a dull road mile I do most weeks, with some fairly steep offroad hills ( I very vividly remember how Runnymede felt 2 weeks ago!) . Burford seems a steep woody version. And if Mr Miller is doing a 38min 10k, when he'd be Dachs' level on the flat, you know it must be an arse.
There is a 5k, but it was won in 23mins last year, and the mix of effort versus reward I think isn't worth that either!
I'd even looked up a 1miler at Bourton on Water, with a very strange start of 6.30 this evening. But a 50mile drive just for a 1mile seemed mad too
So erm...race 200 is still up In the air! 3 weeks time is the Murder Mile, so it's just a question of what/anything before that.
There is a Battersea Park 5k on Monday which i'd made noises about doing with some of the Datchet crew a while back, no idea if they are still on that.
Also a relay the week after
Interesting as ever to hear Ric's thoughts. Can't argue with the sentiment and that running shouldn't be taken for granted but isn't that just a microcosm of life? Doesn't stop most of us getting frustrated by injury and inability to acheive our goals. I think we just have to accept we are all different and hearing others' perspective helps temper our excesses and improve our outlook.
Anyway enough philisophising and onto the Saturday business of pr! Bracknell for me today which is only the 2nd toughest in the locality having done the hardest last week. Did 19'41 which is my best on the new tougher course there and hopefully not as mediocre as it sounds (seems around 80 seconds slower a course than its neighbour at Woodley). Funny how pr's are rated by Run Britain; last weeks was rated a 6.5 course which is crazy high for a parkrun course (so they reckon it was one of my best ever runs to do 19'45 there). Contrast the 5 mile race I did the previous Sunday which they considered s..t as the course had a 1.6 rating (mind you that run was indeed crap
Mind you, I was doing an easy stretch one day and felt a tiny tiny ping!
So, six weeks later... Still wonder what that was all about.
My second big injury was an Achilles, or rather the bits around the Achilles where it joined the heel. Took three weeks of almost immobilising the area, before it was able to repair.
That could be the issue sometimes. Constantly stretching and prodding the problem doesn't always help. Hard to resist.
My own minor set back has almost fixed. Still a work in progress. Some stretching and prodding might be in order.
Good as ever on the pr Pete.
Notable as earlier in the year it was you who had received the biggest set back.
🙂
Surprised you went back for more at Bracknell Pete, if it's one of the toughest ones. On my little tour of them, I realised the ones not to do again!
Set off for today's long one, didn't put a distance on it, with just a vague route in mind to miss the very close areas of the 2 local race set ups.
Hands were streaming with sweat a mere minute in which always suggests humidity city! First 6 or so miles were increasingly warm too. Then it seemed to settle.
Ridiculously took a corner on a short steep hill too tight, and managed to slam my thigh into a wall!
Now that hurt! 20-30secs on the floor rubbing some feeling into it, and then being 2miles from home with only 9 on the clock I needed to actually get home for starters. Managed another 3 for a 12 miler at 7.10.
Icing the area now, I think it's probably a bit of a dead leg job. Did that once in my footy days where someone's knee smashed the top of my leg and instantly disabled me.
Minor sort of thing, but it's got to put tomorrow's Battersea Park 5k off the agenda I think, it might even put running off the agenda for a day or 2. We'll see though! Aches to walk at the mo.On the plus side the run felt pretty comfy beforehand! Although possibly just because I was glad I wasn't racing offroad in the weather!
15 miles for me as a first run out, averaged sub four minute mile pace. A pair of wheels were involved however. No adverse after affects.
🙂
10k was very odd, one guy from Guildford and Godalming came flying past with a massive lead and then stopped and walked up the next slight hill. Ended up 30 seconds behind the eventual leader so must have lost maybe 1.5 minutes over that last section.
Half was won by Anuradha Cooray in 73 minutes, class runner, then Fabian Downs second 4 minutes back and Simon S from Marlow another 4 back. He has just turned 40 so must be pot hunting. First female 51st overall.
The thing I noticed was the number of unattached runners, 6, 7 and 8 all unattached but also last finisher 3:05. Why do a tough half in 3:05 when there is a 10k on the same day? Should be a cut off.