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Speed Endurance for 10k?
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I'd start longer (rep wise) and work down though,
For example start with mile reps for a few weeks and gradually build to shorter - smashing shorter reps first will lead to injury!
Thanks Scott,
The plan is to introduce a tempo type run on Tuesdays first, I'll keep this run at 10km always but slowly increase the distance of the tempo section. So the first one will be 4km up 3km @ tempo pace 3km down, then next week 3km up 4km @ tempo pace and 3km down etc building up to 6km @ tempo pace. Once I've done a few weeks of that I'll look to introduce an interval session on Thursdays, and as you suggest start with long intervals and bringing the distance down and the speed up as the weeks pass.
Time to start up this thread again! As some of you may know I have my own training thread but my next stage relates here specifically. So thought I'd post with the intention of sharing to help anyone! Hoping I can start regular sessions next week after a long time out struggling with injury BUT I have been running steady miles on a consistent basis for a while now and built up my mileage to be around 50m average for the last 4 weeks..
I am happy to post sessions I will do and my basic weekly structure here - It starts Sunday so I thought I'd do it today as I am working tomorrow night..
The aim is Great South Run (10m) 9 weeks away 26th October. Failing entry to that Lordshill 10m the week after 2nd November should be fine...
Plan - I will be following a 10KM training plan. Leaning towards more tempo stuff and a conditioning hill session, weekly. The volume I think will be fine for the 10m race as it is more than what I was doing before...
Where am I now - I'm out of shape from 6 months ago, so it's important to structure and plan my sessions to my current fitness and as I get fitter (hopefully) then react.. I have recently ran a 5KM / 10KM and HM so have a solid idea of my pacings..
SO -
Week 1
The 1st week see's 2 sessions where as It would normally do 3 (and does).. Tue / Thur + Sat.. This works for me around work / personal life. It also means I don't have a hard sessions the day after a long run. I think it's ok vice versa though..
For me the hill session maybe dropped / replaced depending how my achilles reacts.. Some people struggle / breakdown with 3 sessions so be aware of your limits, I myself will be managing how I feel.
Session 1) 3 x 15" off 3:00 recovery - 45" Minutes volume so for me this should be ran between 10KM pace and 10m pace..
Session 2) Hills - 3 Sets of 1",1",1",3" - Jog down recoveries or 30s... 90s between sets
May struggle to find an appropriate hill. But a session with efforts at that pace can suffice. 18" Minutes of volume so should be quicker than 10KM pace if done this way but short recoveries means no blasting the reps
Hope everyone is running well!
Scott, what does 'steady' mean for you? marathon pace, slower?
Scott, just out of interest, why is your MSR the day after your LSR? Typically isn't the MSR on Wednesday?
I get though it's two big mileage days back to back but both run slower in comparison to other runs...
Also thinking about it, I'd rather that than (what would be the norm) 8m on the Monday then session Tuesday then face a 10miler Wednesday before another session Thursday..
Of course seeing how my body and legs reacts and changing the program is always on the cards so it may revert to that which is what I used to do...
Marrows - currently my steady runs are around 6:55-7:15 pace - quicker end when shorter (in general say 5/6m)
My HM (PB) I ran the other day was just under 6:00m/m and my current 10km pace was 5:40m/m
My long runs aren't much slower to be honest if you are also wondering by perhaps never quicker than 7:05s and the first few miles just like 7:30 pace
When I start doing sessions I may naturally be running the steady stuff slightly slower.. When in PB shape (10km in 33:00 / 5:20m/m) my "fastest" steady run planned was 8m @6:45 which I wouldn't often hit anyway but say 6:50 for example...
So example would be 60 minutes AM / 30 minutes PM..
I've just tailored a few things as it's based on 90+mpw athlete and I'm not doing doubles all the time etc just yet .. As I increase mileage or look too, I may take this approach on too
So for me the MSR works but could split to 8+4 over time which in turn for a 10km would probably be better
Fair enough, Scott, we all have to juggle training around to fit in with other commitments. Good luck with your training, hope the injuries stay away.
I completed my first 10km a couple of weeks ago. Was hoping to go sub 40 but ended up just over in 40:02. Hoping to have another stab at sub 40 at the end of October on a supposedly flat/fast course.
So close Dom! It'll come!
I cutback last week following some racing the prvious week and some tiredness catching up with me. I still completed 1 of the sessions dropping the other one and having massage and physio anyway.
This is my plan this week which I will class as the base for the next 8 weeks.
Around 50m Steady running over 5 days and then adding two sessions which volume will be between 5-10 m depending (not inclduing WU / WD) so Mid 60 mile weeks.
Tuesday session
2KM (3:00)
2 x 1KM (90s)
5 x 400s (45s)
2 x 1KM (90s)
2KM -
Aim will be to run these just inside 10KM pace. The 400s will not be ran that hard as I don't want to potentially cause problems but I will run them at a quicker pace to introduce that leg speed
Thursday session
1 x 24" (4:00)
2 x 12" (2:00)
Ran around 10m pace just inside for me
Hi Scott,
I will be keeping up with your posts for sure as have a 8.2mile race in October as well, around the same time as yours.
Excuse my complete ignorance as I am new to all this but what does 24" mean or any number with a " at the end of it!!
JB
So.. The session 24" ..
Was 1 x 24" (minutes) then 2 x 12 minutes so 48 minutes total volume.. One of the larger sessions mind
Anything I post such a as 10 x 1km (60s) the one in brackets is the recovery time
What race is that for 8 miles...Off road?
Back home on computer so can get the sessions up now...
The sessions for this week were again on Tuesday and Thursday for me with steady running around it..
10 x 1KM (60s) on the Tuesday (which I did yesterday)
The goal was to run them at race target pace but I started a tad slower (10s) and ran the last 4 quicker by a few seconds (6)
Thursday see's a progression / tempo run.. 9 mile volume into 3/3/3 no recoveries
1:10/55s/40s - slower than 10KM pace..
I worked out I would be running about HM pace for the last 3 so may be inclined to reduce these times by around 5-10 seconds overall seeing how I feel... BUT this is a high volume session so I am doing it with caution and gauging my effort using HRM.. You could build into this by doing 6 miles 2/2/2 too...
Thanks Scott,
the 8.2 miler is a road race.
Funny distance to train for I think so going to work on a 10k training plan but adapt it ever so slightly.
Out of interest does your weekly total work out at roughly 80% steady/long easy v 20% session?
I have recently read a few things on this and most coaches seem to be convinced this is the right split give or take a few %.
I was very naively doing the opposite for the first few months training but have recently in the last 6 weeks or so flipped it on its head and make sure I stick to 80/20 now and have seen great results even in such a short period.
I follow a very similar weekly schedule to you but can only squeeze in about 30-35 miles pw at present. The second session I struggle with as just don't know different variations I could do on that run so have just been doing 4-5 mile tempos all at the same pace. I hope to find some new interesting one's following your posts!
Finally do you ever cut back the mileage? I.e. I hear a few people do 3 weeks full mileage then drop back in week 4 to 50% and repeat. Apparently it gives the body time to recover and repair damaged muscles etc and reduces the chance of injury?
Thanks again,
JB
Current planned mileage is around 65 - around 45 being steady state stuff and two sessions of between 6-10 mile volume
I had previously worked off around 30-45 miles per week total with 3 sessions and 3 steady runs but also 2 core workouts in the week. I don't so any now. I got injured though and only just coming back into full time training so settling for more slower miles but two big sessions
I agree a cutback week helps. 50% is fine - I worked off either 3:1 or 4:1 ratio - cutting the volume rather than intensity.. For me though I haven't had a huge sustained block of mileage so to speak so I wasn't cutting back all the time
You may have allready looked back but a few people including myself uploaded some sessions on this thread..
Tempo running is good, my current program is focusing on that more so now than intervals. But tempos are for bridging gap between speed and endurance. So I don't expect to see huge gains as quick from when I was doing intervals more often.. (I was doing a tempo every other week though before) having said that, it make make me even quicker than before - only when the program is up and I race etc will I see...
My old coach who I've been linking in with says 1 x LSR and 2 sessions is what the Kenyans do and all the too USA schools do and it's the "right approach".... Occasionally doing a block of 3 x sessions or 1 session depending on goals.m, races etc
4 x 1KM (90s) 5 x 400m (60s) 4 x 1Km (90s)
Thursday session -
9m progression run 3/3/3 splits
1:05/50s/40s slower than 10km race pace
Quick chat with coach moments ago - Moving sessions to leave 2 days between them.. So Tuesday + Friday. May mean I move my alternate rest day but so be it. Can do Tuesday + Saturday however, wouldn't always like to do it Saturday as day before LSR...
As I have niggles and am only doing 2 per week this optimizes training inbetween reduces chance of aggravating things ..
Next week sessions
Tuesday -
2 x (sets) 2KM (3:00) 1m (2:00) 1.2KM (90s) (9.6km total volume)
Friday - 3 x (sets) (3 x 5") 90s between and 3 minutes between sets (45" total running)
Will be attempting the Friday session in the morning before heading away for the weekend... Been an off week for me..A tempo session in this week
Session 1 -
2MILE (3:00) 2 X 1MILE (2:00) 4 X 800M (60S)Session 2 -
3 X 15" (3:00)