Bonds

Hi all,

 If you sign up to a charity and get a gold place for £XXX sponsership pledge, to what extent do you have to guarantee getting them that sum of money?

 Surely a pledge is that you'll try, but what if ya dont make it? (Say, ya raise £500, not $1500?) - do ya still get to run?

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Comments

  • Well its not legally binding, but you'd be a bit of a tw*t if you committed to something you werent confident of raising it. You give the undertaking you can, so if you cant - dont do it. You'd be taking funds off the charity.

    You have a year now - start saving and make any difference up yourself ?
  • i wasnt saying that I wouldnt/couldnt - but why would charities ask for over a grand for a runner to do what they love doing - i just think it's a piss take with the amounts asked for....

    I think running a marathon is for self gain, proving to yourself - fair enough, raise money if you want, especially on your 3rd, 4th or 5th time, but why not let the first time be personal, rather than ransomed?

  • Correct, it is a pledge so if you fall short they cannot hold you liable. That said if you do fall well short and it appears you made no effort they can add you to a LM charity blacklist. Speaking to one charity they have never added anyone to it but they do have the option.

    Normal charity tactics are to pressure the raiser to make up the shortfall. Will be interesting to see how people get on this year with the credit crunch.

    That said before you take a golden bond place you should try and work out what you believe you can raise, if you think it is unrealistic that you can hit the target then morally I don't think you should take place.

  • -then don't take a gold bond place, or run a different marathon.

    The London marathon is many UK charities' biggest fundraiser of the year. They have to buy the places from the organisers, and they don't come cheap - nowhere near the "small" fee that the ballot runners pay.

    As Cougie says, if you're not taking the place with the intention of doing it more for the charity than for yourself, then don't do it.

  • Are you bored and trying to wind people up? If you are then good luck!

    If you don't want to be 'ransomed' then why have you asked the question in the first place? I might be wrong but I think there are non-charity places available too.....the word 'ballot' springs to mind!

    Personally, if you pledge to raise a certain amount and then fall short then you should be forced to pay up. It's a contract surely? There are people that CAN raise the amount required and you don't deserve their place if you can't raise the cash!

  • I think Cougie and Basil have taken this totally out of context, but maybe that's just who ya are - I asked a simple question and never said that I had no intention of not raising funds (or even taking a place), Im just asking for some info, so thanks for what ya did give,  and thanks to BSB for seeing where I was coming from with the question

  • and Mikey - just shhhhh - are you a bitter Chelsea fan just looking for someone to bite tonight by any chance?

     

  • Paul, m'dear, you're the one who used the phrases "piss take" and "ransom" when referring to the amounts to be raised, and asked why charities would be asking you to do this.
  • I asked a simple question, just to see what other peoples opinions were - i didnt ask to get crap back from idiots did i?

     did i?

    nah, didnt think so

  • Paul - I wasnt implying that you were ?

    I was speaking hypothetically - but then you have gone on about being ransomed ?

    If you really want to get in, then running clubs get places each year, and keen runners should be able to qualify with a good for age place.

    I'm not sure the 'credit crunch' will have much impact - if any - look at Comic Relief - huge increase on the money raised. Maybe people arent pi$$ing their money away on silly luxuries, but spending it on things that count ?
  • Ooh Paul - why the attitude ?

  • well thanks Cougie, I aint a life long runner, i aint in a club, and maybe a bit of advice about running clubs etc rather than calling me a tw@t in your first answer would have been more helpful? But what I was trying to say, is that I aint got a "close to heart" charity, and dont wanna ponce for the right to run, so was just after a bit of advice.

  • Paul Dallison wrote (see)

    i wasnt saying that I wouldnt/couldnt - but why would charities ask for over a grand for a runner to do what they love doing - i just think it's a piss take with the amounts asked for....

    I think running a marathon is for self gain, proving to yourself - fair enough, raise money if you want, especially on your 3rd, 4th or 5th time, but why not let the first time be personal, rather than ransomed?

    the simple answer to any potential GB runners is if you don't like it get in the ballot  each year, you will be running in 6 years time, or do another marathon. Charities can only charge what they do as there are people willing to pay it is all supply and demand. That said not all charities just allocate places on how much you lpedge, they take into account why you want to run for them

  • Oh dear....past someone's bed time methinks!    image
  • nite then Mikey, there's a good image
  • Can I add something here....

    Ive entered the ballot for the last 4 years and failed to get on every occasion, however I have run 2 London Marathons....with 2009 being the last one. Both were sealed with gold bond places, and on both occasions I knew full well what I was expected to raise.

    I also knew back in October that I was in......giving me 6 months to rplan how I was going to raise the money.  I saw this as part of my commitment to the marathon, not just getting the long runs in, but also raising money. I did this the traditional way through direct sponsorship but also hosting a quiz night ( raised £350) ...fund matching through work ( Royal Mail) and even a day shaking a bucket provided by the charity. I acheived my goal in the week of the race, which in itself if I think part of the appeal of London and adds to the whole experience.

    I also agree with you Paul that running a marathon is for self gain....but London is an exception to the rule. There are plenty of marathons up and down the country, where the emphasis is on running,  self gain and personal achievement....but remember London Marathon is the biggest single charity event in the UK every year and this is what makes it special.

  • Big Dave - prob the most sensible response so far! And for that, thank you.

     I fully appreciate the whole dont pledge if ya dont care, and how to go about it, but marathons up and down the country, even around the world, are good for those that it's local to.... but I live in London, I remember going out and watching the runners year in year out as they went past the old Woolwich cinema, so sorry, but I dont see why my local marathon is so out of reach.........

     For a simple question, I dont see where so much bs has come from! 

  • Fully agree big Dave, I have had 2 GB places and worked out roughly what I could raise before applying. This year I am 50/50 if I will take a GB place, fully depends how much my charity want this year.....

  • I agree Paul with the lack of marathons in the London area apart from the London Marathon itself ( which we are lucky to have!).   but also remember .....120,000 ballot places went in 3 days this year

    I live in London too.....and until last year there were no half marathons in central London, then like buses two come along...run to the beat and royal parks!....So what I did was look around and see which ones interested me and make a weekend of it...

    In the last 2/3 years Ive done GNR, Liverpool, Milton Keynes ( both halfs!) Cardiff, Reading ( twice) Eastbourne, Hastings ( twice)....so the family treat it as a break...we travel on the Saturday morning....stay in a hotel ..( premier inn) for £50 for the 4 of us...and enjoy it....   and isnt that why we started this in the first place?

  • ...... and this year 2010 is my 5th consecutive application.....so if I dont get in through ballot I wont be seeking a GB .....but wait till 2011 for my guaranteed place.
  • Paul - you are making an assumption that people with a London postcode don't have a greater chance of a ballot place than non London residents. We may well do if anyone knew the secret formula of the ballot.

    I do think London residents should have a greater chance of getting a place, same as residents of the north east should have a greater chance with the GNR, but then i may be biased image....

  • Paul Paul Paul, I didnt call you a twat. I said that if you committed to something you couldnt raise - then you would be a twat.

    Which I think is fair ?
  • Welsh AlexWelsh Alex ✭✭✭

    I read about this somewhere or other. Apparently they can't force you to pay, whatever they would have you think, because if they did the the money you raise would (for some reason) be liable for VAT and this would cost them three twenty thirds of everything they earn from the event plus they would not be able to claim the tax giving top up.
  • I've run with  a GB place before,    when being accepted onto the charity place I had a sensible conversation with the relevant person at the charity and said that I would obviously do my best to raise the £1200 requested for the pledge but may end up a bit short depending upon people's generosity and corporate sponsors and having made a list of potential work colleagues / friends / teammates was sure that I would raise a minimum of £750, were they ok for me to proceed on that basis?

    They were happy enough with this,  job done.  I suggest planning what you think is realistic and then have a chat with them.

  • SlugstaSlugsta ✭✭✭

    Yes, I think you're right, Alex. However, when I took a Gb place I signed a contract stating that I was morally obliged to raise the minimum amount and would make it up from my own pocket if neccessary.

    I think there's a big difference between entering into the contract in good faith and falling a bit short (in which case you should be able to contiue fundraising after the event if neccessary) and signing something knowing that it's not legaly enforcable and never having any intention of raising the dosh.

  • WilkieWilkie ✭✭✭

    Paul, if you want to run a marathon to challenge yourself there are plenty out there.

    Maybe not in London, but close enough to do as a day trip - or make a weekend of it.

    I also think that the charities do hold people over a barrel, but then there are plenty of people who ARE willing and able to raise the kind of money they ask for.  So who are they going to give the places to? 

    The London Marathon is about fundraising.  That's what it's purpose is.

    If you are determined to do London without a gold bond place then keep entering the ballot, or do some others and get a good for age time, or join a running club and maybe get one of their places.

  • GladragsGladrags ✭✭✭

    i know someone whose fund raising was well short with a few weeks to go. the charity spoke to her and she admitted there was no more to come, and they withdrew the place.

    the place does belong to the charity. they can defer to next year and get someone who will raise the correct amount.

  • Jeez, get me for being an "idiot". Paul, my response to you was solely based on your second post, which made charities out to be some kind of money-grabbing runner-exploiting outfit. Which, IMHO, isn't fair. So my apologies for reacting to that, but I felt the comments you made regarding "piss takes" and "ransoming" were uncalled for. I hardly think it's fair to insult me for that. image

    Anyway, most charities will ask you to raise a certain amount but if you've tried your damndest and still can't make up the amount there is little they can do - it is not a legally binding contract. Most will ask you to pay a "deposit" for a place which is non-refundable - around £100 or so (this in turn is still significantly less than they price they have to pay for a place). 

    I didn't have to sign a contract as alluded to by Slugsta, but  understand this may apply. 

  • Agree with BB Mk II......IMO your first few posts were essentially asking for people to say that it's ok to take a charity place and then purposely not bother to raise the money. I would never ever even think of taking a charity place unless I thought I could raise the amount or was prepared to pay the difference.

    I'm amazed you thought you'd get any other reaction!

  • Its really interesting reading this thread. I ran FLM this year, first time applied and got a ballot place and after running the FLM still explain to people that I was really, really lucky. I do still feel bad for those who try each year but I ran my heart out and did the training because I felt extremely priveledged to have been given a place.

    I am still unsure whether I would do the LM again as I had such a great day my expectations are really high and sometimes it is difficult to recapture the "first time". However (takes deap breath) I suspect I will be wanting to run it again and have already been offered places by two charities. I think because I have completed a marathon and raised a fair amount this year for a charity.

    I actually had a converstaion today with a friend whose husband ran last year and he didn't make the target and he has been blacklisted for that charity he was runing for. The fundraising is an added worry and I would hope runners don't  start being blacklisted in the real sense! I think with the current economic climate charities may have to recognise that donations may not be as they have been.

    I also live in London and have to admit it was especially nice to be running on home ground and also in the borough I live and work in!

    Good Luck to everyone in the ballot and in gaining charity places!

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