Ye old helmet debate

2

Comments

  • I only cam eoff once.on a cycle path and not fast.the thing I remember is the the thud, thud thud of my head skimming across the ground three times.........

    i was not injured and i might not have been injured if i hadn't been wearing one......but i remember thinking that I was mightly grateful that i was wearing one......

     

    the other injury was my young son playing ion his bike on the campsite.one of the few to be wearing a helmet.....he hadn't been riding that long and got his angles wrong and rode straight into  a tree.......his bike broke and his helmet broke,.......but luckily he was unscathed......

    once again he might have been unscathed without the helmet,,,,,,,but i was again grateful that he was wearing the tree and the bike and helmet were both replaceable 

  • seren nos wrote (see)

    but i was again grateful that he was wearing the tree and the bike and helmet were both replaceable 

     

    That's just plain confusing image

  • TheEngineer wrote (see)

    The plural of anecdote is not data.

    True but finding the data on this one isn't straight forward and so many different factor's and varible's that wouldn't trust some of it from ever side of the debate. Folks have tendancy to pcik the data that fit's with when they already want to know and ignore the rest that might be inconveniant. Just put the oringinal post up if it makes one person think and if it helps them sooner or later to me that's a good thing. image

    The Silent Assassin wrote (see)
    I know this is a serious debate but I just could read this and leave it alone
     
    Flat Footed wrote (see)

    Having worked the streets of east London now for over 10 years


    Knew it. knew it, knew it, knew it

     

    You can just see it. Good old Flat in stockings hanging around the street corner's trerrifing all the cockney's. imageimage

  • The Silent Assassin wrote (see)
    I know this is a serious debate but I just could read this and leave it alone
     
    Flat Footed wrote (see)

    Having worked the streets of east London now for over 10 years


    Knew it. knew it, knew it, knew it

     

    You can just see it. Good old Flat in stockings hanging around the street corner's trerrifing all the cockney's. imageimage

     

    Oh you bitch SA...Last time you get a discount ...especially some of the weird stuff you want

  • Rafiki wrote (see)

    I only wear a helmet when racing as most of my head is now titanium so fairly robust....... the titanium is a result of the last bike crash, when I wasn't wearing a helmet.......image

     

    so the moral of this story is wear a helmet unless you want to look like Rafimage

  • And back to the question....Didn't NZ make helmets compulsory a few years ago? and as a result they had no reduction in injuries or the seriousness (sp?) of the injuries but did have a reduction in the number of people cycling.

  • Been geeking cheers for the tip of FF found info that can work ever way. Take a look at some of the link's of of the wiki entry on this one. Not changed my view but interesting none the less and very similar to what said above.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicycle_helmets_in_New_Zealand#Advocacy_and_caution

    I lot of it is Anocdotel. One thing saw through and did make me chuckle is one of the reports quotoed use's critical analysis (If sarah is lurking she will get all excited) http://acrs.org.au/wp-content/uploads/28_Wang_PR.pdf

    When you read through it some of the concutions on the wiki entry are slightly misleading depending on if you consider the conflict between that and the stat's before it clear cut. Basically wiki and lots of newspaper's are written by folks who skip though the boring bit's and go for headlines. Sorry for the geekiness image

  • I wear a lid .. but then i was born clumsy

    i find it help when i ride into low level branches ... which i seem to do far to oftenimage

     

    Plus - you have to wear it to race .. so id' rather be use to it ... nothing worst than having something irritate you for 112 miles

  • Strange you should say that Will...riding 112 miles always seems to irritate me.

  • Flat Footed wrote (see)

    Strange you should say that Will...riding 112 miles always seems to irritate me.

    Its just bits of me that it irritates.....image

    lets be honest.... its all prep for an Ironman on my 100th birthday
  • image God bless vasaline. image

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭

    Dropping by...

    I had an accident last Thursday.  I was cycling home from work wearing a helmet, bright clothing and minding my own business correctly positioned on the road.  I car came straight out a junction and straight into me.  My left side took the impact of the car and I was thrown onto my right side.  The only injury I have on my right side is a small graze on my elbow as the side of my head took the impact.  My helmet has three vertical splits in the back (right through), one horizontal split at the top rear and a hairline crack across the top.  Not only did that helmet prevent a serious head injury it also allowed me to get up quickly and get off the road before another vehicle came.   Without a doubt it saved my life.  Now so sure if it has saved my knee though. image

  • popsiderpopsider ✭✭✭

    Really unlikely it saved your life if you were still able to get up and walk away - they aren't that effective - probably saved you a concussion or a bad headache which isn't to be sniffed at.  

  • Tim R2-T2Tim R2-T2 ✭✭✭
    Why do I make my kids wear a helmet and not wear one myself?



    Because I've seen my kids fall off their bikes while riding in a straight line with nothing around them for tens of meters. I've also seen them go into a panic when a vehicle approaches. There is also lots of very robust scientific data that says that children don't fully develop spacial awareness until they are in their late teens. One very good reason not to let them drive cars.



    I know what the likelyhood of me falling off while out on a family ride is. And I'm also pretty much aware of what dammage I would come to riding slower than 20miles an hour.



    People will say "But you can die from falling over and hitting your head", I'll reply, "When was the last time you fell over and hit your head? Are you still alive?"
  • Tim, do you have special super powers that prevent cars from hitting you?

    Its isn't you doing 20mph that is the problem, its other road users doing daft things.

    Seriously, that sense of invincibility doesn't make any sense to me.

    lets be honest.... its all prep for an Ironman on my 100th birthday
  • Tim R2-T2Tim R2-T2 ✭✭✭
    Not really. But I've run over 5,000 miles on country lanes in the last 4 years and nothing has even come close to running me over. Even at night. Maybe I'm just lucky and my numbers due to come up soon?



    There's a lot of scaremongering going on.
  • popsiderpopsider ✭✭✭
    Magna Carter wrote (see)

    Tim, do you have special super powers that prevent cars from hitting you?

    Its isn't you doing 20mph that is the problem, its other road users doing daft things.

    Seriously, that sense of invincibility doesn't make any sense to me.

    You could say the same about yourself walking down the street.   It's about assessing the level of risk.     One of the local well known amateur cyclists round here died last year when he lost control in a time trial - apparently hit a pot hole - it's almost certain that if he'd been using drops instead of time trial bars he'd have been fine.  

    We all make choices that result in a marginal increase in risk yet for some reason helmet choice is the one people pick up on.   Look at the maximum speed thread - nobody pipes up about those clocking well over 40mph having an air of invincibility yet they are certainly adding to their risk of getting hurt by riding at that speed .   

  • Tim R2-T2Tim R2-T2 ✭✭✭
    If I was frequently riding at speeds over 30mph I would want to be wearing full leathers and a motorcycle helmet. Crashing at 40mph is pretty much guaranteed to end in death according to the statistics.
  • Tim.my biggest worry about parents not wearing helmets and kids wearing them is that is seems to be sending the message that its because they are kids they have to wear them....so they want to be all grown up and not wear one and will dump it.....

    they will not believe its a safety thing.its because their parents think they are crap on their bike....

    bit liek smoking in front of children....you are telling the kids is a grown up thing and they will have to wait.....

  • Tim R2-T2Tim R2-T2 ✭✭✭
    No. People's brains don't work like that.



    We form habits. My kids put helmets on as a habit not because they have to or they want to. They've always done it, it's part of riding the bike for them.



    Similarly when I get in a car I put my seat belt on. This is not a choice, I've always done it, it's habit and automatic.
  • Tim R2-T2Tim R2-T2 ✭✭✭
    Also I have witnessed car drivers behaving completely differently when I have been out cycling with a child. They automatically give children more room. I've been passed by cars which then slow down and move out when they see the kids.



    There's a lot of complex things going on.



    Not to mention risk compensation where people ride more 'dangerously' when wearing helmets. Which seems to work both ways with car drivers also passing closer when cyclists are perceived to be more competent.
  • popsiderpopsider ✭✭✭
    seren nos wrote (see)

    Tim.my biggest worry about parents not wearing helmets and kids wearing them is that is seems to be sending the message that its because they are kids they have to wear them....so they want to be all grown up and not wear one and will dump it.....

    they will not believe its a safety thing.its because their parents think they are crap on their bike....

    bit liek smoking in front of children....you are telling the kids is a grown up thing and they will have to wait.....

    If I'm riding with my kids (unless we are MTBing) I'm guaranteed to be going slowly on quiet roads or off road trails so I assess the risk as low - I'm not likely to be wearing a helmet.  

    Unless they are racing or doing something like MTBing I give my kids the choice - my son always wears a helmet because he chooses to, my daughter sometimes does and sometimes doesn't.    If you saw us out some of you are assuming I'm forcing them to wear a helmet and being a hypocrite - I'm not they are just making a different choice to me.   

  • TimR wrote (see)
    If I was frequently riding at speeds over 30mph I would want to be wearing full leathers and a motorcycle helmet. Crashing at 40mph is pretty much guaranteed to end in death according to the statistics.

    I have and didn't, it was wet and I slid a lot, hurt like hell. Didn't bang my head tho.

    It's hilly here so frequently see over 30mph, biggest danger with that is still being pranged by other road users who don't think you're going that quickly so I slowed my commute down as too many T junctions to pass. I've only broken one helmet, part of the damage was a pierced hole from a rock.

  • Snap!Snap! ✭✭✭

    Forgetting about helmets for a moment, why aren't cyclists compelled to have mirrors on their bikes? Lack of awareness of other road-users (cars) must contribute hugely to collisions between cyclists and vehicles. In the spirit of prevention rather than protection (which many think is ineffective anyway) I think making cyclists have mirrors would potentially be of greater benefit than making them wear helmets.

  • popsiderpopsider ✭✭✭

    turning your head is safer, mirrors always have blind spots..

     

  • Snap!Snap! ✭✭✭

    Have you watched how cyclists swerve when they turn their heads to look behind? You wouldn't ride a motorbike without mirrors. What's the difference?

  • I dont think mirrors would be much use with the vibrations off the road ?



    Some cyclists use them but its mainly people with restricted mobility.



    I can't think of any case where a mirror would have been of use to me on a bike in decades of cycling.
  • Snap!Snap! ✭✭✭

    au contraire, monsieur. I sport one bar-end mirror and find it very useful. Yes, on bad surfaces they vibrate, but I know what's behind and to the right of me at all times. It supplements my 'life-savers' and means I can pull around small hazards at the side of the road confident that I'm not getting in anyone's way. I commute 15 miles each way and I'd happily cycle it without a helmet, but I'd feel exposed without my mirror.

     

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