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RW Forum Six - 3.30
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oh no Mr Puffy hope you will be ok tomorrow, did you do it whilst running? Has this happened to you before?
Oh yes there's no other way to strain that particular muscle when you get to my age! I haven't had it, but I got a new pair of shoes, kayano 17's, and they feel fantastic on the left foot but not great on the right. I did squeeze in a lot last week, did my lsr on the previous Sunday, ran tuesday and weds, then another long run on the saturday, so I'm sure it will be better tomorrow.
A few years ago I would have gone out and done the session in the plan anyway, but I know it will pass and I'll be all thefresher for it tomorrow or Thursday.
Mr Puffy - best to put some more rest days in? when/ which is your marathon.. I forget.
not sure I'm going to go 100% for a pure baby P&D, but at least it agreed with my method last year of hard/ medium/ easy alternating.. not 2 hard sessions... (okay Shaggy.. I don't count gym or circuit classes always.. got me!).
I felt my ad/abductor a few weeks ago doing single leg squats with a trx, fine the next time I did them.. stretched them out nicely.
Iced the legs a bit, then bath.. and stuck on £5 pair of compression shorts from Aldi for a few hours.. fine after an easy run the next day.
It is London in April.
I just googled Adductors, there's loads of them in there!
Over 20 miles long runs will be on time duration not distance. Last year I got nearly up to that distance but had no distance pressure and it just happened in a nice relaxed and controlled fashion.
Mr Puffy have you tried laying flat on back on bed and drop leg (on sore side ) to the floor and then massage the muscle, it helps to locate and hence carry out treatment.
Some fine long running going on.
Hello Crashie!
Funnily enough, I was going to ask how fast 'aerobic' should be, and lo shaggy had beaten me to it.
8 and a bit aerobic last night with some strides (which I think I was actually doing 'properly'), actually saw a couple of (downhill) mile splits at quicker than marathon pace. Felt a bit tight at the end, but that's more to do with the final uphill bits of my standard loop. Slow recovery planned this evening with a pilates session thrown in. Next week (13 to go) should be the last hard one of the first mesocycle, but I'm away in the Alps so I'm planning on pulling the recovery week foreward.
I can (based on last year) hold pace at altitude but find that HRM is elevated by 7-8 bpm.
FerrousFerret- Hope you have a great time in the Alps, will you be cross country skiing? That will be good for your legs!
Well what a day today has been, I haven't stopped, I have just finished my 18 mile run, my watch had a funny turn half way through the run but I managed to restart it! Just done some core work, now need to get ready and pick up the kids from school. Will post run details later.
Hope everyone else is ok.
Gazelle - looking forward to hearing how your run went today and this is something off the official six forum threads posted by Ruth, I hope it gives a professional view on cramps which also suggests that we were not far off the mark with all our thoughts.
" As you mentioned you have in the past had some problems with cramps so thought it would be good to share what you need to perhaps think about. Exercise Associated Muscle Cramps (cramps that only occur during exercise) most commonly occur in the calf for runners (and this is the same for you) and can just twinge to being very very painful. This occurs when the muscle involuntary contracts and does not relax. It is thought this is due to unusual stimulation of the muscle but really the exact cause is not known. However cramp occurs more readily in tired muscles hence lack of fitness for what you are doing or running at higher intensities will increase likelihood. Dehydration has been associated as a possible cause of these cramps but in fact the evidence is not that strong to support this although those are an exceptionally sweaty individuals with other risk factors are perhaps more likely to cramp. You may also have heard that cramp is linked to the loss of potassium, calcium and magnesium but this has very little support as there is little of these lost in sweat. Some suggestions to reduce risk of cramp are as follows:
• Stronger & fitter muscles are more resilient to fatigue and hence cramp so may need to work on strength and fitness
• Be very careful when changing speed/ intensity particularly during the later stages of the marathon. Fatigued muscles take longer to adapt to increased intensity.
• Wear comfortable, unrestrictive clothing and footwear.
Steve and Sarah might also have some good advice to add? "Practice good hydration practices both before and during exercise
When during a run do you recommend doing strides in the middle or at the end just before cooling down?
No one has mentioned Drills does anyone do them?
Did threshold run this morning 1 mile @ 9:00mm, 2.25miles @ 7:30mm 0.5miles @ 10:00mm, 2.25miles @ 7:30mm, 1 mile @ 9:00mm.
8mile GA tomorrow back out in the dark and frost I am starting to dislike 5:30am starts.
Gazelle is 18miles your long this week?
OMG what a day! Only just sitting down. I'm either really really busy or total opposite.
Shaggy- Hopefully with all the structured training that you are kindly advising me on and all the comments/advise from everyone on here I'm hoping not to have cramp again in a marathon, note to self must have a banana soon for the potassium.
Wear comfortable, unrestricted clothing and footwear. I'm presuming compression tights are ok?
Scuba Trooper- Nice threshold run done there. I mainly do drills at races, only because everyone else is doing them. Do you do them as part of your runs? Yes 18 miles was my long run, unless Shaggy is putting another long run in for Sunday???!!!!
18 miles for me today. I knew last night that I had to do a few jobs this morning so couldn't do my run until later in the day. So jobs completed by 11.15, then I ate a couple of hot cross bun's(was told these were good for energy) got ready and went for my run.
The splits are in two parts, not because I went out twice! I looked at my watch and it said I have gone about 0.20meters, I was like oh no so stopped and reset my watch.
6.57mile 59:42min 9:05 avg 148bpm
1-6mile @ 9:23, 8:48, 8:57, 9:02, 9:14, 9:14
0.57mile @ 8:51
0.31mile @ 9:35
10.79mile 1hr38min 9:09 avg 147bpm
1-10mile @ 9:00, 8:54, 9:17, 9:13, 9:01, 9:17, 9:11, 9:18, 9:00, 9:07
0.79mile @ 9:16
Very cold out there today, the route was undulating to say the least. I went out with the intention of doing 9:20mm for the first few miles and then staying between 9:25 and 9:00mm, I am normally quite good at running at certain paces but I just couldn't seem to get into the rhythm today.
I'm happy that the times are in the correct zone but I felt like I was always needing to either slow down or go faster, probably the terrain. My legs feel tired so have my compression tights on. I do have a nice recovery run tomorrow.
Once I got back home I did some core work and lots of stretching, I'll do more stretching later on this evening.
Has anyone else had problems with Garmin watches whilst out running?
Good work Gazelle, I just got in from a comfortable 8 miles, frost on my buff when I got back.
I will post the splits up later, I stopped my garmin by mistake after a mile or two, so it will not be totally accurate. I sometimes fumble it with gloves on when I swithc on the light.
Can you still use the light if you lock the bezel ?
I'm just on training centre trying to sort out my profile settings, I still have it set for about 2 years ago, it needs changing for my run on Friday.
Glad you have a good 8 mile run.
Gazelle - Well done on bagging a nice 18 miles.
Sounds like a lumpy route and that is fine as it keeps the muscles working at different pressures and does not cause problems that some flat only routes can cause.
I am glad that you kept the overall pace sensible and with tired legs that is the way to approach things and at this stage it is about getting through the sesssions safely and the increase in pace will come as you get fitter throughout the training, we don`t want to force the pace issue at this stage.
Good also to see you looking forward to recovery runs, that is there purpose and can become very enjoyable runs, albeit a bit sluggish to start with so again just stay relaxed and no fast running.
ST - that is what I have been showed works best, I used to follow schedules and do longer recovery runs and by doing them shorter I have seen the light and now appreciate their purpose and I am sure it works. I hope within a few weeks Gazelle will be saying the same.
There is a down side too it though and you loose the overall mileage within the schedule, so have to put that mileage elsewhere and that makes other sessions longer, but the upside of that is longer sessions tend to help develop your endurance, so for marathon training, you can look at it as a win / win situation.
Strides I personally do them within the 2nd half of a session, once warmed up properly and then do them so as you recover well enough between strides to hold good relaxed form before the next one but not too long that you don`t get into the flow with them, something like stride - recovery easy pace 150-200mt - stride etc.
Drills and form work , we tend to spend more focussed time on this during other phases of training throughout the year, really within marathon training time is limited and there is too much to do anyway, so really you want to be bringing good form allready into your marathon training so marathon training becomes specific, so really we should train correctly throughout the year towards only a couple of goal races, how many people can say they train this way............................they should be, to get good results.
Hi FeFe, enjoy your skiing!
Nice long run, Gazelle, that looks consistent pacing! I'm excused mine til Monday when hopefully it'll be warmer, or at least someone will have turned the wind off. Ten and a bit at a nice relaxed pace for me, followed by 4 and a bit jog out with Mrs CH later. Also an hours core and stretching, which is my New Big Thing...
Wow its taken me from my last post to now to put my recovery run into training centre and onto my watch. I hope it works for tomorrows run, if not back to the drawing board
Shaggy- Thanks for your reply. Is it bad that I look forward to recovery runs? Only in the way that I can get on with other things, they are so quick to do and you don't need to plan them into your day
Can we hire your services after the marathon to get us through the year please?????
Crash Hamster- Don't put your runs off, I did that by the looks of it last year and didn't get the time I wanted. What if it's snowing Monday??? Although it does sound like you have put a good session in above
13 miles for me at around 9mm. Looking forward to my 5 recovery miles tomorrow.
I'm beginning to get used to these mid week longish runs, they seemed to tire me out a lot more at the start.
That's my planning too, Gazelle. I can't run on Tuesdays or Sundays, so I do my long run Monday when I'm fresh, then get a day to recover.
I love running in the snow; just mentioning it makes me behave like an excitable dog. If I had a tail, I'd be chasing it right now
Nice looking LSR there Gazelle. You asked a few pages back about alternatives to maltloaf, I'm quite partial to banana bread- dead easy to make. The recipe I have also has walnuts included.
I think I'll mostly be downhill ski-ing, I keep meaning to give cross country a go but it's a little difficult to find lessons.
A very chilly 4 and a bit recovery last night, started off at 9:30 pace and got slightly quicker as my hands got colder, felt very relaxed.
Cramping- I definately am more prone to cramp the more fatigued I get, but for me it's also related to holding the muscles in one position. If I don't exercise before my Pilates lesson I can generally get by without cramp, but running or spinning before means I will spasm at some point. Similar thing with swimming, where I unconsciously tend to point my toes- after 30 minutes or so I'll start to get calf cramps.
Crash Hamster- woof woof, tails are easy to make
Snow is due at the weekend.
FerrousFerret- Thanks ref the banana bread i will take a look and see how to make it. Are hot cross buns good in moderation! I like the idea of Pilates is it good for your core? I'm guessing by your above post that you fit more than running into your week.
It was -3 on today's recovery run.
Last night I set up my recovery run on my watch via Training centre. So off I went on my run, one floor in my plan was that I also had my ear phones in with some music so couldn't hear the beeps on my watch! So turned the music off for the last mile. I set the pace between 9:25- 9:40
I have downloaded the watch into garmin connect and it does not show my mile splits
It just says the following:
3 miles @ 9:22 avg 28.07min 143bpm
I can't find the run on Training centre
Mmmmmm now, do I set my watch for tomorrows run which is a mixture of easy run and tempo run or not????Decisions, Decisions
Gazelle,
I wonder if you've inadvertently turned off the lap split option? Mine is usually set to auto-lap per mile (but I'm using an old 205). Pilates is fab for your core, it's also helping with my flexibility as well. I do an hours lesson on Wednesday evening and try to remember to do some of the exercises inbetween.
Theoretically I should be training for a long distance triathlon in the summer. I try to fit a couple of weekday spin/turbo sessions in (my bike is setup in the conservatory), then long run and long bike (when it's not tooo cold) at the weekend. I need to get back into a regular routine of swimming- I haven't quite figured out how to fit that in yet.
Edit: Hot cross buns, lovely (particularly with cheese). I've just googled a recipe and it doesn't look too sugary. All things in moderation etc.
Gazelle - if you entered it as 3 miles @ whatever pace you will get one report back , do it as such
1 mile @ x pace
1 mile @ x pace
1 mile @ x pace
you will then get each mile pace separately,
save all your session then you can alter them when they come around again throughout the schedule without having to put the whole session in again.
interval or rep sessions are the hardest to do, but just break it down into the little bits that you want to see a report for ie, mile splits or rest time, for strides I just do "until I press lap button" now but have recorded them by distance before.
To find todays run on GTC just click on the date in the calendar.
FF and Shaggy- Not sure what I did to be honest ref the watch. Will try again for tomorrows run. I have a few miles warm up then a tempo run so I will keep an eye on it and if it seems that it's not working after my warm up I can always manually run.
Hot cross buns and cheese! Never had them with cheese, I'll stick to the low fat version without the cheese
Right off to sort watch out!
Gazelle I'm sure you can get the better of Garmin tonight.
Brrrrrrrrrrrrr freezing. 5 mile recovery for me today @9.38. My hands just didn't want to warm up until half way...
Tempo into work planned for tomorrow
. I'm thinking 2 pairs of gloves and 2 layers.
Gazelle good luck with the garmin. I'm trying to get to grips with mine. At least the training centre is now working. I contacted garmin support and they sorted it out for me. Will try tomorrow to run with a workout set up (warm up+ 5x 1mile @tempo+cool down).
Keep warm everyone
.
Yippee watch is all sorted for tomorrow, well I hope so. Just need a volume button so I can still listen to music.
mon77- were almost doing the same run tomorrow, We can virtually do it together
Oh I forgot to say that on my long run Wednesday I took some giant strawberry jelly sweets with me. Good job I tried them on my training run as It didn't go down well. First the sweet was stuck in my teeth so took ages getting it out whilst running then it made me feel a little bit
will stick with the tried and tested gels I think.
Scuba Trooper- Hope you have a better sleep tonight. What time will you be going out for a run in the morning?
Evening
DId our group run tonight, it was about 6 miles split over four sections, I tried hard to keep up the pace between the musters. I messed up my Garmin too so I don't know the exact splits, but it was a good night with a lot of us doing a similar pace.
Don't envy anyone having to run tomorrow morning, good luck everyone!