Attacks by cyclists on runners

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Comments

  • NLR - I think at VW they just get peed off with riding so slowly so decide to breeze through everyone and assume you will get out of their way. Its quite narrow at times so I suspect although not an intentional "attack", it wasnt completely innocent either.

  • Sorry curly I was responding to the OP. You of course were completely in the right
  • Sussex Runner (NLR) wrote (see)
    Sorry curly I was responding to the OP. You of course were completely in the right

    I know image I was just trying to offer some explanation of where the initial post may have come from as I have had issues at the same venue in the past, so much so I'd rather go elsewhere and run most of the time.

    OP - you could try the Three Castles Way as you can pick that up in the Great Park by and its much quieter image

  • Cycling on a pedestrian only pavement, wrong, unless you are a child who hasn't passed his primary school cycle training.  If you have, and you feel unsafe on the road, walk on the pavement with your bike.  This will also make it a lot safer for any young passengers on the back!

    I run in country lanes and generally run on the 'wrong' side of the road as per general pedestrian safety rules.  Bikes coming towards me usually recognise this and go around, but I've met some who don't.  From their point of view, I can see what's coming, whereas they can't, so it's safer for me to pull out.  A bollocks argument when again you learn at cycling safety to stick your hand out to indicate you're pulling out, and you should know how to look over your shoulder, but some cyclists think it's valid.

    As the lanes around me are also national cycle routes I also encounter groups of cyclists.  That's when I get nervous because the guys behind can't see me coming. Having not cycled in groups I don't know if there's a warning call for obstructions, but I assume there is.

    It is amazing though when you hear both sides of a story and both sides are right.  I suppose that's why I'm the only driver that should ever be allowed on the roads...

  • Ratzer, just picking up on your comment "From their point of view, I can see what's coming, whereas they can't, so it's safer for me to pull out.  A bollocks argument when again you learn at cycling safety to stick your hand out to indicate you're pulling out, and you should know how to look over your shoulder, but some cyclists think it's valid."  That relies on cars behaving properly as well.  A couple of days ago a car hit my arm - I looked over my shoulder saw a car was well down the road behind me, put my arm out, lifesaver check again, next thing the car decided he wasn't going to wait, arm hit, me in grass verge.  Saying that though I would still cycle around a runner, and not expect the runner to move out.

    One big problem is that runners and cyclists do not have to read the highway code to use the road.  Most people only read it with respect to driving a car, and I suspect some of the rules would surprise us all.

  • andrew, the clincher there is that you did right, and the car did wrong.  Next time though, because of this incident, would you take it out on the runner instead?

    If a cyclist was taking the argument that I could see and therefore safely move out, what if I didn't move because I could see it wasn't safe?  What does the cyclist do then?

    (Rule 64, for cyclists:  You must not cycle on a pavement.)
    (Rule 2, for pedestrians: If there is no pavement keep to the right-hand side of the road so that you can see oncoming traffic. You should take extra care and

    • be prepared to walk in single file, especially on narrow roads or in poor light
    • keep close to the side of the road

    It may be safer to cross the road well before a sharp right-hand bend so that oncoming traffic has a better chance of seeing you. Cross back after the bend.)
    (Rule 13, for pedestrians: Routes shared with cyclists. Some cycle tracks run alongside footpaths or pavements, using a segregating feature to separate cyclists from people on foot. Segregated routes may also incorporate short lengths of tactile paving to help visually impaired people stay on the correct side. On the pedestrian side this will comprise a series of flat-topped bars running across the direction of travel (ladder pattern). On the cyclist side the same bars are orientated in the direction of travel (tramline pattern). Not all routes which are shared with cyclists are segregated. Take extra care where this is so (see Rule 62).)
    (Rule 62, for cyclists: Cycle Tracks. These are normally located away from the road, but may occasionally be found alongside footpaths or pavements. Cyclists and pedestrians may be segregated or they may share the same space (unsegregated). When using segregated tracks you MUST keep to the side intended for cyclists as the pedestrian side remains a pavement or footpath. Take care when passing pedestrians, especially children, older or disabled people, and allow them plenty of room. Always be prepared to slow down and stop if necessary. Take care near road junctions as you may have difficulty seeing other road users, who might not notice you.)

    Still leaves some space for interpretation, but not too much.  Cyclists should not attack pedestrians on a shared route.

  • I must be lucky around where I live as the cyclists I come across while out running on country lanes and roads pull out enough to avoid any kind of collision.

    Even pedestrians walking on the pavement aren't always safe from car drivers, one of my colleagues was walking back from the local supermarket some time back and a car came passed and smacked his arm with the wing mirror. He would have been on the pavement close to the road but the car must have been right up against the kerb to hit him.

  • Maybe the answer is that vulnerable road users could "communicate" to each other.  Something along the lines "look out mate there is a car coming".  Both pause for a while, maybe even chat to each other about those damn pesky cars.  Runners and cyclists need to work together.

    Would I alter the way I ride in the future after being hit, probably, I would rather be alive than in the right. Would I take it out on runners, no, as I am one myself plus there is too much agression in the world as it is. ("Imagine" now playing gently in the background).

    Getting back to the OP I would say drop an email to the local cycling clubs, if someone is being an agressive rider and they are part of a club the club will come down on them like a ton of bricks.

  • Never had an issue with cyclists. They tend to be lazy when it comes to shutting gates though! However I have had a fair few hold some open for me as well so I won't hold it against them too much image

    It doesn't take much to step aside for someone if need be on narrow trail (I try to avoid road running but I imagine narrow paths are the same deal). Typically most walkers step aside for a runner, not that I expect them to, they just do. The only real "rule" I apply is that anyone travelling up hill has right of way because it can be a pain in the ar$e to stop on a steep incline probably more so on bike then on foot. 

  • I don't always run on the right in the country lanes I run in. They are very quiet, traffic wise, but because they're so winding, I run on the side which gives me and oncoming traffic a better view. Sometimes I'll even run in the middle of the road, just to make sure I can be seen. I'll then move right over or even stop entirely to let the car past.

    Can't say I've had any problems with cyclists. I've tended to take the view that we're all just trying to get some exercise in the outdoors so we're kind of similar. Having said that, I've never had a cyclist say hello without me first doing so.

    I think I'm lucky as I've never had any problems with any other road users (apart from the occasional chav yelling out the window of whatever shitmobile they or their mate are driving).

  • I had an entire 40 strong peloton shouting at me, telling me I was a effing w@nker because I wanted to turn right in my car and had to stop in the middle of the road whilst waiting for a lull in the opposite traffic. The cyclists were behind me, which made them seem to think they had right of way.

    Several riders decided to spit into my car (the top was down) as they passed.

    Never really felt well disposed to cyclists since. 

  • I've had a simular experience to that Artie when one of the London-Brighton bike riders seem to think they have the run of the roads. When you are on a ride on the road, even an organised one they need to realise there are people on the road going about their normal business. Like parkrunners they have to show respect to the general public.
  • Artie, that can't be all there is to that story.

    Did you stop a little sharply or something? image

  • Maybe seeing a convertable car driven by a male just disgusted them?!image

    SR - The L2B goes right passed my house on a small climb and to be honest the guys who are cycling at a reasonable rate dont cause a problem from my experience. The main issue is the people pushing bikes taking up a lot of road then the people still cycling, but no faster than some is pushing a bike seeming to want to pull out of the draft and start a breakaway! Possibly due to the 1% increase in effort they are putting in for the slope they are ascending their brain shuts down to anything around them. A few of them could do with some performance enhancers... or even some training image

  • Artie - that sounds well off.  Cyclists arent any more savage than any other group of individuals - you MUST have done something to piss them off.  I've never seen anything like that in all my years of club cycling. And spitting ? Who the hell does that ?   Usually you dont get chavs cycling as the cost rules them out. 

    Theres got to be more to this story than meets the eye. 

  • That could be the old overtake-then-pull-up-to-a-stop-whilst-blocking-the-road manoeuvre, a classic displayed by drivers when driving through small villages that have cars parked on one side of the main road.  Overtake the cyclist, then pull in because there's traffic coming the other way...

    I have been known to be the only person who should be permitted on the road when on a bike, as well!

    I remember reading a story which had a guy who started as a pedestrian, then got on a bike, then drove a car, and in each scenario was annoyed at the other road users.  At the end of the chapter he discovered that each other road user was himself!

  • I appreciate the health benefits, and good to the environment of cycling.

    But when I drive I don't like cyclists, as they're either 2 or 3 abrest or there's a very real risk of not seeing them making them very very vulnerable to danger.

    When I walk or run, I don't like cyclists either,  as invariably they're on the footpath they shouldn;t be on!

  • Stevie G . wrote (see)

    But when I drive I don't like cyclists, as they're either 2 or 3 abrest 

    Generalisation, and largely bollocks.

    Stevie G . wrote (see)

    or there's a very real risk of not seeing them making them very very vulnerable to danger.

    Driving without due care.

  • If you do ever get serious hassle like abuse from a large group of cyclists then report them.  Generally a large group is either in a race, so report to race organisers/course marshalls with a few race numbers, or a club ride so at least a few will have club colours on.  If you have no luck straight away then report the entity responsible to the cycling governing body.  Any like minded groups hate it when a few muppets spoil it for others.  Cyclists racing on open roads are still required to follow the highway code, I have been in races stuck at traffic lights before, to see a jerk jump them - a shame he didn't getting a finish time as I reported him and he got DQd, revenge is sweet image

  • Intermanaut wrote (see)
    Stevie G . wrote (see)
    But when I drive I don't like cyclists, as they're either 2 or 3 abrest 

    Generalisation, and largely bollocks.

    Stevie G . wrote (see)

    or there's a very real risk of not seeing them making them very very vulnerable to danger.

    Driving without due care.

    Clearly you drive in an area with very sensible cyclists. Bully for you.

  • cougie wrote (see)
    This nob on a bike sounds like a complete idiot. I'm sure he'd come off far worse than you if there was a collision.

    I have seen runners in races on open roads running on the wrong side of the road looking down and with their iPods on. Sonits not runners or cyclists - just stupid people.

    +1 like all groups of people - rule of averages means there's going to be some arseholes 

  • Ive never had an issue with cyclists, and i see lots where i live when im out running ..they always nod and say hello ....that was until saturaday when a woman cyclist who was fairly old was not going to budge from her line and it was on the same line as me running on the right her on the left we were NOT on a road but a disused railway track..suffice to say i moved cos sure as hell she was not gonna move...

  • I had the issue the OP describes on Clapham common a few weeks ago. I was running along the pavement when a guy on a bike cycled up from the road onto the pavement. There were no cars around. I moved to the right to pass him, when he deliberately swerved infront of me, nearly making me fall over the fence. He laughed, swerved back, then dropped back onto the road and sped away.

    Some people are just complete idiots.

  • I've never been specifically targeted by either cyclists or drivers, but I do have to put up with an awful lot of rude cyclists on the bike paths where I run and walk my dogs. 'Serious' cyclists tend not to have bells on their bikes (no idea why, maybe they think it's childish, or adds an extra 50g weight, or whatever) so they whoosh up behind you doing 20mph then grumble at you if you haven't seen them coming and accidentally get in their way. They've nearly run my dogs over loads of times, when all I need is a bell or a shout and I'd call the dogs to heel and make them sit till the bike was past. Club cyclists are by far the worst. Also if I do see them coming and step off the path and make both the dogs sit beside me, they almost never bother to say thanks, or just smile, or even acknowledge me in any way whatsoever, but just bomb on by as if I wasn't even there. Rather annoying...

  • In my defence a bloody great tank could come up behind me and unless it tapped me on the shoulder with its gun I wouldn't know it was there.

    That is the other thing, just because you assume someone is being rude by not acknowledging you, try to remember the fact that they might not be able to hear you, I don't wear my hearing aids when running (sweaty ears bleuughh!!) so have to be more aware of what is going on around me.

  • I was part way through a LSR one day and was weaving a bit on one of my walk breaks. I was smacked in the back by a passing cyclist (he thwacked me with his hand. I'm glad I was wearing my camelback). I was on a thin path with wide grass verges by a wide road with very little traffic. I'm sure he said something to me, but being partially deaf means I didn't hear. Plus I'd been running for about 3-4 hours, so I wasn't quite with it. There was pleanty of space for him, there was no need to nearly run me over and smack me one.

    Only issue I've ever had with a cyclist. Usually the ones round here are sensible and nice.

  • Fair point about deaf people Adrian, though when it's cyclists failing to acknowledge my hopping out of their way as they cycle straight towards me at speed, I think I can safely say it's because they're rude and not because they're deaf.

  • I cycle as well as run.



    I always try to behave as a road-using vehicle: the very few times I need to be on the pavement, I have one foot unclipped, and I try to not use shared-use cycle lanes, let alone the foot-path. The surfaces on these shared-use lanes are often shocking, and make them far more dangerous than the road, although I'm probably breaking the law by not using them.



    This is a vehicle that regularly travels at more than 25mph. If I come off, in all likelihood I'm eating tarmac.



    By behaving exactly like any other road using vehicle (and that includes claiming my space on the road), you make yourself predictable and don't annoy other road users. I have yet to see inconsiderate behaviour - I think partly because of this attitude. I would pass a runner in the road the same as I would pass any slow moving or static hazard.



    I laugh at runners who use MP3 players in races (mostly in ignorance of the race briefing). Cyclists who wear them on the road are suicidal. They usually combine it with no helmet.
  • Got to add, I find it sad that people have to put up with the kind of crap Jane describes: when I used to be fatter/slower I got the odd bit of grief when out running, now they don't dare - some people are such cowards.





    As non-cyclists, I think it would help some people who are complaining about small social faux-pas by cyclists to empathise with them for a moment. You have to remember that the road system in this country is almost entirely hostile to cyclists, particularly in urban areas. A large part of every ride is taken up with being ultra-vigilant just making sure you stay alive and get a few sections where you can actually open up the throttle - it can tend to leave you slightly frazzled.
  • I think there are idiots in any group. There is a cyclist I regularly see who has a posh mountain bike who doesn't like to get it muddy! WTF! So if you meet him and most places you can pass by running/cycling a little bit on the side of the path he won't!



    I agree re bells/horns they should be compulsory!



    However my main problems are old ladies with dogs! One in particular is kind and stands to side of path but leaves dog on other side with lead in middle so I have to hurdle across! Mind you am lucky as friend didn't see lead and came a cropper. I think she must do it deliberately!



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