RW Forum Six – Sub 3.30



  • Minni - like Sarah I too have many places where I won't run alone.  This could be because of the roads being a bit lonely with no built up areas to go for help if needed.  I run for miles on my own, but never go where I feel I could be stranded for whatever reason.  In all the years I have run only once have I had to walk back with injury from a long run, but that  was very unpleasant and before mobile phones!  I had no money on me for a phone box (how quaintimage). 

     I would never run where I am on long stretches of county roads on my own with no town or village for miles!  I just would not put myself in a position that could, and note I say could invite opportunist crime!  Personally on all my runs on my own I always think about the  route, if there areas of isolation, how I can avoid these where possible and if not making sure they are very short sections of the run.  I also make sure I'm not running in the dark in areas that are not built up and any off road runs I do with others.  Apart from a few fields around where I live where there are house within easy reach I would not run off road without someone else with me.  In my opinion I think safety should be at the front on every runners mind when they set out to run!

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    Oh my. I can run 20 miles and only see the odd house and car - rural living! I used to think along the same lines as you but then I realised I was holding myself back and I guess I'm comforted by the fact that anyone I do see I know. Now I feel more nervous running in a place where there are more people. I once got spooked running in the early morning in the dark. I was on a country lane and I saw a car pulled in on the side if the road ahead. As I approached it I turn my headlight and saw 4 make faces looking back - I turned and bolted as fast as I could!
  • Evening, is today a rest day Sarah?I did 10 today before tonorrow's race to keep up the mileage, it's a route I've done a few times so I thought it might be interesting to see the paces:

    Date    Distance (mile)    Time    Avg. pace (min/mi)    Avg. HR
    05/05/2008 19:03    9.99    1:22:44    8:17    171 (83%)
    16/08/2008 08:40    9.97    1:39:28    9:59   
    03/01/2010 11:26    9.99    1:24:37    8:28    164 (78%)
    10/01/2010 10:34    10.00    1:25:18    8:32   
    14/08/2010                10.00    1:21:00    8:06   
    02/01/2011 09:41     9.99    1:23:08    8:19    161 (76%)
    24/02/2011 18:58     9.99    1:19:46    7:59    154 (71%)
    07/09/2011 18:58    10.00    1:21:07    8:07   
    13/11/2011 10:00    10.00    1:24:18    8:26   
    29/02/2012 18:54    10.02    1:24:45    8:28    150 (67%)
    30/12/2012 13:39    10.00    1:28:27    8:51    161 (75%)
    02/02/2013 13:15    10.00    1:23:43    8:23    154 (71%)

    In Jan 2010 it was 8:38 and I went on to 3:36.

    In Feb 2011 I was well into training after a good autumn and winter and that was run comfortably marathon pace and I did 3:33.

    I live in a semi rural area, I can go off road for miles and miles if I want, or I can run down a B road to busy A road and be under street lights for miles too.

    I remember coming off a trail onto the road and there was a car parked up with two lads chopping stuff out on  a mirror, I just carried on as if I hadnt seen them. And there was a gypsy family that liked to ride motorbikes along the canal for a while.

    Date    Location    Distance (mile)    Time    Avg. pace (min/mi)    Avg. HR
    05/05/2008 19:03    up and over    9.99    1:22:44    8:17    171 (83%)
    16/08/2008 08:40    up and over    9.97    1:39:28    9:59    
    03/01/2010 11:26    up and over    9.99    1:24:37    8:28    164 (78%)
    10/01/2010 10:34    up and over    10.00    1:25:18    8:32    
    14/08/2010    up and over    10.00    1:21:00    8:06    
    02/01/2011 09:41    up and over    9.99    1:23:08    8:19    161 (76%)
    24/02/2011 18:58    up and over    9.99    1:19:46    7:59    154 (71%)
    07/09/2011 18:58    up and over    10.00    1:21:07    8:07    
    13/11/2011 10:00    up and over    10.00    1:24:18    8:26    
    29/02/2012 1

  • Hi Hilly, thankyou for the positive comments. For my one and only marathon I got 3:47 so im hoping that I will be able to smash this....but you never know whats around the corner so I dont want to get too carried away. Im happy to hear that your training is coming on, before you know it you will be hitting the milage that you want, im sure. How was your park run last weekend?

    I have decided to do a xc race in the morning. Its at retford and about 6.5 miles. I cant decide whether to race it or not just yet. My legs have felt great today, so im hoping that they will be feeling even fresher tomorrow to race. It was either that or a 10 mile build up run, which I did like the sound off but the post race buffet swayed me.

    Two weeks tomorrow I have a half marathon in Barcelona. Im hoping for a good time, but I dont want to get too carried away as I will probably be sleep deprived and spend the whole day before exploring and walking around Barcelona. On a plus side, 13 is far less than the 20 I did yesterday so I should manage!

    I completley agree with all you have said above about safety. You dont know whose out there and when you could come into harm, so I would rather not risk it. Like you, if im on my own I have to stick to more built up areas, or places where lots of other people will be. Not only are there some dangerous people out there, you could also have an accident or injury and need assistence. I always run with money just incase I need to phone home, or get the bus or a taxi home. I really need to start running with my phone but I always worry about damaging it.

    On a run with the club about 5 months ago, one of the runners tripped over a tree stump and sustained quite an injury that required a wash out, 20 stitches and crutches for about a month. Non of us had a mobile s we ended up having to run quite away to call for help whilst others in the group carried him to the nearest road.

    My dad and my husband sometimes take it one step too far with running on my own though. My dad didnt want me running around the roads in Darnell and Woodhouse in sheffield as he didnt think it was safe. My mum then went on to say she was spat on in one of the areas above a few years ago, and another time some youths threw stones at me and my mum when we went for a walk. Where my parents live isnt as bad as the two mentioned places above but I didnt fancy doing laps of the place to make up 20 miles!

    Sam Murphy has an article in the March edition of RW about running safely.
  • Hi Mr P....I hope your car didnt cost as much as mine today!

    On my way home from Harrogate last week I hit a pot hole that sounded as though it had snapped my car in half. It turns out my suspicions was right....suspension spring snapped in two....although I didnt realise that my car was dangerous to drive and un road worthy, until after I had drove from York to sheffield and then sheffield to Maltby and back twice....about 120 miles! Now my purse is ??255 lighter : (

    Did you enjoy your rest day yesterday? Ive had mine today and its been quite nice to have time to do other things.

    I love that aching sensation that you get after having a good run or workout, its so satisfying. What position does your wife play in?

    I always find it uncomfortable when you see groups of people doing things like that, like you I always try to look the other way and not make eye contact.

    I feel much safer running in York than I do in Sheffield!

    Its nice that you have your times and paces from the last few years to compare your current times with. I think its looking ok as you were quicker than in 2010. I know your a little slower than at the end of feb 2011...but that is the pace that you got at the end of feb and not at the beginning.

    This year you have more running experience and more marathon training and race experience which im sure will help you even more this year.

    Good luck with your race tomorrow. I cant wait to hear how you get on.
  • Hi Minni, its nice that you do feel comfortable running where you are able to go running.

    It is so difficult as i love all the off road running but I know that I wouldnt feel safe doing this on my own. Therefore if I am on my own I will stick to the roads and pavements but this isnt as pleasant due to car fumes and heavy traffic. In York I am more lucky as there are many cycle paths that you can follow which are off road and can be quite busy with walkers and cyclists.

    My legs felt a little uncomfortable for the first 30 minutes post run yesterday but then they seemed to ease. My friend brought me my new compression skins round so I put them on with my compression socks, underneath my jeans to go to the match and then the local pub. I think they did the trick as my legs have felt fine today, as though I didnt even run yesterday. Im just hoping that the aches dont kick in late..i.e tomorrow!

    I went shopping with my mum today which involved a fair amount of walking around sheffield and then we went for a "spa afternoon" so I did some swimming before relaxing in the steam room and whilst having a facial....a proper rest day!!!
  • Training Diary for forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)

    Week 5, (Day 33) Aim; rest day

    I had a very relaxing "rest day" today (except when I got the bill through for my car)

    I woke up and my legs felt ok, which I was surprised at. I may have gone a little over the top with wearing my compression tights (skins) and compression socks yesterday...but they look like they have done the trick (and they kept me warm at the match).

    I went into town with my mum today and did a fair amount of walking to a number of shops and then wagamama for lunch. Afterwards we had a power walk to hilton hotel for our spa afternoon and facial (my mums xmas present...which I just had to buy myself to keep my mum company).

    We did about 30 minutes of swimming before relaxing in the steam room and then whilst having our facial.

    I feel completely relaxed and refreshed and hopefully will still feel the same in the morning for when I do a xc race.
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    Puffy - it looks like you're nicely on target going on those stats. Good luck with the race today.

    Sarah - also good luck with the xc. It's really windy here do hope you guys don't have it.

    I've been thinking a lot about the safety and I guess I'm lucky in that I live in a very safe area, where I know everyone. I always run with my phone (and sometimes use a long run as a chance to chat to friends - AA, from the sub 3:30 thread, and I have passed many a long run mile chatting!).

    I ran 20 yesterday that passed through a village at 9 miles and 3 farms. I did it with others and if I'd been my own I would have missed out the village and just stuck to the farm roads. It was icy yesterday and we ran a hilly route. I struggled a bit on the first 9 miles as the cba fairy seemed to be sitting on my shoulder but then I got into it and was fine. The second half was 8 minutes faster than the first and with bigger hills, with the last 6 nearly all sub 8 m/m and the final one was 7:45. The three of us ran the first half together then spread out on the second.
  • Hi you have one of those blue tooth headsets to talk on the phone whilst running or do you just run with the phone at your ear?

    I think that your really lucky to be able to run where you do.

    What a fabulous run yesterday, despite you struggling for the first half. It just shows that you can work through those tough times and come out the other side smiling.....with speedy miles. image

    Just wondering, with london being flat, do you feel training on hills helps as it will be easier at VLM, or hinders as you are not doing as many miles on the flat and so your using other muscles?


  • Training Diary for forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM) 

    Week 5, (Day 34) Aim; 6 mile XC race (with a 2m w/u and 1 mile c/d)


    Me and my friend got to the race a little late so I only managed a 0.5 mile w/u image

    The XC race was actually quite exciting and fun in the end...but more so once I had finished and could reflect back on the 6 miles.

    The race started down a short path before it turned left in to a muddy field. I was hoping to start with my friend and use her to pace myself, however soon as the gum went , I seemed to loose her as a few men and women got in my way. I still dont understand why slower runners go up near the front at the start of a race.

    As I entered the first muddy field I spotted her and focused on catching her up. The sludge in the fields was horendous. Each time I put my foot down it was swallowed up by a puddle of mud and water and felt as though it was trying to steal my shoe as I tried to take off.

    I ran from field to field, climbing styles and ducking under electric fences. I have to admit at the point I was wondering why I had decided to do this race. I had a sneaky peak at my watch at this point and was disappointed to see that it was only at 1.51 miles.

    I decided to concentrate on my friend in front who I was closing in and just pretend it was a training run that we had gone on.

    We left the fields and then entered a woods. This wasnt much better....the paths were sludgy, and there were hurdles made up of streams to jump and step stone across and falled tree trucks to jump over. At the point I was 4th lady, and my friend in 2nd place, only seperated by another lady who appeared to be struggling on the hills.

    Just as we left the woods and entered another field I past her. This gave me some confidence as I realised that it wasnt just me struggling in the deep mud and strong winds.

    On leaving this field I was blessed with a short stretch of road, it felt like I was on a track, a had a spring to my step, my feet felt light and I ended up passing my friend and the first lady.

    Unfortuantley this road didnt last long, after climibing over another style we ended up in another field which was up hill and straight into the wind. The lady who was first originally came pushing past me and I let her so that I could use her as a slight wind breaker. At the top of the field and hill I managed to over take her and was hoping that she had burnt out a little.  This was at mile 4.

    The next mile was down a dirt track so slightly less muddy and slightly down hill. I felt like I was flying down there. At the bottom there was a huge puddle..I though I had seen the men infront run through it and it was about up to their ankles, however as I ploughed through it, it came up to my knees and had bits of ice in it.

    After this the final mile was retracing out path down the 4 fields that we had run through which were seperated by styles and electric fences and patches which were muddier than before.

    I got to the last field before the last stretch up the concrete path to the finish when that lady over took me again. I tried my best to catch her on the final stretch but I just couldnt.

    I ended up coming 2nd lady 11 seconds behind the first lady (although it felt more like 5 secs) and 20 secs infront of my friend.

    By the end of the race, I had enjoyed myself, it was fun getting covered in mud and the race between us ladys was quite exciting. Im really happy with my position and pace, considering the 20 miles I had run on friday. I think even if I hadnt run on friday I would have still been happy with them. I was also told later that the lady who had beat me mainly runs fell runs for the hallamshire harriers (a good RC i

  • in sheffield.

    My average pace was 8:25 min/mls for 6 miles

    My total milage for this week; 43.5

  • For week 6

    Originally I was going to have netball training on monday and a netball match on Thursday. But due to me being in sheffield on wednesday and thursday I have managed to find someone to play instead of me on Thursday night.

    I have decided not to go to training tomorrow as I have only just got back to York after being in sheffield since wednesday and will only get to spend three evenings here before I have to head back down there again. I play netball 30 minutes drive away and dont tend to get home until half 9-10, this together with the fact that I will have a lot of catching up to do at work tomorrow so will probably find it difficult to leave by 7pm means that im going to give netball training a miss tomorrow but will replace this with a run instead. Im just waiting for Minni to get back to me to see what she thinks I should do next week

  • /members/images/644249/Gallery/me.jpg

    My muddy feet and legs....just glad that I wore tracksters!

  • Well done Sarah, good effort!

    My race went well too, but I wasn't second man!

    I got there early in case it filled up, it was a miserable drizzly morning and the race hq was in a leisure centre that could have been a detention centre. The timing chips were ankle tags, very appropriate. The atmosphere was great though, Very efficient organisation and a friendly bunch of runners. Because I was so early I got in good warm up and was feeling confident at the start

    My splits were according to the garmin






    Plus about 30 seconds, so I don't know whether to average that across each mile or whether the garmin was inaccurate on a particular mile or what.

    Overall I was very pleased, I was comfortable until the last half mile when I had to work a bit, I was only overtaken by one bloke, and I'd passed him in the finishing straight but he came back. Certainly didn't feel yesterday's ten miles. I didn't hang about, it was cold and drizzly and I knew I'd suffer if I didn't get warm so I got changed and came home after a cup of tea.

    I think that time would be indicative of around 3.39 so still being conservative about London but it was overall a very good weekend running wise image
  • Hey Sarah - sorry I haven't posted on here for a bit but have been following and you and Minni seem to be doing a great job. Well done on second ladyimage

    Just try a bit harder next time and you may win!image

    I agree about people starting in the wrong place. I would say that with the way you are running you will always be one of the first ladies so you need to believe that and get there early and in a good place. Keep up the good work!

  • Well done on the race - sounds like seriously tough conditions but a huge amount of fun at the same time! I used to do a lot of cross-country racing when I was school and it was always a bit of an adventure - it's a totally different experience to road or track running and it seems to leave a bigger smile on your face at the end, doesn't it?

    sarah osborne wrote (see)

    The lady who was first originally came pushing past me and I let her so that I could use her as a slight wind breaker.

    Haha love your tactics image I'm going to remember that next time I'm in a windy race!

  • Great race and to come 2nd lady off the back of a 20 miler is very impressive indeed. Hopefully it won't be too difficult to get those trainers cleaned up! image It must be very encouraging to be running 20 milers so early in your training plan. How many 20 milers are you hoping to fit in before race day?

  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    Sarah - very well done today. What a result! You are absolutely flying and the extra miles seem to be doing you good!

    Sarah will update but although she's due a cutback week we feel that this should be done the week after next as a mini taper for the HM. I've recommended a session that I did this week for her Tuesday night speed session - 1400m intervals at 10k pace. A bit of an odd distance but they worked for me.

    Sarah you asked about the benefits of training on hilly routes. I really don't have a choice because of where I live but I do have a 14m loop that is more or less flat with only one real hill and I use this for my MP runs.
  • Haha, Mr P, you made your race sound quite fun with the ankle tags! Luckily it was dry for me (except when I was knee deep in that puddle). It sounds like you had a good run, and having to work in the last bit just shows that you gave it your all which is good. When they work out your predicted times, according to a recent race time, should that be when youve tapered for a race rather than doing a long ish training run the day before? Im still staying positive that you will achieve your goals.

    Hi DS2, hows your running going? I met a very nice mechanic on saturday who came to my rescue after a pot hole snapped my suspension spring in half so it was pointing towards my tyre...I was told that my car was unroadworthy and dangerous. He offered to repair it on Monday but as I was in sheffield and needed to be in York tonight he kindly repaired it on saturday instead.

    Hi Steve....Ive got to admit I loved the race more afterwards than during it and enjoyed it more knowing that we were travelling back in my friends car and I was going back to my parents to shower!! I do love mud....although its been pointed out that there may have been some cowpats amongst all the mud too! Glad to hear that your fighting fit again and running well.

    Evening Ady, thankyou....I wore my trail shoes and left them at my parents in the garage to dry hoping by the time I go back down on wednesday they are at least dry and possibly cleaner (little hint to my mum if she gets bored). Before I started my training for London I knew that my weakness was endurance so its very encouraging that ive done two 18 and a 20 miler now. I do have a couple of quieter weeks coming up with Barcelona half two weeks today and Belvoir challenge (15) three weeks as yesterday before I step it back up again. Originally I would have still been on my first 18 miler if it hadnt been for the brass monkey being cancelled. Your training looks to becoming along great....cant wait to practice the jelly baby carbo loading recommended by Ruth!

    Hi Minni, thankyou, it was nice to be in a race...its been a while now with missing brass monkey. Do you have a race coming up any time soon? I do like hills...where you live sounds so pretty and picturesque.
  • My schedule for week six;

    Monday; resistance training + 3 mile recovery run

    Tuesday; 8 miles which includes a 2-3m w/u, 5 x 1400m (0.85 mile) reps @ 10 k pace (6.55-7.00 min/ml) with 90 secs recoveries + c/d

    wednesday; Rest day (running clubs AGM in Maltby)

    Thursday; Rest day

    Friday; 20 miles outdoors, steady

    Saturday; Rest or 3 mile recovery run

    Sunday; 10 miles; made up of 4 miles easy, 4 miles @ MP, 2 miles easy

    Total Mileage; 41-44 miles
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭

    Puffy - sorry I completely missed your post last night.  Well done!  Getting progressively faster in a race is something I can only dream of. image  Really good that you didn't feel the 10 miles either.  Looking good. image

  • Training Diary for forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)
    Week 6, (Day 35) Aim; resistance training and recovery run

    Netball training actually ended up getting cancelled so I didnt end up feeling guilty about not going.

    I spent 45 minutes doing resistance training today followed by an easy 30 minutes on the treadmil.

    For my first mile I increased my pace from 11 min/mls to 9:13 min/mls

    The second two miles was ran at 9:13 min/mls

    The last .2 of a miles was between 9:13 and 12 min/mls

    Total miles 3.2

    I felt extremly comfortable throughout....and only had to blow my nose twice (I always have a bad case of the runners nose, it gets worse the more effort I put in)

  • Thanks Minni it was a very good weekend.

    How did you get on today Sarah? I did a short tempo run, it was really windy here, but I was pleased to get out, I've been looking forward to it all day. Tomorrow is nine miles steady so I'll do a couple of laps of the village before repeating last week's run.
  • Well done on your race Sarah!! Sounds as though you had a good run and a fab report too!! image Felt like I was running it with you!! (Although I wouldn't have been able to keep up of course!!)

    Was thinking today wish we lived a bit closer - would be fab to have a training partner going for same time marathon as me so we'd have some company on long runs!!

  • Good evening Mr P, I managed my reps but I have to admit I found it more difficult than the ones that I did last week. I cheated and did mine on the treadmill, although I do love doing my speed training on a treadmill as its easy to judge what you are doing and when which I find more difficult to do outdoors...unless on a track. Did you have much snow?

    Always a good signs when your looking forward to getting out, did you have a rest day yesterday? Hope you have a good 9 miler tomorrow. What pace are you hoping to go at for a steady run?
  • Hi Sarah, the way your running, im sure you wont have any problems keeping up. Your running looks to be going great despite the little hiccup with your back. I havent had chance to go on your thread since the weekend but im hoping to catch up later this week.

    That would have been lovely if we could run together. Its so difficult to find people to train at your own pace, or even train with you when your doing a crazy number of miles.

    Just been looking at the website for TR24 again today, it looks so exciting, I cant wait to do it already.....although im not sure I would be looking forward to it as much if I was having to run for the full 24 hours...your mad, but your also an inspiration. Are you going to do it for charity?
  • Training Diary for forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)

    Week 6, (Day 36) Aim; Speed training. Roughly 7.5 miles including a w/u, c/d and 5 x 0.85 miles reps @10k pace with 90 sec recoveries.


    After doing my 45 minute resistance training circuit I then went on to the TM to do my speed training.

    This consisted of;

    a 2 mile w/u starting at 10:36 min/mls and ending at 8:20 min/mls

    5 x 0.85 miles at 6:53 min/mls with 90 sec recovery @ 8:20 min/mls

    0.71 mile c/u starting at 8:20 min/ml and ending at 9:05 min/ml

    I found these reps more difficult than those last week...this could be for a number of reasons such as longer reps and shorter recovery, or maybe it was the homemade fruit cake that someone brought into work which I just couldnt resist...I think it may have weighed me down a little and the brandy did repeat on me a couple of time....however despite me finding these a little tough, I also found them extremely satisfying.....I certainly left the gym with a smile on my face.......No pain....No gain.

    I cant believe that I now have two days off running....I will be raring to go by friday!!
  • Training Diary for Forum 6 sub 3:30 (VLM)

    Week 6 (day 37) Aim; rest day

    With the exception of about a 20 minute speed walk today I have completely rested my legs.

    I spent all morning in clinic, then had a quick dash to the hospital to complete some forms before driving down to sheffield before rush hour to go to my RC AGM.

    Tomorrow I have another rest day planned due to being on a course in sheffield, followed by a trip to meadowhall (which I promised my mum), followed by a journey back up to York
  • MinniMinni ✭✭✭
    Hope you're enjoying a couple of rest days Sarah, you sure deserve it! Sorry that was a harder session last night but you still did it really well and survived! The training benefits will be big.

    I ran my intervals tonight (4 x 1.5m) and imagined I was you - gliding along effortlessly. I think it helped!
  • How's the resting Sarah? 6-pack of lager and a curry?

    I did nine miles tonight but messed up my Garmin so didn't record the paces very well. I did a slow mile round the village before setting off on my usual 8 mile route.  It wasn't as big an improvement as last week, but still very indicative of progress, getting progressively faster until the hill at the end where I slowed down a bit, speed session tomorrow so I don't want to overdo it.

    Minni I listened to Marathon Talk again, and the Training Talk was about long runs...the bit aimed at more experienced runers said that it was time to start putting some Marathon paced miles into the long run, and gave several permutations, I though I might try 5 miles at marathon pace within my 18 miles this weekend what do you think?


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