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Barefoot runners - why so intolerant?
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Who's being aggressive now?
On that basis i'm not reading your responses anymore cos your mean to everyone
Some of the best coaches in history were slow and plenty didn't even run, Seb Coe's father for starters. He preferred cycling
Go get your coaching badges!
I have run in many different types and brands of neutral cushioned shoes over the past 35 or so years although in those early days many of the shoes had little or no cushioning. Recently I had been struggling with a persistent shin pain for which my physio suggested I needed to strengthen up my calves by trying barefoot running. I got myself a pair of "barefoot" shoes i.e. those with no cushioning and have used them once or twice a week for 3-4 months now on some of my shorter runs and it does seem to have made a significant difference to the pain problem. It has also improved my overall running form (probably because of the strengthened calf muscles) but to say they were the be all and end all, I don't think so - I still use proper cushioned shoes for the longer runs and regardless of what shoe I wear I still heal strike as that is my natural style
"I still heal strike as that is my natural style" - careful Bionic - that's like a red-rag to a bull for these types! Without ever having met you, they will tell you that isn't your natural style and that you've developed that by wearing 'foot coffins' that are designed to hurt you as part of a shoe-makers conspiracy to hobble and therefore control the populace. You will never be free until you buy another large corporation's shoes which are slightly different! You might like to call them 'The Emperor's New Shoes'!
BTW there is an online shoe company owned by Runners World very own Sam Murphy and yes you guessed it!
It's called The Emperor's New Shoes'!
Sam Murphy is not just a brilliant coach in the normal sense she is also a brilliant natural/barefoot running coach as is her partner Jeff who won the Grizzly 20 recently in a barefoot shoe! http://www.sam-murphy.co.uk/
I like Chloella's desription of '2 types of barefoot runner' from 11-30am this morning. I'll add my own '2 types of barefoot runner', coming from a slightly different angle.
Type 1 benefits from wearing minimalist shoes.
Type 2 THINK they benefit.
The Type Ones genuinely have fewer injuries with these shoes... and as they are seen as unconventional, there is a greater tendency to talk about this 'miracle cure'. Who doesn't like to discover something that is unconventional but works? What is hard (IMO) for some people to grasp, is that just because it worked for them, it doesn't mean it works for the majority of people. Some become evangelical because they've found it works so well for themselves and somehow assume that the 'conventional' running shoe manufacturers are all liars and cheats! (they probably are to an extent!)
The Type Two's are like the Type Ones, but don't genuinely benefit. I'm convinced that a lot of people have had injuries, and their recovery just happened to coincide with changing to barefoot. So why wouldn't they assume a link? Just like people who take antibiotics for a viral infection find they get better within a few days (same as the people who don't take the antibiotics!)
Considering the amount of money pumped into the running footwear industry there is a remarkably small amount of research into the field (sorry about the pun) especially with regards to shod-runners, motion control, minimalist and barefoot.
The most interesting study that I've come across with respect to the efficacy motion control footwear was conducted by the US army:
http://phc.amedd.army.mil/PHC%20Resource%20Library/Effect%20on%20Injuries%20of%20Assigning%20Shoes%20Based%20on%20Foot%20Shape%20in%20Air%20Force%20Basic%20Military%20Training.pdf
My take away from this paper is that observation of static pose and foot shape is a poor predictor of injury risk. It just isn't that simple.
On the forefoot, minimalist front, the studies that I've read regarding energy efficiency are rather small in size and sit on the fence.
There is a lot of excitement about "barefoot" running, that's great, however simply switching footwear is not a panacea. Switching gait, improving proprioception and gaining the appropriate physiological changes all take a lot of time and hard work. I wince seeing so many people where I run along the Thames in the City of London heel striking in very pretty minimalist/barefoot footwear because I imagine it's very painful.
It's interesting to note Lee Saxby's (the running coach who trained Chris Mcdougall in Born to Run) opinion on converting heel strikers to forefoot runners is rather pragmatic, paraphrasing: if you're not getting injured doing what you're doing, then don't fix it.
In the interests of full disclosure, yes, I am a forefoot runner. I'm not medically qualified.
Kinda!
Some barefoot runners become preoccupied with heel,mid foot and forefoot striking when they should pay attention to their posture first,rhythm second and then relaxation.
There are no benefits to appropriate barefoot shoes other than allowing your foot to do it's thing (There is a difference between barefoot shoes and minimalist BTW) and giving you weather and puncture protection just like our ancestors.
When you can feel the ground through your shoe (proprioception)you will make subconscious decisions to which part of the foot you should be landing on.
Cushioned shoes make over 80% (in fact a recent study recorded 96.6% of runners heel strike) of runners land on their heel at too fast a speed because your 200.000 nerve endings in your feet cant feel the ground.
My team take our cameras all over the country and film runners who heel strike on hard surfaces and when we ask them to take their shoes off most/ 90% plus stop landing on their heel. If were not supposed to land on our heels explain this and if you don't believe me try it on your friends,but it has to be on hard surfaces!
If you try the above experiment don't let them run too far simply because it takes a long time to adapt!
BTW i wear shoes! they just have no padding or support and a wide toe box.
If you are wearing cushioned/structured shoes and read Born to Run and think nature will heal you then you are in for a big shock!
Nature wont heal you it will break you if you try to rush the process.
For what it's worth i know the kinda barefoot runner 'In it for the cake' is on about i unfortunately have to present to them on occasion! Yes i have to even be in the same room!
The stink off their Vibram 5 fingers would knock a dog out!
T
This minimalist barefoot stuff was covered over 20 years ago in a book called 'Winning Without Drugs', where it suggested that over protective shoes prevented the feet becoming stronger etc.
🙂
Old as the hills!
Bruce Tulloh 1962 European 5000m Champion barefoot and his daughters.
The American Journal of Orthopedic Surgery from 1905,the list is huge!
Oh yeah throw in a few million years of evolution as well!
BTW i wear shoes they don't have padding or support! just in case i didn't mention it!
Well said/observed Atish!
Ive heard Lee Saxby say this too his ebook is worth downloading
Do you have a problem with something?
You sound a tad intolerant.
🙂
Just to play devil's advocate, would you think it's better for a cricket wicket keeper to play bare-handed... or maybe with minimalist gloves?
I dont know! what do you think?
???? I was complementing you on that book you mentioned! i have never heard of it and am now having a search for it online.
Lost in translation
Is it possible to be 'Barefoot Intolerant'? I have a friend who's dairy intolerant and she swells up.
HAHA
I'm glad about that Runz.
The book had David Hemery as one of the authors.
I've been training via the principles of the publication ever since I read it.
My copy is now in the hands of one of the best young tri-athletes in the UK.
🙂
Well... (and this isn't an argument I've thought through before... which might soon become obvious
)
You can look at the slips who stand right next to him... and they don't wear gloves. They benefit for greater 'feel' and agility. And you could argue that their hands will 'strengthen/harden' with use.
But the slips only have to use their hands maybe once or twice a day, unlike the wicket keeper. He needs protection to prevent damage from the repetitive thud, thud, thud all day.
Extending this to runners, a short distance runner can go barefoot(minimalist), like a slip fielder can go barehanded. But long distance running on hard roads is as unnatural as catching a hard ball 300 times a day... so needs more protection.
I know it's simplistic... but I also think it simplistic to just say that we were born to run barefoot... because we weren't born to run 20 miles on concrete roads !
I got a book you might be interested in by Keith Livingstone 'Healthy Intelligent Training'
BTW i attended a clinic hosted by David Hemery in New river Sports centre (Haringey Ac old home my club) in 1984 he really left a good impression on me.
If you buy the H.I.T. let me know what you think. I use something similar with 2 athletes i'm coaching at the moment both 800m runners.
I've only started posting recently but have dipped in and out of the forums for years so when you had a pop i thought you just being antagonistic like a lot of people on here.
But i read back my response and saw how you could of taken it the wrong way
So iv done my research and hope iv made a good purchase.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MALPncD9bko&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Check these out if your interested in making a switch to barefoot/min shoes.
I've run marathons in shoes which are 3mm thick on the road, I'm now in my 40s
and i weigh 12 1/2 stone! 3 stone over my old racing weight! I'm only 5'8".
I run 40 plus a week these days in the same 3mm sole shoes and don't get injured.
I'm not the only one, there are plenty who have benefited from this approach,but it takes along time to adapt,it took me a couple of years so for that reason it's not for everyone.
I'Ve said many times If you read 'Born To Run' and think you can throw away your shoes and nature will heal you prepare for a shock not just in your foot!
Nature wont heal you it will break you!
Jeff pyrah has just won the Grizzly 20 in Vivobarefoot shoes and runs 2.30 marathons in Vivobarefoot Evo's
Runz, I sent you a message.
You must be running in a pair of Nike Dualist.
I do most of my running training in racers. Conventional trainers are nice as a change as its like running along with cushions on my feet.
Noticed even wicket keepers have broken fingers, ouch! even with the gloves.
Nature is actually brutal.
🙂
I'm not running in Nike.
I wish i could tell you but i work for a big brand and it not worth the hassle i could get by revealing which shoe i wear!
What i will say is 'it's not about the shoe'!
All we need from a shoe is space for the foot to splay and a bit of weather/puncture protection.
A wide toe box is a must to engage the big toe (4 x as thick as the other toes) for successful toe off.
And you are so right about nature!
Nature wont heal you it will break you if you don't take time to adapt.
Thanks for the message BTW i replied
I'm off running now in my thin soled wide toed shoes!
Runz,
Best not give too much away on here.
🙂