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Beyond #asics262: life after Target 26.2 for sub-3:30 runner Malcolm
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OMFG!!!!! Steve Marathon Coach that session should have come with a severe health warning, much like the one on the Insanity DVDs!!! Felt like vomiting from the middle of the second rep.....
But the times were 9:16 / 9:08 / 9:07, or 7:25mm / 7:19mm/ 7:18mm I did the majority of it on my local parkrun route so I could imagine being at parkrun to get the speed, although I didn't do it on the hills... but man, really felt nauseous in the recovery periods... Had a much longer warm up this time - the main reason the first rep is a bit slow is I ended up running out of the park, and if I continued would have gone straight into the path of traffic, so had to turn around, which wouldn't have helped average pace!
Sarah a I'm not actually tracking my calories, but its something I find with my clients, when you are eating real food, the volume of it can trick you into thinking its a lot of energy, when actually calorie wise its pretty low - its all those hidden calories that lead to weight gain - for me - red wine, which together with a speeded up metabolism has lead to weight loss - see above re: Malc's intervals... wish I hadn't listened to your text now!!!
love reading about the sessions you lot do....
So happy I'm not doing them!!
Sarah - ooh, Crossfit sounds great, although I prefer kettle chips to kettle bells
Love a pull up though! Those were my favourites when I was in a 'proper job' and went to the gym. If you do them regularly you'll soon improve but it is a little embarrassing when you can only do 1 (or none) at first
Freemers - I forgot you had a live in masseur! Surely it's worth the pain for the benefit - or could you not have a quiet word and get him to back off a bit?
Angela - lol
Enjoyed that then? Ignoring how you felt, it looks like you did a great job looking at those splits!
Jen - ha ha
But you know what? I'm glad I'm not doing your sessions too - the mileage would kill me 
SESSION REPORT - Wk 6 Wed (Easy Run)
The foot took a bit of a beating yesterday and although it felt ok walking around the house I didn't really know how it would be until I started running.
I soon found out though - from the start it felt a bit awkward, more like tight and weak than painful.
I'm trying to be more cautious in this campaign so I looped back round towards home which would make up a mile and give me a chance to evaluate it.
I was quite surprised to see that, after it warmed up, it improved quite a bit. Not perfect, but alot more like it has been in the other runs I've been doing lately. Feeling more confident, I decided to keep doing laps round the block and take it a mile at a time.
Once I was into a rhythm I felt I could keep going but occasionally it would feel a bit weaker so after 4 miles I decided it wasn't worth risking another two and called it a day.
Once again it felt better after the run than before it. For the rest of the day it's been fine too so the optimist in me is going to assume that a little loosener did it some good. I guess I'll know in the morning
I hope this isn't coming across as negative, I don't feel that way at all. It's annoying that the problem is still there but if I can do tomorrow's session without any major issues then I think I can happily call that progress
However, I really need to get rid of it soon before it starts to drag on. Luckily I'll be seeing Physio Sarah on Saturday so hopefully she can give me an idea of what's wrong and how best to fix it.
Run Summary: 4.2 miles in 39:10 (1.8 miles down on target and at a slightly slower pace than 9mm too)
Malcs - You might as well make the most of your own personal physio, hope she gets to the bottom of it without too much pain
.
My sore ankle has turned into a sore Achilles, so I've given it 4 rest days and plenty of ice/heat, and stretches. Did 7.1m today, slow and easy to start and slowly picked up the pace, and ave 8.17mmp. It felt sore at the end, but not too bad. Will probably do a short loop for my lsr at the w/end , and then repeat it depending on how it feels.
Move over Malcs, I have cancelled tonight's session. Definite onset of shin pain so I've Been foam rollering and stretching this evening. I'll see how it is tomorrow and just keep resting til it is gone.
in 2008 I had awful shin splints in February and managed to race in April but got awful cramp in the last few miles and had to stop. I should be able to fend this off I think if I am disciplined and don't panic.
good luck at crossfit Sarah. I used to be able to do pull ups once!
Angela have you sorted out the logistics for Manchester yet?
Mr P, you are a genius! I should probably get on with booking a hotel... Unless I already have... I can't remember.
. I know I was looking at a premier inn...
Sarah O - well at least Chris remembered the day (although perhaps not out of choice) even if it was not so clear for you! Congrats the deed was achieved at least!
No more posts about a full English breakfast on race days or I wont be able to sleep at night
Malcs
See you Saturday on your best behaviour...lots to discuss!
Ruth - congratulations, you made the thread's 1000th post!
You win a kidz breakfast at Jesters Diner
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-norfolk-21287000
Looking forward to Saturday too, although a tiny bit scared too
Simon - eek, really hope that achilles gets under control. Good to see you treating it with respect.
Mr P - nooo! No more injuries please. Sounds like you're nipping it in the bud though. Hope it's nothing more than a little flare up. Fingers crossed for you!
Be careful Malcs. Sounds like onset of PF to me. When I had it it eased as I ran but it gradually worsened until I could barely walk on it.
Might be worth comparing notes with Clive?
I'm pretty certain that mine was caused by wearing different shoes that were too narrow - or tight laces?
DS2 I think its all the high heels Malcs wears...
DS2 - I'm not sure if it's PF, isn't that more the bottom of the foot? Clive's issue was near the heel. Mine is around the outer arch.
Can't really say for sure though without seeing someone.
Angela - ha ha
Only on Saturday nights mind!
quite a few niggles around!
Malcs probably wise to cut the session as the extra miles wouldn't have given much gain.
It is difficult evaluating sometimes. I tend to carry on when I can and it generally has worked for me as now into 39th year of marathoning and have never missed a planned marathon (yet!) but sometimes it is much, much better to play safe.
I gained nothing in training myself this morning as so slow.
Though calf not great, the restriction was more hip/thigh related and after very slow start, got quicker but was still slower than 10 minute-miles overall for 7 miles in two parts the second part was jog to chiro!
On the subject of niggles...I've developed 'something' in my right hip since Saturday; possibly flexor strain, but feel quite deep so possibly in the joint. Doesn't bother me when running - I did 18 on Sunday and 8 w 5 at HMP on Tuesday without any problems, but smarts a bit when I'm walking.
Had yesterday off andI've just got back from walking the dog and I think its a bit better today, so I'll carry on as per schedule for a few more days and see if anything changes.
Hope everyone else has some speedy recoveries.
Steve - wow, 39 years of marathon running, that's one impressive record! So is this year 40 or 39 and are you planning some crazy celebration for the 40th?
Great to get your thoughts on the matter of niggles and injuries. It's quite reassuring to hear that carrying on running when possible has consistently worked for you.
Sorry to hear the hip/thigh is still troubling you. How was the chiro?
Lou - not you too! I hope you find it better today. If it doesn't bother you when running it doesn't count right? That's the rule isn't it?
How is your training going so far?
TODAY'S SESSION
Week6 - Thursday
Speed Endurance
5M with middle 3M at marathon pace (sub 8s – rest 9s) approx 42 mins
Bizarrely the foot is feeling pretty good today - not perfect, but better than yesterday. As a result I'm feeling cautiously optimistic about today's session. It's only 0.8 miles longer than yesterday but then there is a step up in pace.
Weather looks a bit moist. I could get a soaking but then I haven't had one yet so I can't complain.
How are everyone's niggles today, any improvement overnight?
Hope session goes well if you attempt.
with regards to trying to carry on, I do always try and find out what the niggle is and get treatment asap as well as go regularly when not injured to hopefully solve a problem before it appears, and am lucky after running so long that I know a lot of good people who can treat me but appreciate not everyone can do that.
I do take more rest than I used to and only did one run last week between Monday and Friday to try and rest the niggle but tried to get the long run in on Sunday.
Some niggles you can run through and some aches disappear or ease slightly as you warm up but if it's getting worse during a run then suggest cutting session short immediately and the older you are you do learn to know your body better but also have to be aware injuries take longer to recover from!
Malcs My first marathon (as teenager) was October 1976 so 2015 will be 40th year but the 40th anniversary is still some way away - some years did 5 marathons but now just one a year.
Afternoon all . Just thought I'd wind you all up by declaring that I'm still niggle free! ( said with fingers crossed behind my back!)
me too jenf!
I think its all the extra resistance training I've been doing - and likewise for you with your olympic lifting!! 
*touches wood*....
Steve - 5 marathons in a year sounds like hard work. Did you race them all or sometimes just jog round chatting?
Malcs - training is going well apart from the hip niggle. Did 18 on Sunday without too much trouble. Tuesday session was quite satisfying as I averaged 6:46 for the 5 HMP miles and felt fairly comfortable at that. I was struggling with that sort of pace in the build up to Bedford HM before Christmas so feel there has definitely been some improvement.
Just done 7 with 3 at MP and the hip felt a bit sore for the first couple of miles, but then eased off - barely noticeable through the MP section.
Fingers crossed your foot is ok today.
Oh dear - we don't like a full sick bench, do we? Healing wishes to all those afflicted...
that's amazing. I can't even manage that in a 10 k ...
Lou D.: 6:46 HM pace
Talking about HM pace ... I'm due a tempo run but weather forecast says -10. I think I may bin it and wait for warmer weather. It may be a long wait but c'est la vie. Have asthma and trouble breathing in the cold. That's when I wish I still had gym membership ... but it's really not worth it for 2 or 3 tempo sessions during a cold spell.
Chicka - I did once run a whole 13 miles at that sort of pace - seems like a long time ago now though. At the moment it's very much a hypothetical HMP, but it felt comfortable for 5 so that is reassuring.
Niggles are very hard to totally avoid at this time of year as the body adapts to the increasing workload and I think if anything, even if the training increases in March, because you are stronger and it's milder, the niggles might actually lessen.
The key is to stay on top of them now and not let them become an injury. Today was better than yesterday for me but may rest up for 2 days now and seek more treatment.
Lou - according to Power of Ten, which might be missing something, it might only be four, I did 4 marathons when a relative youngster in 1979 - all slightly quicker each time - a 2:39 in June then 2:36 in September, 2:36 in October then 2:35 in December.
Then in 1996 did four - 2:48 at Boston and 2:56 at London in same week in April and then 2:55 and 2:46 a week apart in September. The 2:55 wasn't flat out and was because I was doing a report for RW.
Did four in 2000 around the 3 hour mark and 3 in 2003 but since just once a year.
In 2003 I did a 2:42 and 2:46 and while I've never set off with the intention of a just getting round marathon, a few I may have eased off and jog/walked the last few miles as I did with the 3:22 at London in 2003 where I had a few problems but I had run the 2:42 a few months earlier so probably wasn't too bothered and think I paced a sub-3 pace to about 21 miles, then socialised the last five!
Steve - the only person I've ever socialised with in the last 5 miles of a marathon was God!
Oh how the other half live
Fascinating stuff though.
Thanks for clarifying your approach to niggles, sound advice as always.
Good to hear you had a better day today!
Jen - you are quite amazing. It must be all the power squatting. I'll have to jump on the band wagon because there's clearly something in it. The only squatting I do at the moment is....well, let's not go there.
Lou - amazing pace there, really great to hear things are going well!
Chickadeee - minus 10! I don't blame you for staying indoors. You need to come over here, it's like early spring again here today.
Angela - how are you feeling today, recovered from the death run now?
Freemers A holiday in the Cotswold sounds lush...I reckon youve done enough hill training whilst on holiday to last you the year
. I tend to set the incline to a max of level 10. On tue I did 1 min reps at level 2,then level 4, then 6, 8 and then level 10 with one min on the flat inbetween. I then do the circuit again. Im not sure what the levels are in % incline though. Only problem with doing hills on the TM is that there are no down hills to aid recovery!
Angela so you enjoyed the speed session then!! How did you feel afterwards?
I like optimistic Malcs. I managed 2 pull ups yesterday at crossfit. The rest I did with the assistance of an elastic band (which was actually quite fun).
Simon I hope your achilles tendon is feeling better today.
Haha Ruth everyone seems to remember my wedding as the one with no groom...we do look back and laugh now...only chris would miss most of his own wedding! I promise no further talks of full english...the link Malcs put on here made me feel nauseous!
Chick I have the same problem with my breathing as you in the cold and/or wind. Im not asthmatic but I was as a child (suppoidly) and I was on inhalers for 2 months after getting whooping cough in 2012. I always suffer in races in winter as a result...thought about trying an inhaler before the start but then I worry about it having adverse effects!
Wow Steve thats an impressive number of marathons all in impressive times...even when your not trying! Do you have a "big/special"one in mind for next year?
6:46 mm for 5 miles in training, thats really impressive Lou D
Today's run was much better than Tuesday - 6 miles averaging about 8.15s, but the last 2 were sub 8. My heel pain is just noticeable, nothing to stop me running but I'm rolling it on a tennis ball under my desk to be on the safe side.
Chick - I remember doing a run when I was in Chicago about this time last year - it was a similar temperature and the coldest I've ever run in. Never again
Lou - I think I might just have managed a 6:46 mile during a parkrun. Just the once, mind....no way could I keep that up for 5, let alone a full HM!
SteveMC - about 15 years ago (I think it was 1999) I went on a pre-marathon training weekend with the charity Whizz-Kidz, who I was running for in London that year (although as it turned out I didn't run in the end, but that's another injury story!). You were leading the training for it (it was somewhere in the peak district if you can remember that far back!). I actually remember you talking about doing those 4 marathons in 1996 in one of the Q&A sessions and thinking you were mad
Angela cannot come to the forum right now as she doesn't like Malcs' crazy training sessions....
Hmm, well, I didn't feel as good as I did after the 400s Sarah a, but it does feel like I'm getting to a good peak ahead of my half marathon in a few weeks. Last 8 days have been pretty tough and full on, and I'm meant to be doing 9 miles at MP saturday and 17mi LSR on Sunday. I will probably work hard until wednesday next week, and then put my longrun on Friday instead of Sunday to give me a little more recovery ahead of the half marathon, whilst not missing out on the endurance training for the marathon. Just had a sports massage, and actually feel a bit nauseous after bleurgh...
There was a LOT of tightness in one calf, which felt a bit weak with some plyometric stuff I've been doing, so I shall ease of that too, but luckily tomorrow is rest day, so should have settled in time for Saturday
Blimey you can talk, nine on Saturday and 17 on Sunday? I think insanity is getting a hold on you Angela.
Freemers it breaks my heart when I have my breakfast in the hotel on raceday...I have paid for breakfast but can only eat porridge while they tuck into one of London's best breakfasts.
How did it go Malcs?
I did eight at about 8:20s, iced immediately and feel ok now but we will see tomorrow. Felt heavy and tired so next time I race I will incorporate minimum two days rest.