Howdy, Stranger!
Categories
Options
P&D Spring Marathon 2018
The materials in this website are in no way intended to replace the professional medical care, advice, diagnosis or treatment of a doctor, qualified personal trainer, therapist, dietitian or nutritionist Runners's World, Part of the Hearst UK well-being network © Copyright 2017
Comments
Such a cheery weatherman Westy - It's a wonder you aren't on the telly
Sounds like a decent target Reg: certainly no sandbags being bandied about.
Ramjet: you seemed to have got the marathon pace right then if the legs aren't feeling too bad
Good couple of runs those Westy
Keep an eye on that post tib Steve, but as you stay just stay away from the speed work
You seem to run well off little miles Reg, so I reckon you'll surprise yourself at Reading
6 x 1km (200m jog recovery) on the track tonight. Reps were 3:11, 3:14, 3:15, 3:17, 3:19, 3:20. Averaged 3:16
6 and 4 mile double for me. Getting out again in the dark isn't much fun. Not sure how Spoons does all his doubles!
Right now, I'm thinking of making Manchester week a big one - front loaded with a 2-3 day 'taper' - then run at about about 9 minute miles (compared to Newport target pace somewhere 7.37 - 7.50)... so any thoughts please.
Millsy... 2nd in a marathon. Good effort!
SQ... good luck with the injury. Anyway, I'm sure you're right to consider a more relaxed run - especially in memory of your uncle.
Accidental 2000ft. Nice One.
Nice pace Andy. And Hazel - enjoy getting back into it.
Steve... you're going to have to show some patience. Good luck.
Hundred miler AWC? Great. Hopefully do one next year.
Nothing for me this week. Rested Monday, too much work tonight. Now to bed. Newport HM rearranged date is this Sunday. Forecast snow showers. Saturday night -3C. 9am Sunday 1C with wind from the North-East 30-50km/hr... can't wait!!
Snow is now forecast to be further south, most places in UK will be dry, so Reading and co should be ok (still v cold though).
EOM
6ish mi for me today.
For a decent watch I could go up a bit - even get a second hand good one. Any other suggestions would be welcome because I'm at a loss exploring all the options. Cheers.
Exciting about the ultra, AWC. No doubt the run camp S&C will all help. You’re a braver man than me! Must require such a different mindset.
Trip looks exciting, Joe. Look forward to seeing some photos on strava. Pretty good half off the back of very little run training. You’ll no doubt convert well in the marathon with all the monster bike sessions.
Sounds a lovely ski break, Hazel. I did a season in Switzerland many years ago. Haven’t been skiing since 2014 now – definitely missing it.
That’s a bloody tough VSS, Ramjet. Although as you say, it is probably slightly a result of some using it as a training run and comparing it to their PBs. You are an architect of the tough score!
Impressive intervals, Westy. I find I can go faster on the treadmill, but don’t really count it as actual running.
Nice track work, Reg. Good luck for snowy Reading. And very impressive reps from Scott.
I would consider second hand, NE, if budget is a consideration. I bought my wife a second hand Garmin and sold her old one. Worked out about £30 net and it really was as good as new. A lot of people never use theirs.
A little tester to feel my way back in today. 15M at 7:04 average with the main set a ‘descender’. 24 mins, 18, 12, 6, 3 with 3 min rests. Paces well off a similar session in the Autumn, but it was very windy and I felt pretty wooden after last week. Knee generally fine, although I can’t fully bend it yet for drills and the short sharp stuff. Paces not far off for the 24min and 18 min at MP effort (6:34 and 6:27), but well below the sub 6m/m I want for the shorter ones. Still, a decent effort. I won’t taper for the FoD Half, but will go out and enjoy things. Now the classic question of what to wear in -1C for a half.
Just had a look at strava flyby for the first time in ages. I bumped into spoons three times this morning, but funny to see how close we were for lots of it. Saw you cut the session short, so hope all is ok. That said, 12.8M at 6:4x pace is still a cracking session after so many 100+M weeks.
Can't help on the watch front NE. Don't know if they have a model which ticks all of the other boxes but my current TomTom Runner has a good battery life (lasted 6:45 hours in a race last year).
Glad to hear your stomach issues were only temporary Steve.
Standard Tuesday trot for me yesterday evening, started off dry but it was pouring by the time we had finished. 5x1km reps later today - should be nice weather for it for once but I have tired legs from the weekend still.
I'm looking at the possibility of snow or at least sleet for Saturday's race as well - and fairly brisk NE winds - the first 2km are up hill straight into the wind.
"Quick" ultra question if I may: I am toying with the idea of running a 56km 7 weeks after my spring marathon and 14 weeks prior to my autumn marathon (Berlin). If I am not looking at doing a time in the ultra but just get round it is it likely to take too much out of me for the preparation for the autumn marathon? I could postpone the ultra to next year but I was thinking of doing the 100km then. The 56km covers part of the 100k course and I can get some more experience of running at night (race starts at 10pm) was my idea. I guess the correct answer is do 56k next year and 100k the year after that if I want to give any priority to Berlin. Sorry for the rambling.
NE - Fingers crossed for Newport for you weather wise. Will it be a PB attempt?
AWC - Doing Guernsey Ultra (36 miles), so should be good. Views look amazing and shouldn't beat me up as badly as the 100k did!!
Scott - Speedy reps as ever.
Another 6 miles this morning, 9:38 average for 124bpm average. Knocked together my plan for this ultra. Going to keep pace steady with no speedwork, then see where I am in 3/4 weeks as have a local HM. If feeling OK might race, if not I'll use it as a MP session. 9 miles planned for tomorrow.
Better a headwind at the start than the end, Hazel. I'd say doing a 56k at that point will be fine. The only issue might be 'peaking' three times in relatively short succession. Building in rest weeks will be important.
Congrats on the 2nd place Millsy. And good luck at Eastleigh.
Glad the knee is doing ok SQ, good to see you back out there.
Enjoying the photos Joe, what a jet-set life you lead!
Glad you’re recovering well from the training marathon Ramjet. SSS is deeply flawed imo, I’ve done parkruns in perfect conditions with massive scores, and races with rubbish weather with tiny scores.
Nice MLR and intervals Westy. Thanks for the weather updates, really hope Reading isn’t impacted. Not had much much with weather this year, two races cancelled due to snow already!
Sensible to back off Steve, sounds like you’re heading in the right direction.
Speedy reps Scott.
NE check out DCRainmaker: https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2016/09/hands-lezyne-computer.html It concentrates on the bike version but presumably the software is similar.
Hazel I’ve no real experience but 14 weeks before Berlin is a long time, so I would have thought it would be ok, especially if you’re not going all out at the ultra.
Another big BAC session planned this morning, very similar to SQ with 24 min, 18 min, 12 min, 6 min, 4 min, 3 min, 2 min, 2 min, starting at MP and getting faster. I’ve been very busy and a bit stressed with work this week, so was feeling a bit tired (mostly mentally, the legs felt ok) but the first 24 mins came out right on target MP and in the right effort zone, which I was happy with given the breezy conditions. The second 18 min rep came in at 6:11/mi so a touch slower than I’d have liked, and by this point I was already feeling pretty tired (again, not really in terms in leg fatigue, just general tiredness) and my head wasn’t really in the game.
I therefore decided to bin the rest of the session. I could have carried on, but would have probably had to bury myself to complete it and I’m very cautious about overcooking things at this point and ruining all my hard work. I therefore thought it was best to cut it short, and hopefully be ready to put in a good MP run at Reading on Sunday. It was still 7 miles of reasonably fast running, which is the most I’d have done if I was sticking to a traditional Pfitzinger plan anyway.
Hazel: based on my experience I would say that's fine. I ran a 54mi ultra 8 weeks after Southampton Marathon last year and it was 17 weeks before Abingdon. I did 5 easy weeks and then a 12w/55mi P&D plan which worked really well. I found doing an ultra off the back of marathon training is good because you don't have to build loads of endurance. If I was you I'd have 2 weeks rest and then do a 12w P&D plan. Good luck!
Spoons: I agree SSS is pretty useless IMO. My first marathon which was really hilly was given 2.4 but MK Marathon which is flat got 2.8 and both run on fine days. I think it works better in comparing the same race but fails badly at comparing different races. Mainly because its the organisers giving it a rating and how can that be consistent across different events. And well done for listening to your body - you training has been immense and has got you in brilliant shape so there's little to be gained now by pushing through a barrier like that for the sake of it.
SQ: glad to see you are back at it. Not surprised the knee is still a bit stiff. I have the same dilemma about what to wear at Reading for -1 which feels like -5
spoons - wise and prudent.
SQ - the speed has returned without missing much of a beat!
Steve - nice low HR, great ultra training (seems the thread has as much ultra talk as marathon talk these days)
NE - I’d say it’s still a bit close to contemplate running a full marathon even at your LR pace. If you’ve got a history of quickly recovering then maybe you’ll be fine but there will be residual fatigue whether you notice it or not. How much do you want a PB at Newport?
Highlights of my read back:
Really pleased you found the guinea pigs NE.
SQ - ouch. But pleased to see your knee is healing. Don't listen to anyone saying you should stay away from the bike. Triathlon forever!
AWC - I'll be supporting my husband at RTK, I'll make sure I keep an eye out for you too.
Westy - Love the weather reports.
All is well for me, twins are growing well. My knee appears to be healed, and I ran a parkrun (very slowly) last weekend. I can't quite tell how much of the slowness is from 4 months off, and how much is from my growing belly. But in any case, it felt very good to be back.
Hazel: 14 weeks is plenty of time to allow for recovery & rebuild. It's only 56K so unless it's near vertical really shouldn't take much more than a marathon out of you.
SQ: Certainly seem don't seem to have lost anything with a week off & a remarkably speedy recovery for what sounded like a horrendous injury.
Spoons: Sensible as ever - not surprised tiredness has finally caught you out given the huge mileage. I'm struggling averaging just 80Mpw
Worryingly my left knee has started giving me gyp in a similar way to how the right one went last year. Might have to resort to a day off
AWC - If you want to do Guernsey, make sure you apply when entries open (or close to it), as it does sell out quickly.
Seeing as I ran a marathon on Sunday I decided to ease into the intervals to see if anything was going to break. This turned out to be a fun way of doing them.
Splits were 4:20, 4:00, 3:50, 3:45, 3:45 and 3:40.
Probably only the last 3 were approaching the right effort level but I don't take speed work very seriously these days and this was enjoyable!
Good to hear from you, JCG. Pleased it's all going well.
Watch the knee, Jooligan. You've got loads of miles in the bag.
AWC, I will almost certainly go short short and vests. May add gloves, long socks and (outrageously) arm warmers - in that order.
Wise decision to knock the session on the head, Spoons. And as you say, still a good chunk of running. Amazing how mental stress can fatigue running, but definitely true.
Stitches seem to have done the job nicely, although I do still feel battered and bruised. But I can run - hurrah!
JCG: glad to hear all is going well with the twins! He'll love RTTK. Beautiful scenery and amazing organisation - I would thoroughly recommend it. You should be easy to spot in your super hero outfit
A few short intervals at lunch today - 5x600m. With the wind 2:15; against the wind 2:20! So not bad but still struggling to shift this cold properly. I feel much better than last week but still not 100%
Nice intervals Ramjet & AWC.
Not quite a day off but certainly not my usual Wednesday mileage/effort: 7K progressive on the TM started @8:03 dropped 14s/M each K to finish @6:26 m/m. Think the knee isn't tracking properly so doing lots of foam rolling of the quads, ITB & hamstrings.
SQ - great to see you back running so soon.
Spoons - don't worry one bit about that session, all the hard work is done.
Good luck to everyone doing Reading Sunday (and any others), hope the snow stays away.
No snow here, just 25 degrees and blue skies. I've been swimming in the sea for the last 2 mornings at 6am in just a pair of trunks. Makes me think the UK is not all it's cracked up to be.. Just doing easy runs as the legs are still pretty pummelled from Sundays effort. I've written a race report if anyone wants a read;
https://spragginsblog.wordpress.com/2018/03/14/surrey-half-11-03-2018/
Wise decision to back off this morning spoons.
Good to hear all is well JCG.
Careful with that knee Jools.
Nice progressive reps Ramjet.
With those weather conditions you might find it difficult to get back on the plane to the UK Joe. Will read the blog Joe - I have worked my way through the whole thing in the meantime and have thoroughly enjoyed it.
Thanks for the ultra feedback SQ, spoons, AWC, JohnOz, Jools and SteveMac. I have some time to sign up yet. Alongside of physical considerations I might need a bit of a break mentally post-marathon and be able to train for a while without plans and goal races before starting a new marathon plan for Berlin.
8 and a bit miles with 5x1km reps at lunchtime for me. Splits were between 4:27 (1st rep) and 4:36 (last rep) so faded a bit. Also set off too quickly at the beginning of each km and struggled towards the end. Need to try starting off slower and speeding up or at least holding the pace. Something like Ramjet did.
Steve... the half this Sunday is exploratory. I think the pb (1.33.38 - also on this course) is a bit beyond me - I'm thinking of doing the first few miles with a 1.35 pacer and finding out whether that's too quick or (unlikely) if I can kick on a bit.
And thanks for advice on watches... spoons thanks for the link. I've looked already - I think I found every review on the internet and it's taken hours - hence desperately hoping someone has some personal knowledge. Or can advise on a specific alternative model.
Right... I'm off out for a late VO2 session now.
Doing another easy run today, 6 to 8mi.
One problem for races on Sunday will be the strong winds, may make PB hunting difficult.
Just a little bit jealous of the nice weather, Joe. Enjoy.
Useful to know, Westy. I'll definitely be in enjoy it mode.
10 easy miles on the canal this morning. Legs very tired. I quite like the strava feature that tells you how many times you have run a particular route. My 18th time of this, and definitely in the slowest quartile. Some big puddles to contend with, so went for the run through rather than skirt around option.
AWC perhaps it’s the course profile rating on the RunBritain race listings you’re thinking of? They’re equally useless because as you say the race organiser rates it, and some people’s definition of “flat” is very suspect!
Glad the twins are doing well JCG and you’re slowly easing back in to running.
Hope the knee is nothing serious Jools, take it easy you’ve had a great run of training so far this year, you don’t want to spoil it.
Nice intervals Ramjet, AWC, and Hazelnut.
Glad you all agree with my decision yesterday. I’m really pleased I’m sensible enough, and confident enough in my training these days, to listen to my body and know when to cut my losses. And it says a lot about my progress that a “bad” session ends up with 12 miles at my current marathon PB pace! Got a nice early night last night and feel much fresher today.
Had an enjoyable, if wet, run along the canal this morning. Nice to see blossom appearing, and lots of wildlife around (including the lesser-spotted SoreQuads) - spring is slowly coming. Unlike SQ I attempted to dodge some puddles, which was a big mistake as the wet mud/grass was as slippy as ice in road shoes and I nearly ended up in the canal! Managed to stay upright though, and after that gave in to having soggy shoes.
Good news about the knee SQ, nice marathon session that considering
Always annoying when you get caught in the rain Hazel, much prefer it raining from the off!
You still completed a big chunk of fast running even thought you cut the session short Spoons, better to be sensible if not quite feeling it
Nice comeback JCG
Sorry to hear about the knee Jools, hope the rest day does the trick
Nice reps from Ramjet , Hazel and AWC!
Think you might be rethinking your post yesterday Joe, judging by the stormy picture you posted on Strava earlier
30 mins yesterday, after some self massage and strengthening in the evening legs are feeling good today and ready for a session tonight
I was sweating a lot, but not sure I qualify as wildlife, spoons?! I do love the peace of the canal - and you're right. the muddy grassy sections can be lethal. Just embrace the puddles. Quite liberating once you do. BTW - did you pass a swan on the path shortly after we saw each other? Pretty fiesty when I did.
Enjoy the evening self-massage, Scott.
Having said my legs were tired on this morning's run, they now feel like a baseball bat has been taken to them. Very stiff quads and calves and struggling downstiars. Yesterday's session has certainly taken it out of me. Beasted!