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Talkback: Lucozade Sport Super Six: Andy (sub-4:00)
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No snow here yet in London but may be coming this way.
Yes don't see a problem in doing a run today instead of tomorrow - it's not that the run yesterday woud have exhausted you.
I would say, if conditions are ok, you could probaby go a little quicker than slow on Sunday...as you were planning a 10K initially
the snow has decended here so its unlikely that running club will be on tonight...............
so difficult to work out whether to take a rest day or to go out on my own a do a slow 5 miles.........( I'm a week ahead of you on the schedule).tomorrow was going to be a rest day..........My Oh was going to be running tonight as well so got to try and take turns................really want to avoid the treadmill as I hate it on there.........if I run on that it will be the speed session
I got back to running wearing ITB straps (I used these last time I returned to running) and all was ok(ish). Now I have constant aching on the outside of both legs and quads. I can run with discomfort (not pain) but feel I may be doing some lasting damage which may compromise my ability to run London.
I'm going to rest again for a few days and see if I notice any improvement. I guess, if anything, it's an opportunity to improve my swim stroke.
Andy et al, I hope you have more luck than me.
Please let me know if anyone else has experienced this or has any suggestions how I should proceed.
Thanks
Really sorry to hear it KingRich. So many of us have had problems in the last couple of weeks, I'm sure half of is is through running tense in the snow and ice as we're worried about falling over and doing ourselves a serious mischief.
Sorry I don't have any useful advice beyond what you're already doing, and (I know this is not what you want to hear) rest. Can you get a physio to look at it and see if they can alleviate it a bit?.
KingRich- I have to run with a strap on my left ITB always, and often wear a light strap during the day too, but the thing I've noticed, is that, as long as I do that, I'm better to keep running, and it gets worse if I stop for any length of time. Running slowly doesn't suit it, so have to run briskly and take walk breaks instead ( still managed a 4:12 marathon doing that!). If you're injury -prone, have you thought of the 3 day per week schedules?- that's why I switched.
Tempo run on tready today- 11km , middle 8km at 11.8kph- nearly killed me! (remember, i'm only running 3xper week, so the runs are all hard)
I don't know...all these people out there sticking to the 'dreadmill' rather than risking life & limb (like I did) on the icy seafront this morning.
Actually most of the snow had turned to sort-of ice, that was very crunchy and very grippy, so no issues with slipping over. My only real problems were my eyes the constantly watering (to stop them freezing?) and my dog not wanting to go any further (wuss!).
A very refreshing 10m, very slow but I'm still getting back into running legs after most of December off.
Congrats to all for their 'first' schedule run....before you know it you'll be knocking out an 11m tempo on a Thursday night after work, wondering what all the fuss was about. (Note - that happened to me, last March, and I still remember thinking I never thought I'd get through the schedule to be able to do it).
KingRich - sorry to hear about the ITB, sounds tough. I've got no real experience with ITB, but asalways, if in doubt about doing "serious damage" get to a physio. Sometimes just hearing them saying it's not too serious gets the mind around it.
King Rich: Hang in there mate. Can't offer any advice i'm afraid, Lake and Hashette recommend a physio. Sounds logical to me.
Hi All
Tues 4M Slow (day early according to schedule) Tick
A slow treddie session in 37.18
Mile 1: 08:58 139bpm 0% Gradient
Mile 2 08.47 154bpm 0% Gradient
Mile 3 09.43 151bpm 0.5% Gradient
Mile 4 09.50 158bpm 1% Gradient
Started off at 11km speed for first two miles and felt great. Really relaxed. Looking at mile splits I then decided to reduce the speed down to 10km (it was meant to be a SLOW session) and have a play with the treddie gradient button (never used before). Still felt fine during run but very tired afterwards. I don't think it was the run effort itself more a lack of hydration throught the day and during the run. I'd also donated blood the night before which couldn't help. Still run two done
and just as well given the expected weather tonight.
Question: I tried altering the gradient on the treddie following an off forum chat with fellow Super Sixer The Evil Pixie. Any thoughts on using gradients on treddies. I've always found them artificially quick compared to real outside running. Does using the gradient counter this to a degree? Am I loading pressure unnecessarily on the calfs by doing this?
It feels great to tick off the training runs doesn't it?!
Right, I am officially totally fed up with the snow now. Ran on the treadmill tonight - hate it! I also seem to run more slowly on the treadmill than I do outside for some reason. I certainly didn't alter the gradient! I think the advice is to do this to make it more comparable to outdoor running where you would have wind resistance etc and you are propelling yourself forward rather than bopping up and down on the spot going nowhere!
Andy - had the same idea today re treadmill. It wasn't as boring as I'd thought it would be as I had to concentrate on not falling off and pressing the right buttons. A gradient of 1.5% (or degrees?) felt about right, and 12 kmph was OK for 4 miles. There's a track outside the gym, and I did one lap to cool off -it felt great, but slightly as if I'd had too much to drink!
Snow's heavy here tonight, so it'll have to be snow-running tomorrow!
Good job on the running people. I ran on Sunday and Monday and was sitting it out today - snow's been pretty constant all day in Brum so unsure if it was a goer anyhow. Going to be a mission to find somewhere to run tomorrow - was hoping to run a little farther due to a half next week but 4 miles it will have to be!
AndyV - just got the Feb edition of RW with the nice glossy pictures of you supersixers and coaches! Regarding the treadmill, there's a little article on p17 about increasing the gradient of the tread - says 'you dramatically increase the power output from quads, hamstrings and calves' otherwise the muscles don't work so hard.
Andy
well done on the run tonight - that is fine in the circumstances.
You may need to watch the blood doning. While it is admirable you do it, it doesn't really fit in with marathon training, and so may be best you wait until after the marathon.
Naughty runners tend to add blood rather than take it away as it boosts performance!
Well done on everyone who completed their sessions in difficult conditions today or will have to do them tomorrow.
I was expecting the track session I organise to be weather affected tonight as the forecast wasn't good and the track tends to be slippery in cold conditions as it isn't greatly maintained. However, it was a crisp and relatively wind free night and though too cold wasn't bad at all though I didn't run well myself.
Considering there were quite a few regulars absent and the forecast wasn't great, I was surprised the group numbered 29, which is the most all winter. Must be new Year's resolutions!
However, while weather was fine a few hours ago, now the snow is falling heavily in SE London. Hope it clears by April!
I just thought I'd wish a Happy New Year to everybody here. I am still away on holiday for this week and the following, so not much training happening for me. My knee seems to be recovering though, and that is good news. I will try catch up with the posts these days. Good luck to everyone that started training for London!
The first sign of snow and everything falls apart down here, we're just not geared up for it. Last time round Hertfordshire County Council had a very smug message on their website about their fleet of gritting lorries being ready for anything. By 9am the following morning when nobody was moving anywhere, it had been replaced with a moan about unprecedented weather conditions, blah blah blah.
Hope you're okay if you're trying to get to work Andy, the pictures on the news look a bit grim
I've noticed that you mentioned the possibility of being dehydrated during your run yesterday. Apologies if you are already aware of the following. The easiest way to find out how dehydrated you are is to check the colour of your urine. Your urine colour should be pale/clear atleast 1-2 hours before you set off. I would recommend drinking 2L of fluid a day and an additional 500ml 1-2 hours before your run.
During your run you should be aiming to match your sweat loss. You can monitor this by calculating the amount of body weight you lose through sweat. If you weigh yourself before your run and then again afterwards, any body weight loses are likely to be through sweating, e.g. if you lose 1kg of weight that equates to 1L of fluid. Therefore you would have to drink a litre of fluid during that particular run.
The overall aim is to avoid losing 2% of your body weight and this has been shown to impair your performance.
Afternoon All (Particularly to Kitty The Cat - who if my memory serves me right has posted from the US! fair play lady)
Prepped to work from home today only to leave the memory card required at the office yesterday night. Doh! This meant a two hour trudge in deep snow to get to the office. In truth I kind of enjoyed it as I had the mindset "I bet many won't get into work today so if I do (whatever time) its a bonus". Its all about positive mindset I guess. Or maybe I'm still "high" after giving blood the other day!I suspect the latter
Depending on the weather I may do the Thursday Two miler today (treddie though~) as I definately won't be running tomorrow or on sunday (long run on saturday instead). We'll see.....
All Forum: Thanks for the tips/advice re treddie gradients
MM: I'll check out your thread re hydration as suggested. Cheers fella
Gareth (Lucozade man): thanks for the informative post. Let's just say it wasn't pale straw coloured and leave it at that. I plan to try a "sweat test" on my next long run and assess based on your advice above. I'll report back to you and the forum in due course.
And Finally:
Inspired by the marvellous effort from Kitty The Cat (see above) I am setting the forum a challenge. Who can (genuinely) post a message on this thread from the furthest possible distance from blighty before VLM 2010. Over to you guys...make me proud
strange remark to read on given blood............as most people only give once every 5 or 6 months I can't see how giving blood is going to harm anyones long term training programme.......yes you might not perform as well for a day or two and people should avoid it the week before the race...............but there are no long term effects
but when an expert like yourself says a sweeping statement like that so many runners might take the advise...............and runners are one of the groups most likely to be able to give in the community...........I think that the statemnet is irresponsible...........
Sorry It wasn't meant to be irresponsible and didn't want to intentionally stop anyone giving blood, as it's a crucial service, but think about in a training plan.
Once every six or even three months is not going to have an effect but if you did it every month it would and if you are going to do everything to get as fit as possible in a certain timescale, then you need to at least know that it will have an adverse affect on running, training and racing and make a decision on it.
One runner I know whose performances were very up and down only was solved when it was realised the blood giving was having the effect and then he decided to only do it end of season and his performances became far more consistent.
I don't know how many of the running community give blood but I doubt if very few faster or elite runner do, but perhaps they are more driven by performance
Evening all,
it's just started to snow properly here in Kent...the kids are whooping round the house saying they're not going to have to go to school tomorrow. I fear they may be right.
A gentle 9m this morning, my last 'off-schedule' run to get my running legs back after xmas. Going to have to buy a set of skis for my tempo run tomorrow.
Take care all
P.s. I'm now not going to give blood until after April, but then give two leg-fulls, to catch up.
Hi All
Re the blood thing. I give blood every 16 weeks which i think is along standard blood donor guidelines these days. My next session is now not until after May so no further impact on the training. I have O Positive blood (common garden muck really) which can be used by more than one group so I kind of feel its my "duty" to donate. Based on my own experience (about 15 donations) I find I am a tad tired for a day or two afterwards but nothing real bad. Hell, I've run short distances in the last two days so it can't impact the "amateur" that much. Everyones experiences are different but a common sense approach for would be marathoners must surely be "if your going to do it, do it soon" so that it has no impact at all when the training gets tougher.
Hi again
I did my "Thurs" scheduled two miler steady today (on treaddie in gym on way home from work) as I know I won't be able to run tomorrow or on Sunday. Running five times a week ain't easy is it?
I did a short free weight session and full warm up (dynamic stretching) before which may account for what i think is a higher than expected heart rate. Took it steady based on a constant 12km per hour speed.
Total Time: 16:22
Mile 1 08:16 142bpm
Mile 2 08:05 155bpm
Felt good to be honest. Quite pumped that the gym was open and I could fit it in despite the weather. Run three tick
Looking forward to experimenting with the hydration advice stuff Gareth (Lucozade Man) posted on the longer runs. What odds on an outside run soon ?
Be safe in the slush and ice peeps
Well you certainly learn alot on this forum! I have been thinking about giving blood for a while but never actually done it. Maybe I should wait until May then. I didn't think of it like that!
Is this snow ever going to go away?! I don't run again until Friday now on my 3 day schedule. I am going to try in the park on grass at lunch time. If not it's back to the treadmill I suppose.
Training is looking good so far Andy. Only another 15 and a half weeks to go!