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Comrades (South Africa) 56 miles
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Joe - finally worked out what JFDI stood for!
Jellybean - i have found with the big chain hotels that you get the option of either paying up-front for a cheaper rate or leaving it until your stay for more. With independents and smaller chains in Cape Town and Franschhoek I have been asked for the balance fairly early on - but usually by credit card only, not money order.
Carmen - sending you healing vibes...
Thanks everyone... just got to hold it together til the 26th
Carmen... I would but I'm not good at hopping. Hope you feel better very soon.
JB... you have mail
Nice 10 mile run this morning. I am considering a marathon in November as the 1:27 half of the other day is an indication that I should be able to break 3:20 for a B seeding. It would be good to get the qualifier out of the way allowing me to pile on the miles during March and April without a mini taper.
Sporta - Off a 1:27 you should be closer to 3:10 than 3:20.
I'm reckoning that at the moment I could do an easy 3:40 for pen C or if it goes perfectly scrape 3:20 for pen B at Berlin.
What sort of difference would it make in time to cross the line ?
Also if I do an easy 3:40 I won't have to take any time out to recover but doing a 3:20 will mean at least a week out recovering.
I started in the C pen on three previous occasions and it never took more than about 90 seconds to cross the start. I think as long as one is infront of the Green Number Club in the E pen, one won't lose too much time.
In my experience missing out on a Bill Rowan or a sliver can not be blamed on the time it took to cross the start (as long as you are infront of the E's)
I started in B this year and am fairly relaxed over a B or C start next year. I have a C qualifier already from Comrades and also Sundays Marathon which I took steady/training. If I run a B in next few months it won't be because I am aiming for a B if that makes sense.
I found this year that there is a whole bunch of guys (mostly) at front of C who steamroller through the Bs at the start anyway. Within 100 yards of the start most B's and C's were fairly mixed. I was even overtaken by an F runner in first 400m.....not sure what strategy they were following!
Starting in C pen is fine if your chasing a Rowan, worked Ok for me! As Keith say above I have been passed by H seeded runners within 10K. But if you look around you at the finish (assuming you run less than 9 hours) and there will be very very few who aren't B or C seeded.
This year being a up run is a bit different in that the roads at the start are wider and therefore less congestion, in 2009 on the down run I had no choice but to run at the pace of the pack around me until Polly's after 10K. Stops you going off to fast.
Flights are booked
well.... mostly anyway... I've booked return flights to Jo'burg so just need to book a domestic one way flight to Durban.
I'm doing a safari thing after Comrades and will end up at Jo'burg from that before flying home
It's all coming together... thank God for the credit card
Trinity - I have just booked up a safari as well and turning it into a holiday afterwards....
Interesting to hear the comments about a B or a C seeding. My aim at Venice is to go under 3.20 and therefore get a B seeding but only because i want to break my PB of 3.24. So good to know if all goes pear shaped on the day i can still pootle in for a sub 3.40 and still be in the right place on the start line..
Two questions ...
If I break sub 4 will I be in a different category from just sub 4.30? If I dont make the sub 4 this Ootober and I am not hopeful . there is no point breaking my backside and should probably just go with the 4.15 qualifyier I have and just get on with training. Would it be worth really going for it ?
How many days would you need to go on safari
Fizziofinn
The main medals won from the various pens from 2010 were:
2010
2010 Main Secondary Time
A Silver 43% Bill 35% >3h
B Bill 62% Bronze 23% 3h20m
C Bronze 51% Bill 40% 3h40m
D Bronze 75% Vic 14% 4h
E Vic 41% Bronze 40% Green
F Bronze 55% Vic 35% 4h20m
G Vic 56% Bronze 26% 4h40m
H Vic 53% DNF 39% 5h
So your 4:15 puts you in Pen F just behind the Green Number gang. So you would be behind the most experienced runners in the race which is both a plus and a minus I guess. But well over half the people in F still get a Bronze medal. Breaking your back to get into D (sub 4) means you would be running with slightly more people destined for Bronze but not sure if it would make that much difference.
keith
Thats very interesting and thanks so much for that Keith. I think I might hold off this weekend and work hard for the October marathon. The odds do seem quite a bit more . I am considering changing to Amsterdam even though it is the week before , although Im scheduled with warm up races for Venice. It might be easier to get sub 4 and I do like Amsterdam.
Havent got around to Hypnosis yet. It would kill me to get a good time until I get to the meccano bridge on the Venice route and then to take an hour to cross it , if I can even do that.
or if I could get Trinity to wear my chip and borrow her time , I would be sorted
The other thing worth thinking about is that the above stats probably give a better indication of result againt your "average" marathon time rather than a once in a lifetime personal best. For exmple I would imagine (but have no proof and its only a hunch) that a fair number of the Bronze and below B pen runners came from those who managed to scrape in one performance at say 3:18 or 3:19. Where as most of the Bill's came from people who "regularly" ran within the 3-3:20 window.
So pushing out a one off super time would I guess have less significance (apart from where u line up) on your finishing time than your normal or "comfortable" (if there is such a thing) marathon time.
I agree 100%, a better indication of your finishing time would be to ask yourself 'How easy did that marathon time come? Can I do it again next weekend and the weekend after that without a proper taper, or taking time out for recovery'
This is also true for all the other runners, killing yourself to get a sub 3 marathon won't result in a silver, just as running yourself into the ground to make the sub 5 qualifying time will leave you with little chance of finishing before cut off.
I think what we are both gettiing at is that you have to look at a 'comfortable' marathon time when trying to predict your Comrades time.
Keith - Nice stats where did you get them from out of interest. Just wondering what % silver are from B & C
Made them up
Or alternatively there is a section on the Comrades forum where they publish this stuff. The above was summarised from
http://forums.comrades.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=3745&PN=1
93 Silvers from B
19 from C
1 from D
1 from E
2 from F
There were 480 Silvers from A, and 116 from other pens. so roughly 20% came from non-A
Keith
My comfortable marathon time with no training ( as I have found out a few times this year
) is about 4.15 ish. MY PB of 4 .10 felt easy peasy and think I would have been able to do 4 if i had had any kind of pacing strategy. I think that by the time January comes around with regular training which I havent had for ages I should be well capable of regular 4 hour marathons but I think the advice is to not race them next year - just do them at training pace?
I had hoped to get into a pen so as not to lose too much time at the start . Sub 11 would be a bonus and will work and aim for that rather than aim for 12 and struggle to make it before the deadline. would rather have a cushion of an hour.
Sub 4 was a target this year until I got sidetracked with the ultras. Would still like to have a go at it although I havent had regular training since about juuly. I reckon I am good for the endurance and the distance ( 26.2). Not sure if I have left it too late for the pace to pick up though. How long does it take with 4-5 days running would you think?
Thats an interesting read Keith. I reckon a bronze is doable for me and that would sit quite nicely alongside my bronze from teo oceans
Fizzi - with regards safaris, i went on a 1 day one in April which was fab but not really enough time to see all the animals, you come back just wanting more. This time i have tagged on about 4 days after to see them all again. And do i take it you are still planning on going to Venice in October and beat that demon bridge?? I hope so as it would be fab to say hi at the finish.
Cheers Keith.
Fizziofinn - There is something wrong with your training if it doesn't improve your mara time by more than 15mins.
I ran Windermere this year off NO training and came in just over 4hrs with abit of running and then seven weeks proper training I'd expect to take 30mins off that time at Berlin.
Admittedly I'm not exactly a good example but you should expect a better return from training than that
Joe I think I am too afraid to push myself in races. So tend to run very conservatively. Going to try and do lots of tempor runs and fast intervals and see what happens. Any advice on the kind of speedowrk I should be doing at this stage with about 6? 7 ? weeks to go
Marty..venice marathon website has changed and the route is up. I wonder if that bridge thingy is on it this time. My friend is going to check it for me. If it isnt there , will definitley go but if it is , I think I will chicken out and pay to do amsterdam. Or perhaps I could start early comrades back to back and do both >LOL
Just hope they accept my details!
Good evening,
SD - Finally got the hotel sorted, a relief and I'm beginning to understand the meaning of 'welcome to Africa'
Well I went to bed with a stomach ache last night and woke up with the trots! Just what you need 4 day before a race. It's been Gatorade and water only for me today-I'm staving. I'm supposed to do a tempo run in the morning but I'm not sure that's on. Providing the fast kills the bugs I reckon I've still got enough time to carb up.
Odeon. Good luck for Sunday, I hope it goes well.
This will be my last post until I get back from the Somme, hopefully it will go better than the last time a member of the family was in the vicinity and all being well I should go one better and get a t-shirt as well as a medal.
Nite.
Fizz - I wouldn't try to do lots of speedwork , I aim for one maybe two but at the right paces. Build it in gradually as if you aren't used to them they are hard on the body.
This website lists various types of Workout & if you combine it with the Pace calculator it gives you pace ranges to aim for each type of workout.
Use a recently achieved time not your target time or a past PB when working out your paces.
I would start with short steady state or tempo runs and gradually build them in distance.
Just my thoughts.
I don't do speedwork... get my speed from hill reps
Just thought I'd throw that one in
Carmen- glad to hear you're sorted for somewhere to stay.
JB - take it easy. I find that running hard when not well can take a lot out of you - and require a longer recovery afterwards...
Just my penny's worth on seeding pens for the up run - don't get too obsessed with trying to start near the front as possible. It's not like the down run where it is really important because of the narrow streets. As an example Bruce Fordyce always made sure that he was right at the front on down runs but he was a bit more relaxed about his starting position on up runs...