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A bit like sub-4 (but 15 minutes quicker)
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I am a newcomer to this thread but after having thought about it for a while sub 3.45 is proabably where I should be aiming for.
This will be my second marathon having run Stockholm in 2004. All was going well until 32kms and then my race fell apart and i finished in a time of 4.42 - I know my training in the last month before stockholm wasnt up to standard but all the same the way I fell apart at the end of that race mean I am relectant to aim too high this time around.
Due to limited access to races I havent many time to base my target on my pbs being 41.16 for 10km set in 2004 and 1h45 for a half set in 2003
Hopefully with more long runs this time around and a mild swedish winter a sub 3.45 should be possible.
Tallguy, not sure how near you are to Hastings but the half there in March (I think)is a good test (plenty of hills)and gets a lot of support from the locals, I did it for 2004 and was useful for the build up
My races upto FLM2005s it stands
St Albans 10
Watford Half
Grizzly (ha,ha,ha,ha,no,no,n00000)
Reading Half
And maybe a few others,
Have a great 2005 everyone
My racing plan upto FLM 2005 (if all goes well).
30/01 - Ferriby 10 (nr. Hull)
20/02 - Snake lane 10 (Pocklington, nr.York)
13/03 - Liverpool FLM Half Marathon
--OR--
20/03 - Adidas Breakfast Run 16M (Kingston)
03/04 - Lincoln 10K
The Lincoln run doesn't really fit in with the rest of my schedule but couldn't resist a 10K PB attempt based on marathon training. It will also be a nice week off from a long run following planned longest run the week before.
I've been away for New Year as I was doing a Triathlon in Edinburgh. The race went fairly dreadfully as I've been ill with Flu symptoms but at least I finished.
I haven't done a lot of running the past week due to the Flu. My knee injury is also still hanging around whicj is leading me to have doubts about whether to do FLM or not as I could postpone for a year. I really want to do 2005 but I don't want to make my knee chronic. I'll see how things go when the longer runs start again in a week or two.
Colin D - There was a training schedule I found at one time that had you train up to 26 miles in build up to the marathon for the exact reason you mention. So that on race day you know what it is like to get to 26 miles and you know that you can already do it. I could never follow it myself, but you can see it at:
http://www.coolrunning.com/engine/2/2_0/128.shtml
For my race build up I'll be doing a couple of Half Marathons:
Lossiemouth to Kinloss (Feb)
Inverness Half (March).
There are no races over this distance in NE Scotland so it'll just be training runs beyond that distance. I'll also do two more short triathlons between now and April.
Best of luck back at work folks. I'm Scottish so tomorrow is a bank holiday as well.
Cheers
PPB.
Thanks for the link. Interesting article, and one which I'm tempted to follow. It's common wisdom that running marathon distance in training is detrimental, but if that is the case how do you prepare for ultra events, or multi-day races such as the Marathon of Great Britain which covers 155 miles in 6 days. You can't prepare for that on 40-50 miles a week and a longest run of 3:15...or can you? My wife is horrified that I've even looked at the link to the Marathon GB, but after seeing the Marathon de Sables on the telly, this looks like an interesting challenge! How do you train for that and where do you start? Could FLM just be a medium length training run with company? Or am I really going mad?
I would like to join your thread if that is okay. I am afraid that I cannot match anyone else's impressive training stats so far as I am yet to start my programme! I had to pull out of the last 2 FLMs due to injury in my training programmes so I am taking it very steady and am determined to make it to the start line! I have had slight achilles tendonitis and the flu so am holding back for now, but plan to start in the next few days.
I have done the New York Marathon in 3:50 and my PB for the Half Marathon is 1:35 so I think I should be able to crack sub 3:45 as long as I can stay fit. Anyone else out there with the same issues?!
On the basis of the above, I would avoid doing 26 miles prior to the big day but then I am prone to injuries...
See you at Reading, Save Ferris
FLM will be my first marathon too and so far I'm still very excited. My 10k pb is 44m and my half marathon 1.36 so I'm aiming for between 3.45 and 3.30.
I started low-level training in November and everything's been going really well so far - but what I'm noticing as my weekly mileage goes up is how tired I am.
I don't know if it's because I'm not eating right or simply a lack of sleep. I start work at 7am and usually don't get home until 6.30pm. I run about 7 or 7.30pm for at least an hour and come back buzzing. Then I need to eat and before I know it it's 11pm and I'm still jumping, even though my alarm goes off at 5.30am. It was okay when I was only running three times a week but add in the long runs and an extra weeknight session and I'm exhausted. Please, any ideas?
Hmmm, new RW issues marathon plans are based around time and heart rate effort. Anybody else prefer running to distance? I find the working heart rate a bit too much like hard-work, puts me off form and makes whole thing a bit of a chore.
After getting in 4 runs after christmas, even including a bit of a speed sesh, did nothing from new years eve to monday, but managed to get out for another run through bluebell woods today. great fun as it's got a lot muddier so my mate who didn't have his off roaders on gave me plenty of amusement slipping all over the place. Will try and get more runs in now, aimin for 6 a week including he dreaded speed sessions so hopefully will start to get faster and lighter.
Detox that sounds like a fair spread of runs, from Lincoln to Liverpool, where are you based ?
Shepherdess welcome to the thread, your times sound easily good enough for sub 3.45. I think your problem is that you're still too high from the training rush. The only evening i train is sometimes on a tuesday with a running club and i sometimes find it a bit harder to get off to sleep then. I don't suppose there's any chance of going out at lunchtime for some of the sessions ? i do nearly all my running apart from my long run at work in my lunch break although i realize that's not possible for everyone. Does mean i sleep like a baby at night though.
Welcome Booner, I hope you stay injury free as your times look pretty good as well, keep on sretching and keep off the roads as much as poss.
Anyway hope you have a good start to the year.
cheers
pete
Has anyone ever had anything to do with Trainsmart? (http://www.trainsmart.com/) I noticed they are doing VO2 max testing at the Swim/Bike/Run Expo at Sandown in February. I almost booked up until I found out they are only offering bike based testing and not treadmill. I appreciate your VO2 max is your VO2 max no matter what you are training on, but I know from experience that my training 'zones' vary greatly between cycling and running. I can happily work out at any HR be it 50%/60%/70%/90% on a bike, but when running it's nigh on impossible to keep my heart rate < 80% without walking. That being said I can run/jog at 80% quite comfortably for 2 hours +. (I know my HRMax is 193 and my resting HR is 46). So, my question is, do you think a bike based test is of any use for a marathon training schedule?
I have had my VO2 calculated in a fitness test several times. This used the run bleep test, a sit up bleep test, a lung capacity reading as well as body fat percentage. I'm lucky that it's quite cheap to get done where I work (just £8) so I tend to do it once a year. I don't feel there is any real advantage to training in knowing my VO2 max. I used to do it as a challenge to see if my fitness levels were improving.
Welcome Shepherdess & Booner, some seriously fast half marathon times you both have. I try not to exercise too late at night as otherwise I'm really buzzing. I normally only sleep about 5-6 hours anyway.
PPB.
Thought i'd join this thread as this is the time i'm aiming for. This will be my first marathon and I started training in November before I knew I had a place. Unfortunately for the Christmas period i've been injured with what appears to be achilles tendonitis. So, am now already behind with the training plan and very nervous about running again, anyone got any advice, or should I just stop panicking?
Sorry to hear you have had achilles tendonitis. So have I...
I did my first run of my FLM training programme this morning and can slightly feel a twinge my achilles on my right foot this evening. I am stretching, icing and going to put some insoles in my trainers. For the first few weeks I am building up my mileage very slowly and may try running on a treadmill and some swimming if I can. I have missed the FLM for the last 2 years through injury so I am going to be very cautious, too!
Any other tips from you guys out there would be very welcome!
Has anyone seen where you register for the RW Pacing Runs yet? I've seen several references to the one in Richmond Park on Feb 27th, but no sign of where you can sign up for it?
This year I am lighter and have more time to train (so it looks like).
Good luck everyone
Booner - Sounds like caution is a good option. Unfortunately can't offer better advice than that as have tried all sorts myself to not aggravate injuries while building up miles. Have done swimming, exercise bike, ski-mahcine, leg strengthening exercise and treadmill. End result is that after a few months I've lost fitness rather than gained. Finally decided that I've read too much advice in mags and forums and that I'm going to seek the help of a sports injury specialist.
Peter Bedwell 2 - Live just outside hull but I'm not in a club so probably miss out on local events. Find a bit of travel makes me take events more seriously and is also a good excuse to meet a few out of town mates. See your planning 6 runs a week, hats off sounds like a good target for getting used to being on your feet 9especially if your considering marathon of Britan). I rarely do more than 4-5 runs per week but often considered 6 a week over shorter distances.
KarenR - Panicking a bit myself from time to time as still feeling recent injury even on short distances. Going to see a specialist to see what he says. Still 14+ weeks, thats more than is needed for a decent preperation. If worse comes to worse you can always drop expectations a little or even defer.
On a run last night trying to concentrate on form and watch what I was doing wrong to cause injuries. Very scary, my whole body leans left meaning my left leg does the majority of the work. My right foot seems to hit the floor at almost a 45-degree angle from inside to outside causing leg to bend into an unnatural bow and massive overpronation (I think). Hopefully specialist will suggest some miracle cure for me like orthotics or point out exactly what leg strengthening exercise I need to do.
I have taken the plunge & opted for a sub 3.45 training schedule. Don't know if I am being a bit ambitious as last year had a lot of probs with torn medial ligaments in knees.
I am a Marathon newbie but I have been running for about three years on & off, my best time being 1h19m in a ten mile race which I did last year.
Started properly running again last Nov & was doing ok until I copped for that really nasty chest infection thingy that was floating about & had to stop training until last week.
Anyway, I have decided to follow the training plan off this website & so far so good. Done my first three runs & if anything, I have done them a bit too quick, Do I need to slow down or should I carry on as I am?
Looking forward to getting some tips & advice & offering my worthless opinion if so required :-)
Regards
Nick
Nick, no matter how much you read about the trap of running sessions to fast, it's so easy to fall in to, especially on a day like today. Today was my first "brisk" session since the Christmas bug set in; half mile jog, 3 miles brisk (7:44, 7:41, 7:22) then half mile jog. I'm sure this was more than I should be doing for a 'steady' session, which was what the schedule called for. I find using an HRM useful for making me keep the pace down, especially if you have one you can configure with alarms/alerts. For my long runs, I set the max HR as 165. If it beeps I force myself to slow down or walk, until I'm back to about 163. Takes some self discipline, but worth it. Also makes you very aware of your running 'economy'.
I'm keeping a very close eye on any niggles or twinges. I think I'm going to swap most of the 'easy' Saturday sessions for a bike session, at least for the first month (Which will hopefully keep in reasonable stead for the sprint Triathlon I'm looking to do 2 weeks after FLM). That will give me two rest days before the long run on Sunday and two days off running after the brisk/steady sessions.
Feels good to have a plan!
Detox-Euphoria - I live around your area, have you any recommendations on sports injury specialists.
Have been looking at the training plans and I think I'm a bit ahead of myself - my long runs are longer than they should be at this stage and my weeknight runs are turning out to be quicker than they should technically be. Do I need to ease off a bit? I really don't want to overdo it now by being excessively keen and then pay the price later on down the line...
I think you're right about the faster sessions, I went out with the club on Tuesday night for a seven-miler and pushed it a bit too hard - my ankles were suffering yesterday. Might lay off a bit for the next couple of days before the Glozzer 10 on Sunday. Anyone else going to be there?
great to see so many newcomers on the thread, welcome one and all !!
Went for a couple of laps of ilkley park today, only about 5 miles in 42 mins so not too fast as will probably be doing a nice hill/off road sesh with a mate tomorrow. Will hopefully be doing a long run saturday, at the moment i'm also ahead of schedule a bit, feeling comfortable at 15 + miles. At the end of the day, the training schedules are only a guide, one thing us old timers have noticed on the thread is that everyone reacts differently, overtraining for one is undertraining for another. I think the thing is to just listen to your body, if you're doing too much it will let you know.
It's great to hear all the first timers, the first time i stood on the start line i was thinking 'help, what the hell am i doing' but you will all get round dont worry. Then you'll probably be hooked but whatever happens you'll have one of the most memorable days of your life !!
Anyway good running all
cheers
pete
I still find it hard to imagine maintaining 8:30 for 26 miles, but hopefully I'll have more faith in myself in a couple of months!
Where's the glozzer 10? I'm looking to do the Dartford 10 a week on Sunday - anyone else going along?
Just been to have ITBS looked at and have learned that I need to persist with stretching it but also stretch hamstrings constantly as I'm currently tight as a yorkshireman (I say in jest being from the east of gods own county myself). Have some exercises I can do in office without fear of embaressment - and advised to do every two hours so as to achieve some more flexibility over the next month. So by marathon time I'll be two feet taller, maybe I could be Tallguy 2 on this thread. But seriously I'm kinda glad I don't have to go down the route of orthotics and trainers that make me look like frankenstein just yet.
Mentioning trainers just reminded me of a question i wanted to ask. What do all you guys/gals train in? Do you have specific shoes for different runs? And what do you plan to run the marathon in? I always used to do my speed training in performance type trainers (Asics DS-Trainer currently) as I'm fairly light - but I haven't done any speed training for quite a while. I use Adidas Supernova Control for any longer runs as they have more cushioning and arch support, think they'll be my marathon shoes as legs are usually in tatters by 13 miles in performance trainers. Probably not really fast enough for performance trainers but they do feel good in short 5 and 10k races.
Karen R - Only been to the one specialist. The practise is just called 'Physiopherapy and sports Injury Specialists', its in Swanland (West Hull), tel. 01482 633887. Have been twice and met both physicians. Both are encouraging and not of the "if you run you should expect injuries" opinion. Sound, practical advice, I probably wouldn't have had to go for the second time today if I had followed advice more closely the first time and not tried to follow every non-specific suggestion I could find on the internet.
Anyway must stop typing now and get out running while its still not too cold. oops, too late
I've a pair of Asics GT2090's that got me through my first half marathon early last year. They were bought without any real advice from a general sports shop. Turns out they were a pretty good bet - it seems I pronate only very slightly, but because of my height/weight (6'3" / 13 stone) I should apparently look for some support/stability as what pronation I have is magnified. Personally I feel I need cushioning above all else.
Around September last year I picked up a pair of Asics Eagle Trails - for wet/muddy offroad use - and I've just picked up a pair of Saucony Grid Omni 4's which I'm breaking in for the FLM (If they're not worn out by then!).
The Eagle Trails feel 'clonky', but of all three pairs, they are the ones that seem to leave me with the least amount of twinges and niggles following a long run. Haven't quite worked that one out yet.
I have suspicions that the GT2090's are on their last legs - started getting some niggling knee/hip/back pains back end of last year which went after I bought the Saucony's.
Bought the Supernovas as they have a tiny bit more arch support and felt snug from the off. Comparing the two the Supernovas are significantly thinner around the mid foot area which seems to suit me but I know many others might find them too tight. Done about 110 miles in these since start of November. For a while was alternating with GT-2090s but now the GT-2090s haven't left my cupboard in a month.
I also found that first trainers I bought with no prior advice were great. Nike Air Spiridons, performance trainers, from JJB. Back then I had no idea about pronation, cushioning, eva and al that malarkey. Bought them as they seemed light, airy and it was a make I'd heard of. Runners world reviews slate them but I thought they were great upto about 13 miles at which point the lack of cushioning punsihed tired legs. Retired these reluctantly at over 700 miles. I'm only 5'7"/10 stone so performance trainers probably not so bad for me.