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LIVERBIRD wrote (see)
......but must have gone to the toilet when he got round to creating Runcorn and Widnes...*runs off*
......but must have gone to the toilet when he got round to creating Runcorn and Widnes...
do you think God makes a distinction or even has a conceptual distinction between "beauty .v. ugly" or is that just a human invention? according to the saying "beauty is in the eye of the beholder" there are probably people out there who believe that the most beautiful place to be is "Runcorn & Widnes" (I personally can't argue for either having never seen the place)
Is religion a human invention and if so to what purpose? does it do what it sets out to do? When it comes to religion there appears to be a lot of discord amongst human kind as to which is the true/better religion.
On the otherhand I feel that most People have equal appreciation or are in total agreement when it comes to appreciating the majesty and wonder of nature in all its awe inspiring glory.
I see that there has been some activity on here since I last looked in.
Yesterday was Church, LSR, Rest, then cooking, eating and watching the athletics.
I did not go out to the evening service, so Mrs BD went on her own.
depends on the week......we tend to go only every other week to church as we had a family meeting to see if the kids still wanted to go or not.......after discussion it was agreed that we would go twice a month and these tend to fit around races.
the kids enjoy the 'sunday school' as they get to discuss many topics and religions and are allowed and encouraged to discuss if god exists..........whilst having tea and biscuits.......they enjoy it more now that they have this informal session as they are all comp age.......
I do agree with those who find that a LSR in the country can be quite spiritual in its own right.
Either an Early LSR then Church
or Church then Afternoon LSR
or Race and an Evening service if possible....
Good point Mutts.
Our church is forever pointing out that being a Christian is not something you do on a Sunday morning and I personally HATE the idea of tipping up on a given day to get my "stamp" and then I can go out afterwards and get on with my life for the rest of the week!
I have no issue racing on a Sunday morning. I don't do it every week and if anyone from church wants to come and cheer me on, I'd consider that fellowship!
Well God has given me the gift of running, so if a race is on a Sunday perhaps thats where I'm supposed to be.
I hated it, BD - it was extremely boring, I didn't believe in it, and couldn't wait to escape. There would be a row at home every Sunday morning about whether I had to go or not.
Sunday School was bad enough, but when I graduated to "Youth Group" it was even worse. In the end I just stopped going - I'd leave the house at the right time, and return at the right time, killing time in between.
My mum caught on in the end, and finally gave in - I was probably about fifteen by then.
I am now agnostic with a leaning towards non-belief. I find what you say interesting:
I have moved from agnostic, through searcher, to a still rather poor level of belief, but I am working on it.Most of which has come about through a nurture group, rather than through attending church.
Surely you either believe, or you don't? How can you "work on" believing in God?
I think that everyone has to work at it. The greatest of the saints do not necessarily find it easy to maintain belief.
I do not have too much trouble believing in God.A creator god is just as good an explanation for all this as anything else, and better than most.
I have more trouble with belief in a caring god who wants a personal relationship with me, and that not because there is anything special about me, but because to God we are all special and loved, (even the forum Trolls).
I have the most trouble in believing in Jesus as the living embodiment of God on earth.
When the congregation was asked the question that Jesus asked his disciples "Who do you say I am" I did not have an answer springing to my lips.
There is a prayer that says it best - Lord, I believe; help Thou my unbelief
I used to say that I was only a believer when I sang, but that is changing. Faith is something you have to work at, and not just on your own, but in the company of other believers aka The Church.
I take the view that either there is a god, or there isn't. I just don't know, and actually don't care.
Whether I believe in god, or creationism, or that we're the decendents of an alien race from another planet makes no difference.
It is what it is.
i don't think it's as simple as you either belive or you don't, you say yourself Wilkie that you are "leaning" towards non- belief, this would suggest you have not 100% made your mind up about your own views.
In this modern age where we question everything that is put in front of us, it is hard for some people to decide where their faith is, if they have any at all and can take learning and teaching to find something you truely belive in and find faith and happiness in, if thats in creationism, buddhism, islam or christianity then its all good, whatever gets you through the day i say, but i'm not neccessarily of the mind that you need to attend a church to have that nurtured although clearly, for some it helps, at the moment for me i'm not sure.
What I mean is that I do not believe that god exists, but that I acknowledge that I may be wrong about that.
I wouldn't say "there is no god", rather I would say "I don't believe there is a god". I'm keeping an open mind (and hedging my bets )
My own views are quite clear to me, but I know that my views are not infallible.
I've the same view as you wilkie.
It does seem unsual these days for somebody to say "I don't know" rather than being dogmatic.
I am just back from a bible study session.
We started with an excerpt from a Monty Python film about the search for the holy grail.
I think "I don't know" is a really healthy attitude to adopt. An opening enquiring mind. Exactly what I was discouraged from having when I was involved in the Christian faith.
I was also briefly involved in Subhud which is not a religion but a spiritual practice. Again, what led me to finish my involvement was too much dogma and the belief in a higher power.
I do not believe in a higher power. But I am stil open to sprituality and things beyond my ability to explain them.
Hi to the Select Crowd.
I went to church this morning.
We had a guest speaker, he mentioned about a man he met in Scotland, who had been to church (Kirk) for most of his life, but only became a Christian on joining an Alpha course, and learning why Jesus came among us.
I then went on a fairly short (11m) LSR (I did nearly 15m Yesterday)Started food prep for this evening.Watched the men's 5000, and the women's 1500 on the BBC.went to bed for an hour.Back to church for another guest speaker.Home to finish the cooking and eat the food. Roast beef, assorted veg - pots,mushrooms, peppers, carrot, & parsnip, with a plum based sauce. Plum and oat bake with evap' to finish. washed down with shiraz.
I've found reading this entire thread really interesting and quite thoguht provoking. I live with Mr S and little in S in a small village. We don't have a service every week at the village Church, just once or twice a month. Little S thinks our vicar Charlie is fantastic and is not averse to asking typical four year old questions mid sermon. I'm glad to say his enquiring mind is encouraged by our small congregation. So, for me if there is a service at Church that's where we go, then lunch then an afternoon/evening LSR. If no service, extra snooze in bed and a LSR at some point during the day.
I completely agree with all the comments about being put off church as a kid. I recall trotting along to Church with my mum because that's just what you did and having to sit very quietly through very long tedious services. Everyone makes up their own mind in the end.
a really interesting thread!
I'd class myself as someone who does believe, but hasn't done a lot about it in recent years in terms of going to church regularly. Once in a while is more like it.
Personally, I go rowing on Sunday mornings, so LSR is either after work on Friday (always a joy) or Saturday. (Did try it after rowing once or twice - disaster - legs didn't work at all)
But I find it interesting that so many events - whether running, rowing, whatever - are held on Sunday mornings with the clear expectation that no-one will find this clashes with church. How expectations have changed over the last decades.
I quite agree with others that to my mind regular, clockwork, church attendance is not the be-all and end-all of a person's religious life. But I was on a course recently where I met a woman who said that she didn't like the fact that so many races were Sunday am. because church, for her, was really important and she was forever having to chose between two things which meant a lot to her - her running and her faith. She said she didn't do half as many events as she otherwise would have done.
Are there not also evening services, though?
Several other posters on here have referred to them. Perhaps it depends on your church.
I have been surprised by the number of church-goers on the forum. Other than my mother, I don't know anyone else who goes to church.
I guess a thread with a title like this would attract them even though they might not be that numerous, WIlkie.
If I don't believe in something, then I just leave it at that as long as it's a reasonable conclusion to draw based on the evidence, I don't really see it as something I need to work on.