Moraghan Training - Stevie G

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  • Congrats Johnas! my daughter has just slept through for the first time in 3 months! Haha. It's not hindered my running at all as it just takes a bit of planning nowadays. The Missus knows how grumpy I am if I don't get out.

    Went to see the physio last night who thinks I should be ok. He seems to think it was just tight and after spending half an hour gouging my lower calf he said although it will be sore to touch, it should be ok to try a light ten minute jog on grass tonight. He's right about it being sore! 

  • The Bus wrote (see)

    Nothing in the diary for me except Abo, but may well do the Ridgeway the week before and the Wooburn 10k on 8th Sept. I'm also in France until the 1st Sept. Whereabouts are you going? What's the track 10,000?

    The Ridgeway is a tough off-road 10 mile race the weekend before a marathon! Just to remind you, here is the photo a photo of you looking knackered at the end last year and behind Owen.

    http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8473/8100779993_2173667db9_o.jpg

     

    I am in Alsace so will be popping in and out of France, Luxembourg, Belgium and Germany.

    10,000m is Vets champs 10,000: http://www.vetsac.org.uk/Enter2013.pdf
    10,000m Champs, 4 Sept, Kingsmeadow Track 6:30

    Odd thing is that they have a track 10,000 for vets and last year they ran 3 races with a total of 8, 11 and 8 finishers. I appreciate that you don't want a crowded track and don't want issues with lapped runners but they had 35 runners in Moscow on Saturday and it worked out.


    http://www.thepowerof10.info/results/results.aspx?meetingid=65074&event=10000&venue=Kingston&date=5-Sep-12

  • Will take a look at that 10,000...

    As for ridgeway, I was knackered, but had just scraped a course PB, despite being beaten by Owen! Yes, perhaps not the best idea the week before Abo, but on the other hand, it would be a more fun substitute than running a 10 mile tempo and should be OK if it sits within a proper taper. Interestingly (sort of!) my PB at ridgeway until last year was set in 2006 - 1 week before I did Abo as my first Marathon....

    Probably won't bump into you in France then (!) - we're in the Jura.

     

  • Now then, now then, what's been going on here.

    Johnas, first of all congrats on the good news. I hope you stay running well and committed throughout the bairn growing up, and don't be one of these chaps who disappears for 15years or so!

    Bus, hope things are settling at home, and the niggles and running are taking your mind off it!

    Scott, welcome, but calm the pace of those runs down. There is no beneficiality at all of doing all your runs in the 5:xxs. Take it from me, you WILL break.

     

    Ric, old son, I've missed you, and I think you've missed me, as I have a suspicion that you've had to amuse yourself a bit in my absence with some crazy posts.

    One min you were saying you were quitting in autumn, next min you're doing 20milers? You've got a marathon planned haven't you?

    You certainly aren't quitting anytime soon. No one who was going to quit would be fretting weighing themselves after running and taking their son with them to act as some kind of food caddy!

    As for me, I'm just trying to strengthen out the pelvis and hip weaknesses. Not doing any quality at the mo, but did 49miles last week, so can't really pretend I'm injured!

    Week before was only 26miles, but that was due to a most weird straining of an intercostal muscle and barely being able to breathe comfortably for 3-4 days! Ironically, on returning, the hip/pelvis was actually tighter, showing me it's a niggle you have to keep warm and mobilised.

    In the non racing period I've been taking some delight from my little stable of coachees. All 3 of them will be in potential pb shape for their September target races.

    Our own Litty took a fair chunk off her pb at a hot and hilly 10k course, and Skinny FF managed to do the same despite a preceding 5-6 week spell getting over an injury! Exciting times ahead.

    In Litty especially I recognise an incredible competitive side, having in her 10k race, smashed a big pb, won the women's race, and also won the county championship, and STILL not being satisfied.  That's the kind of spirit that will ensure future success, but I hope she can enjoy the ride along the way.

    This is getting all school mastery, so I'll hopefully be back to racing myself soon, so I can stop writing like my time was 20years ago and drop the wistful reflective tone!

     

  • SG, welcome back.

    Not quitting running. Just the racing. (winter racing tbh)

    There's a race (5mls) next weekend in Battersea Park. It's the final part of the Summer League which I've already won.

    Toying with the idea of replicating the start of the real event; the 19.67 mile leg of the Round Norfolk Relay. By replication I mean eating a tuna bagel and downing a litre (at least) of some isotonic mix less than five minutes before the start.

    If I go sub 30 minutes without blowing a gasket, watch this space.

    Two years ago when I ran 6:28 pace for the RNR,  my average mileage was only 26 per week.

    Doing 80 plus now.

  • I need to get #4 good enough on a bike to tail me for the 20 milers this winter. Worst bit is that the paths I like the best are really not suitable for a 20 mile bike ride: towpath has a lot of stiles and gates and gets very muddy. Windsor Great Park is nice for a 20 mile on good patsh but it is a long haul there and back, Phoenix Trail is nice but really there is only 5 miles so it is an out and back and repat which is a mental killer.

    Any ideas nearer to home (local guys)?

  • Phil, the answer is the same to last time you posted that image

    would one of your kids really want to be cycling with you for 2 1/2hours or so!? That'd be dedication.

    Careful of overtraining there Ric.... a chap a few pages ago was pointing out the perils of overtraining....

  • image

    Welcome back SG! Must admit I hadn't appreciated the scale of the PB with the County Champ and race all in one Lit, so, er  - well done!

    How did that post come back again then Philip?  I've done some short runs with the kids on bikes, but I'm sure if I could find the right route they'd be up for a bit further.

     

  • Stevie G . wrote (see)

    Phil, the answer is the same to last time you posted that image

    reloaded and it asked me, said yes ...

  • So current plan is for a 3,000 on the track next Wednesday. Race tomorrow lunchtime menas one track session on Friday so two questions:

    1) target time?
    2) what track session?

    I was thinking of trying to get clsoe to 10 (my current po10 PB is 10:18) and maybe do some 400m reps, maybe 8*400 in 80 seconds with 60 seconds recovery. does that sound right, I am Ok with the pace but recovery is still a bit of a mystery to me.

  • I remember doing a  5x 800s at 3k pace off 2.30recoveries. Looked hard, but got me used to a prolonged exposure to the pace needed,

    It was sessions like that which made my 9.46 feel comfy first time round.

    Unfortunately 2nd time round I'd not done any of the fast stuff for a bit, and a 9.44 felt much harder work!

  • Nice one Lit.

    Stevie G . wrote (see)

    Phil, the answer is the same to last time you posted that image

    would one of your kids really want to be cycling with you for 2 1/2hours or so!? That'd be dedication.

    I know lots of people whose kids happily cycle alongside whilst running. Mine don't seem to be interested, Or they're fine for the first mile then the whining starts.

  • How old are they Iron?

    Philip - target time: impossible to say! Only you can know how you are feeling at the moment compared to PB. As for the session, I'd say 8 x 400 sounds about right (only guessing as I've never done a 3000m though image) but to keep form and effort level consistent, I would say a longer recovery would be better, especially so close to the target race. 60 secs is good if you are trying to train your body to cope with lactic acid over the longer term, but if its pure leg speed you are focussing on, then I would reckon a minimum of 90 secs, but  probably 2 mins. 

  • Iron, cycle alongside for a bit yes, for 20miles? Maybe not so much.

    In my early days running, a pal Bood used to cycle along while I ran 10 miles or so. They were good days, where you're just starting out and not sure what you're capable of.

    I remember thinking that doing a half marathon would be a breeze, as our 10mile gentle runs had been. Come the first half marathon that feeling disappeared about 1/4mile in!

  • My lad was seven years old and came along for up to 20 miles. As I said before, I used to push him up the hills or when he got tired. One difference was he wanted to come along without me having to ask. And still does 10 years later.

  • Stevie G . wrote (see)

    I remember doing a  5x 800s at 3k pace off 2.30recoveries. Looked hard, but got me used to a prolonged exposure to the pace needed,

    So to things there, pace and prolonged. All the calcs say that soemthing round the 10:15 mark is achievable which is 82 seconds a lap. The last minibus I did (6x800) was in 2:50 so 85 seconds pace. To do 5x800 in 2:44 looks hard so will probably go for 400 reps in 82 to see how they feel. Then the remaining issue is obviosuly how to get used to 7.5 back to back: guess the sight of some 11 year old girl chasing me down may help.

    Normal rant about runbritain. So I submitted my Chicagp 10k to po10 and bugger me, they accepted it! So now a 10k I ran in the USA couints for po10 and runbritain and has bumped my handicap from 4.0 to 3.6. Oddly also, I was the 2nd brit in the race behind a 31:59 whippet (who did 49:25 for a 10 miler in 2011) and his handicap is 5.8, slob!

  • Remember with the 800s, I got 2.30recovery, so you may be able to hit the 2.44 if you use the same recovery (2.44)

    Also Phil, depends on how you transfer down the distances. I should probably be doing 9.30 rather than 9.44 for instance, so you'll do well to hit 10.15 if you're working that out via McMillan or somewhere. Especially off 1 3k session?!

  • Phil, I did (8 x 400 @3K) x 2. 90 seconds between reps, lap jog between sets. I was in 10:05 shape and was running 79s laps. That way you get prolonged exposure to pace but in manageable chunks of 400. If that looks a bit too much try the first set at 5K pace. Which is what I was supposed to do but just did it all 2s faster.

    I'm hitting a low key track 5K tonight. Total training race, been hitting consistent miles and did a leg session at the gym yesterday so not expecting anything amazing. But will take a sub 17:30. Looking at previous results the field seems pretty strung out so I may be running solo.

  • Stevie See... Good luck in the 5k. Looking forward to hearing all about it. I fanciIona track 5 this summer but haven't seen one that would fit the schedule.. Oh well, next year. Although less track up in Cumbria. 

  • Stevie G . wrote (see)

     

    Also Phil, depends on how you transfer down the distances. I should probably be doing 9.30 rather than 9.44 for instance, so you'll do well to hit 10.15 if you're working that out via McMillan or somewhere. Especially off 1 3k session?!

    Last year I was racing track and alternating 3000 and 5000 and did 18:05 and 10:18 so this year I am under 18 so should manage 10:15. The calculators are saying 10 dead.

  • ahh, as long as you are factoring OUT the  over optimistic calcs image

  • Massive congratulations to Johnas on the news.  Exciting times ahead.  You have no idea what you're about to put yourself through...

    Excellent time and good pot hunting win for Matt.  Almost time for a picnic at the finish line before 2nd came home.  Good 10 miler from Tim, and nice to see Iron back running and SG ticking along.

    I'm at approximately peak marathon mileage at the moment.  Weeks of 84, 82 last couple of weeks, with 80 expected this week.  22 miles on Sunday, and 15 on Monday.  Actually went down the track yesterday for the first time in months, although I did my own threshold session, as speedwork proper doesn't start until next week.  4 x 2800m @ threshold (essentially just under 10 minute reps), with paces as 5:33, 5:39, 5:33, 5:35. Felt reasonably comfortable.  Mileage should drop a bit next week to allow the reintroduction of speed work.

  • Thanks for advice Steve G.. I will slow them down.. Back fro ma few days away with work so only 1 small run in 4 days.. Today 5 into work and I'll slow it down.. Run tomorrow not sure and then probably hit Medina pakrun saturday on the Isle of wight as I'm on there the weekend with family 

  • Dachs - that's a damn good bit of endurance base you've built up there, and that rep session shows the speed is pretty good too (I'm not jealous image)

    Did a double on tuesday and the frst of a double this morning. All a bit slow, but nto as uncomfortable as the last few weeks. Idea is to try a 20M in France on Sunday (fingers corssed I can work out a decent route and not get lost!!). Probably going to have a day off tomorrow to leave the hamstrings ina reasonable state for the looooonnnngg drive down on Saturday - will see how the run home goes tonight.

    Anyone racing this weekend? (Scott's aprkrun noted of course...). Couldn't find anything near enough in france, but I did notice the nearest large town, about the size of marlow, has TWO running tracks!!

  • Didn't run the 5K in the end, my legs felt sore all day. Would have been a nightmare, the race is low key with a tiny field so running around on my own to a shocking time didn't appeal to me. Ran 7.5 instead, 9.25 today with the final 2 @MP and 1 @HM.

  • it seems any race I target I never make the start line.

    Chester marathon last year- no

    Trafford 10k- no

    capenhurst- big doubt.

    I went to the physio on Monday who advised a gentle jog on grass on Tuesday. Could still feel it slightly so he said up it to 3miles and try 4 today. All at really easy pace. Felt as though it was back to square one at one point today. I can't seem to get my forefoot  down properly without feeling it or any slight uphill (more slope than hill) seem to trigger it too. Anything quicker than a 7.30min mile and I'm buggered. 

    ive messaged him and asked him if it should be rested but he says that if its rested and I don't stay on it, then when I try and go for it eventually, the chances are that it'll go again. 

    I've pretty much wrote capenhurst off but Ben Nevis is in 4 weeks. Any thoughts on resting or gently jogging still? Been going the gym on the bike and x trainer can't feel a thing. 

  • 8x400m at the goose shit track at lunchtime: 83, 83, 82, 81, 80, 81, 83, 80. Was aiming for 82 a lap so a little scatter due to wind, rain and general goose shit and geese problems but happy with that. 38 for the week so far and 14 planned for the weekend will take me over 50 miles for the first time since the start of April. I hadn't planned to do such a big week but with August having two weeks holiday it looks like I will do 13 days without a break sandwiched in-between 10 days off before and after. 

    By the end of August I had hoped to be on 1333 miles to hit 2000 for the year and it looks like I will be about 80 shy of that so need close to 190 a month for the remainder of the year to hit the target.

     

  • Long time no posting. Looks like plenty of great training and racing has been going on.

    I've been upping the miles again after the Scottich Half foray with a view to peaking for Cardiff Half in early October. I spent the week up in Scotland on holiday and just gradually built the miles back up again after the race. Got a good few easy 10 milers in at about 7.00 min pace before coming home. I then did a long run last Sunday of 15 miles and will be trying to build this back up to 18 miles over the next month or so.

    This week has reverted back to normal with 3 x mile reps Tuesday at 5k pace (5.35) off road and hilly. Steady 10 milers Wednesday and Thursday at around 6.45 pace. Feeling a bit tired, so I’m canning tonights tempo in favour of a very easy jog  for about 8 miles. I’ll try to get 16 miles in on Sunday.

    With this in mind and reading my haphazard training for the target half in October, does anyone have any specific advice for half training. Ideally I’d like to get 1.19 so any advise would be much welcomed.

  • Well Chris,  training advice will come from two directions depending on how you view distance running.

    From those who believe its just a game of numbers like the extension of a spreadsheet you'll get a load of abstract zones and paces which might work were it not for variables beyond anyone's control.

    Or the alternative view where the process is actually about physiology and biology in which numbers play a part but are secondary compared to simply becoming stronger, faster and not injured on a regular basis.

    The numbers process is really about doing as you're told. The other way involves having to understand why you're doing it.

    Progress is really about remaining in the game.

    My numbers are about keeping the level of the hard and fast miles to less than 10% of total mileage. The rest is jogging, if you like.

     

  • Ric, you do a lot of chiding in your posts these days.

    Who uses "abstract" zones and paces? I'm trained by calculated zones from my current fitness, as are the people I help out. So am interested who uses these random zones?

     

    8x400 at 10k pace tonight after a particularly appalling day at work. As it was a first quality session back,it was set as a rather light "10k pace".

    Having remember it's hard to even keep to 5k pace for 400s, they came out 77 average, so pleased with that, as wasn't exactly trying to burn the track up.

    Hip/pelvis felt a bit rusty, but if 77s are flowing can't be too bad.

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