Fink for Outlaw 2012

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  • So sorry - I do bang on, don't I? Sorry if I sound bossy. (I am bossy image).
  • AJ, a few of us did the Swash before Outlaw this year (although Outlaw was a few weeks later than it is next year).  Marshman is a smaller race but well organised I believe.  Depending on the current on the day, the Swash swim is about as far removed from the Outlaw swim as it's possible to get short of a sea swim.  The bike course has a similar profile to Outlaw and the run's not a bad course either, although a bit long at 14 miles (bike course is short).
  • At the moment, my swim sessions each week are a one-to-one lesson with a coach, and then an hour by myself practising what I've been taught. It's slow progressimage.

    I have to say though, the coach I have been using is great, we do lots of technique work, and then the rest of the lesson is him telling me to "stop moaning, yes it is hard, get on with it!!" Which is just what I need image

  • Thanks Andy and Mother Hen image. My Oly swim time was 33min, so never going to set the world on fire; I am as you put it a fit, crap swimmer.

    I have some fins, and they do give the legs a workout. My calves know they've been used. And I'm fully aware it's about technique. The slower I swim the faster I get.

    I'll sort out some coaching.

    AJ - I'm signing up for the Marshman. A flat possibly windy course that is a good excuse to try and stay aero for the whole bike. The Swash swim cut-off is what put me of Swash. Marshman is the BH weekend too.

  • Technique work's bloody hard work, too, isn't it? Knackering.
  • Chilibean wrote (see)

    Good for you, Steady! image

    Bike skills seem such a good idea. Though it would help if I knew someone who cycled! 
    Any throughts are we going to do anouther mentor's thread girls and germs? Don't want to persume i speak for everybody if i start one.image
  • Cat I have never completed a fink swim session I usually do as much as I can of the session within the hour and generally only do 2 sessions a week until half way through the build I then start sticking in a long open water swim of around an hour , but this this year for IM Wales I binned the pool completely and tried to get in two shortish 40 min and one long open water of an hour for the last 15 weeks of training and hey presto a swim PB of 1:12 , by comparrison my IM first swim time was 1:40 when I stuck most closely to the fink swim proram so I must be doing something rightimage Oh I didnt loaf with the time I saved binning a swim session I stuck an extra bike session inimage IMHO everybody (including me) gets too hung up on the swim its just a nice warm up for the bikeimage
  • Cake wrote (see)
    Chilibean wrote (see)
    Good for you, Steady! imageBike skills seem such a good idea. Though it would help if I knew someone who cycled! 
    Any throughts are we going to do anouther mentor's thread girls and germs? Don't want to persume i speak for everybody if i start one.image

    Dont we already have one?
  • Re fink swims.... That's what put me off the fink program..
    In year 1 I just swam, once or twice a week, building my long swim from 30mins up to about 1hr15mins . My longest swim was 3.4 k, but I was lucky to hit 3 k most weeks
    I didn't enjoy swimming too much.... image

    Last year I got some swim coaching, ie got some technique and also swam the full distance 3 times - ended up knocking 15-20 mins off the swim time. I enjoyed swimming a lot more image

    This year I am a swim god!
    ( still slow but enjoying it!)

    So I think fink swim sessions are great if you are already an established regular swimmer, or really enjoy swimming. Otherwise I would use them as a guide, doing what you can, but make sure you build the distance in the spring
  • Very reassured by all this swim advice.  I'm a really slow swimmer (1900m 52 mins) so I've gone back to basics and just booked some 1:1 endless pool coaching in TI.  Plan is to concentrate just on technique for now and forget distance, so I might do 45 - 60 mins in the pool (as per Fink)  but distance will be tiny.  Hopefully come Spring I can reap the benefits and start to get some distance up.  I'm tempted to still do one endurance swim a week to keep some swimming fitness and confidence up but don't want to imprint more bad form.  My swim coach suggests 70 - 80% drills. Any thoughts welcome.  Ta.

    image

  • Oh and hennie is right about the HR zones
    I worked out my z1 run hr to be 129, with z2 being 139
    I am currently using a hr cap of 143 for my runs....

    That being said I've now been running 5-6 years, and my hr has consistently dropped. Ie it used to be 155 for an easy jog.

    So as a newbie you need to run at a hr that is sustainable in an IM, and need to train at a hr that encourages all the fat burning / physiological changes needed just to keep going.
    However a slow run pushes your hr up to anaerobic levels
    I think to generally run slowly, keeping Hr down even if that means more walking than running. Fitness gained over the year will change things to a degree, but endurance beats speed
    However faster runs/ higher hr has a faster/ bigger effect on fitness....

    My missus is going through this conundrum and I am not sure of the best way to go or advice to give.......
  • Thanks OC. Coaching is on the roadmap.

    Soupy - your swim time is fine!

    For the record my Z2 limit is 173 (based on the last sprint in a 10k). It could be higher...Hennie and I discussed our HRs a lot of pages back!

    Average for Beachy Head marathon was 156 (for what the avg HR is worth - probably bugger all).
  • Forgot to say, loving the comments on here about this being a journey.  Its perhaps an overused phrase (especially to Strictly adicts) but that is exactly what it feels like and that now I'm just saving up for my ticket. image
  • Soup Dragon wrote (see)

    Very reassured by all this swim advice.  I'm a really slow swimmer (1900m 52 mins) so I've gone back to basics and just booked some 1:1 endless pool coaching in TI.  Plan is to concentrate just on technique for now and forget distance, so I might do 45 - 60 mins in the pool (as per Fink)  but distance will be tiny.  Hopefully come Spring I can reap the benefits and start to get some distance up.  I'm tempted to still do one endurance swim a week to keep some swimming fitness and confidence up but don't want to imprint more bad form.  My swim coach suggests 70 - 80% drills. Any thoughts welcome.  Ta.

    image
    Soupy - sounds a really good approach image (although I agree with CAt - you're not THAT slow!   You'll be a swimming goddess by July!)
  • Back from Dublin with a very pleasing PB just under 4 hours. Pleasing as a PB by 20 mins but also as the rain started pouring down as I collected my kit bag!.

    A great marathon experience with a good crowd and on narrow roads at the end giving great encouragement. And of course post race Guinness must be good for rehydration and replacing essential nutrients.

    Back home and Fink has arrived so I can read the theory and start planning, whilst I enjoy some recovery time!

    I'm with most of the above on the swim trtaining and was going to replace some sessions with more bike, certainly during the base. I'm also at about 50 mins for 1900 and despite enjoying swimming and putting in effort to train/improve form I appear to have reached my peak! I also want to put in OW training as I suffer from the initial "claustrphobic" panic, aside from "keep doing it" any other advice for that?

    I've looked at Marshman and its a possibility, just being a few hundred miles away and bank holiday weekend (I think) it might be a journey too far.

  • floreat salopia wrote (see)

    I've looked at Marshman and its a possibility, just being a few hundred miles away and bank holiday weekend (I think) it might be a journey too far.


    I'm based in Manchester so have looked at Marshman but cba with the distance.

     I'm considering The Beaver, May 26th. I would be interested in anyone's opinion of race and timing's in relation to The Outlaw.

     Cheers 

  • M...eldy wrote (see)
    Cake wrote (see)
    Chilibean wrote (see)

    Good for you, Steady! image

    Bike skills seem such a good idea. Though it would help if I knew someone who cycled! 
    Any throughts are we going to do anouther mentor's thread girls and germs? Don't want to persume i speak for everybody if i start one.image

    Dont we already have one?
    image Where have I missed it there is one from last year?
  • Beaver an option but a little later than others. I think I am going to go for Swashbuckler as marshman a little too far from the midlands as I have to work bank holiday monday (I know!)

    Been building up the training over last few weeks and just concentrating on getting all three disciplines in reasonable shape before embarking on the FINk 'journey'!

  • Marshman is too far for me too. I'll check out the Beaver!! That sounds so wrong!!!!!

    I'm having a massive attack of cba this week. I've done nothing since Monday, I even had a couple of hours at home alone today and spent them sat on sofa drinking brews and watching tele!!!! I've promised myself I'll be good tomorrow....
  • Well done on Dublin Floreat, sounds like you stormed it!
  • I just did Dublin Marathon on Monday, so apart from being on the bevvy for the rest of this week, I am working overseas from Saturday for a week or so.  My Outlaw training will start when I get home.

    I'll need a sighter closer to home, but the lack of half distances around that time might leave me with limited options.

    Anyone have advice on tackling this in May as a training block? 

    http://www.gatewayironchallenge.com/

    Following Fink to the letter is looking to be hit and miss for me due to the other things I want  to be doing this winter.   I want to try XC on top of the schedule.  Is there scope to fit in that sort of training and weekend racing?

    Edited to say well done Floreat, I hadn't read that ealier.  My time was a tad disappointing at 4.10, but I offer no excuse, it is what it is.

  • Hi VT'd.

    I'll be racing XC over the winter months to mix things up a bit.I'm also going to be racing the Wokingham HM. The intermediate plan peaks at a long run of 1:30 (bar a single 2) in the first 20 weeks,so I'll still need to put in some serious (thinking 16 milers) to get into shape for the HM.

    Having just looked at the running, Fink seems to be very very light on the long runs. A single 3:00 before the big day?? image

    I guess the assumption is you can walk it if need be?

  • Well done in Dublin VT'd, 4.10 beats my time there last year.

    I agree that the running looks a bit light on Fink, but maybe that's cos I'm used to mara training. I was hoping to do Manchester mara in April, but I have no real plan on how to incorporate it into Fink. I was sort of thinking of running longer than the schedule suggests, and hoping for the best
  • ShuffleB is doing the beaver, (already entered I think) and I'll be there to support.....

    I htink its about 4 weeks ahead and thats an ideal gap image

    I think thier t-shirts say something like 'i licked the beaver'  but that might be an urban mythimage

  • bburn plodder wrote (see)
    I agree that the running looks a bit light on Fink, but maybe that's cos I'm used to mara training.

    Run training for an ironman bears absolutely no resemblance or relation to training for a standalone marathon. image

  • What she says ... 3 hours will be plenty IMO  
  • 1hr is too much in your opinion,
  • Fur Cough and go to work !
  • Ok you can go home now.
  • 30 mins and counting
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