Are you and "in" or an "out"?

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  • Just had a missive from our Chairman outlining the measures the company has taken to ameliorate the immediate effects of Brexit.

    It's a big company. It will survive but it's not the sort of thing you ever really want to read.

    Horrible feeling image

  • MuttleyMuttley ✭✭✭

    Personally, I think Labour is screwed in the traditionally staunch heartlands, the working class areas. They've voted to leave and will probably go UKIP, on account of the immigration issue. Mistaken or not, they've been complaining about it for years but not been listened to.

    We're in for a long stretch of Tory government, imho.

     

  • 15West15West ✭✭✭

    ...unless Labour can have a major change in it's approach...can't see it under Corbyn.

  • runner-manrunner-man ✭✭✭

    Had a statement from my employer stating its business as usual. Disappointed but remain committed to Britain and to Europe.

    I think there needs to be understanding into why 51.9% voted leave. I said before, many vote based on their own circumstances. Many vote what affects them. Not others or the country. If certain issues dominate their thinking, its very hard to change.

    Disappointed Cameron resigns. I think he called this too early thinking he'll get his way. One year after winning the election which wasn't expected. If he called this next year, he would had time convincing the public and maybe a different result.

  • Rumours on the BBC website that there are elements in the PLP "organising against Jeremy Corbyn".

    With the Lib Dems AWOL for the foreseeable future it needs to be more centrist  (I've said this before). Opposing far (or at least further) right with far left isn't going to work in the real world.

  • runner-manrunner-man ✭✭✭

    http://ichef.bbci.co.uk/live-experience/cps/400/cpsprodpb/vivo/live/images/2016/6/24/c667d192-df80-48e9-a093-407ee83be669.png

  • It's good to see there is as much sensationalism and extreme views post vote as there was before.image

    To use a driving analogy we were driving along in one lane, now we have reached a sign that shows we need to be in the next lane. So we assess the traffic, make a strategy for moving lanes, follow that strategy and then we are in the new lane.

    Once in the new lane we forget we were ever in the old lane.

    Provided we have a good driver we should be fine. (hmmm, might be a bit of a problem with this bit...image

    But seriously do you think we won't be driving Audi and BMW any more?

    My own sensationalist view is that the EU will now break up over the next 5 years so there is no point in Scotland and Northern Ireland leaving the UK because there will be no EU to join. With oil as it is I'm not sure what an independent Scotland would look like financially but I don't think it would be pretty - two more basket cases for Germany to pay for if they left the UK and joined the EU?

    PS you missed Gibraltar off the above list - now that is a messy one!

  • 15West15West ✭✭✭

    What if a big lorry is coming the other way?

  • Pound rises 5 cents against dollar in last 4 hours as people realise the world has not actually ended.

    Other headlines

    Ex Pats living in Spain outraged that UK has voted to leave EU - 'life is great in Spain' they say.

  • runner-man wrote (see)

    Had a statement from my employer stating its business as usual. Disappointed but remain committed to Britain and to Europe.

    I think there needs to be understanding into why 51.9% voted leave. I said before, many vote based on their own circumstances. Many vote what affects them. Not others or the country. If certain issues dominate their thinking, its very hard to change.

     

    My theory is that it's about the dumbing-down of politics and the petty, adversarial nature of debate.

    Time was the electorate, especially the working class, was properly, passionately, politically engaged. They turned out to listen to politicians speak to them at rallies. They were members of trade unions, they knew what is was that united them. 

    Now, in order to appeal to most people, all you have to do is deliver your reasoning in a soundbite that would appeal to a child: "Take back control"  - isn't that easier on the brain than, "actually, it's complicated" or "go and find out some facts for yourselves"?

    It isn't their fault, they've been conditioned to expect simple answers to complex problems (exactly what this vote reflects) and, as a result, we have a large part of the electorate that has, fundamentally, been rendered incapable of reasoned, independent thought.

    A mention here for a colleague of mine - she is pretty young and had no idea how to vote. She spent the last couple of days finding out the facts for herself and reading lots of impartial information. In other words she did what you would expect any intelligent voter do do but no longer bothers to do. 

    She voted Remain.

  • Maybe I did go too far VDot.



    Where was Corbyn in all of this ? He was invisible.
  • I've always voted for the Tory party and yesterday I voted leave. I think today's slump will be a temporary setback. Trade agreements will be defined and it will be business as usual. 

  • JT141JT141 ✭✭✭
    Or, we're driving along in one lane, we reach a sign that says continue straight on, steep drop on either side. We ignore this because the bloody establishment telling us what to do. That sign was probably put up by a foreigner. We veer off the road into the undergrowth. Plummeting drops are just a leftist conspiracy. We just need to bash through a bit further as the car gets trashed because there'll be a field full of puppies and money just passed this blind dip....
  • Norman Smith, BBC:

    "I think you will find Labour figures later this morning calling for Jeremy Corbyn to consider his position because of the lacklustre campaign he fought. We could end up with a situation where David Cameron is gone, where Jeremy Corbyn is gone. You could almost end up with a reshaping of politics at Westminster. And on the back of that we may even have a general election sooner rather than later."

  • JT141 wrote (see)
    Or, we're driving along in one lane, we reach a sign that says continue straight on, steep drop on either side. We ignore this because the bloody establishment telling us what to do. That sign was probably put up by a foreigner. We veer off the road into the undergrowth. Plummeting drops are just a leftist conspiracy. We just need to bash through a bit further as the car gets trashed because there'll be a field full of puppies and money just passed this blind dip....

    Nicely put! 

  • Are you driving an Audi or a BMW?image

  • Great day for buying shares and sterling
  • Skinny Fetish Fan wrote (see)

    Are you driving an Audi or a BMW?image

    Lada

  • JT141JT141 ✭✭✭
    It's a Rover 200.
  • Molly - how do you feel about Farage backing down on the 350M a week to the NHS now and Hannan saying that immigration won't change ?



    Do you feel misled ? at all ?
  • HA77HA77 ✭✭✭

    I was pretty pessimistic this morning but compared to some people on here I've got my rose tinted glasses on. I really don't know how my work is going to be affected but I'm just keeping my fingers crossed.

    I can't help but think that the EU itself is somewhat to blame as well. I think it's, rightly or wrongly, seen as an undemocratic lumbering institution of bureaucracy and red tape that doesn't listen to the people and is resistant to change. Any good that comes from it is lost to lots of people because of its image problem. With the rise in euro skepticism across the EU I would've thought it would've been working hard to reform or at least be seen to be engaging with the people and recognizing their concerns. Maybe they have but I've just missed it.

  • JT141JT141 ✭✭✭
    Farage wants to make the date a public holiday. This time next year he envisages large numbers of people not being at work today. You know what, he might actually be right about something.
  • If we had voted narrowly to say I think that would have been a wake-up call.

    Now any reforms they do make on the back of this won't be benefitting us.

    Hello foot, meet bullet...

  • cougie wrote (see)
    Molly - how do you feel about Farage backing down on the 350M a week to the NHS now and Hannan saying that immigration won't change ?

    Do you feel misled ? at all ?

    Well I feel vindicated in saying these people were absolute f*cking liars.

    Wasn't so sure it would be proved on day one though!

  • I think now we have voted to leave they will reform to try and keep the EU together and stop other countries leaving - too late for us.

    This is a shame because if they had shown this willingness to reform before we voted perhaps we would be looking at a different result this morning.

    The EU gambled that they did not have to change and we would still vote to stay in - they were wrong.

    EDIT - I disagree with Scream thought that a close vote to stay in would have brought about these same reforms - at that point all our negotiating pressure for reforms would have gone.

    My work is also likely to be massively affected if new trade agreements can not be made but there are 2 years for this mess to be sorted out so I would rather approach it calmly and see what happens and adjust accordingly than jump off one of the cliffs on the side of the road just because it is there. Perhaps if I stay driving along the road for another two years I will reach flatter ground.

  • Cougie - it doesn't make any difference because immigration was nothing to do with my decision. My degree in the late 80s was European Languages and Business and we studied a lot about the EU and it seemed a great idea in theory but now I just feel that the EU is not what I hoped it would be all those years ago. 

  • The thing is HA77 that most people arent interested in politics - so they're not going to make the effort to look at what the EU does.



    Was it Lit that went to the EU with school and saw how it worked ?

    Well even if you had a TV prog about it who would watch it ?



    I think the problem is with us - rather than the EU as such.



    Maybe things will work out in the end - but I have no faith in the leaders of the exit campaign,



    They promised 350m a week for the NHS. They've gone back on this already this morning.

    They over committed on their 'savings' from the EU contributions ten fold.

    Immigration - they can't control that.



    I don't see any plans there - if things go well then its down to luck rather than brains.
  • ZouseZouse ✭✭✭

    I feel nothing but despondency. 2 years of hand-wringing and negotiations ahead, followed by 5 years of unravelling & rewriting legislation & begging for new trade agreements. There will be no progress in this time and no real work done to benefit any of us by any government regardless of party or leader.

    It is a retrograde step, and I can see no benefits whatsoever.

  • HA77HA77 ✭✭✭

    You're probably right cougie but I think the result could've been different if David Cameron had been able to get more out of the negotiations. I know there was a special deal for the UK but I think it was generally seen as the EU being unwilling to change.

  • Skinny - well it might, it might not. It doesn't matter now. We could have had another referendum in the future if it hadn't reformed but there's no way back from this unless the scales fall from the Brexiter's eyes so rapidly before October that article 50 never gets invoked. 

    Won't hold my breath though...

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