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Sub 3:00 FLM 2005
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I can't imagine what 20 miles running on the treadmill would be like. Were you being serious? As I said a few messages back - you guys are an inspiration!
Here is my marathon 'pedigree'
2001 Amsterdam - 3:13
2002 London - 3:07:00
2003 London - pulled out at 20miles
2003 Blackpool - 3:41 (ran on the hottest day of the year!)
2004 London - 3:11
I picked up on the treadmill 20 miler as well, thats got to be tough!
Your training sounds pretty similar to what I put in for Berlin.
Just need to get Snowdonia on Sunday out of the way, then have few weeks rest, and start again!
I don't somehow think Snowdonia is the place to go for my sub 3!!!
I followed the sub 3:15 schedule which is marginally easier on you than the sub 3 - but as Andre said I always tried to outperform the schedule. In the 10 weeks before tapering I averaged 49 miles (one was a low running week 'cos of a hamstring strain but did cycling/x-training in stead) with 6 runs > 18 miles and a peak of 70 miles in a week. I did most of the speed sessions on thursday and tempo on tuesday both trying to hang on to the quick ones at the local running club.
So not much different from Andre but he just did his training quicker than me! I agree though I think there is no substitute for those high mileage sessions/weeks.
Andre - are you doing the FLM then or are you going to be too busy changing nappies?
It's a shame that there's no shortcuts to sub 3. I'll just have to do what I can. I think that I will aim to be ecstatic if I get 3:00:01. That would be a huge jump up for me.
Is it better to just do high mileage training?
Blisters - thanks for congrats, Paul and I saw a few guys at Dublin that had finished in 3 hours and seconds, they were gutted.
Daniel - you need some speedwork I reckon to build your speed endurance - I found that the speed sessions were a welcome break to the distance workouts and looked forward to them as you got a good workout in 30 mins rather than 1 hour +!!
Daniel – Speed work is important, but if you don’t get enough mileage in and blow up at 20 miles then it all goes to waste.
Did you enter London though? I'm of the opinion that it's always worthwhile entering 'cos you can either defer or at least build up your refusals.
Speedwork is a necessary evil for me as I'm not a particularly 'fast' runner (I can only just break 20min for a 5K). Strangely though some of my fastest 7-8 mile training runs came the day after a speed session. Not recommended I know but my legs just felt good.
For my long runs I also try incorporate a big hill at a late-ish stage (e.g. at 15 miles out of a 20) - found this was good conditioning for digging deep even when you're quite knackered.
Maybe sub-3 at london is too soon and there are lots of other things that may get in the way between now and noon on 17th april but if not then I'm increasingly of the opinion that sub-3 is not impossible. If not FLM '05 then Dub '05 or wherever...
You've got a great chance. It's a flat course, with good support, good company, good targets. At the pointier end it is also fairly ordinary, and not at all crowded.
THIS IS YOUR BEST CHANCE. GRASP IT.
I'm currently not feeling I could run anywhere at sub-3 pace though. Did 7.5 on sunday and was struggling all the way round - managed to get in within the hour but it was hard. There just was no spring in my legs.
I'm out with the club tonight for ~6miles, but I think I'll drop down to the 7:20 pace group.
I think I'm going to only do ~4 runs and 30+ miles per week for the next 4 weeks to give my legs a rest. On non-running days I'm going to do some cycling and swimming (went swimming last night and I realised how much I miss it!). So hopefully I'll retain a reasonable amount of fitness while giving those pesky leg niggles time to recover.
Then 1st of December I'll start increasing mileage and start on the speed sessions again.. but a little bit quicker than last time!
Andre - Shepshed on sunday?
I felt exactly the same on Saturday when I did a 7.1 mile loop - legs were hollow. HAd a rest on Sunday and then did 10 x templar hill reps on Monday and the legs felt great! Had a day off yesterday and if time permits will try for a 10K or 5K. I just want to maintain fitness as I am doing the Bolsover 10K on the 19th December - want to finish year with pb at 10K to make it a clean sweep in 10K, half and marathon for pb times.
I'm heavily involved in the x country season at the moment which means that I have to have Friday as a rest day and more often than not I am knackered to do my long runs on Sunday. Still, there is a long way to go until April............
Toucan - went out to see what the legs could do over a 10k last night - did the Rothley 10k and did 37.49! my previous best on that course was 39.15 in the race in June - the marathon training has paid off!!!
That's an excellent time for the Rothley course - I think it's at least minute slower than a 'flat' course. It shows what improvement I've still got to make to get under sub-3.
I'm running the shepshed with a couple of friends and I'm out on a stag night the night before so I'm not going to get a p.b. on sunday. As they've changed it to a two-lap race mostly on paths through garendon park, you know do the 'hill' twice although I doubt you'd consider it to be a hill now - certainly nothing like templar road.
Next 'proper' race for me is the turkey trot in December. I've nearly done a clean sweep of p.b.'s this year. Only one I missed out on is a 10M p.b. which I haven't raced since last summer, so my best for that sticks out like a sore thumb.
In the past I've used Hal Higdon's advanced, but this time I thought about trying the 18-week 70-mile p/w plan in Advanced Marathoning, for a change. Anyone had any experience of it?
Am I right in thinking that the Sunday long runs are at or near your projected mara pace or have I mis-read that?
Dont worry too much about what days you do things, just try and get all the key sessions in.
I guess with all these plans, the trick is to get in the key sessions, but without doing 2 hard days in a row too often. And fit in races too.