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Nice Little Runs in Sutton Park
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Well done DH, bet you're well chuffed. Sorry I couldn't get there in the end
You too Mike, excellent work. What's your next marathon?
Prue - glad your leg's a little better. Not got time to answer your q's now, I'll try to post later
Well done DH, glad you enjoyed the race. You can sign up for some more races now then!
MH, well done on your first marathon. Who'd have thought Stratford would be that hilly!!
Prue - how did you get on at Gary's? What did he have to say? As regards hammy injuries, it's impossible to compare one to another. It all depends on i) severity (minor tear vs major tear) ii) location (an injury in the belly of a muscle will heal quicker than one at either end) iii) individual healing capacity (some people seem to heal so much quicker than others) and of course iv) getting the right type of treatment.
Generally accepted opinion now ( ignore RW headlines!) is that you should RICE for 48-72 hours then MICE as soon as possible (M=movement) before moving onto MICES (S=stretching). The movement will promote blood flow which will help the site to heal and the stretching will ensure that the fibres are aligned correctly as they repair. Add a bit of regular sports massage in as well, which will help with both of those AND help to keep other muscles "loose" (they invariably tighten to protect the injured site).
As to why your calves go tight...errrm, lots of reasons. The Manx? 31 miles and 8000ft is a long way! Lack of stretching? New shoes? Dunno, need to think about other things.
Well done Mike. Sounds like the sunshine was challenging! You did great to hold in there
A few words about the Black Mountains then:
Hmmm, in retrospect, I feel I went into this a little mentally unprepared. I think I'd got a bit blase about long days out in the hills. But come on.......... it's never going to be easy covering 25.5 miles over 6790ft of rough terrain. In effort terms this is virtually equivalent to a marathon in distance, with another half marathon's worth of effort for the ascent! Despite the great company of John from the running club, and the decent weather, I was on my last legs by 20 miles, only to be faced with a huge 2000+ft climb up Pen-Allt-Mawr (2362ft), just when the sun was shining down at its strongest. Half a tonne of sugar in various forms (gels, jelly babies) eventually got me to the top in just over an hour! From there it was just an hour's running to the finish. We got back in a time of 8 hours and 3 minutes.
It was a great route though, covering some very high and bleak terrain in the Black Mountains, including it's highest, Waun Fach (2661ft), and the diminutive and very cute Table Mountain (which looked tiny from above). It was tough though, with the ascent mostly packed into 3 long climbs, the last of which was a killer. It's 266ft per mile, which makes it a very long A class fell race, with 3 of us thinking it felt tougher than the Manx Mountain Marathon.
In my own defence, it was less than 2 weeks since I'd ran a marathon PB, so I think my legs were still a little knac....... tired.
A great social weekend though, great company and great to be camping
Sounds like a great weekend Juicer. I was looking at that one last year. Well done btw
Prue - as ER says, you can't compare hamstring injuries. My longterm hamstring problem has been mainly due to small tears near my glutes. These did not bother me for ages, but as I continued to run, without paying attention to sufficient stretching and strengthening, I believe my muscle tore again and again and the scar tissue built up into a knot, eventually causing uncomfortable friction and shortening of my hamstring. That can only be treated by breaking down the tissues with massage.
I recently had a larger acute tear in the centre of my hams(at Compton) (biceps femoris if I remember correctly from my study days) which bruised very deeply. My course of treatment has been very much what ER has outlined above. I also sought advice from a physio initially which was very helpful in highlighting my quad/knee problems and then I moved onto massage from a Sports Therapist, whom I have been seeing weekly (now moving onto two weekly).
It's important to realise that the hamstring tear is just the symptom, the problem may lie elsewhere eg tension in your back, calves, feet etc. It's therefore pretty useless seeing someone who only looks at the site of the injury.
I would now more than recommend regular sports massage to anyone that runs, as I have discovered that I have loads of knotting and tension in my muscles in areas where I would not have suspected any problem.
Blimey UM, you have been in the wars haven't you? Hope the recovery continues and glad to hear you're getting good treatment.
I think you're spot on with saying the problem tends to lie elsewhere. Back and glutes are the common places in my experience. In particular lower back problems cause all sorts of tightness in the leg muscles so you're correct to say you need someone to look at the bigger picture. I'd always recommend an osteo.
And you're also right about sports massage. It's a great "maintenance" thing which will help ensure that those little niggles don't turn into something worse. And, where there is an injury, the important thing is to keep other muscles from tightening and affecting gait etc. which can lead to further problems.
Only one word of "caution" - there is not enough regulation in the area of sports massage at the moment so you need to check the qualifications of the person you are seeing. There are effectively 2 levels - a Level 3 qualification which you can get at a local college in evening class and Level 4 which involves far more study and commitment. If anyone wants to find someone in their area, best place to start is the Sports Massage Association website, www.sportsmassageassociation.org There's a search facility. And you never know who you might find on there
(though I'm NOT called Evil Rich
)
That'll make it just 2 weeks since the 37 mile Calderdale as well won't it?
ER/UM
Thanks for the advice. I have been reading up and asking quite a few questions, so have been following the advice right from the begining and it all seems to have been the right thing to do. I saw Gary on Monday, and I'm so glad I did as it he was able to answer a lot of my questions and give me a thorough MOT. He diagnosed a tear in the Hamstring and luckily its in the muscle (the outer bicep one), so recovery should be alot quicker
. He also looked at what he though was causing the problems and I now need to re-access a few things (like wearing my orthotics again 
) and I also have some work to do on my weak glutes and abductors which need strengthening as its pulling my pelvis out of alignment. So a bit of work to do now and continually. ER - All your advice from above is what Gary has advised too, so i'm doing some massage, stretching and icing a couple of times a day. Thanks for your advice!
MH - Well done again, hope the sun burn and legs ease!!!! A nice report....
just typing this in the break before extra time in the footie
p'man: Are you off to Moscow for final?
Did a nice undulating 5 miler tonight - furthest run this year - felt ok and was sure I could easily have done a few more mile - So I'm quite happy about doing 10k at DK10 next week.
Took 52mins for 5 miles but just can't run any quicker because as soon as I try and lengthen stride and go from plod mode to faster running it starts to hurt
Got to have Cortisone injection into left knee in the morning so hopefully that will help
and got appointment at Ortopeadic Hospital in Selly Oak ( for right knee ) next month.
.......right back to extra time
ER - Don't fret, there's nothing radically wrong. My main prob has been my chronic ham tears, but I've been running quite a lot lately and things are getting better. The massage has been essential in relieving tension in my back (probably through sitting down at work) and other muscles, and also breaking down small knots of scar tissue. I can now straighten my left leg once again and have full use of my quads! I've also been stretching and doing a range of strength exercises.
It just makes me realise now that years of running (25 years + in my case) take their toll on the muscles and all those little tears we sustain need ironing out. I wouldn't not take my car for an MOT for 25 years, Im sure (deliberate double negative
I totally agree about your word of caution of the field of Sports Therapy. It's a very similar situation in other areas of the sport industry. I'm fairly lucky that I have contact with a range of Health, Exercise and Sports professionals and I don't have to rely on looking up someone on the register.
Prue - glad you've got some advice. You'll be back before you know it. Just thought I'd add that after my ham tear at Compton, I did take 3 weeks off (was given the go ahead after 2 weeks but decided to err on the side of caution)
AA - Glad to hear you've got your appointment, knees are horrible things! Mr UM has had knee probs for years, he got wiped off his motorbike almost 20 years ago and did untold damage to his left leg/knee, but now his right knee is almost as bad through compensation. He had a MRI scan about a month ago and I have just noticed that he has had an appointment come through at Good Hope on 22nd May to see an Orthopaedic specialist.
Ironically... our cat hurt his right leg recently (think he got chased by the big bully black cat on the block). He has been unable to jump and his leg started wobbling. I suspected knee ligament problems. Took him to the vet on Monday evening and he confirmed a knee problem (it keeps moving out off alignment). The vet was keen to know that Billy (the cat) is insured and we now have an apointment to see the animal orthopaedic specialist on 08.05.08. and he will perform the appropriate sugery on the same day .
Ouch! - had my cortisone injection ( quite painless really ) and saw mri scan results of my other knee and the physio explained it all - ( loads of rubbish floating about, cysty things, increased synovial vascularisation, and some tracking damage ) - so just need to wait for Op date for a clean out.
Left knee feels great - no pain - although that's probably due local anaesthetic - but fingers crossed!
Welcome Deis .......
There's no hard and fast meeting days/times as such. We tend just to state on here when we are running and arrange meets. Would be great for you and DH to get together for sure. She is the newest Beanie and did Lung run and is going the 5k too on 18th I believe. She runs at about your pace and is lovely and very highly motivated at the moment
Keep your eye out on here for meetings ...... know we are all pretty booked up with events at the moment and there are a few of us injured at the moment so could be a while before a big group meeting but DH may well want to meet up.
PM - cheers for run earlier ......... sorry about lack of transport ........ meant a longer run though
AA - sounds yuk ... but also sounds great that things are all moving forward now. Great about that run you did. Looking forward to seeing you and having a bap with you at DK next week
My running mojo has been a little hit-and-miss this week. Did a 5M on Mon and then turned up at the park in all my gear just to tell TR that I couldn't be arsed to do the planned 15M and in fact couldn't be arsed to do anything at all. So, I drove back home!! Turned up at park on Wed and didn't feel like doing anything. Forced myself to get out of the car though (as the rain excuse I had been banking on suddenly stopped) and did 5M. Really enjoyed it once I got going though
Just done 9M with PM but it was pretty slow and stop/start and I can't say I felt brilliant but that's the way it goes I spose.
Seems I may well be doing much more running than I'd planned ... car has packed in
Looking forward to this 10k I've got on Monday .... need to blast it from the start to see where I'm at over that distance. Not done a road 10k for a year and a half!!!
Mornin' all, I'm back in Blighty.
Is anyone running in SP on Sunday morning?
Briefly back online in London
DH - great report!
Prue/AA - best of luck with injuries and recoveries.
RC - cheers for yesterday.
tumps - I'm up for a run in SP on Sunday morning
AA - yes, I've already booked for Moscow.
as many as you want to do DH!!
Suggest we meet at 1000 at Banners Gate...so
Banners Gate Sun 4 May 1000
Tumps
Peaceman
DH?
deis: Welcome to the thread - everyone's really friendly so keep your eye out for when there's a run together.
I've decided that cortisone injections are awesome ( juicer : think voltarol but 100 times better ) - It's definately stopped the tendonitis symptoms/pain in my left knee and it's great walking around having a pain free left knee.
Did 5 miles today ( 14 for the week now!!!! ) but took it very slowly @ 11 m/m as it was great to run pain free and didn't want to chance setting it off again. I'm sure the effects won't last permanently but it's still great having the relief from the constant nagging dull pain.
rc: yes pork baps on weds - can't wait - looked up my result from last year and did it in 59 mins so it's going to be around 1:04 this year.
p'man: Are you just flying in and out?
prue: hope injury is getting better?
tumps: where have you been?
happy running this weekend everyone
aa - remember the problem is still there
don't go mad on that knee - the steroids are masking the pain
TR - cheers for the Cobra Classic entry form - I'm in for that, I didn't fancy the Hillwest 10K good as it is as I've done it twice now.
Thats fine Deis, but really you'd be fine. I was 4 months off my 1st 10K wheN I ran with the Beanies and my longest run was about 5 or so miles.
It was because of running with them I began to believe in myself even more that i could go to a much longer distance and get faster. I truly believe running with people better than yourself will improve your ability no end. It did for me.
AA - agree with lurker, don't forget that your knee isn't better - the injection is just a painkiller. As for Moscow, I'm staying for two nights. Can't cope with two 5 hour flights in one day!
RC - Thursday's run didn't feel that slow to me
DH - can't believe you were 17 stone just two years ago. That's fantastic progress to go from there to a sub-64 10K.
tumps/DH/etc - 10 at Banners it is then.
Dont worry Tumps..you'll be at my pace whether you like it or not!!
See you in the morning...and take it easy with me, Im in agony after 2 speed work sessions and weight session Thurs & Fri
Hi Deis
Banners gate is the corner of Chester Road and Monmouth drive. If you are coming through Erdington I can pick you up at an arranged spot. PM I can pick you up too if you need me to.
I wont b running fast Deis so dont worry, Tumps & Pm can always run ahead and loop back, its the system they all use with me, and walk breaks are fine to, what ever you need.
I'd be going through the city centre; nowhere near Erdington, I'm afraid.
Would you be going anywhere near Town Gate or Gracechurch shopping centre?