Paris Marathon 2017

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  • Eggyh73Eggyh73 ✭✭✭
    FRG2 - I'm going to completely disagree with Kenno's first point. I ran my first sub 4 in Paris back in 2012. My first week of the taper I didn't run a single mile as I broke a toe playing football. My mileage the next two weeks was less than I'd planned. I ran a 3:49.

    I'd ran several marathons on two week tapers and always performed badly. What you did in the three/four months prior to the taper is what makes the difference on race day. I'd place good money nobody has ran a worse time because they ran 12 miles rather than 20 miles two weeks out. I'd also place good money that many would pay the price for running a 20 miles two weeks out and feeling fatigue from that late in the marathon. Fitness comes from the long term, not the short term.

    Marathon runners tend to panic that they've never done enough miles. If they miss one training run they'll lose all their pace and fitness. Try and push through injuries and illness in fear of fitness loss. If you have put in a decent training schedule over the months then taper time is about getting to the start healthy and rested.

    That said some people recover quickly and will be fine doing what Kenno suggests. It's just my personal opinion that I think there is zero benefit from doing so. It's just mind games.

    I'd actually say the biggest taper error is over eating. Sorry folks, you don't need to start carb loading weeks out!
  • Morning All, beautiful PB at the marathon last weekend Kenno ..... looking forward to seeing you take a chunk out of that in Paris (with the pressure off the time goal)

    Eggy speaks a lot of sense. Longer training block needs a longer more gradual taper. The fitness you need for the marathon is the endurance which comes from doing all the miles and long runs in the training block. That hangs around the longest.  The fitness you lose is the cardio. So during taper you don't need to worry so much about long runs or mileage . You need to try to maintain that cardio fitness while reducing all your sessions to get the fatigue out of your muscles from months of pounding...... so a little more emphasis on shorter sharper "tempo" runs, more rest days and don't over eat and don't stress it. You've done the work, just need to get to the start line in one piece.
  • FRG2FRG2 ✭✭✭
    Thanks for the feedback. Was looking forward to taper, feeling a bit nervous now it's here. Following Hal Higdon, so will stick with him. 
  • Eggyh73Eggyh73 ✭✭✭
    Got 20 miles in this morning. Taper time now for me as well.
  • Hi guys,

    just catching up after a few few weeks on holiday. You lot have been busy getting the miles and PB's in, some awesome times I have spotted while scrolling through. It's great to read how well you are all doing and plans going well for most.

    good news is the piriformis injury appears to have gone away, although I haven't ran in anger for 5 weeks now, I got in a 5k beach run last week at a 9 min pace and felt ok. But then spent 3 days in bed with a sickness bug losing over a stone of weight. Fair to say it's not been the best marathon training for me. My plan is to build my weight and strength up and get some short distance runs (10k, HM) in the next 2 weeks and scale back my Paris plan of a sub 4 to getting across that finish line.

    @Eggy - count me in for the pub too please, I fly home early Monday so not too many beers, although that might numb the pain temporarily.

    i noticed someone mentioned about Instagram and twitter names, mine are below if you wish to have a follow:
    IG - mark_j_hatton
    Twitter - markhatton2009
  • Eggyh73Eggyh73 ✭✭✭
    Hatton2009 - I think the best plan after your injury and illness is to forget the time and just go out and try and find a comfortable pace you can tap out.

    Due to my injury issues training for this that's what I plan to do. Forget the watch and just find a nice pace and try coast my way through it.

    The time will be what it'll be. Get through and live to fight another day.
  • kennokenno ✭✭✭
    How's your hamstring eggy?

    Ive just done 15 miles. It would have been 20 if I hadn't run last weekend. 

    By not tapering too early I meant don't just let your mileage drop like a bomb - which is what I did. I felt I was undercooked last year and could have done better in the taper. 
  • Eggyh73Eggyh73 ✭✭✭
    edited March 2017
    The hamstring is much better, but not 100% yet.

    I've managed to get out for a few runs recently and distance wise I'm good, but I need to go very easy on pace.

    The main thing is I'll be able to run, which was in doubt at one point. This one will be about finishing without aggravating anything. 
  • TBO2TBO2 ✭✭✭
    Good luck with it Eggy. I hope it holds up for you. Everyone seems to be doing really well-not long now
  • Tapering is an odd thing. Received wisdom is that it should take 3 weeks. I've never done more than 2, for the reasons Eggy cites (fear of decline, in a nutshell). I personally feel that 20m two weeks before the marathon does not have any impact on my performance, but it's all about individuals.
  • kateykatey ✭✭✭
    Nells, thanks for that re the running watch, I will have a play. It's still very new to me so I've not explored it found all the settings. I'd had my old one about five years and it's surprising how used to something you get as it was quite fiddly compared to the new one, yet I could find my way round it easily.

    I'm meant to be doing my first half tomorrow. It's hilly so not what I'm used to! So far I've had zero sleep tonight despite it being 2am as my baby boy is not having a good night, he was screaming his head off, woke up my four year old. Got him settled and then she woke him up again by calling me and that triggered another 40 minutes of crying. Not the good nights sleep I'd been hoping for.

    As an aside my sister called me this evening worrying about security in Paris. She offered to stay at my house with the kids while I'm there. Must say it would be much easier not carting a 4yo and 11mo about with us but not sure if it's a shame for the older one to
    miss out. She does love cheering runners on although has taken to yelling "sprint finish" rather manically at Parkrun about 50m out after she heard my husband yell it to me once.
  • kateykatey ✭✭✭
    Re tapering I have the half this week and was going to try 18 next weekend which will be my longest run so far. I only do short runs during the week which I think has been a flaw in my training (not by choice, by necessity).
  • Last tune-up race done - Welwyn Garden City Half, which is an out-and-back course with a couple of noticeable hills and the whole way back straight into headwind. Horrible, so pleased to match my PB, even with a collapse in pace in the last couple of miles. How did you get on Macca?

    Katey - Here's the FCO's travel advice on France: https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/france For reference, the UK's current threat level is 'severe', meaning that an attack is highly likely.

    I didn't know about the SAIP, I'll be downloading that. Paris is a big city struggling with international and homegrown social and political problems which make it an inherently risky place, just like London and Berlin. That said, I didn't think twice about going the Spring after the January Charlie Hebdo attack, or the following year after Bataclan etc. My personal view is that if we allow terrorism to alter how we live, then it has achieved its aim (which is to destabilise society). However, I don't have children, so that's a high-horse that's pretty easy for me to sit on.
  • kateykatey ✭✭✭
    I'm not worrying so much about the terrorism angle but whether it would be easier for us without them! It was the news that prompted my sister to make the offer as she does tend to be a worrier on that front. I think we may leave the four year old and bring the baby just for ease of only having one child to manage and he is a lot easier and can be carried in a baby carrier. If the four year old starts moaning about tired legs she weighs a ton!

    So my first half marathon today. I quite enjoyed it although it was ridiculously hilly. The elevation climb was almost 300m and there were a lot of long steady climbs followed by short steep downhills which I liked even less than the hills. As I train almost exclusively on the flat, they were an unpleasant shock to the system. My watch tells me I have climbed 64 floors and I only wore it for the actual race.

    I was finding it relatively easy and up to 18 miles was on course for 2 hour 40 minutes however I turned onto the seafront for the last three miles and the force of the headwind was brutal.  I tried to drink out of a cup at the end and the wind blew the water out before I could sip it. I loathe running into a headwind and did let it get to my head. I also started to get a stabbing pain behind my knee which actually made me yelp out, but I think I was running awkwardly because of the wind (I was holding my head sideways and twisting my body a bit). My pace dropped dramatically and I finished in 2 hour 52 in the end. However I did feel quite fresh still and I've been running round with the kids all afternoon and don't feel I've done a run at all today which I take as a good sign. 

    I do feel I can run the marathon at a similar place (before the slow bit at the end) which would actually be 5hr20 so I'm hoping my target of 6 hours isn't totally unrealistic.
  • OrbuttOrbutt ✭✭✭
    Katey. I hope you meant km rather than miles, otherwise you've run a very long half  :)

    I've had a few runs where I've changed my gait due to weather and it's amazing how the slightest change can cause problems. I take it it's not hurting now, as you're running around with the kids - that's good.

    On a flat(ish) course with adrenaline and crowds, you'll be fine  B)
  • kateykatey ✭✭✭
    Oh yes upto 18km!!! I've not managed 18 miles yet ... that's my target next weekend! 
  • Eggyh73Eggyh73 ✭✭✭
    I don't think anyone enjoys running into a head wind. 

    I'd certainly be careful about your posture when you run, as Orbutt said slight changes can cause pain or injury. That's easier said than done when battling a bad headwind though.

    Well done on getting it done though. A hilly half in less than ideal conditions by the sounds of it.
  • kateykatey ✭✭✭
    Just reading back on the thread while sitting on the train. I'm unsure whether to try 18 miles next weekend or not - I've only done 16 so far but now I'm wondering if I should be tapering now?
  • kennokenno ✭✭✭
    I did 17 2 weeks before my first marathon and ran a half the week before. It was a good confidence boost for me. It was was PB until last weekend. 
  • Eggyh73Eggyh73 ✭✭✭
    Katey - I think it might be a good one to attempt a run/walk to see how you feel on it. You might want to pick a route that you can bail out on, say after 14 or 16 miles, but can aim for 18 if you feel ok. The following weekend you really don't want to be doing any more than 10 miles at the most, probably less, for your LSR.
  • Pistol101Pistol101 ✭✭✭
    Morning all - Reading Half Marathon for me yesterday in 1hr 47. Took just over a minute off my PB. Think i had a bit more in the tank as ran the last few miles with the 1:45 pacer (started in front of him). It was very windy in places so i''m pleased.

    I'll let the legs recover for a couple of days, probably a gentle few miles tomorrow and then Thursday/Friday i'm going to get the last LSR in. I have 2 x18 and 1x20 in the bank. I've done 2 and 3 week tapers before and don't think made much difference. It's just been 2 weeks since i did 20, so for the sake of my mind i'd like to get something big in. 
  • Pistol101Pistol101 ✭✭✭
    Eggy - yes we'll be there for the drinks at the pub post race.
  • Pistol - well done on the PB in less than ideal conditions.
    Katey - I make that a PB too, I hope you can take some confidence from it.
    Dom - well done on matching your PB yesterday. You're right about turning into the wind at halfway, those miles on that long road were tough. I managed to find a PB from somewhere so quite chuffed, particularly as I lost my race no 20 mins before the start and resigned to not running. I found it with less than 10mins to the start. Not the kind of warm up I'd recommend.
  • nicko1981nicko1981 ✭✭✭
    Eggy - pub plan sounds good, count 3 of us in, can't make the pre-meal so be good to meet everyone after.

    Did Hampton Court Palace half yesterday with an 8 miler before to make it a long run, would recommend this way of doing a long run, makes the last miles a bit more tolerable, though the temptation to go too fast is there for sure.

    It's a bit of a weird route on that race, a lot of just running down a main road on the pavement amongst the public. Lovely start and finish locations though.

    Well done Pistol on the PB, great time especially if you had more left in the tank.
  • My tuppence worth on the taper. I ran my best marathon time off the back off the Pfitzinger & Douglas (P&D) plan, which still has you training hard more or less up the the last week. In fact, it has you doing 3 x 1600m reps at 5k pace 10 days before the race. The main difference is that the length of the long run is much reduced, from 20 miles three weeks out, to 16, then 12. So it's about reducing distance, but keeping intensity going.
  • Another public service announcement - travel insurance. If you have/are planning to take out travel insurance, make sure it covers you for taking part in a marathon. Some explicitly do, some don't. If in doubt, contact them and ask. Some will cover you as long as you're not taking part 'competitively' (i.e. you're not hoping to win a prize or being paid to compete). You don't need a specialist policy, there are many normal ones that are OK, but it's worth checking.
  • OrbuttOrbutt ✭✭✭
    I have Tesco multi trip travel insurance and it covers non competitive marathon running. :smiley:
  • I'm already feeling nervous now my taper has started. Had a great trip down to London to run my final 20 with EHN on Saturday. Eggy count me in for The Frog, the burgers were lovely last year.
  • Eggyh73Eggyh73 ✭✭✭
    Ok, the pub has been reserved. With much help from my undercover helper in France, who can speak French without a Glaswegian accent! The details are:

    Frog Revolution
    9 rue de la Bastille

    Metro Bastille.
    Follow, Sortie (Exit) 7 - Place des Vosges
    Next to the Hippopotamus Restaurant

    Upstairs bar reservered for BCRC/RW
  • Thanks Eggyh for sorting out the Saturday and Sunday :-).
    Did my long run yesterday at the excellent Ashby 20. Happy with a PB and negative split considering the brutal wind and undulating course and now time to taper.
    Good luck everyone on your individual journeys and stay positive - you are all fantastic.

    @dslbcfc
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