P&D Spring Marathon 2019

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  • SorequadsSorequads ✭✭✭
    What was your first mile in the swimmers, Joe?
  • 6:03 versus an average on the day of 6:13, so not actually that outrageous..

    5:51 for mile 3 was probably a bit silly though. That is a quick mile in London though. 
  • HA - All in good fun and good LR

    NE - I knew that link would be fake but still clicked it for some reason

    Macca - No worries, I’m thicker skinned than that. Agree that it’s weird having all the extra time again. Friday would usually be an MLR, but is only 5 miles this evening. Not sure what I’m going to do with myself as the pub would be my usual fallback.

    TR - Not sure if putting holes in your shorts is the way to go. Make sure you wear a good pair of pants underneath 

    Joe - Good session. I think it’s been clear for a while you’re a runner that does a bit of swimming and cycling.

    SQ - I find easing off for a couple of days can make it feel like your legs are getting worse. I think it is a mental thing though.

    AWC - When training is going well I think the 14 @ MP is an enjoyable session.

    Spoons - Good progress once again

    The beet shots is an interesting one, I’d read articles before on the benefit but completely forgot about it. It looks like beet-it seems to be the main brand. Is that what other people use? I’ve tried to have a ‘no stone unturned’ approach to this training block, so it makes sense to take a look at this.

    The last intervals of the plan yesterday, 3 x 1 mile. Averaged about 5:52 for the reps and just over 9 miles at 6:57mm. Everything seems to be moving in the right direction, the only real struggle at the moment is to not eat the same amount of food I was when running 90+ mile weeks.
  • Re the beat it shots - I use them for my A marathons and has to be done. Anything that tastes that grim has to work! ....(screwing my face up as I speak), Its become part of my Marathon ritual.


  • NE / HPR - I clicked the link as well.. Cant believe it was fake , disappointing!

    Fake news ... Fake news... (now I know how Donny Trumpster feels)

  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    FBT 'beat it' shots - distilled essence of Michael Jackson? ;) How's Brighton looking
    Quit fannying around Joe & admit you're going for a PB at VLM. Decent MP session that which indicates a 2:35 should be the target which sounds realistic as an A goal for you this year given everything else.
    Seems like almost everyone is approaching peak performance nicely (or sitting there already for the Manchester runners) at the moment. Not feeling it myself unfortunately: 2x10K today which were harder than the pace would indicate. Did have a backpack on which always makes it harder. Shoulder still stiff & painful but moving better.
  • NorthEnderNorthEnder ✭✭✭
    Thanks for letting me know about the broken link... I'll get the IT department in to fix it.

    Beet it shots?  Beetroots are much cheaper and feel more natural.. and a nice snack the evening before and the morning of a race.   Done that a few times but no idea if they work.  I can vouch for also having panicked at the amazing colour of my pee after the first race where I did it.  I really thought the exertion had caused me serious damage until I started to wonder.  The pee was so unbelievably red.  Maybe that's how they make Beet-it shots.

    Slow progress Jools... good luck with that.

    Another good run for me today. I'm just feeling lighter on my feet this week and steady running speed is back to normal at around  or under 9 minute miles...50-60 seconds per mile faster than just a fortnight ago when it was laboured.  

    Did the VO2 session I should have done last week...  10miles with 5x600m (80 sec interval).  Felt good  and the reps are short and only a few, so rather than do the namby-pamby P&D VO2 intervals ("5K pace is enough for marathoners")... I decided from the off that I was going to do a pace that left not an ounce of energy out there...  and I reckon I got it bang on because no more than 2 seconds difference between any of the reps and averaged 6:12 and I was spent at the end.  Not checked my records yet but it will be there or thereabouts with my best for that run.  Off to the Madejski Stadium tomorrow. Sorted out where I'm going to park... saving parking fees and all the traffic hassle by parking 3 miles away - with a nice 5m route logged in my watch for a slow recovery run to the ground.
  • AWCAWC ✭✭✭
    edited March 30
    NE: that’s very consistent pacing. Hard to do!

    Jools: keep your head up man. You’ve got some serious training in your legs which will come through soon enough!

    Final MP run for me today. Had to bring it forward as I forgot The SPO’s special day is tomorrow which calls for breakfast in bed. 

    So VO2 intervals on Wednesday followed by 2 hilly commutes Thursday/Friday wasn’t what I’d planned!

    Went surprisingly well - avg 6:53/mi for the 14 MP miles and Garmin tells me a ran a 1:30 half. Slowed towards the end but can’t really complain about that as I had next weeks 50 miler on my mind. 
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited March 30
    Joe - good 3x3m session, whats the rest period, that eould be an easy session  for me to include as 3x20min.

    Jools - 2 x 10k is still a tough day.

    AWC - well done on the 14 at MP, it was a nice day out.

    Been a bit preoccupied recently as my dad had some bad health news resulting in major surgery yday, but he is apparently ok and i can go visit later.

    18 with last 3m av 6.40, which was as fast as my legs would go today. 2 weeks til the B of the Bang. Did some counting yday, since 1st Dec ive done 14x20 (inc 3x23), 30ish mlr and around 25x10 miler. I am a lot better prepared than i was for Abo.
  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    Good news about your dad TR & you are unquestionably better prepared for Brighton than you were for Abo. Time to ease off & get any fatigue out of your body. I should do the same ;)
    Sounds like you're both in great shape AWCNE.
    I did my last LR today parkrun followed by Llanbedr-Blaenafon Fell Race. Managed to finish in 2:59:50 again which was exactly the same time as 2 years ago!! Day off tomorrow :)

  • AWCAWC ✭✭✭
    Great race Jools. That’s a hell of a lot of climbing looking at Strava!
  • Nice racing Jools, very impressive. Well earned day off. 

    Got a couple of weekend activities to report back on.

    Went to Sizewell parkrun yesterday, lovely event on the coast by the beach. Plan was to not get carried away and save my pennies for the following days duathlon. Obviously I got carried away, but just did the bare minimum, sitting on the poor chaps shoulder for 4.7km while he quite clearly drove himself into the ground before easing past with the finish in sight (18:55). What a w*nker, Spraggins. 

    Main event was today. We all knew we were playing for 2nd place with professional triathlete Joe Skipper (7th pro in Ironman World Champs last year) showing up for a bit of fun. Everyone went off like lunatics as per, and I was sitting in about 10th after a mile, managing effort accordingly.

    Got a real buzz when I went through the first 5km in 17:30, feeling awesome (run distance was a random 3.3 miles). Hopped on my bike in 5th, quickly moving into 3rd and yo-yo'ing with 2nd for the 30km bike leg the entire time. Averaged 23.3mph and 285w for the 50 mins which was slightly down on last year. 

    Guy in 2nd was crap at changing his shoes, so I slipped into 2nd and tore off, hoping to put a bit of daylight in early doors. From here on in, just running scared (he ran 10 seconds faster than me on the first run), but instead of looking back I'm frantically asking random spectators how far back he is. I'm getting mixed reports, anything from '10 seconds' to '200m', so just get on with it and run hard.

    There's a point at about 2.5 miles where you can look back, and thankfully he's not there. Biggest buzz of the day when I go through the 2nd 5km in 17:30 (identical to first run) after an hour + of hard work. Got to have a look at that 5km PB in the near future. Enjoy the last few hundred metres and take 2nd for the second year in a row. 

    Planning two big weeks of running now before a 2 week London taper. 

    Saw Hamo had another awesome race today...!
  • NorthEnderNorthEnder ✭✭✭
    Hope all works out well with your Dad, TR.

    Nice racing Jools...  sounds like you're on the mend... and certainly top marks for consistency.

    Fantastic result today Joe. Great fitness and great determination.    As for the park run...  I just had a quick look. You didn't mention that it was a guy in his fifties that you tracked and sneaked past at the end...  and just held him off to beat him by 2 seconds!  

    AWC... smashing 14 miler

    I did the same run this evening...  19 with [email protected] 7:26* to complete a 55 mile week. (* If I don't count the 60 second pause for a drink that I had at half way). That's 6 seconds per mile faster than last year... and 11s faster than my target MP. 

    This [email protected] run always comes out considerably faster than the marathon pace that I do ultimately achieve.  But very interestingly, the prediction has been closest for my two highest mileage campaigns...  and those gaps were 11s and 12s.    In other words, if I follow that pattern, then that 7:26 might convert into an actual marathon pace of 7.37 (yippeee)  or 7.38 (bugger!).  I've definitely seen a rapid turnaround.   
  • HA77HA77 ✭✭✭
    TR - Hope your Dad is ok.

    Joe - Great result. You must be maintaining your bike fitness reasonably well. A couple of great runs there, particularly the second time around. Other guys probably rocked up, thinking, "Well, I'm competing for 3rd place here, after that IM hero and the clown in the flat cap."

    Couple of great MP runs NE and AWC. Really tough session but great confidence boosters. NE - funny to think about those small margins between glory and disappointment.

    Crazy racing Jools. Well done.

    Easy weekend for me but good start to the week with 10x 1km, 2min slow jog rec. Averaged 3:18  for the reps (ranging from 3:24 to 3:13), which isn't much faster than HMP really, but certainly felt harder and could feel that the legs had a good workout. April already and less than 2 weeks before the taper begins. Sheez.
  • Fat Boy TrimFat Boy Trim ✭✭✭
    edited April 1

    Jools - to be honest, Brighton not looking so good, last 6 weeks has been patchy training and I feel sluggish, like you were saying, the effort appears more than should for the given pace. But it might be alright on the night.

    Managed a slow 16 miler yesterday and felt dreadful after it, not inspiring confidence.

    Are we at that time of the campaign where we start talking about toe nail cutting and hair cuts yet?

  • HA77HA77 ✭✭✭
    FBT - I've got my pre-race hair cut booked in the schedule for Fri 26th, just 2 days out from race day for maximum effect.

    What about long range weather forecasts?
    https://www.accuweather.com/en/gb/london/ec4a-2/daily-weather-forecast/328328?day=28

    Or how many carbs per kg body weight during carb loading?
  • NE - well done on the impressive Vo2 and MP runs, for me, the last MP run is usually the best indicator of on the day performance.

    AWC - Another great MP run, the plan usually has a mini-mini-taper so to pull that out the bag with the recent mileage in the legs is impressive.

    TR - all the best with the real world stuff.  If theres any justice (and I think there is in this game) those LRs and MLRs should pay dividends in a couple of weeks.

    Jools - well done on the PR fell race double post 10k double - I'm tired just writing that, you know what to do now........

    Joe - love this bit, "plan was not to get carried away............Obviously I got carried away".  Great results in both.

    HA - great start to the week.  I think for me, the question is not when to have a haircut but whether I do it myself.  Was it tight fist Tuesday ?

    Fairly quiet weekend here.  I ambled up to the local PR thinking if enough fast peeps swerve it I could be in with a shout of first finisher as its often won in high the 19s or even 20s.  Being passed in the first 2metres by a local sub 2:30 marathoner quickly put that thought to bed but a successful solo time trial for 2nd ensued and I'm happy with a course all time 12th position.  (its only been going 20 weeks mind :) )  In more exciting news I got hold of some beet it, although not concentrated so had to down 500ml to get a similar dose.  My stomach wasn't happy for a few minutes but with a bit more training it'll be fine come race day.  I'm a bit disappointed though in the lack of colour effect.  In further exciting news, armed with SQ's voucher code, I ordered some cheat shoes, so many thanks are due SQ.   I just hope I don't piss beetroot juice on them in all the excitement this Sunday.  

  • george_george_ ✭✭✭
    HPR-Great Intervals session. I think you're allowed to eat freely this week!

    Jools-Fantastic result at the weekend especially given your recent travails

    NE-That's quite the VO2 session although sounds like the football wasn't quite as good? 

    AWC-Great run, not sure I could manage [email protected] at this stage by myself

    TR-Hope your dad continues to recover 

    Joe-Great tri result. Skipper might not turn up at the next one so the win's out there for you!

    HA-Huge session, 3:18 average is unobtainable for most of us!

    FBT-You never know, you might just be fine on the day 

     
    Proper crap run yesterday. 12 miles @ 7:50 average but felt so sluggish throughout. Not helped by every man and his dog being out in the spring sunshine so very much an obstacle course of a run. Rest day today  

    Speaking of weather, Manchester seems to be in store for some sleet this week. Rather that than blazing sunshine, but still...
  • hamo44gfchamo44gfc ✭✭✭
    HPR...that's a good interval session, super pace. I know what you mean with the eating during the taper v 90 mile weeks :D

    Jools....2x10 km is a tough session, esp with a back pack on. That was a proper class race you put in yesterday, really well done.

    NE...Super Vo2 intervals, well done.

    AWC...that's a brilliant MP run, they are always hard work. Whats the target now for Shakespeare?

    TR...really sorry to hear about your Daddy, best wishes for a speedy recovery. That is good consistency for long/Medium long runs.

    Joe...Excellent Duathalon, well done. They are awesome stand alone 5k times, never mind before and after a hard bike effort. Congrats on the 2nd place.

    NE...Very good MP run, well done.

    HA77...Good session this morning, nice way to start a new month.

    FBT...Head up, and it'll be alright on the night, is the right attitude, keep the faith and plugging away.

    Macca...well done on the parkrun, bad luck with the 2.30-er, always the way.

    George...we


    I swapped the long run planned for Sunday with a 10km race. So, I ran a 20 mile long run on Saturday morning, averaging 7.40's keeping it easy-ish effort, along the flat tow path with Sundays race in mind. Happy enough with the outcome, but the legs where tired all day after it, so wasn't sure how yesterdays would go. Was meant to be 18 miles according to the plan, but wanted to add the extra 2 on to satisfy my mind/ocd, as it means after next weeks 22m lr ill have done an average of 2 20+ miles a month for the 6 months before London.

    4 mile warm up before the race got a bit of life back in the legs, so i decided to give the race a good go and see how i got on. Surprised to come out with another pb (that's 5 in my 5 races this year, genuinely shocked at how 'in form' i am) of 34:25 to finish in 29th place. It was a top quality field with the race hosting Northern Ireland v North of England male and female races as well. 3 mile Cool down finished off the day nicely.

    6 mile recovery with the head torch back on this morning, was darker than id thought it would have been. Legs felt ok too which is a good sign, as i might need to bring the intervals of the week forward to tomorrow morning to allow me to get rubbered at a David Gray concert tomorrow night. It will be my last nights drinking before London, and i don't fancy interavals with a raging hangover on Wednesday.
  • hamo44gfchamo44gfc ✭✭✭
    George...dont know whats happened there, sorry. Was meant to say, we all get those runs sometimes, but that's not a bad average pace at all, esp considering the obstacles. Well done.
  • FBT - I got cut off somewhere, meant to add, given the injury disruption, not surprised it felt sluggish, well done for persevering.

    George - I’ve often had the worst run of the campaign the week before goal race. 

    Hamo - incredible set of results, I think you’ll have to pencil in a 20 miler the day before VLM as it seems to work. Off to Strava stalk:)

    For completeness, 18 week plan, 1434miles at 7.43 ave, 22 MLRs (13-16) 11 LRs (20+) 5 longest = 153 miles, 2 days off.
  • Fat Boy TrimFat Boy Trim ✭✭✭

    HA - Good point about the long range forecasts.. forgot about them

    Looking good for Brighton currently

    Macca - To be fair I normally feel Sluggish... just a bit more sluggish than normal ! Seems like a few others have been in a similar position George, Jools etc.

  • SorequadsSorequads ✭✭✭

    Good reps, HPR. Nicely timed to bring you to the boil for this weekend. Good reps as well from HA – rapid, and NE. Impressed you ran to the football. Did you then watch in running kit? Run back? Good time efficiency either way.

    Backpack could have made shoulder feel more painful, Jooligan? Rest it up and you will come good. You’re training has been a million times more consistent than pre-Abo.

    Great MPing, AWC. You know full well 6:52 is a 3 hour marathon. Adjust the target pace accordingly and give it a real bash! Well done on the MPing NE as well. You have made such progress recently.

    Good progression long run, TR. Have confidence – you have been so consistent.

    Super racing, Joe. Not a bad name to lose out to. So, have you now got lock laces in the VFs?

    Can’t believe HA has posted a weather forecast already. I took the bait and clicked – which will mean I now check every day for the next 26 days.

    Great parkrunning, Macca. Slightly scary that you are only adding in the magic shoes now. Really excited to see how well you go in Manchester. Good to see your enormously impressive summary stats as well. Well worth looking at these to give yourself confidence I reckon.

    I’d take sleet all day long, George. Actually, I don’t mean that. I’d take it during the race, then demand sun the second I finish and to hell with those still out there.

    Hamo – yet more amazing racing. As I said on strava, can’t wait to see a 10k from you that isn’t post 20M run! In all seriousness, I think you are going to trouble 2:40 in London. Get a pint in for me whilst you’re waiting.

     

    Upon returning home on Friday, I was greeted with a nice surprise: the MV35 Bronze medal from the Trail Running Championships the previous weekend. I know it is completely dependent on who turns up, but some solid silverware that I will actually keep.

    Had a window of opportunity on Saturday morning, so combined a buggy-free parkrun with a long run. Despite the very thick fog, it was return to the two lap summer course. It is potentially faster as there is far less overtaking required, but it definitely hiller with significantly more grass. Not a problem in dry weather, but the heavy dew made for a slippery run. 18:19 – 11s off a course PB. I was expecting to go quicker, but will really aim to break 18 minutes there over the summer. A 15M ‘warm down’ gave me 20 for the session. I couldn’t be bothered to work out the average pace of the three different runs, but I suspect it would be just below 7m/m, so a good workout. Despite treating myself to a steak after, I felt really drained all of Saturday, and so was relieved to only have an easy buggy run on Sunday.

    So, 327M for the month, even with a couple of injury scares. Building nicely.

    Enjoyed hitting the riverside-trials with spoons this morning. Last big week ahead. As Macca has previously alluded to, it looks a little funny with no Friday MLR, but a double thrown in on Wednesday. Recovery this afternoon in the sun I hope, before 6 x 1200 in the morning. Snow is being forecast again!


  • AWCAWC ✭✭✭
    edited April 1
    Hamo: thats a fantastic PB off the back of a 20 miler - really impressive. Target for Shakespeare is around 3 hours give or take :D
    George: hate the dogs being out - really upsets your rythym and you always get a rubbish run every now and again
    Macca: not what you wanted a 2:30 marathoner! I've turned up to parkrun before thinking I'll get top 3 only to be shunted into 4th because a local elite turned up!
    FBT: you might surprise yourself with your mega taper!
    TR: glad your Dad is ok after the surgery. Fingers crossed for a speedy recovery
    NE: smashed the MP run. Bodes well for race day
    SQ: glad you got the medal in the end!
    Bit of a mini-taper for me this week into Saturday's 50 miler and then it'll be proper taper time for Shakespeare
  • Fat Boy TrimFat Boy Trim ✭✭✭

    AWC - I'm as good as anyone else on here when it comes to tapering!!!! And carb loading - I started 6 weeks ago!

    George / AWC - Funny you guys should say that about dogs, I got attacked today again by a dog and ripped my good shorts.. They always seem to go for me. I must look like a rabbit or something!

  • 1SteveMac1SteveMac ✭✭✭
    AWC - Superb MP session!
    NE - Nice Vo2 and MP session!
    Joe - Nice MP and Parkrun.
    Macca - Great parkrun position.
    SQ - Great time, think you'll go sub 18 soon.
    As I had half a day holiday on Friday I did 90 minutes on the bike on Friday, then Saturday was an 11 mile run, which while not fast (8:50s), felt tough and my HR was higher than normal. Then a 4 miler on Sunday, which felt much better. Might not have been a good idea to cycle on Friday instead of having a rest day, but it's done now, cut back week done.
  • Joe Blogs-BRJoe Blogs-BR ✭✭✭
    edited April 1
    NE - Haha, rumbled! It really was shameful, I just sat behind him, doing the absolute minimum, before easing ahead and just glancing behind continuously to make sure he wasn't raising his effort. Great to see things turning in the right direction. What do you put it down to? Just consistency and training?

    HA - solid start to the week. Can't believe we're in April already. Don't think people take too kindly to getting beaten by the FC.

    Hamo - just keeps getting better and better for you. Amazing stuff. I think your potential is massive, if you're making these giant leaps now, don't see any reason for it to stop. Awesome work.

    Macca - an incredibly consistent block. Can't wait to see you reap the rewards. I'll warm up my vocal cords now..

    SQ - elastic laces installed in the VF's. No further dramas on the horizon (hopefully). Great weekend of running.

    FBT - a dog went for me the other day. After trying to bite me, I wafted it away with my foot. The owner (big, muscly fella), then comes over to pick a fight with me. I told him if he can't control his dog, fork out for a lead. Then I ran away. 

    Decent training Steve.

    Just looked back, 413 miles for March, which is my biggest month by over 50 miles. Going to keep the foot to the floor for two more weeks before thinking about some sort of taper schedule. (Does this mean I'm racing it now..). 
  • JooliganJooligan ✭✭✭
    Wow. What a great w/e from the thread.
    Standout training performance: NE's MP run
    Insane stuff from Hamo again rewarded with yet another PB.
    That's seriously good running in the duathlon Joe and shows what a bit of run focused training does for you. How far up the road was Skipper btw?
    300M in March for me even with my Sunday off. Wasn't tempted to do anything yesterday as I'd rehydrated with several pints of apple juice. Think it must've been off as I didn't feel rehydrated at all the next day & had a banging head to boot ;) Quads are still sore today so just a  steady bike commute done.
    Here's the second of the 3 ascents from Saturday
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    Thanks for all the comments re my dad, after a recent diagnosis he had to have his stomach removed, which has obviously bee a worry (in his 80s). But can be controlled, its a bit like having a gastric band.

    Jools - that was a tough and long day 2 weeks out !

    NE - im amazed that you think you have to slow down so much from that 14m section to get to mp. I wouldn't be able to run 14m at mp, let alone quicker than it. I think you need to rethink that.

    HA - nice set of 1k reps there. I have one more session of 3min reps pencilled in.

    Macca - cracking stats, esp the 5 longest runs totalling 153. Hope the shoes give you a boost. I think im too heavy a heel striker for a pair of those, they wont last very long for me.

    Hamo - as others have said, you are setting yourself up for 20m the day before race day ! Cracking running and progress.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited April 1
    SQ - well done on the big month and the 3rd place medal. My mudt be better than Abo was a statement not a question. As you say, ive been consistently consistent in producing consistently consistent consistency. Ive never had such a good mileage bank balance going into race day, shame i didnt do it 10 years ago.

    FBT - Im not really into checking the weather or amount of calories required for a carb load etc but i will no doubt be revising my 6.40 times table, but its quite easy in 3m blocks.

    George - I too had a slow heavy legged run today for the 9m inc strides, but i take that as a good sign, its certainly not time to feel good yet.

    Joe - amazing miles, with some real quality in there. Dont overreach now.
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