Sub 3h15



  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    Looking forward to hearing all about it. Good luck. 
  • G-DawgG-Dawg ✭✭✭
    Hope it went well, Gul. Great campaign.

    15 easy paced trail miles this morning. Could feel the hill attack session from Thursday in my legs but that's OK, just a time on feet, enjoy the views run.

    Saw you pop up on Strava, OO, so I gave you a follow to seek inspiration on how to get quicker as an old geezer.  B):)
  • Hope it's gone well for Gul today - report in please!!!
    Good trail run for you there G-Dawg.
    I was also out on the trails for a 19 miler up to Leith Hill and back - generally very pleasant along the Greensand Way but with 2,300 ft worth of climb according to Strava it was quite hard work in places. Got through it by listening to a couple of MT podcasts, including yet another shout out to Badbark on the listeners' podium.
  • GD - nice trail run.
    Lorenzo - wow, that's a lot ascent. Well done.
    So, the good news is that I got a PB. But the slightly less good news is that the wheels still came off in the last 6 miles. Official time 3:20:28, 14th overall and 2nd MV50. Got to be pretty pleased with that. Well, really chuffed actually - 10 min PB! Great to see Birch. Thanks for coming over; it was much appreciated. Had a meet-up with some of Mrs GD's family afterwards, so didn't set off home till late in the afternoon. Will post a proper report as soon as I can. Probably tomorrow.
  • Rother Valley marathon 2018 report part I

    Mrs GD and I drove over to South Yorkshire on Friday evening and stayed close to the country park. Woke up early (5am) and had some breakfast - croissants and banana. Plus some extra strong coffees (caffeine depleted over the previous week). Decided to get changed at the park as the car park attendant needed to see the race bib to let us in without paying a second time for the parking, so thought it would be easier.
    Got there in good time, about 8:10 and left Mrs GD in the car, while I went to find the changing rooms. Ended up at race HQ but was good to go. They gave me wrong directions to the changing rooms (it was directly opposite!) and set off back towards the car park. Spoke to another steward and he gave me the correct directions and I traipsed back to the building opposite race HQ!. Got changed. Didn't have any change for the lockers and decided to take my things back to the car (was heading that way in any case!). By now it was getting late, but still had time for a short warm-up (5-10 mins) and one final loo visit. Managed to remain calm - so that's some progress since White Peak marathon (ask Poacher!) Was at the start line just in time for the pre-race briefing and handed my spare top to Mrs GD. So far so good.
    The course skirted round 2 lakes in a big loop - just under 3 miles in distance. I decided to stick to my plan - despite Stevie's sand-bagging comment ;) Had some discomfort in my glutes for the first few miles, but nothing disconcerting and it soon calmed down and then finished. The final lap had a detour just before the end of the lap to a finish off the main course. There was a tent with some ipads set up for people to check lap splits (and number of laps finished just in case they couldn't keep count!) so I guess that was why they moved the starting mat back a few hundred yards so that it counted the laps before the tent. I stuck to the original location of the mat (or a decent estimate) for taking lap splits. There were no mile markers and obviously, I had auto-lap off. So it was down to the 2.9 mile lap splits. The final lap was just a fraction shorter so I just based my plan on 9 equal laps for ease of calculating pace/estimated finishing time etc...
    The GPS was working fairly well except for a few spots on the course where the current pace went haywire (one second target pace, then 10:00/m and then 6:00/m! So I was pretty much running to feel and just going by the lap splits.
    The first lap split was 22:19 but only measured 2.85 miles. Fitted in pretty well with my plan though and felt nice and easy (as you would certainly hope!) The field was fairly well spread out (71 registered runners and 51 finishers), but I did get to chat to a few runners over the course of the race. Second lap was a tad faster in 22:09 (2.87 miles), but not as much as the natural pick up in pace I would have expected before almost 6 miles and was around 3:20 (ignoring measured miles and going by laps). So I decided to deliberately pick up the pace a little bit more. 3rd lap came out at 20:22 (2.88 miles). A bit faster than I had anticipated, but still felt very easy. One or two runners were starting to come back to me and I wondered if this led to a bit of over enthusiasm. The paths around the lakes weren't ideal. A bit rough here and there and pot-holed occasionally, but nothing to make any noticeable difference I would guess.
    At some point on the fourth lap (I think), a guy came storming past. Given that we weren't particularly to even halfway, it obvious he was setting a great pace. Turns out he just broke 2:35 and won by just over 12 mins! Very impressive. On the other hand, I was keeping a more conservative pace and finished the fourth lap in 20:38. By now I estimated that I was comfortably on course for sub 3:15 if I could maintain the current pace.
  • Gul DarrGul Darr ✭✭✭
    edited November 2018
    Rother Valley marathon 2018 part II
    I didn't really notice until afterwards but each lap was getting slower - maybe I pushed a bit too hard on the third lap. Even so I was still overtaking the odd runner (not many, maybe just one or two a lap). Very difficult to say now, but I may well have been better tagging along with one of them. Difficult to say exactly where the halfway point came, but I estimated it was somewhere around 1:37. So another 4.5 laps at 21 mins each would bring me home in 3:12 perhaps. Lap 5 kept me on target with 20:46 (by now the laps were consistently measuring 2.88 miles which would be slightly under distance).
    I was now getting more confident of a PB barring complete disaster, but we all know how easy that can happen in the last few miles let alone 12! The only slight concern was the three slight inclines towards the end of each lap. And I was starting to find them more and more demanding. I would say that they were very close in part to the "hills" where I do my hill sprints although not very long in distance. Nonetheless, I think they contributed to my downfall.
    Lap 6 saw me edge over 21 mins with 21:02, which was fine in itself, but an indicator that something was going wrong. Slowly, one by one, the runners I had overtaken started  to pass me (the first one being the MV50 winner, I think!) With still 9 miles to go I was starting to struggle and it showed with a 21:49 7th lap. The slopes really were starting to hurt and my quads were aching badly and by the end of that lap I was in a real mental battle.
    I think it was on lap 8 that I saw Birch  and he gave me some encouragement. Even though that gave me a lift, it wasn't enough to stop the slide. The end of the penultimate lap came in at 24:38 :(
    I had to summon up every bit of determination I had to just keep plodding on (and it was definitely a plod now!) What ever you do, just DON'T stop, I kept thinking, otherwise it will be game over. Sub 3:15 had slipped out of sight and I was desperately trying to hold on to sub 3:20 (London GFA time for me). It's almost exactly 5 years since my dad died and I was telling myself how proud he would be and it spurred me on. For the last time I came to the "uphill" bits, and although I kept running (of sorts) rather than walking it was quite painfully slow. 
    I came towards the tent and the final turn to the finish and saw Mrs GD and other family members and they cheered me on as I tried to press on. 26:44 gave me a time of 3:20:27. So missed the GFA but it was still a 10 min PB.

  • Gul - Congrats on a massive "official" marathon pb. I'm sure your Dad would have been very proud of you. I was very touched by that. It's just lovely. I really enjoyed your report and I bet this will give you a lot of confidence for your next one. I'm so pleased for you. 
  • Rother Valley marathon 2018 part III
    Mrs GD came over and congratulated me as I slurped down a bottle of water. I was utterly shattered and hobbled over to give her a hug. Birch also made another appearance and put it into perspective. Still a 10 min PB and it wasn't an ideal course.
    I went over and chatted to the rest of the family for a few minutes before heading off for a shower and it took a while as I was really struggling to bend. T-shirt and medal were optional for an additional fee, which I didn't plump for, but still got a freebie pair of Hi-Viz socks (very nice) and a bandana. No food though which was what I was really desperate for. So I headed back to the car where I had a few supplies. By now I was shivering. It wasn't particularly cold and I had worn a thermal vest under a singlet for the race. I put my coat, hat and gloves on and got in the car and texted Mrs GD. They had all gone for a bit of a walk and I saw them heading back to the car park shortly afterwards.
    We went off for some lunch and I drank loads of tea (8 cups I think) and had a bowl of soup to warm me up. A bit of cake to finish and by the time we got up to leave I was feeling miles better and could bend easily again and the aching muscles had gone back to a more usual state. It was ages since we had seen the family, so it was a great afternoon.
    However, I did notice that even after all that tea (and the water) my urine was really really dark. I don't think I've ever knowingly been that de-hydrated before. Maybe need to re-visit my hydration strategy! When we got home I weighed myself and had lost 5lbs even after all the lunch.
    The official results placed me 14th as I mentioned with a chip time of 3:20:28 and 2nd MV50 (1st MV50 was way over 8 mins ahead and finished 10th overall). All in all a good result. Finally broke the 3:30 barrier and edging towards GFA. I would like to give it another shot in the spring and Boston, Lincs., seems a good option on the face of it. I've decided not to bother joining the waiting list for the Peddars Way Ultra. A bit of recovery and then I'll make a push for my target of 3,000 miles for the year as some base training before the New Year. Good night all :) 
  • Thanks GM- time for some sleep!
  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭
    Many congrats Gul that’s a nice read and fantastic result. Need to sort that hydration for the next one 
  • Meant to say I am glad in one sense that I didn't dip under 3:20 as it would quite possibly mean being fast enough to apply for a GFA place but just too slow actually get one under the new rules which would be really gutting.
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    well done Gul. I take your point on perhaps narrowly missing a gfa is possibly less annoying than narrowly getting it and it not being enough!

    Whilst I appreciate it's minor info, you didn't mention in your report the fuel strategy in race or anything about water stations?? 10 minutes is a great pb and I think Boston would be a good one for you as it's flat and probably reasonably close to home. 

    I hate the urine being like that. I recall after London this year in the heat I drank a bottle of water then 4 peronis. by time I got back to my hotel the colour was most disconcerting. 
  • BirchBirch ✭✭✭
    great report, Gul - and, seriously, a great performance.  

    The surface around that loop definitely isn't ideal - only a small percentage is tarmac, a larger amount is rough enough to be slightly detrimental.  
    No distance markers - you had your gadget, and a strategy, but actual physical markers can be a good psychological boost, I believe, when things become tough.  
    The small field, and the stringing out of runners, means long stretches of solo running - not helpful.  

    these things may, in themselves, be "small" factors, but they add up . . . .
    so, great work to bag a PB on there - and not just a "Bubka" one, either - 10 mins is massive !!  and a 2nd place age-group, too :) 
    a final thought - as DT alludes to - were you happy with your fuelling (carb-load) in the days prior?  I don't worry too much about "in-race" fuelling, as I've found paying attention to the nutrition in the 2 or 3 days lead-up works for me, but DT makes a valid point, certainly regarding water - does seem you may have been dehydrated  . . .    
    anyway, Gul, so pleased I made it over there to see you, and it was a pleasure to meet Mrs GD too. 
    keep chipping away - Boston could be made for you - but take time to reflect, and most importantly, enjoy your achievement   :) 
  • SBD.SBD. ✭✭✭
    Well done on the PB Gul - it does sound far from a PB course and I would have found the lack of mile markers very disconcerting.   You showed great mental toughness to get through those last two laps.
  • edited November 2018
    Gul - I'd echo what others have said.
    It's not in every race that you can get a 10 minute PB so take time to reflect on, enjoy and bask in what you've achieved. The 3:30 monkey is now not just off your back but sent packing. Sounds like it wasn't the easiest course in terms of terrain, lack of distance markers and also a spread out field, all of which make the mental aspect that bit more challenging.
    I imagine it wasn't all that warm but dehydration is still a factor to take into account - how much fluid did you take on en route?
    6.5 easy miles for me this morning to bring me up to 50 for the week.
  • Gul well done you did great on a tough course  , that 3:15 isn't too far into your future now with a bit more fluid taken in the race ,enjoyed the report too. 3000mile a year is massive and is starting to pay off and I expect you to cash in a whole lot more of it.

    2 sessions this week :
    3 x 1k on tuesday with jog back to start then
    6x400m then a 1.7mile tempo lap to finish on Thursday No other running yet and increasingly struggling to keep up hanging of the back of the 2nd group as the reps went on, my days in the leading group are currently in the past !!!!

  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭
    edited November 2018
    Good outing at the Brampton to Carlisle 10 miler today. Conditions favourable for a good time and so managed 60:48.  It could have been closer to the hour but the legs started to fail me over the last few. Average pace 6:04 per mile and the first 10k in 37:22. This races always pulls in a strong field so happy with 3rd V55 and a team prize for our Vet trio. 
  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭
    edited November 2018
    ffs oo......I'll be chasing shadows at brass monkey!!! Great time!! Well done on the team prize also. 

    Nice total, Lorenzo. 

    Leslie, good work. I wonder if you ate better off keeping away from club sessions and just establishing consistency on your own? we all tick differently, just thinking how I'd best move forward. 

    Easy 13 today with a deliberate pick up second half. First 7 averaged 8.09 pace and overall came in at 8mm so last 6 averaged about 7.50 so still easy. pretty big training week coming this week. 
  • BirchBirch ✭✭✭
    OO  - that's really top-notch running, especially for your age category (not to mention the recent NY marathon).  Well played !!    
    XC League race #3 yesterday, and, although I was near the back again, I at least was strong enough to try hard - proving (to myself) that I wasn't "weak" to drop out of race #2, but that it was a sensible decision (a lesson not to start when feeling cr*p, particularly now a bit older).  will wait for results later in week to where I figure VoGit-wise in the standings . . .    
  • Great run Gul, solid knocking 10 minutes off your PB and I am sure if you had run a mid-sized road marathon the same day you would have been comfortably inside 3:20. I am not sure you need to worry too much about hydration if you run in mid-November: running a marathon is not a normal thing for the body to deal with and it has to concentrate on a few central systems and wind others down. 

    OO, stunning 10 miler. I have put to bed any thoughts of sub-hour but it seems you still have a chance.

  • G-DawgG-Dawg ✭✭✭
    Crikey OO, that's rapid. Well played!

    Congrats on a huge PB, Gul. That's proper impressive, especially on a course that doesn't sound ideal. i also agree that dehydration at such events is a factor. I seem to need water every mile for a raced marathon as bigger events seem to supply but lesser events which have water every 3 or 4 miles is an issue for me. Abingdon last year was a case in point.

    Recovery yesterday was a round of golf at Wentworth. very lucky to get a round there, it was brilliant.

    Will hit my highest ever annual total this week, 1640. Will ease up to it tonight with some hill reps...
  • OO - That's a brilliant run really brilliant. Well done.
  • OO54OO54 ✭✭✭
    I should say that yesterday’s race is a net downhill and we had favourable wind. I have also put aside dreams of sub 60 PMJ. The last was 2014 on the same course and this was my best time since then. I must confess though, when I went through 6 miles in sub 36 I did entertain the brief hope that it could happen.
    Congrats on our the milestone G Dawg. XC is just grim Birch, I’m impressed you have a go!

  • OO - fantastic time for your 10 mile race and congrats on the age and team podium placings. You are in excellent form.
    Leslie - nice work - pleased to hear you're back out on the road. You'll soon be on their heels again!
    DT19 - nice MLR; good luck with the training this week - what's on the menu?
    Birch - good to hear you were feeling a bit stronger at the XC this time.
    GD  - not a golfer myself, but that must have been a great experience. Good mileage you are notching up.
    Thanks everyone for your comments. There was a water station on the course, so as it was a 9 lap marathon, I passed it about every 2.9 miles. However I only took advantage of it on the last 2 laps - so probably too late to make any difference if dehydration was a factor. I didn't take on any carbs during the race either. 99% of my running is done within 10-15 mins of getting up out of bed and I don't have any food or drink before or during. So race day is quite a bit different for me and something I obviously need to work on. As PMJ said on a cool November day dehydration wouldn't be a real issue - unless maybe I was slightly dehydrated before starting? I drank plenty during the day before (several litres which is normal for me). However after leaving work, I had a glass of water with my evening meal before driving over to Yorkshire and then just a cup of decaff coffee before going to sleep. Also the hotel room was very hot and took ages to cool down after I switched the heating off. In the morning, 3-4 hours before the race, I had three cups of double strength coffee.
    Regarding carb-loading, I certainly didn't go over the top (which I think I have done once or twice before and felt bloated) but I thought I had still taken on enough carbs to be ready for the marathon. I had 2 croissants and 2 bananas to eat with my coffee. 
    I have an issue with carrying gels with me in that I can't get a belt to stay in place without fixing it so tight that I cut myself. Maybe a better option would be to just carry a bottle of sports drink and kill 2 birds with one stone, sipping now and then. It's so long since I've bought / used any I can't remember now if they come with carbs and electrolytes? That would be better still.
    So a few things to work on. Maybe might need to pencil in a few dates to do some training at 9am rather than silly o'clock so I can get it right rather than leave it to the day given how infrequently I race.
    I am also having second thoughts about my pacing strategy (you were probably right Stevie!) If I set off much closer to target pace it might be more economical. I think when it came to pick up the pace on Saturday, I slightly overdid it and that probably had more of a detrimental effect that any of the other factors.
    As people have said, it might be easier in a larger field of runners. Boston is on 14th April and has a combined limit of 2,000 for full/half and fun runners. This year there were over 500 finishers and 3:15 was around 50th place, so that would be okay I reckon.
    Oh, 2nd day of rest today and only slightly painful going downstairs now :)

  • DT19DT19 ✭✭✭

    Yes, lots to take on there, Gul.

     I use a flipbelt for marathons and longer training runs. I like to practice in-race nutrition during my longer and bigger training sessions so that it is all OK on race day. The flipbelt is expensive for what it is i.e a band of lycra, but I can get 8 gels in it (i've not tried more but there would be room) and you don't notice it when on and there is none of the hassle and issues that come with an actual belt. I highly recommend them.

    Started the week off with 4 at recovery first thing. Targeting circa 50 miles this week with some mile reps planned tomorrow and then a decent tempo later in the week. Off to Cardiff all day Saturday with the local rugby club for the wales v SA game. Will be a messy day so sundays 13 will be fun!

  • Huge congratulations Gul on the pb on what sounds like a not ideal course. 9 laps would be hard mentally, especially towards the end! FWIW I think dehydration would definitely play a factor towards the end, even on a cool November day. We all sweat differently but I find even in cool weather I get quite a sweat on at marathon effort and faster. I drank at every water station at Abingdon plus took salt tablets and electrolyte gels which I'm sure helped towards my result

    Regarding carrying gels I have an armband that carrys four gels which I used for London. I don't use it anymore so you would be more then welcome to have it if you wanted to give it a try :)

    A 10 minute PB shouldn't be sniffed at though, you should be proud!

  • DT - big week indeed! Flipbelt sounds like it's worth a look.
    Stevie - thanks for the offer - would probably have to be kid's size to fit my wimpy arm!
    Photos from the marathon have now been posted and free ones at that  - who says Yorkshiremen are tight ;) ?!
  • Obviously, these photos were taken before the last 2 laps...
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