Sub 3



  • WardiWardi ✭✭✭
    TT.. good to see you making progress of sorts, hope it continues.
    LMH.. when a car is impacted it tends to mess up a load of electrics/gadgets too which all adds up.  Hope you can get a quick decision one way or the other.  Stay confident for Sunday, weather still looks good.
    Selbs.. great tempo run with a nippy finish!
    Padams.. that sounds like a strange knee niggle, sensible to cut those reps short if you weren't sure.
    Last night's club run circa 10m turned into 11.5m as the keen historian in our group wanted to run a lap around the site of the bloodiest battle in English history (Towton battlefield).  Quite a pleasant off road loop with just enough daylight left to do it.  Another 9.5m today, just avoided a wetting this morning.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    edited September 2019
    LMH - so like the P and D 6 inc 4mp, and you are expecting to hit mp?
  • Selbs - good news on the Abo number. Super speedy tempo sesh.

    TT - progress with the steady HR improvements.

    LMH - bad news with the car. Hopefully second opinion goes your way. I am favouring a conservative hit out on sunday so I can carry on training fully next week. However, if I'm going along nicely it might be difficult to resist going a little quicker. What's your PB? Having some pacing duties might just incentivise me :)

    Wardi - yes Sale club vest - a new shiny one :) solid miles last and tonight. 

    6x900m last night averaging 3:11. This meant this mornings 4:35am medium long run was on very tired legs. 
  • The electrics are fine and body work not bad at all Wardi - but the impact pushed the wheel in and damaged the suspension. You're not tapering for Sunday then?

    No, nothing like that TR.

    What's conservative sj? My PB (set at VoY last year) is 1.23.43 - I convert well rather than run fast.
    If you think you can or you think you can't you're probably right.
  • selbsselbs ✭✭✭

    nice reps SJ.

    Wardi - racking up a few miles there!

    Menn - i'll refine my target probably a week or two out from the day, see how next few weeks go.  in the back of my mind, i guess i have PB in mind (don't we all!) but maybe getting too old to threaten it.  I haven't run a a really good marathon really since 2:41 in london in 2016 - i guess if i can get back to anywhere under 2:45 i will be very happy, and even in the 2:4x range will be an improvement on last couple of years where i have been getting slowly slower in the mid 2:50s.  So i'm going to give this one a good push.  The mid week and long runs though still show i am a way off that form, but i have a bit more time.

    With the added focus i have now, i have largely cut out alcohol for the past two weeks - well since i got back from holidays, just the odd glass of wine, and been drinking non alcoholic beer as i can't quite give up beer totally!  It has meant the weight is dropping off me, so i am hoping running at a lower weight come race day gives me a bit more time as well... 

    5.5 mile easy commute this morning, will do an easy 60 minutes later.

  • Selbs - No need to hope, losing weight partly through training and better diet  will greatly improve your speed.  For me, losing 6 lbs probably accounts for 50% of why I've gone from a 3:05 to a 2.48 ish marathon runner. 
    Belated congrats to Menn, thats a swift time and to Cartman, quite a journey from sub3 in Luton to the next one 12 years later in the US. 
  • The weight loss is going to help selbs and you're not old enough to blame that for getting slower :-)
    If you think you can or you think you can't you're probably right.
  • WardiWardi ✭✭✭
    OO.. I did consult my mate and he said post hernia op to running again was about a month.  However he did lots of long walks ASAP after the op which he said did help the recovery process.
    LMH.. I will do a mini taper from now, my intention was to 'front-load' this week.  I have already volunteered for Parkrun on Saturday to take away the temptation for a 5k blast!
    Selbs.. if the weather gods are kind at Abo I would say go for the sub 2:45, your training has been pretty thorough.
    SJ.. I will look out for a shiny glistening Sale vest then!  I guess there won't be too many from your club in the race.  Good speed in those reps BTW.
  • I was off on a work trip for 3 days where I did nothing but work, run, eat and sleep, so I didn't keep up here. But I did note a fine HM by CD, a very decent one by Menn too, commiserations to LMH for having the car accident and a nice sub-3 by Cartman.

    I'm now in standard marathon training for York, so I did a training marathon on Sun with 10K tempo in the middle (which was pretty pants), and have been trying to do as many miles as I could fit in for the rest of the week. Which has become pretty ploddy, but I've done 75M now including Sun, so I should have 80-90M done for this week if not the magic 100. I don't think this is going to be a very quick marathon though -- maybe I should allow myself to just enjoy it and focus more on VLM2020. For now I'm doing the usual training in the hope that my legs get quicker again though. Two week Lakes holiday coming up, so plenty of training opportunities, though it can be a challenge to log conventional flattish miles (already swapped notes with LS!).

  • Hi Gang,

    Leg is settling nicely. A couple more days and I should be thinking about something gentle.

    What is your training MP @selbs - 6.15 ish? A decent target. Im a massive fan of MP in training and the 16 with 12 or 18 with 14 is always my race pace marker. I read somewhere 1LB in extraoptimal weight = 1 min over a marathon for a 2.45-3.00 marathoner. 
    Alcohol - Stopped boozing  over a year ago and now will imbibe on hols or have an occassional glass. I think this is a significant part of my being able to continue progress into the 2.3x range.

    @CharlieW - a 10k tempo in the middle of an lsr in a high mileage week is going to be a tough session. Is this a standard session for you?
  • selbsselbs ✭✭✭
    Well trying to get it there Menn, but not quite there yet!! Good news on the leg.
  • selbsselbs ✭✭✭
    and I don’t think I would ever manage 12 or 14 at target MP in training either!
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    SJ - cracking early mlr again, your mlrs always motivate me to get out there. I bet the feeling when you get home on a Weds after work, knowing you don't have a 2hr run to do xos you did it earlier is awesome.

    LMH - no need to worry about that 4m pace then. You can pb Sunday if you want it, I'll never get to experience that again. Go for it.

    CW - get some quicker sessions in, you dont need 100mpw after yr 100k.

    Menn - good news on the injury progress.

    I had a really hectic day today, had back ache and wasnt really up for a 15m commute home, but i had read that SJ was out at 4.35am yday, so.......15m done. Cheers SJ. Ill have a beer later in yr not off the beer pre Abo yet, im more dedicated to beer than running.
  • LMH - hmm. Sub 1:23 would be ideal but will decide day before I reckon. Legs were a little heavy in tonight's recovery run but coming back. 

    Wardi - just me I think. Hopefully new arrangements are good. I didn't mind the car parking chaos last year, I just took my time and chilled whilst others drove in every direction possible to squeeze through the exit. 

    Selbs - good stuff on the abstinence. I have cut it right back but food is another story! Seem stuck at 76kg which must be morbidly obese to proper runners lol.

    CW - I didn't realise you were returning to york. Good stuff. Is that in an England vest again?

    Menn - good news re the leg.

    TR - glad to be of service and hope the beer went down well. This weeks Tues night session into wed mlr was a tough turn round ~8 hours recovery. Left tonight's recovery run until tonight! Only a few more of them to do. You are right about not having to do it at 7pm too.
  • WardiWardi ✭✭✭
    A well deserved slurp after a 15m commute TR. 🍺   Do you leave the car there or get the train/bus to work?
    Good to hear you're on the mend Menn.
  • TRTR ✭✭✭
    SJ - 8 hrs doesnt leave a lot of time for eat, sleep, repeat. But needs must. Not sure if thats better than a double day for recovery or not, as sleep might stiffen the legs up.

    Wardi - shortest route is 5m, so ive done it as doubles in the past, but i dont enjoy doubles. So i favour running home one day and back the next morning at the mo, and run for longer in that run.
  • TR - as I'm older than you and have a handful of chronic medical issues to manage I'm not sure why you think I should be in a position to PB and you not? 

    You are training really well sj. I fear sub 1.23 may be too big an ask but I might get to watch your back gradually disappearing into the distance for a few miles at the start.

    Wardi -Is Mrs Wardi running?
    If you think you can or you think you can't you're probably right.
  • Wardi - yes, it is better the more I flex my knee if that makes sense (seems to release it). Unfortunately like LMH I am a bit of a shuffler so unless I run fast I don't pick my feet up much.

    selbs - very nice MLR, promising for Abo.

    LMH - that's a pain about the car, you're due some luck this weekend so hopefully you'll have a good run.

    SJ - sounds like you're banging out a lot of quality.

    6M for me on Weds lunchtime - knee was still sore but not a major issue (just need to kick my bum every so often on that leg to loosen it up!). Didn't fit in any training yesterday due to family/work stuff but will hopefully fit in another 6M or so today.
  • SJ - 78kg here too. I think I’ve got down to 74 before the usual comments and comparisons from the nearest and dearest. 
    Selbs - you tried Free Dam? It’s a half decent low alcohol beer from Morrison’s and others. 
    TR - look after that back👍🏻 Well done on getting out. It has to be the hardest thing about training when you just don’t fancy it 
  • Lots of quad stretching required by the sounds of it Padams.

    Grace is ill again. Mark is ill (he is supposed to be doing his first HIM in five years tomorrow) and the garage has just sent a text to say that they are still awaiting the engineers report............
    If you think you can or you think you can't you're probably right.
  • LMH - you're really having a rough time of it at the moment! Hopefully it turns around sharpish!

    selbs - you're sounding in decent shape!

    Wardi - nice mileage!

    - likewise.

    sj - very early MLR!! Good reps too.

    CW - where in the Lakes? We had a long weekend near Windermere last weekend (done no running but got a few walks in). It was my first time there and it was absolutely gorgeous!

    Menn - glad to read there's progress with your leg.

    I'm also looking to cut down on my booze consumption - after a holiday in Greece (ouzo and Mythos), Cornwall and the Lakes (loads of local ales) I've had enough of it for a bit. Hopefully it will also help shed some weight too. To put that in context I was at least 150lbs at the start of the week and race weight is 130!! As a start I need to get that down to something close to 134lbs as a training weight.

    I've upped my morning jogs from 30mins to 5m (work commute route) the last two mornings, and predictably, after 30mins my pace for HR plummets. Last night was my first 1/2 effort run (70-75% HRR) and unsurprisingly that saw a lot of HR drift too. Usually that run is current MP +30-ish seconds, and came in at 7:12/mile, so over a minute a mile off pb shape (at least).
  • selbsselbs ✭✭✭

    oh dear LMH, do your best to try and not stress about it, hard though that may be, hopefully getting out for a good run on Sunday will help.

    Top MLRunning there TR.  longest MLR i have done is 14 miles, maybe i am missing a trick there.

    SJ, don't misread my cutting back into total abstinence, i aint that much of an athlete and do enjoy a beer too much!!  But for me it's been a big cutback so is making a difference.  But tonight i have lads poker evening, so will have a few beerios for sure, but i will also take some low or zero alcohol varieties to keep a lid on it.

    Thanks for the recommendation Menn, haven't tried that yet will put it in my next shop, most of the ones i have tried so far are awful!  The german ones so far seem the best of a bad bunch (the famous Erdinger and Clausthaler unfiltered).  I also tried a little craft beer (Small beer) that is 2.1% alcohol, but didn't like that, but they also make some other ones like a pale ale which is 2.5% so i might try that.  Will try your suggestion, and also i think the Bredog nanny state.  guess it's all too big a change from the high alcohol continental lagers i like!  but i plan to try and keep a bit of discipline now i am on that road throught to Abo, just watch out post Abo while i blow out!

    5 miles recovery runs last night and this morning. LSR planned tomorrow of 21-22.

  • they are generally pants @selbs - Ghost ship IPA is one of the better ones too. 
  • selbs - it will be something different to think about on Sunday, assuming I don't come down with whatever it is either of them has of course! Mark likes the San Miguel Zero (we don't usually drink Monday - Thursday, holidays etc excepted).

    If your weight loss is as swift as your return to running TippTop it won't take you long.
    If you think you can or you think you can't you're probably right.
  • Selbs: I'd say small beer over alcohol free.  Wiper & True do a really nice one, but I don't know if they sell outside Bristol (you might be able to get it mail order).  We also had a nice one last night, but I'll have to try and remember to check the recycling when I get home to find the name!

    LMH: hope Mark & Grace improve.

    7 miles with some strides this morning.  Legs feel a bit heavy and taperish, as I've only done 5 mile jogs otherwise this week.  Came back to discover that the cat's tracker was showing he had gone for a nice walk across a busy road during rush hour.  Thankfully he managed the return crossing ok!
  • Menn -- yes my standard approach these days is to have only one quality run a week, which is both my long run and includes any speed work I want to do (block of tempo or reps), if I do any at all in the week. I have a day or two off before that so I can do it with fresh legs, and everything else is just easy volume (often very ploddy). My recovery is too poor to do any quality on successive days, and if I have more days off the volume gets too low, so it's the recipe I've settled on as working for me.

    TR -- I might at least only do training marathons on alternate weekends, and have a more modest long run with more quality in the other ones. But the general pattern is the only thing that works for me these days.

    SJ -- sadly no England vest for me this time, my performance was too poor in Chester last year to qualify again. (And my only selection race this year will be York which is also the champs so again there'll be a strong turnout, so I'll again not be selected -- but who knows, maybe next year as an MV50.)

    TT -- Keswick again. A very different feel to Windermere, where the town at least is a bit like a seaside resort; Keswick is more of a outdoorsy mecca, where every other shop is an outdoor shop and the supermarket is full of people in lycra and/or waterproofs -- I feel right at home! Staying there means we can do family stuff like theatre trips, rowing on the lake and restaurants without having to drive, and there are good walks from there too (Skiddaw, Catbells). But we drive a little way for some other walks (Scafell Pike etc). And of course it's the start/finish for the Bob Graham Round, and not far from Lorton where LS hangs out. All highly recommended :-)

  • WardiWardi ✭✭✭
    LMH.. sorry to hear about more upheaval at home.  Mrs Wardi will be spectating, she hasn't done a double digit race for nearly 2 years (seems to prefer 5k-10k).  The only way I could bribe her into a half marathon would be to enter one somewhere exotic overseas!  BTW if it serves to lift your sprits a bit I rode the bike around Sunday's revised course and apart from the one railway bridge (circa 6m) it is flatter than a billiard table. :)
    Jools.. I hope that tracker isn't infringing the cat's privacy rights. ;)
    TT.. from little acorns grow, it'll come back in time.
    There was a pleasant non-alcoholic beer at the finish of the Valencia marathon though I can't remember the brand.  Very cool & refreshing after a warm marathon.
  • Wardi: he sits and cleans his bottom in the street, so I don't think privacy is high on his agenda...
  • You have a tracker on your cat Joolska?

    Which exotic destination did you have in mind for the half Wardi.........:-) Let's hope there's no wind either though whether I make it to the start or not is anyone's guess at the moment.

    I was in the shower after my run this morning when the garage called to say that repairs had been authorised and I could collect a courtesy car  - excellent - however before I was dry and dressed the postman knocked at the door, Grace barked at him and collapsed. Emergency trip to the vets and she basically said that Grace will either make it through the weekend or not. Offered to admit her but said that as it sounded as though we knew what we were doing she was happy for us to bring her home if we'd rather.  We brought Grace home, administered her prescribed medication and got MiL to sit with her whilst we collected the courtesy car.
    If you think you can or you think you can't you're probably right.
  • It never rains but it pours, LMH.  I hope she's OK after the weekend.  Good news on the car though.

    selbs - I've just ordered from  Low alcohol beers are a bit hit and miss but I ordered a selection to try.  They have a porter and a couple of other dark beers that are really good.  The Paulaner alcohol free knocks spots of the Erdinger one IMO.

    I'm event directoring at parkrun tomorrow so I might get out in the afternoon, then a long run planned for Sunday.
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