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Sub-39 at the Stubbington 10k
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You are a jokerman. and the reason ill not use these forums anymore, i dont like rude arrogant people, who over rule everyone else, try coming across a little more polite.
As i said, im no expert and i was not giving advice just saying what works for me, and what was mentioned by other people, so who's right and wrong, you may be wrong and others maybe right, im passing on what ive read and advice ive been given, everyone is different and beleive it or not we are not all elite nor does every one want to follow those hard to understand programs,and most have full time jobs so are unable to put in loads of miles, and have to find a happy medium, its the real world use novices are running in.
If someone who runs a 34 min 10k says miles are not important, who am i to disagree, he is doing something right, and miles are important if you are training for big runs, even i know that. If you read the post properly you will see that i said i know the long runs should be easy, but i run them at an uncomfortable pace, thats what i want to do, and what works for me, its up to others to take on board what they read and take it from there, but please dont undermine people because you think that your knowledge is far superior than everyone else.
This is part of what i read yesterday.
It's not about 'getting the miles in'. It's the intensity of those miles. Pushing yourself for 15 miles per week, is better than going through the motions for 40.
I'm also doing the Stubbington 10k so will post on here.
Tendonitis Squall? I had trouble through July and August with that, saw a physio on numerous occasions and its all cleared up now.
Have not run a 10k since July but feel realy good at the moment with 5 weeks slowly built back upto almost 40 a week, did a tempo run tonight 7 miles at 6.47 and felt pretty comfortable.
Jokerman, always enjoy reading your advice, whoever your alias is at the time. Often wondered about your running, you must have some decent times behind you?
SDalyVictory......"I reckon it's more beneficial to run 30miles with these sessions thrown in than 40miles easy, you certainly feel more knackered"
Sorry, what I meant to say was 'I know from experience that it is more beneficial'
Earlier this year I was running 50 mile weeks, with minimal quality. My 13 week schedule for the GSR switched this to 40 mile weeks with up to 4 quality sessions in each week. I found my progression slow when running the 50 mile weeks, however upon starting the schedule, between may and september i took 4 minutes off of my clubs 7.5 mile handicap time, 2 minutes from the 3.5 mile handicap, and 2 minutes off of my 10k time.
Maybe the top guys are running 10/12 sessions a week. But this thread is about Paul's running who (no offence intended) clearly isnt.
I did 1.23. The quick runners are around 36 min 10k, and i dont always stay with them for the distance, its just my way of training, the realy quick one, 34 min 10k doesn't go either.
Hey, i never said i was a good runner or i know everything, cos i dont, its just nice to give a perpective of how i train, i run how i feel.
My times based on my training are,
5m---29.24---10k-37.01--- 10 m-61.49---1/2m-1.23
Thanks, i do yes, the 10 and 1/2 were on hot days, so i would like to think i could get another min of each, in cooler conditions. In the great scheme of things they are probably average times, but im peaking i think.
I joined the club last summer, with a 41.30-10k time, and 68.50-10m time and 1.31-1/2 m time, so ive done something right, for my level, im 39 also, so im never going to be elite.
I think I have achilles tendonitis...
My heel is creaking...
Hope all goes well Squall. Important thing before any training is that you are fit and well
Nice to see you Jokerman love reading your posts even if no one else does
Contrary to expectations, there's a lot of valuable training/running knowledge in there.
He's certainly helped me a huge amount in the last 12-18 months.
jokerman - Wouldn't be the first time someone said that
Tinka, your times sound very similar to mine, 15-20 seconds quicker for most distances but a few seconds slower for the half. My times are reasonably bang on using Macmillan calculators and suchlike for times across the spectrum, so not sure if you have a minute to take off the 10miler and 1/2marathon without certainly taking more off the shorter runs.
Jokerman, I was thinking reading your fairly abrasive but obviously informed approach you sound just like a fella who was on one of Squall's other threads. I forget the other alias but presume it's you as well. Is that why you hide your forum posts as you change names a lot? Why is that by the way?
What kind of times have you done, I'm presuming some good ones as you seem to have the theory behind the desire to run a lot, whereas a lot, myself included just reel out stacks of miles without much thought.
It's starting to irritate me a lot how thin-skinned people are... and how personally they take things. It's just a running forum. I come on here and take everything with a pinch of salt.
And I separate the wheat from the chaff... if I don't like a comment I just let it wash over me.
Jokerman knows his stuff.
Squall, know i should of let it go, but i do bite a bit sometimes, just felt a bit patronised, thats all, and i would not talk to people in that manner. Your not a fireman by any chance?.
Stevie g, your probably right, maybe wishfull thinking on my part, but the half had a git of a hill at the end, and i would like to think i have a 1.22 in me for the 1/2. The goals for next year are sub 37, sub 61 and sub 1.23, marathon training should help.
This post has prompted me into some reading today. Im reading about the tempo runs and threshold runs, which i was probably doing at the club runs anyway, but im getting an understanding of it.
Also, although i was aware of it but could never concentrate on doing it, is breathing patterns, i tried it on tuesday, by controling the breathing whilst still running hard, and it did seem to work. Although towards the end of the run i slipped back into very fast breating, probably 1/1.
tinka - Interesting point about breathing. The more racing I've done, the more I've started to use breathing much more consciously as another tool for pace judgement. I think this has come especially from doing a series of 5,000m races over the summer; maybe it's the fact that I'm running at close to VO2 max, i.e. getting more experience of what's happening with my breathing when I'm close to max aerobic capacity.
So for the vast majority of a 5,000m race I'll have a 2-2 pattern, but for a good few laps I can afford to let this change to a 2-1 (in-out) without dying towards the end. This in turn has helped me in 10k's - struggle to keep a 2-2 breathing pattern at halfway and I'm definitely pushing a little too hard. I think this is especially useful for races in the range 5k - 10k compared to, say, HR because HR is steadily climbing for a good proportion of the race. I also think it's good for mental toughness - if you know you've reached a certain level of perceived effort in a previous race, you know you can push it at least that hard again, so why not give it some more welly and see what happens! I'm convinced I kill myself more in races than I used to.
Agreed to a lot of the stuff above from different people.
Times wise I'm always more keen to learn on people's progressions through the times barriers then what they do now in isolation.
This is where guys like Barnsley runner and Bryn R are useful as they can tell you how they broke 40mins then all the way through to 33mins or so.
My own story started with a sub 42, and now knocking on the door of sub 37.
Would like to think this can come down a few minutes, but that's the journey we're all on!
To be honest after a cold last week and now some bizarre back strain that leaves walking a little jarred and running painful i'll settle for running without reaction for now!
tinka, sometimes the terms are used interchangeably (sp?) but strictly speaking I understand a threshold run being a subset of a tempo run. i.e. 'Tempo' refers generically to running at a pace which is hard but sustainable, but 'threshold' defines this more precisely as running at lactate threshold (LT), the point beyond which lactic acid accumulates quicker than you can flush it away from the muscles.
LT is thought to be about the pace you can sustain for an hour's racing, or close to 10M in your case, and is a good pace for a classic tempo run (warm-up, 20-30mins @ LT, cool-down). However, you could equally do a tempo run at, say, HM pace so for the same effort you can keep going for longer - obviously good for practising target HM pace for example. You can still call it a tempo run but you're not running at threshold any more (just below).
Shame I can't do Venn diagrams on here.