Shades Marathon Training



    Big G - I know it's not your sort of weather but you should be sheltered once you've come back down the first hill.   Good luck.

    Ian5 said:

    Shades-I just don't understand that if you get rejected you have to pay,never seen it before.Even though its a tiny amount I wouldn't enter for that reason but I'm sure a lot will.

    Ian - You're probably wondering why this strange ballot system hasn't sent me off into one of my rants  ;)

    Before Dublin marathon had a ballot system they had two entry prices one for runners from EU and one for non EU runners, the price difference was significant, can't remember exactly but it was a lot.   So I had expected the pricing to favour EU runners but the price is now the same for all runners, I had expected to pay an extra 40ish euro.   Much fairer as all communication is by email and has been for many years so no reason for price difference.   I think London charge more for overseas runners using postage costs as a reason but I don't know if they actually post anything to overseas runners anymore.
    I hope the €3 charge does put runners off, more chance of a place.  :)   This is the first ballot I've entered for 20 odd years, first online one ever.   When I did Berlin there was no ballot entry, just had to be very quick to enter.

    8 miles this morning.  I had intended to wait until dawn but as the forecast was for conditions to worsen I went out in the dark, milder today, rain but not heavy but a strong wind in a few places.   Despite that I had a lovely run.   If it gets worse I may drive to the gym though.
  • RcoutureRcouture ✭✭✭
    edited January 8
    Big G - Good luck today

    Shades - Nice 8 miles

    4 miles for me this morning. Shocking HR, like threshold/vo2max level at 10min/mi, so think either I am ill or HRM needs replacing. That aside the ITB seems ok but this other mystery squat thing is bothersome. Don’t want to seem like a diva but I am tempted to change this current physio again. The progress has been awfully slow compared to last time I had ITB even prior to the marathon and on this occasion they’ve not even kept me running and I’ve now got an added problem. I also need to get off Strava for a bit as am too envious of seeing folks going off on long runs. Not the best mood today 😀.
  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    Shades-Better news on the pricing then,so only the losers in the ballot essentially are paying the admin costs, have they said how many spaces are available?
    Good news about the holiday yesterday changes,we are now off to Fuerteventura in 10 days,bit of warm weather training.
    Rcouture - try changing the battery in the HRM, some models give odd readings when battery is low.  Mine will occasionally give me random high readings if there's an electrical storm around.

    Don't you think you might be a bit hasty re your physio.  Your previous physio that you thought sorted your ITB more quickly didn't do that great a job as it came back again and it shouldn't, not really that sort of injury.  This physio still got you through your marathon and with a good PB.

    Injuries and recovery are not an exact science. I assume you've stopped doing anything like squats or strength work to let that new niggle/injury heal.

    That's the big negative about Strava or any publicised training website, folk compare themselves to others instead of concentrating on doing their own training right.

    Ian - yes only the losers pay the 3 euro.   No idea how many places, the marathon has been cancelled for the last two years due to Covid so I suppose they've been checking with deferred runners if they still want a place.  I think in June there is a 2 week window to get some sort of refund too, or there has been in recent years.

    Yes, much better news for travelling and great timing for your holiday.   Have a lovely time.
  • RcoutureRcouture ✭✭✭
    Shades - Yes you’re right objectively re the physio, even if I think my magic strap and no running had a lot more to do with me getting around on the day of the race but who knows really. Think I’m just very frustrated as it feels like I should be raring to go after so much rest and rehab. I have indeed stopped the strength work until my next appointment. Re Strava I normally don’t care about things like comparing paces. It’s more just the reminder that I can’t run very far at the moment which is what I like doing best. 
    Rcouture - injury is horrible and it grinds us all down at times.  Not helped by seeing other runners out there training happily.

    Maybe you just hoped with the extra rest over Xmas etc that you'd bounce back more quickly.

  • Cal JonesCal Jones ✭✭✭
    Rcouture, I feel your pain. Having been benched for so much of last year, I know how awful it is and what it can do to your fitness. If you want to change your physio, give Toby a try, but it may be worth waiting a bit longer and see how you go first.

    Hope Big G is has been dreadful in most places. Glad you had a good run though, Shades.

    I had a bit of a road trip today...A few Chasers had been thinking of attending Kingdom parkrun in Kent, which is basically in the middle of nowhere, so I asked Tunde if he fancied driving. Another Chaser friend and a guy I know from Tooting parkrun asked if there was room for them too so we all bundled into Tunde's car and he drove us there (as it turned out, no other Chasers made the trip, but their loss). 
    It's a really lovely location - a woodland area that is home to mountain biking and various fitness activities as well as a big cafe that's like a big treehouse sort of thing... Not that it's in a tree but it's made out of full size tree trunks. Pretty cool.

    The course is a very wiggly trail course, mostly stony trail but with a bit of mud in places. However, considerably better than the surface I ran on last week at Homewood. It's not flat but the ups and downs are fairly mild...however, it's three laps and what seemed like an easy incline on lap 1 got a lot tougher by lap 3. Fortunately the rain stopped for the duration of the parkrun so we managed to stay dry.
    I obviously went off a bit fast on the first lap (mile 1 was 9:09 which seems relaxed enough for a 5K but was probably a bit fast for the terrain) as my legs felt like jelly on lap 2 and I was a full 40 seconds slower, then over 10 minutes for the last one. My time of 30:09 was rather underwhelming but given I was nearly 35 minutes last week, it's better than that, at least. My HR was pretty high - average 182 and peaked at 192 - but aside from the run feeling rather hard, I felt light headedness or scary chest pain or anything. 

    We all piled into the cafe after for coffee (and a flapjack in my case) before Tunde drove us back. It was a good morning.

    As Kingdom was my 90th different venue I now have to think about where I want to do my 100th, as 100 different venues is a thing in the parkrun tourist community. A new one started at Southall today, so maybe that won't be too hard to get to.

  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    It really was terrible weather for the whole race, and it wasn't just me, errrrm, 'commenting' on it (i.e, there was lots of swearing going on, and not just from me!).  It rained the entire race, but the main issue was the cold.  Some were out there in just a shirt and Adam Holland was there in just a vest, but in fairness even he looked totally miserable on his second lap!  I don't tend to suffer too much with the cold but even I was cold in a jacket, especially for most of the second lap, and I kind of felt my legs seizing up.  It was incredibly tempting to walk some of it, but then I feared the legs may get worse, and this thought helped keep me gong.   Got it done in about 3:50 (I will confirm the exact time as I did forget to stop my watch), which I am fine with in the circumstances.  I can laugh about it now, but it was just stupid conditions really and everyone (me included, no doubt) looked quite miserable out there.  Feet and shoes are totally saturated, as are gloves and jacket.  I may have to wear a previously unused pair of shoes tomorrow if I can't get these ones dried out, but that is fine.

    Speaking of AH, he did a parkrun first in 17:40, but that meant he was late getting to the marathon....I think probably 10-15mins late.  He overtook all but one I think as I don't think he won the event as there was a guy out there flying along really well, even in those grim conditions.

    Just hoping I recover well as I do feel particularly un-spritely at the moment, and also hoping for better weather tomorrow (the forecast is better).
  • Cal JonesCal Jones ✭✭✭
    Well done Big G...I've done a miserable half marathon where it was like the Somme but never a full one in those conditions. Fingers crossed for tomorrow.

    edited January 8
    Big G - well done, sounds grim.   I did a Plym Trail in similar conditions where it got colder as the day went on and swore I'd never do another winter one.

    Would you normally wear the same shoes on consecutive days, really not a good idea.  Wear the new ones.   Shoes need recovery time too.  Will really help your feet and legs to wear fresh shoes.  Doesn't matter if they're straight out the box.

    I saw on FB about Adam, and Davey said he was suffering from hypothermia.   He's always so unprepared for his races, he had to DNF DD one year as he wasn't dressed warmly enough.  He was in the lead at the time and had to pull up.

    I do hope it's much better conditions for you tomorrow, can't be as bad as today 😉

    Good luck.
  • Cal - CBR is very low key, mixed terrain.  Could be considered an introduction to off road marathon/ ultra with about 1/3 off road but then in makes choice of footwear trickier!  Well done on 90 different runs I’ll start looking at the diary for a Saturday for JF.

    Big G - well done big g, hope tomorrow goes well then you can really focus on your final 3 and achieve your goals.  Have you seen Marathon Talk has run it's course and ended.  I haven’t listened to one for a few years.

    Shades -   Signed up for the CBR 13th March as my next marathon.  Agree with Ian, the admin fee seems odd, but wouldn’t deter me from entering.  Funny you mention London, I was on their website yesterday reading about the overseas charge.  They said it’s to offset carbon footprint (getting on a plane etc) they direct the full change to a company that use it for projects.  

    Rcouture when I got injured/ had my fall I managed to switch off Strava, tbh I hardly notice it now in comparison and just get in with my training without too much concern.  It’s a rubbish place to be in but it will get better.

    Got a fair amount of studying done but have a busy 4 weeks ahead of me to get back on track! 6 miles this afternoon just to keep ticking over.  Will break up the studying tomorrow with a shop and a run. 
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Robert, I saw that about Marathon Talk.  I also haven't listened to it regularly for a long time.  I did listen to the one with Sian Longthorpe from last year, mainly because she is local, and as a man they were well known locally on the running scene for winning or doing well in lots of races.  As a man though they won the DD, but as a woman went back and did well there in 2021, and the DD was quite a big part of the interview (I think the interviewer won the ladies race the year Simon won it out right).  It is something I know very little about and I get myself in a muddle sometimes (I have rewritten this several times...), but I kind of knew him at school, although knew his older brother a bit better (both turn up to the tri club on occasion).  Sian does talk very briefly about Chair as Trotters entered her into DD as Non Binary, so not eligible for prizes.  She was totally fine with this but I think she has a desire to enter races as a woman, which she mentioned is allowed in America, where after the interview she has since raced I think.  Episode 587 it was.

    Shades, I have decided to wear the new shoes.  I do ideally prefer to do a short run in a new pair to get the laces right, but I will do that before the event.  Yes, it has crossed my mind more than once that I won't have to do these types of events again in terms of chasing numbers!  I do like them but as you know I prefer the larger events.  I have been lucky with the weather though - from 12th Dec to 9th Jan I will have done 6 events, and only yesterday was really atrocious weather.  

    Didn't sleep great, but this is often a problem after a marathon.  Feeling okay though and the weather currently looks like it will be better than yesterday!  Fingers crossed.
  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    Big G-Impressive getting it done yesterday and getting back out there today.Good luck.
    I've been really lucky in my races can't remember a bad weather day,then again I've only raced abroad between October and April.
    Big G - although you wrote that really well, I still got a bit confused about the gender stuff.   :/

    Glad you've decided on the new shoes, that's all I do a short pre race run for in new shoes is to get the laces right.   Fortunately the days of breaking shoes in are well gone.

    Robert - CBR is on the Shadies list.   :)   is there an ultra option too?

    London's 'green mission statement' really is a load of crap.   So they've been overcharging overseas entrants for years and the existence of carbon footprint wasn't even recognised until a couple of years ago.   So what about the cash they've had from that stream of income for the last 40 years?

    Ian - that's a very rash statement to make about the weather.  ;) hope you're not tempting fate.    DD is in June and the year that Adam Holland DNF'd out due to the weather the temperature dropped to 5 degrees and conditions had been good at the start and most runners were not prepared for the weather.   There were quite a few that couldn't finish.   I had run Cork 5 days earlier in 26 degrees.

    10 miles this morning.   Weather is much better today but a cold relentless wind and even though the sun is out the feels like temperature will be no higher than 4 or 5 degrees for Big G's race.   Hopefully they will be sheltered on the course.

    50 miles for the week for me.

    Gym later, leg session today.
  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    Shades-Suppose I had a bit of rain and wind at the end of DD last year,I nearly got hammered at my track marathon but it stopped just as we started.
    Big G-It is getting more complex around gender in races,and for RD's it will probably get harder as it becomes more common,no matter what is decided I can guarantee there will be complaining.
    Ian - trust me that bit of wind and rain were nothing compared to the cold year.   We all had to be wrapped in blankets after the race and sat inside huddled together.   The ambulance followed a friend of mine in for the last couple of miles as she was in such a bad state, she was crying all the time too. Then they wouldn't let her go until she had changed into dry warm clothes.   
    I'd rather have the hot one (28 degrees) than go through that again.

    Re gender, I noticed when I entered Cork and also the Dublin ballot that there was only a choice of male or female, no other option. 
  • Cal JonesCal Jones ✭✭✭
    Big G, I always sleep like crap after a marathon...achey legs I think, and maybe a bit of adrenaline left in the system. Hope you're having a good run.

    Shades, that sounds awful!

    I finally got my three windmills run done today...started with the one in Brixton before heading to Wandsworth for the little one there (that's the one with no sails that I'd run past umpteen times without noticing it was a windmill) and then on to Wimbledon Common for the lovely windmill there.
    Despite it being above freezing, there was a bit of slippery frost around Wimbledon Common so I had to slow down and be careful there. Perhaps it's because it's up on a hill, I don't know...annoying though.
    Run felt like hard work...legs are probably fatigued from the parkrun yesterday. I was hoping to do 18 but was on 16 close to home and decided I was too bloody knackered to do another two so I just did the one I needed to get me home for 17 miles. Still got a few months yet before Manchester.
    Not so happy with HR though. Perhaps heart is also tired from parkrun but it got pretty high on the hills.
    Cal - you're very dedicated to your long runs.... I'm completely the opposite, wondering how long I can get away with not doing them.

    Your higher HR won't be because of tiredness.   If heart is tired then you will struggle to get it higher.  Resting heart rate will be raised if tired/ill etc, training heart rate will be lower.   That's why max heart rate tests should be done when fresh and rested.  If you run races on consecutive days, such as marathons, HR will be lower on day 2, won't feel any easier though.

    I'm trying to picture a windmill with no sails, very unusual.

    Some more newbies in the gym today, but not getting in the way.   Next Sunday gym instructor is going to show me some leg/glute stuff using the TRX which they've just had secured to a wall.  I've used it a little when we used to do circuits.
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Much better weather today although it was cold at the start. I opted for a long sleeved top with gloves, which was fine for me all the race. It did threaten to rain about 20mins in, but it didn’t really materialise and stayed dry for me all race (as I was leaving it started to rain a bit). It was actually reasonable running conditions - a huge difference compared to yesterday!

    I was feeling pretty good up to about 18 but then developed stomach cramps and from 22 it was a run/walk, finishing  in 3:55. Again, similar to yesterday, nothing to write home about for me in terms of the time, but I got it done and that was the main objective this weekend. A friend is doing her 100th there in August so I may go down for that. 
    Big G - well done, glad conditions were much more comfortable today.

    So that will be your last double for quite a while, I doubt you're sorry about that right now.   ;)

    Hope the stomach cramps have eased and you can enjoy your food tonight.

    Is that a Trotter doing her 💯 in August?
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Shades, never say never, but I can’t see me doing another double this year. If things go horribly wrong between now and May then I would, but other than that I can’t see it this year. It’s not a Trotter but she is often first lady at Plym Trail - Debbie B. She was there both days this weekend and she mentioned August to me today. AH was there again today but did the ultra for some reason. 

    Just so you’re aware, the RED events are trying to get permissions for one in Feb - February 26th. (26.2). Not confirmed yet. 
    Big G - I think she did all 4 at RED? she's a good runner.  I don't know her though.  She must like these sort of events.

    So if February RED event goes ahead I guess you'll do that instead of Goodwood?  

    If it's balmy weather I might consider a late entry, I'll see.

    AH is doing Brathay 10 in 10 again I think.
  • Cal JonesCal Jones ✭✭✭
    Well done Big G - can't have been easy with the stomach issues. Ugh. this. So it seems it was used for pumping water rather than grinding grain. I didn't know windmills were used for things like that but apparently they were.

  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    Big G-Well done yet again.
    I decided to go for 16 today to see how it felt,as it went on I realised I had taken a wrong turn,headed down to the front as I knew I'd have the wind behind me for a few easy miles,3 miles of bliss with a 20mph wind pushing me along the front.Turned and had a bit of a headwind but it was sheltered so not too bad,ended up finishing with 17 due to my wrong turn.
    Cal - that's beautiful in a slightly weird way.  Did the sails fall off or they just removed them when they didn't need it to pump water anymore?

    Ian - seems like you could be marathon ready for Cyprus after all?  That must be your first long run for a while.
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Cal and Ian - great runs for you both!

    Shades, I used to live on a road that had an old windmill with no sails, and there’s one up the road from me now as well. I’d always assumed that as they’re not maintained/used, the sails are just taken off. 

    Debbie only did Day 1 of the quad and did 3:30 I think. She’s a teacher and struggles to get away much with two young kids so is a bit limited with race options at the moment.
  • Ian5Ian5 ✭✭✭
    Shades-I thought it was,but when I looked I actually did 18 4 weeks ago so not along ago as I thought.
  • Big_GBig_G ✭✭✭
    Crap sleep again so sat here yawning my head off.  I am glad I don't have another event today, particularly on that course, as I think the last hill back up to the finish would finish me off ;)  Quads quite sore, and hip flexors quite tight at the start, so just a 3-mile very slow recovery run this morning, and things did get easier through the run.  I will be walking up to work with OH in a bit and I have told her we should probably leave 5-mins earlier than usual to account for my slow and shuffling walking style at the moment!  I am quite tired and 6 in 4 weeks is a lot for me, so I will be taking it easy this week in terms of running, and just do what I fancy, with a view of hoping to get back on it next week in terms of training.  There is a series on Zwift that starts today so I may jump on those and just take it steady. 
  • RcoutureRcouture ✭✭✭
    Big G - Well done on no97

    4 miles for me before work this morning. HR at least not as wild as last run but a long way to go. Knee still dodgy but it’s more this new issue under the kneecap rather than the ITB. Rest tomorrow then go again on Wednesday when I also have physio with the head of the practice to check out this new problem since my usual physio couldn’t work it out. 
    Big G - I'm not surprised you're tired.  Hopefully you'll have a decent sleep tonight.

    Was that your highest ever week's mileage?

    8 miles this morning, milder, much more comfortable weather for me running.   Steady drizzle, soft rain, which I like although I have got wet feet again.  Had a decent run despite sore legs from the gym.
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