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Moraghan Training - Stevie G
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Nice work on the long run Bus.
WAVA - I have tickled the early 80s with 5k &10k. If I reach my targets for this year it would put me around 83%-84%.
Age bests at the longer road distances are inevitably harder I assume because there are hundreds of thousands doing it compared to a handful of old gits still doing track races.
Interesting to hear your plans for Wokey SG. I am feeling positive now I've managed 30 miles in the 7 days since resuming running and I feel like I can jump to 50 miles next week but most likely with no quality, just easy running.
I am considering binning the London Marathon and focusing on Reading Half and then doing a middle distance triathlon in June (Slovakia). Its a Championship race I qualified for with my GB race in Denmark last year. It's basically the 'Challenge' equivalent of the Ironman World Championship race. Challenge are the next biggest race organiser/competitor to Ironman.
I'll probably do both though.
Bottles of wine that is.
Good to hear the foot is letting you run again Reg.
Six miles for me early on. Best run yet, and for that very reason I cut it short.
The 90% WAVA is a level that I've noticed has escaped all sorts of runners who when younger were serial winners at a local level. Note one J. Baker, 600 plus 80% WAVA but only one at 90%. However, since that was a XC we can safely ignore that one.
As for old gits on the track - Andrea W. I note in 2013 ran two track races in the same afternoon, getting an AG of 93.93% for a 3000m and 94.31% for the 1500m.
When I told her of this feat she replied with 'Age Grade! what's that?'.
I guess when able to knock off 90% WAVA, the runner is still pretty well in the mix as a competitor still.
🙂
I bet you do London Reg
Oh and Matt (L) - you are completely bonkers!
Steady club run for me Thursday, hilly route and topped up to 7.5 miles after so happy with 7m/m ish.
Day off Friday then parkrun this morning, first “win” and a Pb at my home venue, 18:49 so only a bit off my best at Burgess park (18:24) on a muddy/gravelly course. Could definitely do spikes over flats which were useless at points.
Tried out a new (to me) gym afterwards. Want to start this once a week just to build some strength back up for cycling and to get a bit leaner/stronger in general.
Nice read Scott. Your posts always make me feel how miniscule my own self obsessed worries actually are. Sounds like you're making a great fist of things though.
Reg- we may end up sharing some of Wokingham together, have no idea how it'll go. In a half marathon there's usually a good deal of running off people, my pb there years back was sticking in a good group just a bit faster than I really wanted to go, and I think it lasted for ages.
I had thought the Women and Vet Adjusted (WAVA) scale was based off the absolute world records, not just age grade ones. Should have realised though, as I was once on the start line with a woman who had hit 99.9%!
It just benefits you to pick out the more obscure distances, AND keep running later!
)
(look forward to doing the Ealing road mile as a 100 year old
ps Bus - nice longrun before work. Just gazumping my 15 Thursday you weasel haha. And i'd taken a luxurious late start of 10 at work.
So it was a F OFF yesterday, and had vaguely planned to jog with or pace a Dasher clubmate round Wycombe. On checking though, they weren't sure where they'd go, and who was coming and hadn't confirmed by the time I fell asleep
In the end I fell asleep at 10!, and slept through to 12 Saturday (!), so just did my own 6miler at 2pm, which is a strange time for me.
Tadley tomorrow..where my XC started in 2006. Completely different course unfortunately. I may have a little jog round the "classic" parts after, although i'm not sure if it's fenced off or anything now - as owned by someone who didn't want it on the course anymore.
Bus I actually typed a post last night wondering how the long run/work/drinking was going to go but it disappeared and I couldn't be arsed typing it again.
This is the second go at this one. Bloody iPad.
Long run today which was supposed to be around 2.45-3 hours so I dropped my van at the garage as it needed 3 new tyres. Ran down to the parkrun and had planned on going round there a couple of times and then heading onto the canal. Due to the hail, sleet and snow, when I got there it had been cancelled as it was dangerous. It's a 1.5 mile loop roughly with a couple of inclines, bit of trail and Tarmac and half of it was frozen hailstones and ice.
Ended up just running multiple loops of the course in sleet for nearly 3 hours. I was absolutely piss wrapped, covered in mud and frozen but got a decent 26.3 miles in 2.53 so 6.34 ave. around 1500ft of climbing in it too, not sure how many laps I ran but I said hello to the same people a few times.
Bus thus proving he has the powers of prophecy
I should add. A Sub 3 hour marathon as a training run is pretty damn good going, and in those conditions too. Well done.
🙂
Yep, that is truly mental Matt.
Who does full distance training runs for marathons
You'd be surprised by just how many do. It's pace what kills, not distance.
Why stop at 22-24 miles if your training for a marathon?
Kipchoge is reported to do 40k tempo runs and he's not a bad un. ;-)
Because for the vast majority of runners, the risks massively outweigh any gain beyond a certain level?
It's great you're in that small amount who seem to handle it with a cigar on.
I think even doing 18-20s would shatter me to bits.
That did make me laugh Reg!
Powers of Strava rather than prophecy Ric - just as good
SG - My life is no worse than any of you guys I tell you!
Thanks Ric
IOWER - Yes I was at Stubby, hard when I get to know hundreds of people, so many faces flash past me!
Good to get longun done before 8 Bus. Miss those days ..
We had an exceptional day here at the show. Super busy all day and by far the best performing stand .
Got out for 5km in between cashing up and sorting things out for tomorrow. Smooth but hard work even at 7:30s, icy though Just manages to get a seat in the restaurant. Surf and turf now the steak is back in. Yummy.
Long day again tomorrow 8-6 on the stand , plus pack down and then drive home and unload van, then move house Monday but I have to work 9-2 first !
The worst part is that a bottle of red is your weekly allowance!
Good run Matt: has to be good for the head as well as the body. It is those days when everything seems to be against you and you still go out for a decent run that make the rest of the training seem a bit easier. If you can the hard ones then the next hardest ones become the hard ones and then you can those and it is a spiral that is hard to stop.
Marathons are a bit odd as they sit on a physiological transition. Our bodies store energy for us to run and make that available. As you run further and further, that store is eventually used up and you hit the wall when you change from short-term storage to long-term storage. There is no definite point at which that change happens so for guys such as Matt, a sub-3 marathon in training does not get too near that transition so it is OK. For slower and less efficient runners, such training would hit the transition and it would be a futile exercise in pain.
Put simply, if you are good enough to run a sub-3 mararthon in training then doing so is good. It is still the best part of a minute per mile than race pace so is an easy one.
I was probably the coldest I've ever been on a run at the end (with the exception of one particular fell-race) and borderline hypothermic, despite hat, gloves, long sleeve merino and wind-proof. I could hardly unlock the back door!
Think I'll have a nap now!
I got a longish one in today, I left just as the snow turned to rain unfortunately but I just about nailed the outfit. It wasn't until the last couple of miles that I was starting to get cold. I use an Odlo base layer which isn't wool as I find that holds the wet too much.
Last few miles my ankle was a bit sore and my groin was also complaining but nothing too bad. Happy to get 16 miles in the bank.
ML, that is an awesome training run! I also admire your tenacity to run loops of a course deemed unsafe
Good running Reg and Bus, I hope the cold snap doesn't persist too long.
4 miles easy yesterday at 8:12/mi for 76.2%HR - a bit high for such a short run, and not the fastest. May have been due to pretty much jumping out of bed and running to fit it in, but felt a little congested too.
So, Storm Force 10 today. The weather forecast during the week suggested a wash out and high winds - thankfully the majority of the rain passed last night, and so we only had the gales to contend with.
The course is a standard Cornish one, gently undulating in the place of flat terrain, and some stonking hills for good measure - watch said that it was just under 600ft in 10mi, whilst that's not massive, it was concentrated in three hills. It's an out (2mi), loop (~5.2mi), return (~2.8mi) course, but the finish line is about 0.8mi away from the start, and so turns out to be net-downhill.
Did a 2mi warm up starting at the race HQ at Camborne College and finishing at the start line at the edge of the town, and then found my place in the starting field - somewhere between sub-7 and sub-8 min/mi. Not sure how I was gonna play the race, I felt this was a good fit.
Klaxon goes, and it's a fast downhill mile down into Barripper, comes in at 6:39 and I'm feeling pretty good despite not running anywhere near this for some time. I may pay for this later I think to myself, and so try to rein it in. Next mile features the first climb, as well as some gentle undulations taking you up to Carnhell Green, where the course starts the loop. This one came in at 7:15, a bit more like it, but still fast given the climb. Next up is a steady descent over about 3 km, going through Wall and heading towards Leedstown, where the loop doglegs. There's a steep climb here, and the two miles come out as 6:43 and 7:15 - trying to make the most of the downhill without going too far. Miles 5 and 6 see the runners heading towards Praze-an-Beeble before doglegging again, with mile 7 taking us back to Carnhell Green. These are gently undulating and the miles are 7:19, 7:19, 7:20. Starting to feel as though I've overcooked it in the first part, through 5mi in 35:15, and 10k in about 44 mins. It's time to just keep plugging and try to keep it consistent. So mile 8 sees us heading back towards Barripper, whilst mile 9 takes us back down the hill that we first encountered, and start to go up the starting downhill... and what a hill it is! These come in at 7:15 and 7:46, not far to go now, I keep telling myself. The final mile features a bit of a climb past the startline, before descending to the college - I don't have much left in the tank, so can't push it as a few people keep passing (despite me passing them on the hill...) A final dogleg directs us towards the finish line in the college grounds and I hear heavy, fast footsteps behind - time to get a sprint on! I manage to keep matey behind, with a final mile of 7:32.
Clock showed 1:12:29, when I passed, like my watch. 7:15/mi for 88.6%HR, not a balls out effort, but still a time I'm pleased with! Plan for an easy out, tempo return clearly went out the window
There were a good number of people that I know went sub-60, including the winning lady, so some fast times despite the course and weather.
8 weeks until Reading now, and so I think some more long runs will help make a difference, as well as a return to the track
I did 10miles off road mainly (90% I measured it) today, but only got a bit cold in the thumb ends. My gloves are mainly waterproof which may have helped.
Decent race Matt. Hilly races are something my joints don't appreciate much these days. Going up isn't the problem, it's the steep descents which do the damage. On training runs I almost walk down some hills.
🙂
What a dreadful day for weather today! Well done on fitting decent to monster level runs in Bus, Ric and Reg. A 16 is very tidy today.
Matt - that's a hard one to look back at in the log, splits al over the place
But in keeping with the hills. Decent turnout - anything a bit flatter for another 10miler in a couple of months? If you can travel to Reading, then how about the Maidenhead 10miler a few weeks after?
I've another 10mi on the 4th March, on the Granite Way (part of the Devon coast-to-coast cycle path). Should hopefully be less hilly! Now just to decide whether to have a stab at a fast 10k in a fortnight, or get a long run in.
Unfortunately my issue is that I don't drive, so I have to rely on the generosity of my partner for lifts to races
So official time was 1:12:30, 125th of 580. Top 3 were sub-55, with the winner in 53:36, and top 19 were sub-60!
Tadley XC today for me then. My 4th turnout in 6 in this series, that's my highest for a huge amount of years.
Furthest distance away of all the XCs (I think, with only the Bracknell...well Lightwater) one coming close. 50mins, probably 40miles or so.
Tadley was my first XC back in 2006, but aside from the long drive, and the parking venue, everything else was changed. One thing that never changes, is how quick you go from having one hour and loads of time, to 20 mins to the start and you haven't got all your gear on, and haven't warmedup /attended to business thoroughly.
Saw TVT's Louise, wow, this really is a blast from the past, not sure she's done these for yonks. And bar this little resurgence in 17/18 I've barely done more than 1 year for a while. Little chat, then quickly seen off by her husband and dog
All manner of hats, thermals and layers were seen, but having tried a couple of variants over the years, I usually find vest is plenty, backed up with some deep heat, football days style!
Years ago I lamented the changed to the "original" (in my days) course, with the glorious stream jump and ploughed field absolute slog to the finish.
They took that out, and it was mainly woods and trails.
THIS year, it was a completely different race, turning the other direction from the parking and wandering for 10mins to a huge field.
Rob had briefed us that there was 200-300m to run then a steep narrow long downhill, so try and get in position then
The longest EVER pre-race briefing from the director, in absolutely freezing conditions. One mile was my "warm up", but today I think anything more wouldn't have done anything. Although I was breathing pretty heavily when passing our boys on their even skimpier warmup, and told me to ease down. I'm not sure I was particularly motoring, it was just a cold and breathy day!
We're off, Dom from Handy Cross has rocketed off like a maniac, as is his way
We've our top senior lineup out today, of Samson, Lee, Bayliss and me. I'd edged Mr Bayliss last week, but he's strong on these sort of more traditional TVXC courses. Last week was quite unusual in that it was almost Saturday league XC fare.
Our Vet side is lacking our top guy in Chris B, and after a week of cajoling Jock Itch we couldn't get him there. With a couple of others missing, we've had to absolutely risk Rob Mc, who is a phenomenal runner from days gone by, and even in his 50s is still quality. However, he's just got back from injury....
So a real awkward one to compete with Windle, as we need to beat them and get a 1st really. Beating them 2nd v 3rd won't work as well, as they'd have their 3rd discounted, we'd pick up 2nd, and still be behind them by (possibly 2 points)
Anyway...; down the hill, loads of really boggy stuff, like throw you off your stride completely stuff. Sticky, and hard to pick the right path without bounding around like an absolute gimp
It's about half a mile in, and there's this strange little stream to leap, and over and up a short climb.
I've only just managed to get past Dom, and wish him well. One day he'll set off slower, one day.
An older chap from Burnham comes past, what the, I think. Who's this guy?! I'm half shocked by the ferocious nature that he monsters by!
Plenty of mild cursing at getting stuck in bogs here and there, and taking wrong steps, and it's pretty clear this is going to be slow and hard work today!
I can tell I'm not taking Mr Bayliss today. On the close sections, he's a graceful lander plotting skilful paths, while I land and take half of the woods out on my feet
Burnham dropped off as quickly as he'd emerged, and I'm up with McCoy from Reading. I know he's a pretty sharp chap, low 16s sort of 5k, recent 1hr 15 half guy, but XC is a real leveller at times.
There's a mad downhill to a fallen tree completely blocking the way. You literally had to ease down the gears hold the tree to avoid smashing into it, then duck under. Awkward if you're over 5ft 5.
Steward shouts some advice about this gully being slippery, as we head down a steep 5metre enclosed in muddy walls little section. I take a minor spill but stay on my feet, shout something about the steward being right, and on we go.
Wargrave comes by, tells me to have a good one. I think, hang on son, it's early doors, I might see you a bit more, but I know he's quality this guy, so I won't. Only surprise is that he's this far back. And in fairness, i'd said similar to Dom earlier
Emerge at a grassy park section, which i'm not even sure now if it's a part of the original field or not. It can't be surely, as we didn't climb back up enough this early!
Anyway, I've slightly eluded Mr McCoy, and Rob F surprises me with a "you're in 8th, but Rob from Windle" is just behind.
Darn I think, around a mile in and one of the rivals right behind to battle!
On we go a bit, and it's one really varied course, you're not quite sure what's coming next.
Rob Windle gets just ahead, but then takes a full spill. "You alright?" I shout back, but I can hear he's quickly back up, and just behind. Can't see that being decisive at all I think.
We carry on, and i'm half wondering when the "Hill" will kick in, as I've heard there's 2 laps, and you do the hill we'd gone down earlier twice.
Through some more trudgy stuff, and there's a sharp turn, and an even sharper turn again through some stream. From the picture after, it looks nothing, but from the angle with branches in the way it was awkward. I'd gone through it, and the steward shouted something, and I half stopped in case I was going the wrong way, but I was off again. It was a dodgy course for almost complete stops in places.
I'm now not sure at all how close people are behind. I can't really hear anything, so for 2-3miles i'm in effect running on my own, in 8th, half worried I've gone off course as it's so damn quiet! Occasional sightings of a few ahead of me on long straights re-assured me, as did the tape and arrows! Marshals seemed to have disappeared for a long while!
A strange section out of the woods on some random grassy stretch led to a "hill" which wasn't too bad, and I really didn't have a clue if I was on lap 2 yet, or if this was still lap 1. I was getting a bit disorientated!
Lap 2 i'm told now was not the same, there was 1 long and 1 short. Goodness knows which was which! It has suddenly dawned on me that no-one behind is catching me, and I'm not catching anyone ahead. Doing 7min miling, i'm really wondering what is going on here
The mud is still very deep in some places, but not as consistent as the first lap, it's almost like the herd of runners have stomped some of it down.
Started to recognise a couple of features, including a 5metre steep super deep mud climb, which was hard work, and another rampage through the stream. I have no idea if this is the stream at the bottom of the hill we originally went down or not, no idea, it can't be surely!
Miles roll on, and we're over 4.5miles, so expecting 5.4m I'm starting to fantasise about the finish. Legs feel fine, but the breathing has shown it's been hard work today.
NOW, the final climb kicks in, not too bad, but feels long. Luckily Rob F is on the hill, and tells me to relax, as I have a good 40secs on (presumably!) Windle.
My stomach is at that "about to blow" stage, which is normally a sign of working at the right level, and I just need to get to the top. Last 200-300m grassy stretch watching my clubmate Rob and a Bracknell guy go over the line, and easily over for 8th, with loads of room behind.
YES! Phew, thank goodness that's over. Average pace of 6.57 probably says it all today! Only 5.23miles on the watch, rather than the 5.4m billed, but would be easy to lose some tracking in woods and circular bits.
Never done a race combining so much mud in such cold conditions.
I was utterly frozen facially, and felt pretty borderline delirious after. If that had been much longer, or in humid conditions it'd have been a nightmare. If there had been 2 exact laps, then that would have been even worse!
So 8th again, Graham and Rob B from my boys were ahead of me this week, but still a few decent scalps behind. Both Reading boys, Rob at Windle, older traditional rivals much further back and clocked a guy who had beaten me at Handy Cross a good few positions behind too. I knew I should have been beating him, but that lost shoe rucked that up!
Datchet had 3,4,7 and 8, and give 29th for vet 1, but vet 2 would have been a fair chunk lower. Rough estimate is that we're ahead of Windle today, but Reading are a mystery. We think they had 1,11,13, with 13 the vet, and had a fair few 20-30s, but all depends on the vet...
Really need a 1st today, as that'd tie it up with Windle. I think a 2nd, even beating Windle's 3rd, would put us 2 behind for the final round, and asking a lot, just to tie.
Either way, that's 5 races and we're only 3 weeks into 2018.
Hopefully this achey knee/quad wear off, and are just down to today's tough course!
To complete the XC reports, as PMJ says, I was also at Tadley. Challenging, arguably overly so, course as it was mostly very narrow; massively muddy, lots of obstacles and worst of all lots of drops into boggy mud you had no idea the depth of. Made last week's course at Woodley look like a run in the park (Oh yes it was one!).
Am always amazed how SG remembers so much detail. All I know was it was a mad stampede start then largely single file for ages. Settled in around 30th and held my place till my 1st tumble after about 6k when a good friend and WV colleague went by with a couple of others. By now I was at the back of a group of around 6 but a long way back to the next. Got myself back on the tails of this group and going well again only to take a much more major fall as I tried to take a low lying fallen tree at pace and hit the top of it. So another 20 seconds lost and bleeding a bit now but didn't look too bad. No chance to catch the group ahead but at least there was still a decent gap behnd me.
Came to the final hill and Rob Foster (SG and PMJ's watching team boss) told me I could cruise in the last 600 and not lose a place. Very kind of him and did just that to finish 33rd in a few seconds over 40. Only 7'30 pace told the tale of this course. Scored again for Windle Valley (6th and last scorer again) and looks like we've won the overall league now whatever happens in the last event. Datchet will probably beat us to the men's title by getting the better of us on our own patch in 2 weeks but think they deserve to after winning the last 3 men's races. Still amazing to think we were also ran's in about 5th the last couple of years.
Not to leave parkrun out; 18'46 for 3rd of 249 at Woking yesterday. Not great, but not bad and can only have helped the prep for today!
Nice one Pete. Sounds more drama on your run! And certainly more company! Some of those low branches that you leapt were mad, as like you say you had no idea how deep the mud the other side was!
Slight correction, we were inched out to 2nd at the Reading one, very narrowly. But could be decisive if we haven't won today! Looks more like we have from the list Dachs supplied, but you never know!
Is the Lightwater Bracknell race not put on by...Bracknell then!? Or is it not even at Lightwater these days?!
Congrats on the overall victory. Need consistency across all areas for that one. We could field a terrific women's team, but "could" is a meaningless word really. Reading could wipe the floor with all of us with their City size club.
Shows how well Sandhurst used to do to consistently win, before, and in my days there. With 1 top end guy Graham, then a little gang my level and under, but a super strong midpack.