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    Caro just sent Karen and I (I think) a message on FB so no public post yet - we are all privileged!
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    Sonya, sounds like bliss! Just seen the picture of R and grandpa on FB, sweet! Grandpa looks very young! Not a pipe and slippers man!
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    Well my run went better than I expected. Main road was pretty clear by time I went out so I was able to do my MP. I also did 20 instead of 18. Pleased about that as I have my half marathon in 3 weeks time which will muck  up training a bit. I seem to have an aversion to 18 milers, it always strikes me that by the time you have done 18 you might as well do another 2 and then have the satisfaction of having done another 20!  So 20 miles in 2.31 with average pace of 7.34 (with 12 miles at marathon pace). 83 miles for the week.

    Hope S is ok CC. Emily seems to have bounced back quickly.

    Enjoy the domestic bliss Sonya. I'm  looking forward to a big roast for tea!

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    Congratulations Caro and family, hope you are all ok and back home soon!
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    yay congratulations Caro, fab news image

    Camlo - look after your self now. No jumping about the place doing housework and such. Enjoy having your feet up and getting waited on.

    Lotte - well done on the 20 miler. My 12 miler i did was only about 20 mins slower than yours, yikes!!! Enjoy your roast, yum.

    CM - blimey can't really add much to what everyone else has said. Although I would probably never want to speak to them again I wouldn't want to cut of all contact with them but just never leave them alone with them. Ridiculous though that they can't even cope with looking after their grankids for an hour and there is no excuse for that behaviour what so ever. From what you say about them it sounds like they should never have been parents and therefore are unable to be grandparents either. Do what you think is best. ((((())))) x

    CC - i don't think a DVD is cheating; i think its necessary!!!

    Sonya - sounds like u and the kiddies are enjoying having the inlaws!

    Did my 12 miler in afew inches of snow this morning and was a white out for the first half. Easier coming back as the wind was behind me and then the sun came out so it looked lovely. There had been no cars on the road, only a few stag prints, it was hard but lovely!

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    Doh! - didn't realise Caro's news wasn't posted to all of us, glad JG was on the ball and posted the message here.

    Some great running gone on today ladies, particularly love Lotte's reasoning that if you've gone 18 you might as well do another 2 to make 20. If I was ever doing 18 I'd be counting down the metres until I could stop and collapse in a heap.

    Sonya - same as everyone else I thought no way that's Rosie's grandad, is that your dad or hubby's, either way he looks super young - where are grandad's grey hairs?

    I really felt yesterday's hills in my legs today so cut my run a bit short, hamstrings super tight so need a good stretching. Still good to get out as was lovely day here. Mum came over and we took kids to park and then out to lunch. Came home and planted up the window boxes with the new plants we bought yesterday - kids loved helping and playing at being Mr Bloom. Then got a bit domesticated and actually cleaned the windows for first time in ages with Issie's help (crazy child still loves cleaning - long may it last). Lovely day and now watching a bit of kids TV before dinner.

    Caro - hope you're all okay, looking forward to hearing the gory details. Congratulations again!
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    Oh, and CC - hope S feeling better soon, nasty coldy illnesses about at the moment; just entering week 4 of my cold now, not coughing so much but still not quite gone. Hope S can shake whatever it is off soon.
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    CC - is she just cold and unhappy? If so sounds like what S has had, probably lasted about a week as she had a lingering cough that kept her up at night too. I'd say keep her at home tomorrow, it seems to wipe them out image

    Karen - laughed out loud at your description of running 18 miles, my thoughts exactly! image
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    MinksMinks ✭✭✭

    Congratulations to Caro, but have to say I was confused after heading straight to Facebook and finding no post.  Didn't realise until I'd read more that she had messaged Karen and JG only.  Think someone said the middle name was still under discussion but what was the first name??

    Set out for 20 miles this morning but had to can it after 12.  My niggly hamstring/glute/whatever was playing up and the further I went the more uncomfortable it became.  I wouldn't say it was properly painful, but I was conscious of it not being right at every step and it was really messing with my head as well as making the run even tougher than 20 miles is anyway.  Lotte seems to eat 20-milers for breakfast - I have never enjoyed running that kind of distance and certainly wouldn't do it unless marathon training.

    Niggle has been ongoing for a while now so I may do as CC suggested and book an appointment with a physio or chiropractor to try to get to the bottom (no pun intended) of what I've done to it.  I think it was caused initially by tight hamstrings but there may be something slightly out of alignment which is stopping it getting better.  I'm going to rest it for at least a couple of days and then reassess.  If it doesn't improve I will have to ditch VLM - I might get round, but it wouldn't be pleasant and it certainly wouldn't be quick and therefore not worth putting myself through another 8 weeks of training.  I'd rather be able to run comfortably for the next six months than cripple myself in one race and be out of action for weeks/months.

    Agree Karen - if I have 18 to run, it'll be 18 and I will be counting every step until I can stop!  I am a 10-12 mile girl - LOVE running that sort of distance on a Sunday.  Feels far enough to be a long run but not so far that it knackers me out for the rest of the day or cuts into my family time.

    CM, that sounds awful about your parents.  Not sure what I'd do in that situation.  I think I'd want to give them a chance to talk about it as it may well be that an over-zealous member of the public has simply overreacted - especially as neither of the kids seemed upset or fazed by what happened.  Even though you don't get on with them that well, they're still your parents and the kids' grandparents so give it very careful thought before you decide to completely cut contact.

    CC, hope S feels better soon.  Can't believe half term is over already, have really enjoyed having my little man around.  And he has really been a model child all week: happy, smiley, polite, sweet, loving ... an absolute little darling. image

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    Minks - think they're waiting until they've decided on the middle name before revealing the full title of little Master Caro. So we've still got time to guess the first name, did anybody get the weight right?
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    My bet is Sebastian. Dunno why!
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    hope s is ok CC.

    sorry about your butt, minks. hopefully it is something that can be treated quickly.

    well, i had 'the conversation' with my parents. dad's view was that there was no issue and whoever it was who reported them to the police should just have gone and talked to him instead. end of.

    mum came on the phone and basically said that E is a nightmare; her behaviour is very challenging and she would 'do the same again' if the same situation reoccurred, because that's how you deal with children who scream.  she went on that it's not popular to hit kids now but apparently that's what everyone did when she was younger and that's the thing to do. hmmm.... i remember being belted 'to kingdom come' as my mum always put it; boxed round the ears etc.

    i said nothing. eventually she did start saying that she didn't know how to deal with tantrums and E pushed her buttons.  (although really - about a minute of crying and she resorted to that). she also admitted that she took her trousers off her because she wet herself, smacked her bare bottom and sat her on a step by some shrubs (while presumably screaming abuse at her - she didn't admit to that and i didn't ask her. screaming abuse is something my mother is very good at, and my father doesn't hold back these days either). she said that my dad was there at that point and he 'took over' - whatever that means.

    there was no apology.  she did say that she had no idea how i coped with E as she is such a nightmare. i explained that she wasn't a nightmare; she was just a toddler and this is what they often do. i said i tend to ignore, or, if i'm in public and ignoring is difficult, i pick her up under my arm and cart her off.  she did say 'perhaps i will have to try that next time'. so maybe there is an admission there that she could have handled it differently.

    but there won't be a next time. i will not be leaving my kids on their own with my parents again. no apology. not even any real concern that i had had a visit from the police. dad was scathing about 'meddling busybodies' who aren't brave enough to confront people.

    my relationship with my mother has never been good. she disapproves of me. the first thing she did when she met N was to tell him that she thought i was treating him disgracefully and that he should have nothing to do with me.  N tried to stick up for me saying that i was putting my kids first and that he thought i did a fantastic job with the kids. my parents said nothing in response to that. all my mother ever does is criticise me, explicitly and implicitly. whenever she stays here (which isn't much these days), she takes over. everything i do, she re-does. if i hang washing up, she goes and rehangs it. if i put dishes away, she reorganises the cupboard. she just comes in and empties my fridge and cleans it out. she sorts out my wardrobes and cupboards every time. i have asked her repeatedly not to do it. she says she won't; and then she does it. i have told her why it upsets me but she still does it.

    i do feel sorry for my mum because she had a very bum deal growing up. but i can't allow her to try to exert negative control over my kids. i will not have my children grow up being called retarded, stupid, 'thick as sh1t', 'waste of space' and all the other lovely epithets which she called me when i was a child. she 'rued the day i was born' and i was the 'worst thing to happen' to her. she has called J a 'nasty, horrid little boy' to his face before. that made my blood run cold as that is exactly the sort of thing she said to me. i will not have my children growing up thinking that that is what they are.

    VERY angry with her. hmmm...

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    Well I just read your post out to hubby and he instantly said "she needs to cut that woman out of her life now. She (your mum) has her own issues and needs to deal with them." so I wonder if there is something in that gut reaction...?? She really sounds like a hideous woman, obviously I don't know her and wouldn't want to insult someone's mother, but from what you have said she clearly has issues of control and of bullying and you should not have to put up with that, never mind your children.

    3.25 miles for me today, just a gentle saunter to check everything still works and I wasn't about to keel over. I didn't image Hopefully now I can get back into training properly, I'm already thinking about sorting out my awful diet that has crept in since being ill.

    Back to nursery run tomorrow, good to get back to the old routine but I feel we've missed our holiday somewhat :/

    Caro clearly chose me and Karen as the 2 who spend their lives on FB...image
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    (()) CM- don't want to say. Find it quite upsetting reading about what they did so cant imagine how you feel. Sounds like E was acting as any toddler would. They are your parents and no one can say what you should do in this situation. It is so sad if your mum acts like that because of the way she was treated as a child. But it is great that you have managed to break the cycle and are a wonderful mum to your lovely children.

    CC- hope S ok. Sounds like a you need a break from all the lurgies.

    Great long runs going on. Am feeling quite jealous! Haven't run since September but hopefully not long til I can get back out there and see how unfit I am!
    Welcome to Christine, I've got a nearly 2yr old and a 1 month old. Pleased to hear you managed a run! I have a babyjogger and am hoping to find time to take Rosie out in it once she is big enough. Maggie used to like it and fell asleep most times I used it.

    Minks- hope you're not injured, fingers crossed. I agree that 10-12 miles is fine and doesn't take all day etc but that 18-20 is a chore! (expect the mad girls on here disagree!)

    Right- must go to sleep if going to get any rest before next feed. Writing on iPhone which is a pain.
    Nearly forgot, yes grandpa is v young, only 43! It's actually hubby's step dad, 17yrs younger than his mum, got together when he was 19, married and expecting hubby's brother by 21. Shows age doesn't matter as they're still together over 20yrs later!
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    Or caro was just brain dead and couldn't think of anyone else's real names at the time! Thanks for passing on the news.

    Home now, shattered. Need sleep.

    The little man's name is Eric Claude Frith. I won the middle name discussion (of course!) it's after my great grandfather major general sir Claude francis liardet. I pointed out that the frith will be passed down as he is a boy so it was only fair that one of my family names snuck in there image
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    Great name Caro! Congratulations! Now get some sleep image
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    Caro - would never have guessed Eric but I love it as a name, Lily has an Eric in her class. Good luck getting some sleep tonight!
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    ChynahChynah ✭✭✭
    Congratulations Caro and welcome Baby Eric!!
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    I like Eric too, lovely name, well done again Caro - hope you got some sleep!

    Aidan is sleeping through again but waking before 6am - not very amused by that!
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    Great name Caro. Hope you got some sleep!
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    Brilliant news Caro and a great name... now rest  xxxxxxxx   image
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    Congrats Caro!! Lovely name image

    CM, I found it v emotional hearing that, I had similar things said to me by mother's husband and it's disgraceful ((()))

    V poorly boy here, off nursery - joy!
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    MinksMinks ✭✭✭

    Fab news Caro, and love the name!  Didn't think about the whole name thing that much when we named Kit - we'd both agreed on Kit (although it's not a family name or even a derivative of any names in the family).  His middle name is Thomas, which is also hubby's middle name and the name of hubby's great-grandfather.  My dad's name was Kenneth Harold - couldn't really have 'Kit Kenneth'; could have had Kit Harold I suppose but neither of us was that keen.  Interestingly my brother used it as his son's middle name.

    Hope you're feeling OK and not too shattered.  Take care (())

    CM, your mum sounds as though she has a lot of issues from her own upbringing which she has been unable to avoid taking out on you.  I think you probably have your own issues too but abusing your kids (physically and/or emotionally) is not one of them.  You are a great mum and your kids are very lucky to have you.  N sounds lovely and not a bit like T thank God!  Perhaps if your upbringing had been different you would never have hooked up with someone like T in the first place.  You've been given a "get out of jail" card so use it!

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    MinksMinks ✭✭✭

    Crossed posts CC - no, had something else after London last time.  It was a butt pain but on the right, and it caused a really painful calf and soreness all under the arch of my foot after the last London as I guess I was running awkwardly.  It sorted itself pretty quickly though.

    Am wondering if my new shoes have exacerbated the problem - they are the same make as my last 7 or 8 pairs at least, but obviously models get tweaked from one iteration to the next.  This injury or whatever it is does seem to have worsened since I started wearing them two weeks ago.  But my old ones are truly knackered and I can't afford another new pair just yet.

    However, I will try and get an appointment with someone.

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    CM - had missed your post - oh well, at least they have admitted that maybe they don't deal with toddlers very well. I'd stick to your instincts and not leave J and E with them on their own again although that's very sad too.
    Can't believe your mum said that to N too - outrageous!

    Struggling a bit with our name list for number 3 here although we still have a fair bit of time to decide!

    Martha has been really naughty this morning, bit Aidan twice and then put the toilet roll down the toilet!!! I thought we were past that bit!
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