HADD Training Method



  • Brian, good news on the running front! Happy to hear it. As for the bike, I too have looked pretty out of my element. I bought a mtn bike a few years back when I couldn't run due to injury. Never really got used to clipping/unclipping. Fell (not off my bike but with it as I was still clipped!) many times. Worst injury was sprained wrist. Think I was going 1 mph when I dumped. I need to learn to like biking as it would be a good long term investment in my legs to do even day per week (instead of a run that day). Worse, I really dislike swimming even more. Think I might need to save up for the Eliptigo (sp?). That looks cool.

    Davey, very smart race! Yes, the even/negative split is really something to be proud of when you hit it. Great work. Looking forward to seeing you carve off more next round.

    Tek, damn!!!!! Sorry to hear you got leveled by a microbe. To put it into perspective, I got hit badly a couple weeks ago and bounced back surprisingly well. The 26 weeks are still there so if you can turn the corner in the next 3-4 days I say you'll be OK. Think really positive (and get tons of sleep!!)!

  • Brian61Brian61 ✭✭✭

    Daveymck, what a very even pace and controlled effort!

    Credit where it's due. Now onward and upward, 3:45 should be within your sights.

    Spin class for me today....

  • Dr.DanDr.Dan ✭✭✭

    image Try not to all off the static bike Brian! image

  • Dr.DanDr.Dan ✭✭✭

    Tek - plenty of time to recover yet ... the legs are trained, just look after yourself and get rid of the bug.

  • Brian61Brian61 ✭✭✭

    Dan, image I managed to stay onimage

  • Dr.DanDr.Dan ✭✭✭

    Well done Brian image


    I took Monday off but then missed my run yesterday as I was too busy ... managed to just sneak in 5.4 mi today with 4.2 mi at MP ... managed a nice low HR (average under 76%).

  • Txs for the subLT info VT,  will leave starting it until November (5 weeks from Marathon).

    Nice link Dr.Dan, a good read.

    Well done for staying upright and the b2b Brian image

    Good run davey, your average pace is the same as my 5k pace - scary fast!

    Tek, good luck recovering and hopefully you'll bounce back like VT image

    Wind was at 20mph today but gusting at 38mph so dusted off the TM, not such a wise thing as Central Heating was on as well. Set it up at 10:21mm's and saw a steady increase in HR and ended up doing 60 mins, 5.8 miles and an AHR of 67.02% image

    It took just over 30 mins to hit 70% and guessing I'd be better keeping at this pace (on easy days) and try to get a lower average HR rather than speeding up to get to 70% faster then (maybe) slowing down after?





  • Andi, I think anything near 70 or below is fine, particularly for easy days. But if you look that HADD stuff, in addition to subLT runs, Joe also did runs that were probably in the 70-75% range as well. Another way of looking at it is what percentage of your week are you at high intensity (read quality). I think a general guideline is to go for about 20-25%, but not sure off hand. I think in my case I end up doing maybe too much of the subLT work compared to my overall mileage. Also, my LRs are probably too long as well. 60 mpw with 20 at subLT and a 17-21 mile LR during the marathon build gives some wonky numbers for sure. But I figure instead of adding in more easy mileage to make the percentages work out, I just rest. My weeks are always 5 days on w/Sat/Mon off. TMI probably, but once I got started couldn't stop.image

    Brian, well played sir!

    DD, seems you are feeling pretty good these days. A great sign!

    7 easy miles yesterday and 6 today w/2 at MP per the dress rehearsal from P&D. Legs are feeling more intact than they have in a long time (aka feeling pretty healed up) but still have some lingering fatigue. Getting oh so close and if my last taper holds true I'll be positively straining the leash on Friday. The MP miles today were good. Even into the wind and uphill I managed 7:08 1st mile and 7:10 second mile at 156 and 157, respectively (that's about 78% of max). Pace felt comfortable. Normally I would have boomed out at 6:40 something 1st mile and then 6:50ish so am hopeful this pace will be comfortable on the day. Also, it was 78 and humid today. But the forecast for Sunday says 55 as of todayimage. I'm driving myself crazy looking at the weather reportsimage

  • Brian61Brian61 ✭✭✭

    VT, easy tiger. What will be will be. You have done all the hard work, and now it's payback time. Don't f*ck it up!

    Ecce, that pace must be very easy for you if you didn't hit 70% for 30mins. I find the HR goes up pretty quickly on the treadie. Stay easy for ~4 weeks after the mara I always say.

    I'm out for 60mins with 20mins in Zone2 today. Will be the first time out of Z1 (running) since 21st August. Itching!  


  • Andi (or whatever your name is there days) if I was you I would add some 75% runs in. You will get more improvements with this and also turn thr legs over more.
  • Dr.DanDr.Dan ✭✭✭

    Enjoy zone 2 Brian!image

    Ecce - some good advice already!image

    VT - you're just about there now ... don't be shit.image

    6.7 miles for me at 8:12/m and 75% maxHR.

  • VT, sounds like your winding up nicely to release all that energy come race day image

    Brian, hope the 60 min run went well?

    lol Spen, I've been called much worse of course image

    Thanks for all the replies folks image

    So, to recap...


    Stay with easy/recovery runs for 4-5 weeks

    Build up the subLT runs gradually (include decent recovery breaks)

    Do some 75% runs in addition to the above

    (try to) keep the faster stuff to a recommended % of weekly distance

    Enjoy running for runnings sake image

    Still windy today so 30 mins on TM... 2.9 miles (10:21mm's) and 63.83% AHR (maybe thats taking things too easily lol).

  • VT all the best for this weekendimage

    And as Andi says, enjoy running for running's sake

  • Roy! How are things? Will definitely remember to do that. After all, it is the best part of the whole endeavor.

    Brian, have fun clearing out the carbon so to speak. It will make you feel more alive (even though speed can killimage). Will do my absolute best to redeem myself after the DNF this spring.

    Andi, you've got it now.

    DD, what do you have coming up this weekend for your LR? And remind me, you race next weekend, correct?

    Tek, what's happening w/the infection? Feeling better?

  • Brian61Brian61 ✭✭✭

    Morning all,

    Ecce, I think maybe use 65% as a starter point. But in the phase you are in, it really doesn't matter. Infact it should give you a nice warm feeling with numbers that lowimage

    VT, and breeeeaaaaathe...... and what DrDan said.

    Yesterday's run was a big step forward for me, and my foot rehab. Just over 8 miles in 67mins @ 73%, with 20mins @ 80.4% (7:28 pace). Plenty of work to do, but I have now put a marker down. Hoping to get a longish run in (~80mins) and a bike ride in this weekend. 


  • Dr.DanDr.Dan ✭✭✭

    Brian - that's great news! image

    VT - I'm considering 12 with 10 at MP on Sunday, as that's what I did a week before Nottingham. My race is on Monday 27th, so not quite next weekend but close enough  (the Irish have a public holiday that day).... and at least I have an extra day in the final week to rest.

  • Brian, nice report! Hope the longer run goes well.

    DD, happy MPing this weekend. I guess I'll get the ultimate dose soon!

    Well, final run in today. Did 5 miles w/6 striders. All systems feeling good. May run 2 tomorrow but may just do nothing as have to drive 3 hrs to get on site tomorrow and then go to the expo (will be staying at my in-laws who live about 30 minutes from the start). Anyone else hate carbo-loading? I just don't like the pressure of having to get all those carbs in...feel so out of my element when I am so loaded up w/food. Trying to integrate more juice/Gatorade/chocolate milk/etc this time around.

  • NayanNayan ✭✭✭

    I'm starting to think carb loading gives you a headache. Had the same thing last time around. Only got to keep this up till this afternoon though

  • Nayan ,  drink more water, all the best for tomorrow.

  • TeknikTeknik ✭✭✭

    Good luck VT and Nayanimage

    Still coughing up junk, so still no training...8 days to go until Frankfurtimage

  • Best of luck VT and Nayan image

    Tek: hope you recover in time. 8 days is still plenty.

    Good marker there, Brian. Things are looking up image

    Congrats Davey and Shoes for conquering 26.2 image

    Not much running here. Spent a week hiking in the Alps which made for a nice change in scenery.
  • NayanNayan ✭✭✭

    Haven't got the chip time yet but it was 3:22:xx I know that much from the clock. 

    I see now what the 'Underpass of Doom' was. Nice event, Abingdon. Would recommend it. 

  • TeknikTeknik ✭✭✭

    Congrats Nayan, nice PBimage imageimage

  • Dr.DanDr.Dan ✭✭✭

    Well done Nayan! image

  • image Great run congrats on your pb

  • NayanNayan ✭✭✭

    Thank you. 

    Teknik- Fingers and everything else crossed for you. 

  • Hi all, I wonder if I could pop back into this thread (I'm an intermittent visitor to these pages) to ask a very simple question. Apologies.

    I'm a big believer in low heart rate training and have dipped in and out of using it over the past couple of years. Despite this I have always struggled to keep my heart rate steady during easy training runs. In part this is due to my local terrain (not much flat where I live) but also because I haven't been able to master keeping my heart rate below my set limits. In the past this has caused frustration and led me to revert to other training methods. So a quick bit of advice from you wise runners:

    What do you do on a training run if you notice your heart rate going above your limit? Do you stop and wait for you HR to drop? Do you walk? Or do you keep on running and try and bring it back down by running slower?

    I'd really be interested to hear any tips and techniques you have on controlling HR at the early base training stage. This method takes a lot of commitment and mental toughness but I'm committed to using it (or a system close to it) for my spring Marathon training. 

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